Tactical Air War

[CptSiddy 557]

3 hours ago, xJammer said:

At this point anyone reading the last few pages must think that Allies have supermen pilots, able to battle twice the number of Axis with worse aircraft and inferior capturing technology. Afterall they won twice already! 

 

 

You are welcome to switch sides and fine out. 

 

 

Edited December 19, 2018 by CptSiddy

[=AVG77=Mobile_BBQ 232]

3 minutes ago, xJammer said:

 

All I meant to say is that when you are facing 0 players on the opponent's team you can commit to the "riskiest" missions. Because the primary risk of working solo for 2 hours on an airfield is a single individual fighter coming 2km above you and completely taking away your chances to accomplish the mission. That fighter doesn't even have to be good - smoke an engine or leak a fuel tank and you have to go home or lose the aircraft. I got lucky in that mission that nobody went out of their way and flew the 40km from a neighbouring airfield to intercept me. However when you are 10:0 there is no element of luck in such a mission  

Point taken.  So the question is when there is no one available to man the other team what can be done to 'balance' this?  Or when a team is outnumbered vastly how do we balance it?   Would we, dare I say it, have to trigger AI reinforcements every time a team outnumbers the other by +10?  We all know that AI can be a rather dubious thing in IL-2, but what if lost AI didn't count against the "lost planes and pilots" score? 

[[110]xJammer 51]

17 minutes ago, =AVG77=Mobile_BBQ said:

Point taken.  So the question is when there is no one available to man the other team what can be done to 'balance' this?  Or when a team is outnumbered vastly how do we balance it?   Would we, dare I say it, have to trigger AI reinforcements every time a team outnumbers the other by +10?  We all know that AI can be a rather dubious thing in IL-2, but what if lost AI didn't count against the "lost planes and pilots" score? 

 

Difficult question. I don't think AI is a solution as you would at most turn soloing targets into "duo-ling" them with one guy working on the ground while the other one distracts whatever AI you throw at it. It will also take away a lot of the TAW charm where anything that moves is a player  

 

 

Considering what we have managed to achieve on TAW as a group of random pubbies that organised in chat and on teamspeak I am scared to think what an organised squad could achieve if they just stop caring about the roleplay aspects of the game.

Edited December 19, 2018 by xJammer

[=AVG77=Mobile_BBQ 232]

I agree that all actions being player generated is ideal, but I also think there has to be a way to keep the numbers more consistent.  I'm even considering forgoing flying tonight when it will be nearly guaranteed to swing toward Red for a few hours and get some morning flights with Axis filling it in to alleviate the boredom of not getting shot at except for AAA.

 

Well, speaking on behalf of the now 5-man squad I joined and the Cat Herd that joins with us, I haven't seen anybody roleplaying.  I have been and have seen pilots take caution or decline suggested missions due to the possibility of 100% blowing a full plane set in one mission.  Honestly, I'm not too good with fighters, I'm slightly better with Il-2s and the only plane I have a decent run with is the Pe-2 which is not a +1.  I really don't mind transport missions, but I'd really rather not do them.  That's not to say I wouldn't get in a Lagg-3 or Yak with a packed house and lots of Axis, but that would be purely for my own fun and practice as I couldn't really be useful to the team.  I surely would be more conservative with my Pe-2s though.    

[ACG_Smokejumper 164]

5 hours ago, 666GIAP_Necathor said:

The IL2 empennage is more weak for the flying tank.

 

If you mean the Il2 I agree and disagree. The vertical stabilizer comes off pretty easy but the rest is solid. The whole tail of the 109 is still easy to knock off.

[=AVG77=Mobile_BBQ 232]

2 hours ago, 7./JG26_Smokejumper said:

 

 The whole tail of the 109 is still easy to knock off.

If I recall correctly, I've seen P-51combat training videos that stated the tail was in fact this weak.  I'll look around and see if I can find it again. 

[-IRRE-Centx 171]

8 hours ago, =AVG77=Mobile_BBQ said:

and the only plane I have a decent run with is the Pe-2 which is not a +1.  I really don't mind transport missions, but I'd really rather not do them. 

 

Just my 2 cents here as a Ju-88 / Pe-2 enthousiast (or A-20 too) : if you're not used to do it, you can farm combat missions by level bombing defensive positions from medium altitude.

If you come at 350-400 km/h at 2-3k altitude, drop bombs and immediately do a 180° turn (don't stay in the bombing view to watch your bombs exploding, cool guys don't look at explosions), you will never get shot by the AA.

And if you dive fast after your bomb run to gain maximum speed and get out of the danger area, you will almost never meet an enemy fighter, since you are out of the area before the enemy get the message signaling that it was under attack. 

By doing this, you can be effective with your bomber AND conservative, and you'll never need transport missions. Average time of mission (from take off to land) : 20-30min depending on map configuration.

I did this a lot on maps #3 and #4, I never lost my bomber, neither by AA or fighter. Only one fighter tried to shoot me down once, but since I dived at 550-600 km/h into friendly territory after dropping my bomb, he didn't follow me far and I went back to base safely. 

 

[ECV56_Chimango 339]

@=LG=Kathon now 3.009 is out; maybe we can use the Po-2 next TAW edition to counter Ju-52 operations.

 

Maybe there could be a LZ for a VVS spy and that gathers info for red side, like LZs or maybe some recon to enemy positions so when we bomb an airfield the damage we do it's twice as much when is not reconed (like old Airforce War from =BY= squad)

 

Come on; any creative people suggestions for this great bird in TAW?

 

 

 

Edited December 19, 2018 by 666GIAP_Chimango

[ACG_Smokejumper 164]

11 hours ago, =AVG77=Mobile_BBQ said:

If I recall correctly, I've seen P-51combat training videos that stated the tail was in fact this weak.  I'll look around and see if I can find it again. 

 

 

It's thin and so will be weak but...... Metal doesn't just pop off like this. Neither does steel reinforced wood which is what later 109s had. We get a clean sheering at the root too often in my opinion.

[JaffaCake 173]

make PO2 into an AWAC aicraft with 3km radar range

[ECV56_Chimango 339]

Once an enemy airfield has certain ammount of damage, VVS can infiltrate soviet Commandos to capture it. This way it works just like the paratroopers. 

[F/JG300_Faucon 305]

8 hours ago, -IRRE-Centx said:

If you come at 350-400 km/h at 2-3k altitude, drop bombs and immediately do a 180° turn (don't stay in the bombing view to watch your bombs exploding, cool guys don't look at explosions), you will never get shot by the AA.

 

Am I still a cool guy if I'm looking at my explosions with the belly gunner after the turn? 

[SCG_OpticFlow 85]

Ju-52 at typical flight altitude in enemy territory.

 

[-IRRE-Centx 171]

13 minutes ago, F/JG300_Faucon said:

 

Am I still a cool guy if I'm looking at my explosions with the belly gunner after the turn? 

 

You're 50% cool.
Real cool guys don't have to look to know their job is done.

 

 

[StG77_Kondor 320]

3 hours ago, 666GIAP_Chimango said:

@=LG=Kathon now 3.009 is out; maybe we can use the Po-2 next TAW edition to counter Ju-52 operations.

 

Maybe there could be a LZ for a VVS spy and that gathers info for red side, like LZs or maybe some recon to enemy positions so when we bomb an airfield the damage we do it's twice as much when is not reconed (like old Airforce War from =BY= squad)

 

Come on; any creative people suggestions for this great bird in TAW?

Buenas 'Che
I have not looked at what loadouts the Po-2 has available, does it have supply drop? My guess is no but it was used often to re-supply partisans and surrounded troops in the rear with weapons, food etc. If something can be done to simulate a supply drop that could also work just like with the Ju-52s. You could have designated 'partisan' areas that are hidden for blue just as the FJ drops are hidden for Red. The Po-2's can resupply these areas and if a certain level is reached there is a chance to capture the AF, or totally destroy part or all of the AFs defenses - so tanks have an easy time capturing it. 

[=LG=Blakhart 264]

http://taw.stg2.de/pilot_sortie.php?id=57048&name==LG=Blakhart

 

Got serious hits on Yak1 in a spin.
Solid 3-4 seconds.
in real life combat guy would blow up in for 1000 pieces, but after last patch we shoot with Harribo Bears...
 ( or maybe even Harribo bear can make more than 0.05 %  damage)
Nevermind...
Guy managed to recover from flat spin, then he ran away to airbase.

Later, low at ground level couldn`t finish this damaged Yak1 in full healthy 109F-4 because some random player pushed one magic button ---> "flaps" 

(Which is keeping big ego [edited] since 2014 😄 😄 😄 )

 

Then I disengaged due to AAA at airbase. Smoking from every hole Yak turn back, pushed flaps button once again, regained speed in 3 seconds to be able to chase full healthy 109 F4 (at emergency power). 
I made few push-pull tricks to avoid enemy fire. He was too far for a shot and serious damage...

Then - wing off from 400-500 m.

 

0_0... [edited]

 

1 hit = 100%

 

[edited]

Edited December 20, 2018 by SYN_Haashashin

[7.GShAP/Silas 382]

1 hour ago, StG77_Kondor said:

Buenas 'Che
I have not looked at what loadouts the Po-2 has available, does it have supply drop? My guess is no but it was used often to re-supply partisans and surrounded troops in the rear with weapons, food etc. If something can be done to simulate a supply drop that could also work just like with the Ju-52s. You could have designated 'partisan' areas that are hidden for blue just as the FJ drops are hidden for Red. The Po-2's can resupply these areas and if a certain level is reached there is a chance to capture the AF, or totally destroy part or all of the AFs defenses - so tanks have an easy time capturing it. 

 

 

There is no supply drop loadout, but surely landing in or simply overflying the correct zone could count(landing is harder than dropping paratroopers, though) .  Very exciting, I would greatly enjoy flying those missions.

 

I would also love to have the Po-2 useable for supply flights with some bonus in the same manner as the Ju-52.  Finally an alternative to the Pe-2.

Edited December 19, 2018 by 7.GShAP/Silas

[II./JG77_Manu* 874]

11 minutes ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

There is no supply drop loadout, but surely landing in or simply overflying the correct zone could count(landing is harder than dropping paratroopers, though) .  Very exciting, I would greatly enjoy flying those missions.

 

I would also love to have the Po-2 useable for supply flights with some bonus in the same manner as the Ju-52.

I think we should keep it realistic. The Po-2 is a small aircraft with small loadouts. Supply drop doesn't make sense, nor does supply flights, the aircraft is not made for that. VVS will get the Li-2 soon enough as Ju-52 copycat. There are so many great things how you could implement the Po, as others have already noted:

 

- Landing a spy in a distinct region: spy will gather intel about Ju-52 dropzones (make it visible for the whole mission)

 

- Landing a saboteur: Airfields won't be able to spawn a certain aircraft type, because saboteur..well saboteured it

 

- doing low level recon: when Aircraft comes very close to enemy ground troops (tanks, arty etc.) at very low alt, the damage by bombs on them is higher (for that i don't know if it is possible to implement)

 

This would lead to some nice asymetrical gameplay.

 

Man i am jealous, it will be surely thrilling to move hand over hand from one treetop to the next with the constant fear to get caught 🤩

[7.GShAP/Silas 382]

5 minutes ago, II./JG77_Manu* said:

I think we should keep it realistic. The Po-2 is a small aircraft with small loadouts. Supply drop doesn't make sense, nor does supply flights, the aircraft is not made for that. VVS will get the Li-2 soon enough as Ju-52 copycat.

 

 

The aircraft was absolutely used as a supply aircraft.  It was used as a kind of fast taxi to ferry those with urgent business between airfields and military encampments.  It often carried medical supplies, weapons, ammunition, explosives, liaison officers.  Delivering officers is no less a supply mission than anything else.

 

It is far more historically correct to have the Po-2 as a supply aircraft than a Pe-2.

Edited December 19, 2018 by 7.GShAP/Silas

[II./JG77_Manu* 874]

1 minute ago, 7.GShAP/Silas said:

The aircraft was absolutely used as a supply aircraft.  It was used as a kind of fast taxi to ferry those with urgent business between airfields and military encampments.  It often carried medical supplies, weapons, ammunition, explosives, liaison officers.

 

It is far more historically correct to have the Po-2 as a supply aircraft than a Pe-2.

 

Ah i was confusing it with the Ju-52 "big crate paradrop supplies". Got you wrong there. As "fast taxi" as you call it, would be nice. But i think there should be a different effect compared to the big Ju-52 supplies..

[JG5_Schuck 254]

Ha ha ha.....

The Po-2, carrying out 'Fast taxi' Para drops, one man at a time!!!

Would be great if it could be incorporated as a spotter plane of some sort (uncovering hidden targets),

just need the Germans to get the 'Uhu'.....

[MentalishMan 20]

On 12/18/2018 at 9:27 AM, =AVG77=Garven said:

Looking at Xjammers sorties it looks like a lot of his "landings" are belly landings at his own airfield presumably since lowering landing gear takes too much time.

To be Fair he did mention this a while back, if you know him from Coconut you should know what kind of stuff he pulls ;)

 

I respect you @xJammer as a Pilot on the Sim Field but not in the Forums and your "Crazy" Opinions. 

Edited December 20, 2018 by MentalishMan
Clarifying.

[=LG=Blakhart 264]

[edited]

 

2. This forum is provided by 1C-777 Ltd. as a courtesy and its usage is a privilege and 1C-777 Ltd. reserves the right to ban any member temporarily or permanently for any reason at any time. Any penalties listed below for violations of the rules are guidelines only and forum administration may take additional action if they feel it is warranted. Use of the forum is not connected to usage of the game and access to this forum is not guaranteed to users as a consequence of purchasing the game.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2018 by SYN_Haashashin

[MentalishMan 20]

11 hours ago, =LG=Blakhart said:

http://

edited]

 

2. This forum is provided by 1C-777 Ltd. as a courtesy and its usage is a privilege and 1C-777 Ltd. reserves the right to ban any member temporarily or permanently for any reason at any time. Any penalties listed below for violations of the rules are guidelines only and forum administration may take additional action if they feel it is warranted. Use of the forum is not connected to usage of the game and access to this forum is not guaranteed to users as a consequence of purchasing the game.

 

 

You got a replay along side it, sounds like a bunch of 109 Jocks flying to close to a Peshka it get a Wiff of the Exhaust Fumes and got punched in the Nose by some 12.7mm Rounds. You know its hard to control a plane if you aim for its major Control surfaces like I dunno the Rudder, Elevator, Engines and Ailerons. Sit down and watch the Replay and see what y'all did wrong, but its hard to come to the fact that Glorious 109 pilots do no make mistakes, yes the DM's are all over the place but to hear almost a Entire Flight of 109's get shot down by a Single PE-2 busting my sides like no other. 

Edited December 20, 2018 by SYN_Haashashin

[DerSheriff 870]

13 minutes ago, MentalishMan said:

You got a replay along side it, sounds like a bunch of 109 Jocks flying to close to a Peshka it get a Wiff of the Exhaust Fumes and got punched in the Nose by some 12.7mm Rounds. You know its hard to control a plane if you aim for its major Control surfaces like I dunno the Rudder, Elevator, Engines and Ailerons. Sit down and watch the Replay and see what y'all did wrong, but its hard to come to the fact that Glorious 109 pilots do no make mistakes, yes the DM's are all over the place but to hear almost a Entire Flight of 109's get shot down by a Single PE-2 busting my sides like no other. 

 

There is something off.
 

 

[Operation_Ivy 368]

I would propose to put TAW on hold until things get sorted out with the DM bug. A little christmas break is nice as well.

[MentalishMan 20]

8 minutes ago, DerSheriff said:

 

There is something off.
 

 

Ive had that happen to me Before on Coconuts. We were RTB'ing away from a AO about 1 to 2 Grid Refs away and my A-20 Ripped apart, the P-39 pilot with me Ripped apart and the other Yak 1 Pilot ripped apart in the middle of the Open Area. No Flak Burst, we were far enough away from each other. I can probably sit down and find the Replay but at least with this it shows whats all going on. Thanks for showing a Example of whats all going on and instead of spouting stuff over the forums calling foul on the reds. 

Edited December 20, 2018 by MentalishMan
Stuff.

[mincer 46]

People that complaining about the "advantage" VVS has with Pe-2, have you ever tried to fly in I-16 or LaGG-3 against contemporary LW fighters? Did you try to intercept a He-111 or Ju-88 in a 4xSHKAS I-16?

[ECV56_Chimango 339]

Please stop TAW till they fix this bug! I have uploaded the 1' track.

 

I've just shot a 109F4, just 1 hit and he went inmediately wings off and spiraled to the ground like on Dersheriff video.

 

Put it on hold!

 

https://taw.stg2.de/pilot_sortie.php?id=57538&name=666GIAP_Chimango

 

 

DOWNLOAD TRACK=> http://www.mediafire.com/file/dsuc9x7tpnr14sh/v3009_DM_Bug.zip/file

[-=PHX=-Geo- 28]

1 hour ago, ECV56_Chimango said:

Please stop TAW till they fix this bug! I have uploaded the 1' track.

+1 I agree with you Chimango, one 110´s gunner broke my wing with his 7.92 mm and die, i was at 650 km/h and i was like 400 mts behind, i did not know about this bug, if i knew i had not entered today, so that my streak is gone...

 

[CSW_606_Druindin 6]

He111 "100% DM bug"

 

Edited December 20, 2018 by CSW_606_Druindin

[=AVG77=Mobile_BBQ 232]

15 hours ago, 7./JG26_Smokejumper said:

 

 

It's thin and so will be weak but...... Metal doesn't just pop off like this. Neither does steel reinforced wood which is what later 109s had. We get a clean sheering at the root too often in my opinion.

 

Well, considering that the 109's elevators are attached, along with the rudder, to the vertical stabilizer and not the fuselage, cutting of the vertical stab will get rid of all the vital controls.  I agree that clean breaks area bit too common so, I'm good with doing the same amount of damage to the same vital point and causing the whole assembly to violently flop around for a moment or two before it rips clean.  Game visuals or not, the result will be, as it should be, the same.

[=LG=Blakhart 264]

7 hours ago, MentalishMan said:

You got a replay along side it, sounds like a bunch of 109 Jocks flying to close to a Peshka it get a Wiff of the Exhaust Fumes and got punched in the Nose by some 12.7mm Rounds. You know its hard to control a plane if you aim for its major Control surfaces like I dunno the Rudder, Elevator, Engines and Ailerons. Sit down and watch the Replay and see what y'all did wrong, but its hard to come to the fact that Glorious 109 pilots do no make mistakes, yes the DM's are all over the place but to hear almost a Entire Flight of 109's get shot down by a Single PE-2 busting my sides like no other. 

 

After other report about the dm bug in last patch...

 

Thank you for being wrong

Apologies accepted 😄 😄 😄

 

[Fritz_Faber 12]

1 hour ago, CSW_606_Druindin said:

He111 "100% DM bug"

 

I guess, the He111 was me HDG 320 from Krasnodar.... maybe you're right. but look at my flight-report, He111 was totally damaged, had to ditch without enginepower... think about, He111 is a large plane, is able to take some hits.

 

 

Dropzones are bugged. Mission 285 we dropped with 3xJu52 at DZ Akhtyrskaya, no reports after Paras have landed, not reported in missionsummary. Anyone else realized that?

Edited December 20, 2018 by Fritz-Faber

[JaffaCake 173]

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/8056-обсуждение-версии-3009-у-2вс-крепость-на-волге-бостоны-над-кубанью/?do=findComment&comment=658820

 

Online translator gives this:

 

Quote

There is no other change in either FM or DM in 3.009 compared to 3.008, except for those listed in the update list. I specifically did a control check of the code before the release. If something constantly seems to someone from version to version, keep the old versions and do correct comparative tests, because individual cases are not indicative, you need statistics on DM for comparison. And it is better to do these tests offline, if we are talking about DM and not about the network.

 

Edited December 20, 2018 by JaffaCake

[CSW_606_Druindin 6]

27 minutes ago, Fritz-Faber said:

I guess, the He111 was me HDG 320 from Krasnodar.... maybe you're right. but look at my flight-report, He111 was totally damaged, had to ditch without enginepower... think about, He111 is a large plane, is able to take some hits.

 

 

Dropzones are bugged. Mission 285 we dropped with 3xJu52 at DZ Akhtyrskaya, no reports after Paras have landed, not reported in missionsummary. Anyone else realized that?

 

I do not complain about the increased resistance of He111, but I point to the excessive efficiency of the shooters.
2 hits - 2x 100% damage - 2 kills

[II./JG77_Manu* 874]

12 minutes ago, CSW_606_Druindin said:

 

I do not complain about the increased resistance of He111, but I point to the excessive efficiency of the shooters.
2 hits - 2x 100% damage - 2 kills

 

Like said quite a few times by now, that is not FM/DM related, but it's a bug that came with the latest update yesterday, unfortunately

[Fritz_Faber 12]

Dropzones are bugged. Mission 285 we dropped 3xJu52 at DZ Akhtyrskaya, no reports after Paras have landed, not reported in missionsummary. Anyone else realized that?

[SYN_Haashashin 949]

Hi all,

 

As said several times since yesterday, there is a bug in MP. Nothing to do with DM or FM or nothing similar but you can breath, they will fix it soon.

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/8056-обсуждение-версии-3009-у-2вс-крепость-на-волге-бостоны-над-кубанью/?do=findComment&comment=658923

 

We confirm the problem in a multiplayer game, something is wrong with the network (in a single-player game, everything is OK), we 
understand, there will be a hot fix ...

 

Haash

[ECV56_Chimango 339]

Thank you Haash!

Once it's fixed, i'll miss this MP bug for sure