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JG7_X-Man

@=LG=Blakhart I must say the new plane set is exactly what I had been requesting for awhile! Thanks for finally implementing this into the game!

There is no universal gain to automatically give everyone a particular collectors aircraft as an upgrade if everyone doesn't have it. :salute: Awesome job in finding away to fix that issue.

 

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WokeUpBlue

So far so good, but I anticipate that people will get quite discouraged at losing ALL their advanced planes if they die even in their basic plane.

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JV44Midnightoker

Its feeling really fucking grindy. The only way to get a good amount of CP is ground attack and the AA is merciless. Perhaps a lower CP threshold to ADV planes? or losing the plane you lose not everything you earned and the rank? 

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335th_GRphgeorg

Is it my feeling or there is a total unbalance of powers? Especially in this first round. If the Blues cannot advance to ADV planes (Bf-109F2) it seems almost impossible to win any map. And most of the time (European zone) the reds are almost double in number.

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WokeUpBlue
26 minutes ago, 335th_GRphgeorg said:

Is it my feeling or there is a total unbalance of powers? Especially in this first round. If the Blues cannot advance to ADV planes (Bf-109F2) it seems almost impossible to win any map. And most of the time (European zone) the reds are almost double in number.


There’s rarely balance during North American time zones as well, but it goes both ways. I made accounts on both sides and try to fly on the smaller side, but that sometimes feels weird.

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Pict
30 minutes ago, 335th_GRphgeorg said:

Is it my feeling or there is a total unbalance of powers? Especially in this first round. If the Blues cannot advance to ADV planes (Bf-109F2) it seems almost impossible to win any map. And most of the time (European zone) the reds are almost double in number.

 

Just a feeling I'd say as it's balanced to within an AA gun of it's existence 💀

 

Numbers vary throughout the day and night, but the server has always had a built in balance feature to even things out, they have been very particular about that and as far I can say done a good job of it.

 

I'm flying Red and signed up for the Pe-2 as it looked to be consistently available end to end of the campaign. However I have to get an IL2 before I get to the Pe-2 and to do that I have to fly ground attack in an I-16 or MiG-3, later LAGG-3 which is nigh on suicidal.

 

Not impossible though and I'll chip away at it even though it's unlikely that I'll survive the IL-2 if I manage to get one :biggrin:

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-=RedS=-Str1ke
Posted (edited)

The end of first map is near.

Starting RCP about planeset on next war on first map, please vote.

 

Edited by SG152_Walter_Hagen
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KG200_Achilleus
Posted (edited)

Planeset is as it was always, some times favors the blue side, and some other the red side.

Just play coordinate with your team (if you have the abilities) and you will be ok even with emils vs migs.

The issue here i believe is the unbalanced teams, especially at early hours it is 3 vs 18 or so, map is maybe changed in only one morning..

Forgive me Blacky if i am wrong, but i am pretty sure that i heard something about balancing in briefing video. 

 

Really missed the old hyperlobby days where a restart where made if 2 or 3 players where more in one side..:)

Fix this unbalancing issue first, and then we will have a really challenging campaign..;)

Maybe a server stop would be a good idea between 5.00am and 15.00pm gmt hours where most unbalancing is occurs.. 

Edited by KG200_Achilleus
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Ala13_Antiguo
Posted (edited)

In this edition of the TAW, as in the game itself (GREAT BATTLES ....) the right-handed pilots in the level bomber, we are excluded.

Having to fly fighters and attack planes to get our bomber plane, I think it is a titanic task and even almost impossible.

Personally, I am almost exclusively a level bomber pilot, forcing myself to fly a fighter plane does not seem fair to me.

What would a fighter pilot feel if he was asked to fly a bomber and then an attack plane in order to get his fighter plane?

Without a doubt the level bombardment is completely removed from this server (my favorite).

Being able to fly with my wing mates bomber formations as before, seems impossible to me.

Being able to survive the entire campaign also seems impossible to me, .. (I have the "The Golden Statue of KUZNECHIK" award for surviving AN ENTIRE campaign, accompanied by a diploma for the highest number of targets destroyed) .... since we are obliged to perform tasks where I personally am not right-handed (fighter planes and JABO), my specialty is bombing at height and level.

I leave you this video of the TAW. May 2020 .... what good times to gain height with friends.

 

 

Regards .

 

 

 

 

Edited by ALA13_Antiguo
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KoN_

Just tried to fly I have some spare time . I can not take off I am restricted to an 8 minute no fly . I was only going to do a Supply run . 

Do I really have to wait 8 minutes just to do a toilet paper supply run . Seems very restricted.

35-Red

8 - blue 

Can I join Both armies' . Be a double agent . Hmm guess not . thinking about it . 😆

 

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1./JG42flesch

The Player (FF)Fishe killt me on Cute after 20 sec off turn out. Concratulation to this Honor Aktion!

A very great Sportsman.

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WokeUpBlue
3 hours ago, KoN_ said:

Just tried to fly I have some spare time . I can not take off I am restricted to an 8 minute no fly . I was only going to do a Supply run . 

Do I really have to wait 8 minutes just to do a toilet paper supply run . Seems very restricted.

35-Red

8 - blue 

Can I join Both armies' . Be a double agent . Hmm guess not . thinking about it . 😆

 


You can have an account and fly on both sides, I do. You’re not allowed to fly both sides during the same map, but I’m guessing that if you don’t even take off from one side before switching to the other it would be ok. Or check the website to see server balance first.

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KoN_
1 hour ago, 1./JG42flesch said:

The Player (FF)Fishe killt me on Cute after 20 sec off turn out. Concratulation to this Honor Aktion!

A very great Sportsman.

Chute killing is allowed . Has been for quite some time and its a heated debate .

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6./ZG26_Gielow
5 hours ago, ALA13_Antiguo said:

In this edition of the TAW, as in the game itself (GREAT BATTLES ....) the right-handed pilots in the level bomber, we are excluded.

Having to fly fighters and attack planes to get our bomber plane, I think it is a titanic task and even almost impossible.

Personally, I am almost exclusively a level bomber pilot, forcing myself to fly a fighter plane does not seem fair to me.

What would a fighter pilot feel if he was asked to fly a bomber and then an attack plane in order to get his fighter plane?

Without a doubt the level bombardment is completely removed from this server (my favorite).

Being able to fly with my wing mates bomber formations as before, seems impossible to me.

Being able to survive the entire campaign also seems impossible to me, .. (I have the "The Golden Statue of KUZNECHIK" award for surviving AN ENTIRE campaign, accompanied by a diploma for the highest number of targets destroyed) .... since we are obliged to perform tasks where I personally am not right-handed (fighter planes and JABO), my specialty is bombing at height and level.

I leave you this video of the TAW. May 2020 .... what good times to gain height with friends.

 

 

Regards .

 

 

I was just about to ask that after taking a quick look on my career spreadsheet.  

 

No level bombers and no attackers planes available on level bombers and attackers pilots careers !?!? 

 

Just did a rail station  mission with 2x100kg bombs on a Mig3 and got only 5 ground kills.

Good plane but horrible payload for ground attack.

 

Going home after bombing, I get a message of truck convoy being attacked nearby. I changed my course to help the ground troops and expecting to intercept some Stukas or 110s to get te CPs necessary to unlock the Pe2. Big mistake !!! Four 109s strafing the trucks because of course they don't have access to Stukas or 110s either. Result after quick dogfight:  Plane damaged and lost.  72AG was nearby and revenged me. 

 

Now I have to fly i16s to try to get to unlock a Pe2 ?!!? I can't even think in the possibility of making 16 CPs to get a Mig back then extra 16 CPs to get a IL2, then extra 16 CPs to get the Pe2.    

 

I am sorry TAW guys but you made a terrible mistake. We know IL2 game is totally fighter biased franchise but you let Jason Williams eating dust after this campaign design decision.   

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=RainDogs=Quimbymouse
6 hours ago, ALA13_Antiguo said:

In this edition of the TAW, as in the game itself (GREAT BATTLES ....) the right-handed pilots in the level bomber, we are excluded.

Having to fly fighters and attack planes to get our bomber plane, I think it is a titanic task and even almost impossible.

Personally, I am almost exclusively a level bomber pilot, forcing myself to fly a fighter plane does not seem fair to me.

What would a fighter pilot feel if he was asked to fly a bomber and then an attack plane in order to get his fighter plane?

Without a doubt the level bombardment is completely removed from this server (my favorite).

Being able to fly with my wing mates bomber formations as before, seems impossible to me.

Being able to survive the entire campaign also seems impossible to me, .. (I have the "The Golden Statue of KUZNECHIK" award for surviving AN ENTIRE campaign, accompanied by a diploma for the highest number of targets destroyed) .... since we are obliged to perform tasks where I personally am not right-handed (fighter planes and JABO), my specialty is bombing at height and level.

I leave you this video of the TAW. May 2020 .... what good times to gain height with friends.

 

 

Regards .

 

 

 

 


In the past I've generally defended the TAW team. Through all the typical mumblings one usually sees on here (imbalance in planesets, player numbers on each side, the lives system, etc etc) I've stood firmly in the camp of, "if you really don't like it, don't play it." Even if I didn't 100% agree with a decision made by the TAW team I could see the rationale...what they were trying to accomplish.

But this right here...forcing dedicated ground pounders to fly fighters with the hope of surviving long enough to unlock their planes...especially with the level bombers who I would argue are some of the most dedicated flyers out there...well...I just don't understand the reasoning behind it. 

My suggestion would be to have the basic and advanced plane idea strictly for the fighter planes, and have a separate career path for bombers with no fighters available. 

Just my 2 cents...for what it's worth.  

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RedKestrel
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, 6./ZG26_Gielow said:

I was just about to ask that after taking a quick look on my career spreadsheet.  

 

No level bombers and no attackers planes available on level bombers and attackers pilots careers !?!? 

 

Just did a rail station  mission with 2x100kg bombs on a Mig3 and got only 5 ground kills.

Good plane but horrible payload for ground attack.

 

Going home after bombing, I get a message of truck convoy being attacked nearby. I changed my course to help the ground troops and expecting to intercept some Stukas or 110s to get te CPs necessary to unlock the Pe2. Big mistake !!! Four 109s strafing the trucks because of course they don't have access to Stukas or 110s either. Result after quick dogfight:  Plane damaged and lost.  72AG was nearby and revenged me. 

 

Now I have to fly i16s to try to get to unlock a Pe2 ?!!? I can't even think in the possibility of making 16 CPs to get a Mig back then extra 16 CPs to get a IL2, then extra 16 CPs to get the Pe2.    

 

I am sorry TAW guys but you made a terrible mistake. We know IL2 game is totally fighter biased franchise but you let Jason Williams eating dust after this campaign design decision.   

I don't think you will have to re-unlock the MiG-3, the Combat Points only matter when trying to unlock advanced planes - at least if Im reading the manual right. Death gets you -6 Combat points penalty on top of 0 CP for the mission so dying on a mission leaves you worse off than if you hadn't flown at all.

Had you survived the initial attack with the MIG, you probably would have gotten between 5-10 CP for the ground targets, depending on what you killed. If you were not captured or killed when you went down, you would still get half your CP. 

But you're right, you first have to get 16 CP for the Il-2, then get the 16 CP for the Pe-2 - 32 CP total. If you get 5 CP per mission, that's 6 missions - if you get 10, thats 3 missions.

It doesn't appear that the distinctive careers are working as intended - rather than having people choose distinct disciplines like attacker, fighter, bomber, and fly those types of planes in your career, everyone spends the majority of their time flying basic fighters. Ironically, the availability of MiG-3s is more than the Il-2s for the first three maps, when production of MiGs was stopped in order to make more Il-2s. 

EDIT: To be fair, this does  model the shortage of Il-2s in the early war, when fighters were pressed into service as ground attackers. By mid war (and mid TAW) we see Il-2s available as basic planes again. 

 

The survivability of the 'advanced' planes like the Il-2 and the Ju-87 is ironically lower than the basic planes so the chances of flying more than a few  missions in one without getting killed or captured is probably pretty low. The Il-2 and the Ju-87 should probably be a basic plane for the attacker career. 
 

I haven't had time to fly yet - the only time I could was on the weekend and the server was understandably packed and I couldn't get in. I'd signed up to be a bomber/attack pilot but it looks like I will need to fly a lot of fighters as fighter/bombers before getting an attacker. Assuming I ever earn one - which is unlikely, given my history lol. I don't think things will change though so I suppose I must make the I-16s and the MiGs work as fighter bombers. 

Edited by RedKestrel
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[FF]Fishe
3 hours ago, 1./JG42flesch said:

The Player (FF)Fishe killt me on Cute after 20 sec off turn out. Concratulation to this Honor Aktion!

A very great Sportsman.

💕 I love complaints about online games. I’ve been chute killed before, now you have been chute killed. When it happened to me I didn’t go into an online forum to complain about a game mechanic which is explicitly allowed in the rules. Sorry for spoiling your rank and K/D. I hope one day you can forgive me, I may not sleep otherwise.

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WokeUpBlue
1 hour ago, RedKestrel said:

I don't think you will have to re-unlock the MiG-3, the Combat Points only matter when trying to unlock advanced planes - at least if Im reading the manual right. Death gets you -6 Combat points penalty on top of 0 CP for the mission so dying on a mission leaves you worse off than if you hadn't flown at all.

Had you survived the initial attack with the MIG, you probably would have gotten between 5-10 CP for the ground targets, depending on what you killed. If you were not captured or killed when you went down, you would still get half your CP. 

But you're right, you first have to get 16 CP for the Il-2, then get the 16 CP for the Pe-2 - 32 CP total. If you get 5 CP per mission, that's 6 missions - if you get 10, thats 3 missions.

It doesn't appear that the distinctive careers are working as intended - rather than having people choose distinct disciplines like attacker, fighter, bomber, and fly those types of planes in your career, everyone spends the majority of their time flying basic fighters. Ironically, the availability of MiG-3s is more than the Il-2s for the first three maps, when production of MiGs was stopped in order to make more Il-2s. 

EDIT: To be fair, this does  model the shortage of Il-2s in the early war, when fighters were pressed into service as ground attackers. By mid war (and mid TAW) we see Il-2s available as basic planes again. 

 

The survivability of the 'advanced' planes like the Il-2 and the Ju-87 is ironically lower than the basic planes so the chances of flying more than a few  missions in one without getting killed or captured is probably pretty low. The Il-2 and the Ju-87 should probably be a basic plane for the attacker career. 
 

I haven't had time to fly yet - the only time I could was on the weekend and the server was understandably packed and I couldn't get in. I'd signed up to be a bomber/attack pilot but it looks like I will need to fly a lot of fighters as fighter/bombers before getting an attacker. Assuming I ever earn one - which is unlikely, given my history lol. I don't think things will change though so I suppose I must make the I-16s and the MiGs work as fighter bombers. 

 

I think you have it mostly right, you don't have to get CPs to get your basic plane back if you die, you start with a hangar full of basic planes again. The Stuka IS available as a basic attack plane for the blue side, but most blues will probably choose the E7 with four small bombs unless they know they have total air superiority.

 

Flying 5-6 sorties with 5-6 CPs for each sortie in order to get the PE-2 should be achievable; I got 6 and 7 CPs in the two I-16 sorties that I dedicated to ground attack on this map. The frustrating part will come from having to do it again if I get killed or captured.

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RedKestrel
1 hour ago, WokeUpDead said:

 

I think you have it mostly right, you don't have to get CPs to get your basic plane back if you die, you start with a hangar full of basic planes again. The Stuka IS available as a basic attack plane for the blue side, but most blues will probably choose the E7 with four small bombs unless they know they have total air superiority.

 

Flying 5-6 sorties with 5-6 CPs for each sortie in order to get the PE-2 should be achievable; I got 6 and 7 CPs in the two I-16 sorties that I dedicated to ground attack on this map. The frustrating part will come from having to do it again if I get killed or captured.

Yeah I looked back later and read the chart better, and saw that I was wrong.

For me I seriously doubt I will get 5-6 sorties in a row without death. I rarely manage this feat on other servers and can't imagine TAW will be more forgiving there. But such is life (or death, as the case may be). But I do like the I-16 and the MiG so its not so bad.

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WokeUpBlue
1 hour ago, RedKestrel said:

 But I do like the I-16 and the MiG so its not so bad.

 

True, the basic fighter planes look mostly competitive with the advanced ones on all the maps. But grinding and staying alive for the level bombers is an issue.

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Pict
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, WokeUpDead said:

 

True, the basic fighter planes look mostly competitive with the advanced ones on all the maps. But grinding and staying alive for the level bombers is an issue.

 

The fighter planes may well be balanced, assuming there's a fighter jockey of some ability in the cockpit, but people who have up till now mostly flown bombers and signed up to fly bombers will struggle very hard to achieve anything, let alone sit in a bomber cockpit. This has as much to do with opportunity as it has with experience / ability, as just getting on the server sometimes is difficult. And when you eventually do reach the target area, it's either already been wiped out, or you get shot down by flak or someone who has more hours & kills than all the German experten put together, in which case you wind up worse off that if you hadn't joined the server at all :) 

 

So as someone who usually pilots a Pe-2 and signed up for the last option, it's easy to understand why a few people are finding this difficult to swallow.

 

It's would be equally easy to understand that the LG guys have put a huge amount of effort into this and have provided a wonderful server that reflects history as much as currently can be in an online gaming environment, if we have followed the whole story, the multiple communiques via forum, video & other media.

 

I would bet that many have missed most of these communications for one reason or another and that most never fully read the manual, feeling that a quick glance through coupled with previous TAW experience will suffice.

This is another story altogether, yet is a large part of the problem. Over communication on multiple platforms, while tempting, can be counter effective, especially if it's not concise, consistent & brief (20 min absolute max for a monologue).

 

======================

 

That said, I'm having fun with the I-16 & MiG.

 

So far I've only had 8 sorties, first two the targets I chose were already wiped out. On the 1st one a guy was attacking my airbase just as I was getting back, but by the time I got the I-16 near enough for a shot at him, the AA took him out. 3rd was a transport in Pe-2, so nothing of value other than 1 transport.

 

4th sortie was an already hair-raising AA suppression idea in a MiG-3 where I got bounced by an experten in a 109E-7, who had already had 1 GK + 1 AK and was planning to add me to his score. I took a fair bit of damage and expected the worst when the shooting stopped as suddenly as it started. Somehow I managed to RTB, but lost a leg then the prop after touchdown and slid to a halt on 2 wheels. Wind speed was at 5 or 6 m/s, so I felt I did well to get down in one piece.

Checking the log of my unannounced expert opponent, I realized that he in turn had been bounced while he was bouncing me and he paid the ultimate price. Big thanks to @=TH=MDA :good: for saving my unworthy skin. This guy I think was also an expert as looking at his log tells me he shot the 109 off my tail yet kept his bombs on board as 2 min later he destroyed 1 AA + 2 tanks, then RTB'd to collect whatever his 1 AK + 3 GK's was worth? I collected +1CP for that caper, I don't yet understand why?

 

5th, 6th & 7th sorties I'd found a tank column near my base that looked untouched, yet had zero AA :)  I made 3 flights, pounded it with bomb's once the rockets twice, plus cannon, but +0CP was had.

 

8th sortie latest and best so far , was a planned AA suppression on an enemy airbase. Worth noting here that so far I have been flying solo and have zero comms set up, which at least from the comms pov is fairly historically accurate in these early VVS birds. All of this is what you are advised to avoid on TAW if you want to survive, yet survive I did after making 2 runs at the target, one with bombs, second with guns.

I got one AA and RTB'd so collected +2CP...

 

...all good so far, but at this pace I don't expect to see a Pe-2 cockpit any time soon unless it a transporter.

 

 

 

Edited by Pict
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=KG76=flyus747
36 minutes ago, Pict said:

 

The fighter planes may well be balanced, assuming there's a fighter jockey of some ability in the cockpit, but people who have up till now mostly flown bombers and signed up to fly bombers will struggle very hard to achieve anything, let alone sit in a bomber cockpit. This has as much to do with opportunity as it has with experience / ability, as just getting on the server sometimes is difficult. And when you eventually do reach the target area, it's either already been wiped out, or you get shot down by flak or someone who has more hours & kills than all the German experten put together, in which case you wind up worse off that if you hadn't joined the server at all :) 

 

So as someone who usually pilots a Pe-2 and signed up for the last option, it's easy to understand why a few people are finding this difficult to swallow.

 

It's would be equally easy to understand that the LG guys have put a huge amount of effort into this and have provided a wonderful server that reflects history as much as currently can be in an online gaming environment, if we have followed the whole story, the multiple communiques via forum, video & other media.

 

I would bet that many have missed most of these communications for one reason or another and that most never fully read the manual, feeling that a quick glance through coupled with previous TAW experience will suffice.

This is another story altogether, yet is a large part of the problem. Over communication on multiple platforms, while tempting, can be counter effective, especially if it's not concise, consistent & brief (20 min absolute max for a monologue).

 

======================

 

That said, I'm having fun with the I-16 & MiG.

 

So far I've only had 8 sorties, first two the targets I chose were already wiped out. On the 1st one a guy was attacking my airbase just as I was getting back, but by the time I got the I-16 near enough for a shot at him, the AA took him out. 3rd was a transport in Pe-2, so nothing of value other than 1 transport.

 

4th sortie was an already hair-raising AA suppression idea in a MiG-3 where I got bounced by an experten in a 109E-7, who had already had 1 GK + 1 AK and was planning to add me to his score. I took a fair bit of damage and expected the worst when the shooting stopped as suddenly as it started. Somehow I managed to RTB, but lost a leg then the prop after touchdown and slid to a halt on 2 wheels. Wind speed was at 5 or 6 m/s, so I felt I did well to get down in one piece.

Checking the log of my unannounced expert opponent, I realized that he in turn had been bounced while he was bouncing me and he paid the ultimate price. Big thanks to @=TH=MDA :good: for saving my unworthy skin. This guy I think was also an expert as looking at his log tells me he shot the 109 off my tail yet kept his bombs on board as 2 min later he destroyed 1 AA + 2 tanks, then RTB'd to collect whatever his 1 AK + 3 GK's was worth? I collected +1CP for that caper, I don't yet understand why?

 

5th, 6th & 7th sorties I'd found a tank column near my base that looked untouched, yet had zero AA :)  I made 3 flights, pounded it with bomb's once the rockets twice, plus cannon, but +0CP was had.

 

8th sortie latest and best so far , was a planned AA suppression on an enemy airbase. Worth noting here that so far I have been flying solo and have zero comms set up, which at least from the comms pov is fairly historically accurate in these early VVS birds. All of this is what you are advised to avoid on TAW if you want to survive, yet survive I did after making 2 runs at the target, one with bombs, second with guns.

I got one AA and RTB'd so collected +2CP...

 

...all good so far, but at this pace I don't expect to see a Pe-2 cockpit any time soon unless it a transporter.

 

 

 

The idea behind locking bombers far up the progression tree was to emphasize how "valuable" they are, but I think the current implementation is not the answer. It has only killed bombers in TAW and made them nonexistent. The idea of "fly more of what you want" has been thrown out the window for bombers and attackers. There is no Ju87 line, no IL2 line. It is not enough to simply tuck these roles under the "bomber lines" and call it fair.

As you point out, almost no one is flying bombers and the ones that have it are too scared to bring it out because they know if they are KILLED/CAPTURED they will have to restart all the way from the beginning. If it takes 5 hours to finally be able to unlock a bomber how many players, at any given time, you can surely expect that bombers will be nearly absent from the gameplay.

It is like War Thunder...

Rank I has millions of players because everyone has access to it.
Rank II is probably something slightly below that because it's fairly quick to get to.
Rank VI only has probably 50,000 because it takes a much longer time to get there.

Now imagine that everytime you die, you have to start back at Rank I. How then can you imagine there will possibly be any Rank VI vehicles in game?

Bomber pilots do not fly fighters. Imagine if it was reversed. Force fighters to grind the bombers before they can unlock a fighter. Doesn't make sense does it? Then how does the opposite make sense? Pilots choose their careers because they want to fly a specific planes. 

At the moment, I can only imagine how betrayed the bomber pilots feel after signing up on TAW as a bomber only to spend 90% of their sorties flying fighters.

If you want to emphasize how valuable bombers are and still prevent Pe2 spamming, punish the team, not so much the player.

Make it like this: 
Every bomber lost = 5 aircraft
Every attacker lost = 2 aircraft
Every fighter lost = 1 aircraft


OR

Reimagine what "Total Aircraft" is for each team.
For example:

Reds no longer have "1500 aircraft"

Instead, make it like this. Have 800 Pe2s + 200 Yaks + 100 MiG, etc... = 1500 aircraft.

If the Reds want to be reckless with their Pe2s and spam, they will quickly run out and have no more momentum to ground attack with it. 

To prevent players from being reckless with these bombers, punish them if they lose X% of that plane. If there are 100 Pe2s allotted for your team and you are personally responsible for losing 5% of them, you will be punished in some way or form.

 

Conclusion

This is how we make TAW more diverse. I think something like this will still make players value their planes, and pilots will actually be able to "fly more of what they want", and still prevent Pe2 spams.



 

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JG700_Benek
27 minutes ago, =KG76=flyus747 said:

The idea behind locking bombers far up the progression tree was to emphasize how "valuable" they are, but I think the current implementation is not the answer. It has only killed bombers in TAW and made them nonexistent. The idea of "fly more of what you want" has been thrown out the window for bombers and attackers.

 

Why attakcer/bomber pilots shoud have life easier then fighter guys?? I am forced to do ground attack to get my fighter why you shoud not? Also to make it truly the same bombers should be earned by shooting down aircraft 😄

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HR_Tofolo

Quick question: if you have already earned a non-basic airframe, can you lose it without using it? for instance lets say I get an IL-2, but after some missions I get killed in another aircraft without having used it. Will I keep it? 

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JG700_Benek

When you die your hanger resets - it means you will loose all advanced planes you had but you will have full set of basic planes. So yes you can loose adv planes without using it.

 

 

Not sure what happens when you have adv plane and the map changes and it no longer is used or is changed a bit (f2 on maps 3 have 20mm from start)

 

like in german jager line:

 

map2                             maps3

0/2 Bf 109 F-2 early
- no20mm
0/1 Bf 109 F-2
0/1 Bf 109 F-4 1.3ata

no gpods
SC250/SC4x50

 

not sure what will happen if on the endo of map 2 you got 2x F2 i think only one shoud remain but i am not sure and will not be surprised if nnone remains.

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RedKestrel
28 minutes ago, HR_Tofolo said:

Quick question: if you have already earned a non-basic airframe, can you lose it without using it? for instance lets say I get an IL-2, but after some missions I get killed in another aircraft without having used it. Will I keep it? 

Your planeset re-sets on death so that you only have the basic planes. So in this map, you would lose the Il-2 since it is an advanced aircraft, even if you never flew it.

An incentive to fly the advanced planes as soon as you get them I guess.

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Pict
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, =KG76=flyus747 said:

Imagine if it was reversed. Force fighters to grind the bombers before they can unlock a fighter. Doesn't make sense does it? Then how does the opposite make sense?

 

On the face of it there is no logic to how they set this up. But from all that I've tuned in to, I think they expected people to score CP much easier that most are doing.

 

There was mention of an average pilot gaining 3-5 CP per sortie. I'm not sure if I recall correctly as this number was thrown out in a video that I found very hard to follow as the subject hopped from one thing to another and dragged on for way longer (more than 3 times as long) than was needed to get the info across. No markers in the video, or notes means that to find that info I would have to sit thought that video again...and that ain't happening again in this lifetime.

 

Anyhow that "average" pilot sure wasn't me :) or most of the bomber pilots out there. I'm guessing it was based on fighter jockeys by fighter jockeys for fighter jockeys. As you say it would be interesting to see it reversed where you had to fly bombers to unlock fighters :biggrin:

 

==============

 

Anyhow I'm not complaining about it, as I said above I'm having fun, lots of it. Plus I think it's way to early to tell how this will affect things. It certainly hasn't stopped people lining up to join the TAW server. Neither did removing the techochat either, unlike what many said before hand. In fact the TAW server has been booming ever since :) 

 

Clearly I can understand how bomber pilots feel about it, and I wish I could just get back in a Pe-2, even just now and again. The IL-2 is a death trap in my hands and the idea of having to earn one of them to be allowed to earn a Pe-2, which will be chased all over the sky from the moment it's seen, is kind of hard to bear.

 

MiG-3 is another plane I enjoy and is great for attacking AA as it has the speed you need to survive, yet there are those out there who would like it removed already :)  Beats me, what would there be left for a Red bomber pilot? The I-16 !!!

Edited by Pict
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JG700_Benek
7 minutes ago, Pict said:

I'm guessing it was based on fighter jockeys by fighter jockeys for fighter jockeys. As you say it would be interesting to see it reversed where you had to fly bombers to unlock fighters :biggrin:

 

I would rather go e-sport way and think this solution gives equal chances to everyone if for expample bombers were given as basic planes it would mean that some players have to grind cps for better tools and some do not. 

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E69_Falke_Wolf

Everybody has an opinion so here goes mine.

I really REALLY appreciate the work that LGs have done with TAW, the web is completely awesome and I can't imagine the hours of work behind it all. THAK YOU VERY MUCH.
 

But. I do not understand the system of getting advanced aircraft. I like the CP system i mean. But I don't understand why bombers and attackers have to fly fighter missions. It's not logical that they don't have basic bomber or attack planes available (at least the blue ones have the stuka). And of course is NOT historical at all.

 

And about the balance system .... It is incomprehensible to me: a few months ago lots of proposals were collected to encourage red pilots to fly and it seemed that EVERYONE preferred to fly blue. Nowadays it is very difficult to find an hour when blue player are not outnumbered.

I like TAW and I will continue to fly on this server (at least for now) but the motivation to do so is less and less every day.

And just to finish. I am not complaining because I have been killed or lost the CPs. I assume my lack of personal skills. But I think that, if it continues like this, many pilots (especially bombers, attacker or any pilot from the blue side) may lose their motivation to fly.

I hope I'm wrong, but in a few maps the red side may fly almost alone, destroying the objectives at will. I'm not sure that's much fun for anyone...

Thank you all and see in the air ;)

And Thanks again for this incredible server (let's try to do better together).

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=19GvFAB=Vlad-Executor

Don't forget that this is a team-play server.

Red players constantly cooperate in TS, single players unite in groups: someone is watching the sky, someone is distracting anti-aircraft guns, someone is storming.

On the blue side, I often see just single fighters, shot down by anti-aircraft guns, storming targets alone, or in pairs.

And then they are simply hanging alone again over any of their targets, and those who are afraid will descend, seeing the group attack of the Reds.

Normal cooperation is only on blue squads, but solo players are quite capable of the same.

 

Don't fly alone. Go to the teamspeak, look for partners.

Survival and enjoyment of flying will be higher.

 

If you are flying alone, you are useless for your side, a target for fighters. This applies to both sides.

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KoN_
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, JG700_Benek said:

When you die your hanger resets - it means you will loose all advanced planes you had but you will have full set of basic planes. So yes you can loose adv planes without using it.

 

 

Not sure what happens when you have adv plane and the map changes and it no longer is used or is changed a bit (f2 on maps 3 have 20mm from start)

 

like in german jager line:

 

map2                             maps3

 

0/2 Bf 109 F-2 early
- no20mm
0/1 Bf 109 F-2
0/1 Bf 109 F-4 1.3ata

no gpods
SC250/SC4x50

 

not sure what will happen if on the endo of map 2 you got 2x F2 i think only one shoud remain but i am not sure and will not be surprised if nnone remains.

oh , That I did not know . So am I being punished twice . ??

You die and hanger resets loose that basic plane and loose a Advance plane too , is that correct .

I'm totally confused now . 😶

This sounds like Escape from Tarkov 😆 .

I must edit here .

All the times I've flown TAW its always about surviving "fly around in circles get your points land and avoid any combat "survive . 

Seen this so many times in the years .

Doing any ground attack was considered suicide if on your own or even in a pair its the mentality of the player too keep his best kit in hanger . 

Edited by KoN_
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=LG=Coldman
Posted (edited)

Basic plane set is progressing too each map so russians now have i16 as basic strike aircraft. Germans has stuka bomber. 

When You loose basic plane but surviving You lost it only during 2h of mission. new mission=new full hangar of basic planes. When You die You loose all advanced planes but Your basic hangar is reset to full of basic planes. So if You have lifes to spare You always have a plane to fly.

Edited by =LG=Coldman
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Pict
15 minutes ago, =19GvFAB=Vlad-Executor said:

Don't fly alone. Go to the teamspeak, look for partners.

Survival and enjoyment of flying will be higher.

 

This is very true...must get my comms back up and running as the best flights & fights I ever had were in a group.

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E69_Falke_Wolf

I definitely DO NOT understand the server balancing system. Is it really fun to fly like this?

GBcvrDg.jpg

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SCG_NoBigDreams

There are always times when one side has way more players, always been this way. On TAW it just affects gameplay a ton, generally the team that has more time "unopposed" will steamroll. Some sort of points balancing system could be in order, for example at 2:1 odds each ground kill only counts as 0.5 on the campaign or something like this.

 

We just gotta live with it, life ain't fair :ph34r:

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KoN_
Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, E69_Falke_Wolf said:

I definitely DO NOT understand the server balancing system. Is it really fun to fly like this?

GBcvrDg.jpg

Last night GMT time it was 80 players more or less equal sides . 

After about an hour Axis dropped off and were out numbered by red  . Very odd to see this in a European time zone . 

Edited by KoN_
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WokeUpBlue
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, HR_Tofolo said:

Quick question: if you have already earned a non-basic airframe, can you lose it without using it? for instance lets say I get an IL-2, but after some missions I get killed in another aircraft without having used it. Will I keep it? 


No, you will lose it.

6 hours ago, Pict said:

 

This is another story altogether, yet is a large part of the problem. Over communication on multiple platforms, while tempting, can be counter effective, especially if it's not concise, consistent & brief (20 min absolute max for a monologue).


Yeah, the forum here, discord, teamspeak, SRS, the website, new manual, planeset spreadsheet, and a video from someone who badly needs an editor is too much.

 

Quote

 

Edited by WokeUpDead
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Pict
3 minutes ago, E69_Falke_Wolf said:

Is it really fun to fly like this?

 

Sure, well I was having fun at any rate, here is the screenshot I took while you were worrying about who was online...

 

Spoiler

2021_5_12__14_29_9.thumb.jpg.17ecdbca71eae124e2a41f6342f25bcf.jpg

 

I had just attacked a flak gun at an airbase in my bomber™ :)  and got wounded to the point I could hardly see, bombed blind almost. This was on the way home, proving that bombing an airbase with my bomber™ is survivable. The darkness got me in the end as apart from being partially blind it became too dark to see anything and I kept groping around near the field until the map ended.

 

Fun, yes certainly :)  Plus my guy is still alive and he got another +1CP for this adventure in the dark, so that much closer to getting to drive an IL-2 :cool:

 

===============

 

Re:- the numbers online I'm sure someone can post a similar set of numbers showing it the other way about. Numbers online are fluid and dynamic and can and do change rapidly.

 

 

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=19GvFAB=Vlad-Executor
20 минут назад, E69_Falke_Wolf сказал:

I definitely DO NOT understand the server balancing system. Is it really fun to fly like this?
 

Screen take in 5 mins after start?

Waiting 20 mins, and see:

1406506677_.thumb.png.a5a93351f76607de8ebd71197683ec82.png

 

But so, yes - during the day there are often more reds, at night - more blue. Equally turns out from about 7pm to 1am o'clock on msk.

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