Do you think IL2 Forums would benefit from a Skin Repository?

[336th_Ripper*]

@Jason_Williams@Bearcat@ICDP@BlackHellHound1@361st_Bugsy@361st_SPEKTRE76@Ouky1991@szelljr@Tom_Weiss@E69_julian57@jasta11ace@CCG_Pips@A-E-Hartmann

@Megalax@Dookie_Monster@Danziger@Gambit21@Yakdriver@vonPilsner@6./ZG26_5tuka@Rjel 

 

Hello Gents, the list of skinners is exhaustive and I really tried to include as many as possible, so please chime in if I have not added you.

 

This question is mainly for the Developer and Forum Administrator(s) with the support of all skinners. Would it be much trouble for you to add a Skin Repository to current forum, much like the one available in DCS?

 

I ask because the skin threads are quite messy.  It would be great to have one thread for incoming projects and then the completed projects placed into a skin repository as suggested by @361st_SPEKTRE76 to me during a recent chat.

 

I see that @Tom_Weiss does this by placing his on http://www.lockonfiles.com/ because of the lack of a Skin repository here no doubt. Some skinners have their own Forum posts like @361st_Bugsy and @szelljr and myself who just started one, while others release a plane per post. Then unpinned threads pop up like the P-47 and the two P-51 posts, one in the 4K skins section https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/54579-p-51d-mustang-4k-skins/ and the other under the other under the Skins & Templates Section https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/54643-p-51-d-skins/

 

This situation is only going to get worse. I am sure users can benefit from a Skin Repository. 

 

Your thoughts please?

 

 

 

Edited November 6, 2019 by BSS_Ripper*
Fixed typo

[Legioneod]

It would be nice to have a finished skins section like the 4k skins subforum where we have threads to each aircraft. Skinners would post finished skins with download link in their respective threads instead of having all these random individual threads opened up. This should be where everyone post finished skins and no discussion or request whatsoever, that way the threads stay nice and neat and not get bogged down with request and discussions.

 

Currently the skins section of the forums is a mess, definitely needs some work.

Edited November 6, 2019 by Legioneod

[Jason_Williams]

Who’s gonna pay for it? That’s always the question. I do plan to offer official skin packs like in ROF but some changes need to be done first to the game and I won’t be accepting just my any skin. These 4K skins are not small and wide distribution gets pricey over time.
 

Jason

[336th_Ripper*]

3 minutes ago, Jason_Williams said:

Who’s gonna pay for it? That’s always the question. I do plan to offer official skin packs like in ROF but some changes need to be done first to the game and I won’t be accepting just my any skin. These 4K skins are not small and wide distribution gets pricey over time.
 

Jason

Hello Jason, I am glad your shared your thoughts and brought up the fact that this type of change would cost. @Legioneod has a free suggestion posted just above. 

 

Thanks for your feedback.

[Ouky1991]

9 hours ago, Jason_Williams said:

Who’s gonna pay for it? That’s always the question. I do plan to offer official skin packs like in ROF but some changes need to be done first to the game and I won’t be accepting just my any skin. These 4K skins are not small and wide distribution gets pricey over time.
 

Jason

Skin repository is not necessary, just pinning threads would help organize things. By offering skin packs, do you mean no more user made free skins, or they would work alongside?

[Raptorattacker]

10 hours ago, BSS_Ripper* said:

please chime in if I have not added you.

Sob!.... sob!!.... snuffle!!..... 

Just as an aside, it's for this/these reasons that I, like others, just started me own thread in the skins forum where my own skins can reside. I mean, previously I had difficulty finding me OWN skins if I had to back-reference any!! I'm interested to see if anything develops out of this and would of course be a willing participant if I see fit.

Rap

9 hours ago, Legioneod said:

and no discussion or request whatsoever, that way the threads stay nice and neat

Therein lies the problem for threads and this is a great suggestion, I must admit...

[Megalax]

I see that a lot of the older aircraft models have their own pinned threads in the skins forums, but as the newer modules have come out, the new aircraft have been left out. Simply having pinned threads for the new aircraft models would help remove some of the mess.

 

Also, Mission4Today has a section for Il2 Great Battles but I think most people have completely forgotten it or simply associate it to the old Maddox titles. M4T pays for their bandwidth with user donations.

[PatCartier]

My solution > http://www.axis-and-allies-paintworks.com/download.php?list.104

To be able to upload, you must make the request and that the members of the site accept you.
It is up to you to see if this may be of interest to you.

 

Otherwise, the comrades' proposal seems good to me. A thread for each type of aircraft with only the link to the skinpacks provided, no bla~bla ^^

++

 

Edited November 6, 2019 by PatCartier

[E69_julian57]

17 minutes ago, PatCartier said:

 

 

Otherwise, the comrades' proposal seems good to me. A thread for each type of aircraft with only the skinpacks provided, no bla~bla ^^

++

 

 

++++1...

[BlackHellHound1]

I have thought about this a lot. And I would support a good and well produced project. I even considered starting my own project to make a proper dedicated site for it. But instead of taking a random site and posting it all there, I would first get support from both the most active skinners and 1CGS and turn it into a collaboration.

However, like Jason mentioned, it would require time and money that I don't have.

 

The problem I have with most of these existing sites is that they aren't all that well designed and tend to miss elements such as clear descriptions, images, a "newly added skins" list, multi skin download functionality, or search functionality. As well as the fact that they aren't a dedicated website endorsed by ICGS. 

To deal with this problem, I have a well organized museum with clear descriptions, shortcuts to "rooms", images, and a "complete collection" pack. I have been trying to get others to follow my example. Some to a greater extent than others (especially the complete collection pack option is still missing far to often). 

 

If someone decided to make a proper dedicated skin website with the support of both 1CGS AND the largest, most active skinners, I will support and help as well.

But until that happens, A single thread with all of the work by a single artist is the best way to share skins. 

 

BlackHellHound1

Edited November 6, 2019 by BlackHellHound1

[FurphyForum]

There's no reason why the pinned sections can't work, they just need to be purged of all the accumulated vomit. ? And yeah definitely no blah blah in the pinned, that's half the reason for the s***y state as well as a lack of skin posting discipline 2k v 4K. 

 

Man... bring out that monsta size broom. ?

[=gRiJ=Roman-]

ABSOLUTELY!!!!

We need some kind of super packs like in ROF!

Edited November 6, 2019 by 15[Span.]/JG51Spartan

[Danziger]

I think once all the planes have been updated to 4k it should just be assumed that all skins are 4k and people should make a large note if they are posting a 2k skin. The pinned threads method can definitely work. They just need to merge the 4k skins section with the normal skins section and clean out all the threads. I would even say start them over again. Make a pinned thread for each aircraft. That is where the skins will be posted with no discussion, no previews, no WIP. Just screenshots with descriptions and links for skins. All discussion can take place in the unpinned threads. It would take a lot of work for a forum moderator though.

[Tom_Weiss]

15 hours ago, BSS_Ripper* said:

I see that @Tom_Weiss does this by placing his on http://www.lockonfiles.com/ because of the lack of a Skin repository here no doubt

 

it is because I run LockOnFiles ?

 

LockOnFIles host files made by the community and it is only natural that I upload my skins there ?

 

14 hours ago, Jason_Williams said:

Who’s gonna pay for it? That’s always the question. I do plan to offer official skin packs like in ROF but some changes need to be done first to the game and I won’t be accepting just my any skin. These 4K skins are not small and wide distribution gets pricey over time.
 

Jason

 

you can add a download section to the website with offline hosting, that is, you add the file and the download is either from an upload site (Google, Mega etc. ) or from another website, it would be the easiest thing to add, we do it at LockOnFiles and the Il-2 forum code is the same that we use.

 

example of a file we have hosted externally

 

Google:

 

http://www.lockonfiles.com/files/file/3653-bartheks-gtm-13-dcs-caucasus-map-redone/

 

Developer website:

 

http://www.lockonfiles.com/files/file/3535-milviz-p-38-red-bull-model/

 

Sim Outhouse flight community website:

 

http://www.lockonfiles.com/files/file/1451-p3d-douglas-c-47r-skytrain/

 

 

 

this option preserves other website traffic as it redirects traffic and does not take away from them.

 

this option has zero hosting cost and it is easy to add to the existing code as it is part of the IPS code package.

 

 

Edited November 6, 2019 by Tom_Weiss

[BlitzPigVoidcracker]

Some good suggestions here...however, the simplest and cheapest solution will work best here. Just having the newer birds have a pinned thread like the older ones. Worked fine before and if it ain't broke...

However, this is said as a user, downloading and enjoying the fine work of the skinners here. I don't know if this pinning solution is in any way easier and simpler for them and at the end of the day what is good for them is what counts.

[336th_Ripper*]

Ideally I’d prefer a Skin Repository like @PatCartier suggested or what @Tom_Weiss is using and Administrating, but if the primary decision makers are 100% against that idea and rather stick with pinning threads and cleaning them up, I am certain you’d get help for many members and influencers.  @BlackHellHound1 offered his help, I’d be willing to help anyway I can if you need me.

 

This begs to ask the question, why was so much effort made earlier on the pinning the threads and then let go as of BodenPlatte pre-release (possibly earlier)?  Have you lost some Forum Admins? Current admins simply tired of working on that? 
 

This is why the skin repository is  the best solution IMO. 

[Rjel]

5 hours ago, FurphyForum said:

There's no reason why the pinned sections can't work, they just need to be purged of all the accumulated vomit. ? And yeah definitely no blah blah in the pinned, that's half the reason for the s***y state as well as a lack of skin posting discipline 2k v 4K. 

 

Man... bring out that monsta size broom. ?

Vomit? How so? Does someone adding a background story to their post detract from the skins? Simply looking at a skin, however colorful,  doesn't do much for me. Knowing the why's that it represents a living person, likely now dead, brings some meaning to it. Likewise, if adding favorable comments or constructive criticism is a distraction then the desire to create is diminished.   

[geraki9]

Hello everyone!

I am very pleased that we started talking about the forum, because it is
since the arrival of the templates of the new Bok and BoB planes that
I see a certain confusion and disorder. First for each plane there was a specific one
threads where we found everything published, including skins, without having to
go look elsewhere. Couldn't we continue as before? From now!
Each plane a thread, where to publish skins, comments, requests, opinions, but
just for that specific aircraft, in short, as before.
I don't think this is expensive, but for good organization
of the forum, it would also be worth donating something, not only in money but also in
physical and temporal help.
I can easily see that a certain antagonism is being created between skinners, delicate,
but antagonism. This, although highly stimulating, should not lead to one
hermetic division, but an improvement of the fantastic jobs you do, to the exchange
of ideas, documentation, tactics for the realization of increasingly faithful skins
to the historical reality of the various models.
I don't know if Google Translation translated well what I wrote in english, I hope ...

Roberto

Edited November 6, 2019 by geraki9

[szelljr]

F.C need a Skin forum ,there only a General Discussion"  .

[ICDP]

I would love to see the skins sub-forum changed to have a single dedicated thread for each aircraft.  I also believe we would have a large increase in interest if the skinpacks could be re-introduced for the best skins.  This would allow people to use skins "mods on" as I feel a large percentage of people ignore the skins because they can't use them online anyway.

 

Though as Jason said this is something they are considering but it is a small team.

[Mysticpuma]

ATAG has a well laid out downloads section. Each aircraft has it's own subjection, the uploader adds the skin and a screenshot, that's it. 

 

https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/Downloads.php?categoryid=12

 

Edited November 6, 2019 by Mysticpuma

[LizLemon]

18 hours ago, Jason_Williams said:

I do plan to offer official skin packs like in ROF but some changes need to be done first to the game and I won’t be accepting just my any skin.

 

I really hope this means PBR

[JG1_Vonrd]

19 hours ago, Jason_Williams said:

Who’s gonna pay for it? That’s always the question. I do plan to offer official skin packs like in ROF but some changes need to be done first to the game and I won’t be accepting just my any skin. These 4K skins are not small and wide distribution gets pricey over time.
 

Jason

What would be the cost estimate? I, for one would gladly chip in. Perhaps something like some of the multiplayer servers have for donations. How about volunteers to help put. I recall Panthercules was providing assistance in the waning days of ROF skinpacks. Again, I would be willing to help with whatever time I have available.

 

Though I was getting frustrated with the amount of time it was taking to issue the final ROF skinpacks, after seeing what a current clusterf... skins are here, it seems that something like what was happening in ROF would be welcome.

[Rjel]

While official skin packs would be a good idea for online, I wouldn't want to see skins limited to what someone else decides are best. There are a lot of skinners from the old IL-2 days who are no longer around, at least by the names they went by back then. What of current skinners should they move on?  Who might replace them in the future? If a newcomer who might be lacking in technique at the start isn't allowed to share his work with the community, they will have little chance to grow into a competent artist. Everyone starts somewhere, even those here who are considered to be excellent skinners today didn't start out that way.

[Jason_Williams]

1 hour ago, LizLemon said:

 

I really hope this means PBR

 

No that's not what this mean. IL-2 does not accept skin packs like ROF because in the beginning it allowed for special skin linked to purchases. This no longer applies and I just want to get back to a system similar to we had in ROF. This is what I have to change.

 

Jason

11 minutes ago, Rjel said:

While official skin packs would be a good idea for online, I wouldn't want to see skins limited to what someone else decides are best. There are a lot of skinners from the old IL-2 days who are no longer around, at least by the names they went by back then. What of current skinners should they move on?  Who might replace them in the future? If a newcomer who might be lacking in technique at the start isn't allowed to share his work with the community, they will have little chance to grow into a competent artist. Everyone starts somewhere, even those here who are considered to be excellent skinners today didn't start out that way.

 

I'm not paying for every skin at every skill level to be distributed. You guys can already do that among each other. I want to expand our library of cool skins, but only ones that meet a higher standard and are historical in nature. Like we did with ROF and it was very popular. That can be managed and paid for. These skins will still be custom skins, but a larger library of quality skins in several organized packs will be a nice showcase of what can be done. No limitations on how skins currently work is involved.

 

Jason

[336th_Ripper*]

@Jason_Williams I only started sinning this year.

 

Please take a look at my recent P-51 Frenesi and CandyMan Moose skins and let me know if those are Skin Pack worthy. I genuinely want to know because like @Rjel indicates, some of us are new to the skinning scene but I’m an incurable perfectionist and if those two skins wouldn’t make, the cut, I would need feedback as to why. 

 

Link to my skins in my signature. Created with ICDP template with weathering turned off  or to a minimum.

 

Thanks I appreciate your brutal honesty

[ICDP]

8 hours ago, BSS_Ripper* said:

@Jason_Williams I only started sinning this year.

 

Please take a look at my recent P-51 Frenesi and CandyMan Moose skins and let me know if those are Skin Pack worthy. I genuinely want to know because like @Rjel indicates, some of us are new to the skinning scene but I’m an incurable perfectionist and if those two skins wouldn’t make, the cut, I would need feedback as to why. 

 

Link to my skins in my signature. Created with ICDP template with weathering turned off  or to a minimum.

 

Thanks I appreciate your brutal honesty

 

Hi Ripper.  I had a look at those skins and there are only a few improvements I would recommend.  I would also add some slight weathering to the alpha channel to give the skin some character. in different lighting conditions (Like your P-47 skins).

 

This is just some constructive criticism to help you take your skins to the next level.  They are already very good.

 

 

[336th_Ripper*]

3 hours ago, ICDP said:

 

Hi Ripper.  I had a look at those skins and there are only a few improvements I would recommend.  I would also add some slight weathering to the alpha channel to give the skin some character. in different lighting conditions (Like your P-47 skins).

 

This is just some constructive criticism to help you take your skins to the next level.  They are already very good.

 

 

Thanks for your feedback @ICDP, yes the Moose antlers were quite challenging to align!  Not sure if the template will allow me to align them even better. I spent a least 2 hours on them!

Rgr for the Camo and weathering! When I have a minute I will look at Frenesi and Candyman Moose Alpha layers. 

[ICDP]

1 hour ago, BSS_Ripper* said:

Thanks for your feedback @ICDP, yes the Moose antlers were quite challenging to align!  Not sure if the template will allow me to align them even better. I spent a least 2 hours on them!

Rgr for the Camo and weathering! When I have a minute I will look at Frenesi and Candyman Moose Alpha layers. 

 

Drop me a PM if you think I can help.

[Megalax]

1 hour ago, BSS_Ripper* said:

Thanks for your feedback @ICDP, yes the Moose antlers were quite challenging to align!  Not sure if the template will allow me to align them even better. I spent a least 2 hours on them!

Rgr for the Camo and weathering! When I have a minute I will look at Frenesi and Candyman Moose Alpha layers. 

 

In all honesty the P-51 skin is not the easiest to work on. Lots of joints to align. I can only imagine what goes into making the templates for it, as creating panel lines and such is not something I would enjoy doing.

[Danziger]

6 hours ago, BSS_Ripper* said:

Thanks for your feedback @ICDP, yes the Moose antlers were quite challenging to align!  Not sure if the template will allow me to align them even better. I spent a least 2 hours on them!

Rgr for the Camo and weathering! When I have a minute I will look at Frenesi and Candyman Moose Alpha layers. 

Sometimes the wireframe layer at the top can be a big help with aligning things. When I am having trouble aligning something, I turn it on at a very transparent level. It will show you where the textures actually begin and end on certain parts. Plus there are lines that can act as a guide for alignment.

 

For example, the forward wing root area on the Fw190A8 (I havent checked the others) has a couple of areas that are not only reversed on which side of the plane they belong but they are also mirrored and turned at strange angles. I was trying to paint a demarcation line across it and it was a nightmare let me tell you. Using the wireframe layer was the only thing that got me close. Even then being one or two pixels off would throw the whole thing off so I finally gave up and just moved my demarcation line.

Edited November 7, 2019 by Danziger

[336th_Ripper*]

6 hours ago, Danziger said:

Sometimes the wireframe layer at the top can be a big help with aligning things. When I am having trouble aligning something, I turn it on at a very transparent level. It will show you where the textures actually begin and end on certain parts. Plus there are lines that can act as a guide for alignment.

 

For example, the forward wing root area on the Fw190A8 (I havent checked the others) has a couple of areas that are not only reversed on which side of the plane they belong but they are also mirrored and turned at strange angles. I was trying to paint a demarcation line across it and it was a nightmare let me tell you. Using the wireframe layer was the only thing that got me close. Even then being one or two pixels off would throw the whole thing off so I finally gave up and just moved my demarcation line.

Hello @Danziger, it did not even think of using it!  I have been using the Photoshop grid view and pulling angles by trial and error,  like when I painted the Horizontal Stabilizer tips on the P-38!  

 

Now my new headache is making two tone colors on the nose cowling. Pulling a straight line leads to the Upper Nose Canopy not lining up with either side of the nose canopy,  so I decide to make a separate Upper Nose Canopy layer and try to position it to match!  I am really close but cannot get it to align 100%

 

I did however manage to perfectly align two tone prop spinners. On my birds they are 100% perfectly aligned for both layers, when the prop turns and when it is stationary! I have those layers locked and will never ever unlock them for the time it took me to get those layers to align up perfectly! 

[bonescraper]

On 11/6/2019 at 2:13 AM, Jason_Williams said:

Who’s gonna pay for it? That’s always the question. I do plan to offer official skin packs like in ROF but some changes need to be done first to the game and I won’t be accepting just my any skin. These 4K skins are not small and wide distribution gets pricey over time.
 

Jason

You can always use Steam Workshop on Steam. I know not everyone Has their game on Steam, but why not use that feature when it's there?

[336th_Ripper*]

On 11/7/2019 at 7:25 AM, 361st_Ripper* said:

Thanks for your feedback @ICDP, yes the Moose antlers were quite challenging to align!  Not sure if the template will allow me to align them even better. I spent a least 2 hours on them!

Rgr for the Camo and weathering! When I have a minute I will look at Frenesi and Candyman Moose Alpha layers. 

Ok so I have created a version 2.0.0 to improve as per ICDP's observations. Details in my thread:

 

[SOLIDKREATE]

On 11/5/2019 at 5:13 PM, Jason_Williams said:

Who’s gonna pay for it? That’s always the question. I do plan to offer official skin packs like in ROF but some changes need to be done first to the game and I won’t be accepting just my any skin. These 4K skins are not small and wide distribution gets pricey over time.
 

Jason

 

Roger dodger Jeffe! I can't wait to submit one when it does happen.

 

 

On 11/6/2019 at 3:08 PM, 361st_Ripper* said:

@Jason_Williams I only started sinning this year.

 

The lord forgives my child.

Edited November 22, 2019 by SOLIDKREATE

[336th_Ripper*]

12 minutes ago, SOLIDKREATE said:

 

Roger dodger Jeffe! I can't wait to submit one when it does happen.

 

 

 

The lord forgives my child.

Yes this I know lol!  I saw the typo a while back but decided it was too funny to correct

[the_dudeWG]

On 11/5/2019 at 7:35 PM, 361st_Ripper* said:

@Jason_Williams@Bearcat@ICDP@BlackHellHound1@361st_Bugsy@361st_SPEKTRE76@Ouky1991@szelljr@Tom_Weiss@E69_julian57@jasta11ace@CCG_Pips@A-E-Hartmann

@Megalax@Dookie_Monster@Danziger@Gambit21@Yakdriver@vonPilsner@6./ZG26_5tuka@Rjel 

 

Would it be much trouble for you to add a Skin Repository to current forum, much like the one available in DCS?

 

 

 

 

 

+1 We don't need 1C to distribute them, just please allow us to post them in the forum, separated by: Game, Historical, Fictional, and Plane Set. Loosen the restrictions and voting on fictional skins, and set up a method to support and utilize historical skins in game.