DCS

[dburne]

23 minutes ago, Chuck_Owl said:

 

Depends how you learn. Not sure what you mean by pedantic (I typically stick to the strict minimum and list the optional checks as, well, optional)... but you're entitled to your opinion. I do disagree with you though. 

 

Some video tutorials are great, but there are tons of them that are just terrible for someone that hasn't already sunk 300 hours in DCS,. The bad ones have people do an air start and have the cockpit almost already set up, missing a bunch of steps that a cold & dark start require. The very bad ones go through steps too quickly and mention buttons by acronym but don't show them nor explain what the acronyms mean (i.e. "Set the SPI to your TGP by making the right MFD SOI by pressing DMS DOWN"). And the terribad ones take 20 minutes to explain a procedure that can be listed on a single page. 

 

For a guy like me, video tutorials are hell since they more often than not drag longer than needed. I love the ones by Redkite because they're concise and structured, but most content creators don't bother putting that much effort in their work. I don't think there is a single best way to teach someone, but I've seen and experienced all of these approaches first hand. Some prefer videos, others checklists, others diagrams, flight manuals, others 1 on 1 sessions... but the fact is that all of these approaches have advantages and drawbacks. Videos show a procedure in real time, but you keep having to go back and forth to see something. Checklists are concise but often overlook things that new players might not be familiar with (or altogether skip important details). Diagrams are good for visual learners but lacks the flows of videos. Flight manuals are chock full of information but tend to be really dry reading. 1 on 1 sessions are good for people who like a personal approach, but are inadequate for people who haven't done any reading prior on the aircraft they're trying to learn.

 

My 2 cents. 

 

 

I find your guides invaluable and very much appreciate all the work you put into them, as well as keeping them updated!

I am currently using your Hornet guide extensively whilst I am learning the Hornet. I use a custom kneeboard I created with Kneeboard Builder so I could display the pertinent section of the guide I was working on, in my VR Headset so I never have to remove it whilst I am learning and referencing your guide.

 

 

 

[Bremspropeller]

30 minutes ago, Chuck_Owl said:

 

Depends how you learn. Most video tutorials I see are of poor quality, apart for a few exceptions. Not sure what you mean by pedantic (I typically stick to the strict minimum and list the optional checks as, well, optional)... but you're entitled to your opinion. Some video tutorials are great, but there are tons of them that are just terrible for someone that hasn't already sunk 300 hours in DCS,. The bad ones have people do an air start and have the cockpit almost already set up, missing a bunch of steps that a cold & dark start require. The very bad ones go through steps too quickly and mention buttons by acronym but don't show them nor explain what the acronyms mean (i.e. "Set the SPI to your TGP by making the right MFD SOI by pressing DMS DOWN"). And the terribad ones take 20 minutes to explain a procedure that can be listed on a single page. 

 

This wasn't intended as a criticism of your work, Chuck. Not in any way, shape or form.

 

It's just as you said, people learn differently. And many are just intimidated by a pdf that's 500 pages long, when you tell them "read this, it's the best source". So intimidated they won't even bother taking a look or won't even get the airplane in the first place, because they feel it's a drag learning about stuff in their spare time.

Others are different and they learn better by reading first and trying then.

 

I have found for myself (and this certainly includes others) that being on voicecomms and having somebody talk me through a procedure a few times and reading your guide afterwards yields the best results for me.

 

I agree that many youtube tutorials are bad, but there are also a few ones that are okay to good. In the end, everyone has to find the right mix for oneself.

 

 

[ZachariasX]

43 minutes ago, Chuck_Owl said:

For a guy like me, video tutorials are hell since they more often than not drag longer than needed.

I just want to tell you how much it helps me having your guides. Although I do like various youtube tutorials, for me they are just a starter to get the flow of sequences, a first orientation. Once I have that, I kind if know what to expect when looking up the pdf guides. Having one that doesn‘t get lost in details and is focused in the purpose, namely getting you to know what you are supposed to be doing, is just perfect.

 

Thank you for this!!

[Gambit21]

So aside from Chucks PDF  guide, who makes the best videos? If I needed to learn the Hornet from scratch (and I do) where’s the best place to go? I assume the ED vids are in there somewhere.

 

[dburne]

28 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

So aside from Chucks PDF  guide, who makes the best videos? If I needed to learn the Hornet from scratch (and I do) where’s the best place to go? I assume the ED vids are in there somewhere.

 

 

Wags has some good videos of the Hornet that I found helpful.

I usually go there first, then to Chuck's Guide, then check out some videos from RedKite I believe it is.

[DD_fruitbat]

1 hour ago, Gambit21 said:

So aside from Chucks PDF  guide, who makes the best videos? If I needed to learn the Hornet from scratch (and I do) where’s the best place to go? I assume the ED vids are in there somewhere.

 

 

For the Hornet in particular I would recommend RedKites vids as very good guides. ED's and Wags (often the same) are obviously pretty good too.

 

10 hours ago, Bremspropeller said:

 

That should have been there right from the start in the early Blocks. CCRP was a thing in A-7s already (Cs, Ds and Es, the latter of which will eventually find it's way into the game).

The pickle-button is just a "launch/ drop consent" loop-closer under those circumstances.

 

 

 

I wasn't talking about CCRP in general, more specifically whether in the later blocks, it dynamically works out the drop point on CCRP loft bombing as it seems to do in DCS block 50, rather than needing to enter a pull up range as was in the earlier models as, @busdriver alluded too.

Edited January 26, 2021 by DD_fruitbat

[CanadaOne]

59 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

So aside from Chucks PDF  guide, who makes the best videos? If I needed to learn the Hornet from scratch (and I do) where’s the best place to go? I assume the ED vids are in there somewhere.

 

 

Ralfidude made some excellent! tutorials for the A-10C II, not sure if he did anything for the F-18.

 

I'm one of those weirdo types who like the Grim Reapers videos, but I know some people really don't.

2 hours ago, Chuck_Owl said:

 

Depends how you learn. Not sure what you mean by pedantic (I typically stick to the strict minimum and list the optional checks as, well, optional)... but you're entitled to your opinion. I do disagree with you though. 

 

Some video tutorials are great, but there are tons of them that are just terrible for someone that hasn't already sunk 300 hours in DCS,. The bad ones have people do an air start and have the cockpit almost already set up, missing a bunch of steps that a cold & dark start require. The very bad ones go through steps too quickly and mention buttons by acronym but don't show them nor explain what the acronyms mean (i.e. "Set the SPI to your TGP by making the right MFD SOI by pressing DMS DOWN"). And the terribad ones take 20 minutes to explain a procedure that can be listed on a single page. 

 

For a guy like me, video tutorials are hell since they more often than not drag longer than needed. I love the ones by Redkite because they're concise and structured, but most content creators don't bother putting that much effort in their work. I don't think there is a single best way to teach someone, but I've seen and experienced all of these approaches first hand. Some prefer videos, others checklists, others diagrams, flight manuals, others 1 on 1 sessions... but the fact is that all of these approaches have advantages and drawbacks. Videos show a procedure in real time, but you keep having to go back and forth to see something. Checklists are concise but often overlook things that new players might not be familiar with (or altogether skip important details). Diagrams are good for visual learners but lacks the flows of videos. Flight manuals are chock full of information but tend to be really dry reading. 1 on 1 sessions are good for people who like a personal approach, but are inadequate for people who haven't done any reading prior on the aircraft they're trying to learn.

 

My 2 cents. 

 

Montreal! 

 

I grew up in NDG. Ever eat at Cosmos?

[Chuck_Owl]

The one on Sherbrooke? Never had the chance.

 

I think my all-time favorite spot in town was Che Churros. Those churros are amazing.

[busdriver]

33 minutes ago, DD_fruitbat said:

I wasn't talking about CCRP in general, more specifically whether in the later blocks, it dynamically works out the drop point on CCRP loft bombing as it seems to do in DCS bock 50, rather than needing to enter a pull up range as was in the earlier models as, @busdriver alluded too.

 

A not so minor point of order. Pull-Up range is what provides the steering cue in order to loft a bomb correctly, so you meet the "manual delivery" parameters in case the green stuff goes away. Essential for special weapons, not necessary for conventional weapons where you could use Backup Dive Toss with the red reticle. If you are making a laydown delivery or a medium altitude standoff delivery, there is no Pull-Up range to program. You demonstrated that it is entirely possible to loft once you are inside the dynamic range of the weapon based on your speed and altitude. That's why your bombs came off at 20 degrees of climb rather than 30 degrees. Otherwise you could safely drive straight and level over the target, as long as you meet fuse arm and safe escape parameters. I suspect this is what you intuit, but wanted to clarify. 

 

So why doesn't DCS include a Pull-Up range parameter? If I had to speculate, it might be that IRL the only guys that used a Pull-Up range were those tasked with nuclear weapons delivery. Lofting CBU was an option in our weapon's guide, but there was no training for that. Meaning there was no range event to simulate CBU loft deliveries, or qualification to maintain. Sometime in the last ~20 years, F-16 pilots were freed from the nuclear mission. Perhaps IRL the fire control software does not include programming options specifically for loft deliveries. Or perhaps it's just something DCS omitted. 

[Gambit21]

I haven’t messed with it, but I do know that the various modes etc are not yet finished. So maybe it’s coming?

[CanadaOne]

1 hour ago, Chuck_Owl said:

The one on Sherbrooke? Never had the chance.

 

I think my all-time favorite spot in town was Che Churros. Those churros are amazing.

 

Yeah, right by Royal. Too late, I'd afraid, they closed. But it was historic. Best greasy breakfast on Earth.

 

Don't know Churos, but I've been out of Montreal for many years.

[DD_fruitbat]

1 hour ago, busdriver said:

 

A not so minor point of order. Pull-Up range is what provides the steering cue in order to loft a bomb correctly, so you meet the "manual delivery" parameters in case the green stuff goes away. Essential for special weapons, not necessary for conventional weapons where you could use Backup Dive Toss with the red reticle. If you are making a laydown delivery or a medium altitude standoff delivery, there is no Pull-Up range to program. You demonstrated that it is entirely possible to loft once you are inside the dynamic range of the weapon based on your speed and altitude. That's why your bombs came off at 20 degrees of climb rather than 30 degrees. Otherwise you could safely drive straight and level over the target, as long as you meet fuse arm and safe escape parameters. I suspect this is what you intuit, but wanted to clarify. 

 

Understood, and makes sense.

 

1 hour ago, busdriver said:

So why doesn't DCS include a Pull-Up range parameter? If I had to speculate, it might be that IRL the only guys that used a Pull-Up range were those tasked with nuclear weapons delivery. Lofting CBU was an option in our weapon's guide, but there was no training for that. Meaning there was no range event to simulate CBU loft deliveries, or qualification to maintain. Sometime in the last ~20 years, F-16 pilots were freed from the nuclear mission. Perhaps IRL the fire control software does not include programming options specifically for loft deliveries. Or perhaps it's just something DCS omitted. 

 

Well, ED have long stated there will be no nuclear weapons in DCS, which I get (that would be 'fun' in multiplayer!), so maybe that's the reason its omitted, or that it may just be the later blocks don't have it anymore as they aren't flying that mission profile anymore, I honestly have no idea.

 

The DCS F-16 is much further behind in terms of development (being much newer) than the FA/18 which is now not far from full release out of beta, when that does happen, some of that development is going to shift to the F-16, there's still lots of toys to come to it, and for me to look forward to, so who knows what's down the line, it may come anyway.

 

This is a skinny list of the proposed systems and loadouts for the DCS F-16,

 

Spoiler

SUBJECT TO CHANGE

 

Our Viper will be an F-16C with the Common Configuration Implementation Program (CCIP) upgrade. We feel this to be the most versatile version of the F-16 with capabilities for SEAD, precision attack, close air support, and of course air-to-air. We will be taking great care though to develop a very accurate simulation of the F-16C Block 50 operated by the United States Air Force and Air National Guard circa 2007.

 

For this project, we are striving to create a very authentic simulation of this particular aircraft at a specific point in time. We have no desire to create a Frankenstein's Monster that combines multiple F-16C versions from different time periods.

 

Core systems of our F-16C include:

 

 

• F-110-GE-129 turbofan engine
• AN/APG-68(V)5 multi-mode radar
• AN/ALR-56M Radar Warning Receiver
• AN/ALQ-131/184 ECM pods
• CCIP (Common Configuration Implementation Program) update
• ALE-47 countermeasure system

 

 

This will be a massive project, so we will separate it into two phases: Phase 1 Early Access release and then Phase 2 Product Sustainment.

 

Phase 1 Early Access:

 

 

• Color Multifunction Display (CMFD) symbology, Horizontal Situation Display (HSD) format, and Head-up Display (HUD) symbology
• Digitally TACAN and Electronic Horizontal Situation Indicator (EHSI)
• RWS, SAM, and ACM A/A radar modes
• BDU-33, BDU-50LD/HD, Mk-82LDGP, Mk-82AIR, Mk-84LDGP, CBU-87 CEM, and CBU-97 SFW unguided bombs
• 2.75” rockets LAU-68 and LAU-131
• Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System (JHMCS)
• AIM-9L/M/P/X Sidewinder
• AIM-120B/C AMRAAM
• M61A1 20mm cannon

 

 

First skin will be the 55th FS at Shaw AFB.

 

Phase 2 Product Sustainment:

 

 

• TWS A/A radar mode
• Multifunctional Information Distribution System (MIDS)
• Link 16 Data Link
• A/G radar modes
• AGM-65D/G/H/K Maverick
• AGM-88C HARM
• AN/ASQ-213 HARM Targeting System (HTS)
• AN/AAQ-28(V) LITENING targeting pod
• GBU-10, GBU-12, GBU-24A/B laser-guided bombs
• BRU-57/A Smart Rack
• CBU-103 CEM and CBU-105 SFW Inertially Aided Munitions (IAM)
• GBU-31/A and GBU-38/B JDAM
• AGM-154A and AGM-154C JSOW
• Integration of the JHMCS with the HARM Targeting System (HTS), Link 16, and AIFF
• Night Vision Goggles (NVG)
   
• ALE-50 towed decoy

 

 

EDIT, quickly searching the DCS forums, and loft cues aren't implemented yet, so sounds like we will be getting them at some point.

Edited January 27, 2021 by DD_fruitbat

[dburne]

Sounds like I picked a good time to finally learn the Hornet. 

[CanadaOne]

Got the skinny over at Stormbirds that the update today includes APKWS laser rockets for the Harrier.

 

Me I like dat! 

[Tektolnes]

17 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

So aside from Chucks PDF  guide, who makes the best videos? If I needed to learn the Hornet from scratch (and I do) where’s the best place to go? I assume the ED vids are in there somewhere.

 

RedKite, Spudknocker and Overkill. I like the Overkill ones the most even though they maybe don't have as many views as the other two guys - goes from scratch all the way up over 38 tutorials.

[kendo]

I've also been making a more determined effort to learn the F-18 after getting it in the lock-down sale last year.

 

Belatedly discovered Chuck's Guide a few months back, and have found it to be absolutely the best resource for understanding all those systems. The clarity, depth, and quality of the images has helped me get a better grip on all that complexity. Still at a comparatively early stage, and feels like I could keep at this for the next year and still not master everything...but i'm making progress. 

 

Totally different experience with these complex modern aircraft in DCS compared to Great Battles/Flying Circus - need to slow things right down and take it one step at a time, but rewarding too. Progress right now is measured by learning another sub-system, rather than flying a successful mission or completing a career.

   

Edited January 27, 2021 by kendo

[unlikely_spider]

21 minutes ago, kendo said:

I've also been making a more determined effort to learn the F-18 after getting it in the lock-down sale last year.

 

Belatedly discovered Chuck's Guide a few months back, and have found it to be absolutely the best resource for understanding all those systems. The clarity, depth, and quality of the images has helped me get a better grip on all that complexity. Still at a comparatively early stage, and feels like I could keep at this for the next year and still not master everything...but i'm making progress. 

 

Totally different experience with these complex modern aircraft in DCS compared to Great Battles/Flying Circus - need to slow things right down and take it one step at a time, but rewarding too. Progress right now is measured by learning another sub-system, rather than flying a successful mission or completing a career.

   

That's why the Harrier trainings that come with the module are so great. Broken down by section, then even most of those have a "long" and a "short" version. How are the training missions that come with the Hornet?

[kendo]

Have tried a few and they can be useful, but I often find they just move too quickly. There is a basic level of knowledge needed just to keep up with the pace.

 

For me, I find I need a good quality written guide (like Chuck's) to give me that basic orientation before doing the training missions.   

[unlikely_spider]

1 minute ago, kendo said:

Have tried a few and they can be useful, but I often find they just move too quickly. There is a basic level of knowledge needed just to keep up with the pace.

 

For me, I find I need a good quality written guide (like Chuck's) to give me that basic orientation before doing the training missions.   

Oh, yes. I usually do both.

[dburne]

Been working today on learning the Targeting Pod with the Mavericks  for the Hornet. Great fun and should be beneficial as I think the same pod is used in some other jets.

Now I am just going through it over and over till I can do it from memory hopefully.

Still progressing in this process.

[CanadaOne]

3 hours ago, dburne said:

Been working today on learning the Targeting Pod with the Mavericks  for the Hornet. Great fun and should be beneficial as I think the same pod is used in some other jets.

Now I am just going through it over and over till I can do it from memory hopefully.

Still progressing in this process.

 

I'm sure I've forgotten how, haven't flown much lately, but I managed to fire a Maverick in the Hornet much faster than in the Harrier. 

 

The Harrier had some strange stuff going on: "Please select the target, okay, now cancel the target you just selected, since you have just selected the target and then canceled the target you selected, please select the target."

[dburne]

7 minutes ago, CanadaOne said:

 

I'm sure I've forgotten how, haven't flown much lately, but I managed to fire a Maverick in the Hornet much faster than in the Harrier. 

 

The Harrier had some strange stuff going on: "Please select the target, okay, now cancel the target you just selected, since you have just selected the target and then canceled the target you selected, please select the target."

 

Firing the Maverick with Jtac doing the lasing is very simple, firing using the targeting pod on the jet is certainly little more complex.

Not too bad though, just got to make sure and do everything in the right order.

[Bremspropeller]

 

She's still a bit lethargic through the transonic drag-spike, but once she reaches about M 1.3 she's definately picking up the acceleration.

TIT-spike and engine self-destruct are supposedly gone. It didn't present itself on my short test anyway.

 

Took this A to M 1.6 with four Sparrows, four Sidewinders and to bags (full at take-off). She might have gone out to 1.7, but I was flashing by my tanker, so I had to hold her back.

 

Does anybody know, why the carrier can't be bothered to acknowledge my Ball Call on a Case III approach?

It always ducks up my approach, hitting my Ball Call key and not concentrating on the groove.

It also blows, to always get a sh1tty grade because the LSO can't find the mike-key...

[CanadaOne]

Dayum!

 

No DCS update on Steam until tomorrow morning. 

[DD_fruitbat]

I've had a play with the new air to ground radar features in the Hornet, and its very very cool indeed

Edited January 27, 2021 by DD_fruitbat

[AndyJWest]

10 minutes ago, DD_fruitbat said:

I've had a play with the new air to ground radar features in the Hornet, and its very very cool indeed

 

Is there any information as to how to select the new features? I can't see anything obvious on the DCS forum.

[DD_fruitbat]

Wag's did two videos,

 

 

 

 

 

My first effort, I used the radar to find a target, selected it with the cursor, it then automatically slaves the TPod to that location, used that to point track, and then slaved that point track to a maverick, and boom boom!

 

 

Edited January 28, 2021 by DD_fruitbat

[dburne]

11 hours ago, DD_fruitbat said:

I've had a play with the new air to ground radar features in the Hornet, and its very very cool indeed

 

Great yet more Tpod stuff to learn now...

[DD_fruitbat]

Good news, you don't have to use the TPod with the air to ground radar .... it just helps!

[dburne]

1 hour ago, DD_fruitbat said:

Good news, you don't have to use the TPod with the air to ground radar .... it just helps!

 

Nice to know thanks.

Going to work with the TGP some more today make sure I have all the procedures down.

[Lusekofte]

I will spend a year learning  the words stated in this topic  

Using those things is just not happening  

 

No way I invest that time in it. Kind of happy I keep interest going in the choppers  

Edited January 28, 2021 by 216th_LuseKofte

[BOO]

20 hours ago, dburne said:

 

Firing the Maverick with Jtac doing the lasing is very simple, firing using the targeting pod on the jet is certainly little more complex.

Not too bad though, just got to make sure and do everything in the right order.

I gave it 10 solid hours of the "right order" over munitions various. Carefully rechecking every point. No two instances ever worked the same on my set up and few ever worked at all. I get that the Harriers Tpod was never optimal but I think there is something rotten in the state of Denmark when it comes to that module's coding. 

 

Such a shame as it is great in so many other ways. 

 

Ah well, there's always the Bug. May as well learn the one thing that everything else in DCS is being F'd over for ?

[dburne]

2 minutes ago, BOO said:

I gave it 10 solid hours of the "right order" over munitions various. Carefully rechecking every point. No two instances ever worked the same on my set up and few ever worked at all. I get that the Harriers Tpod was never optimal but I think there is something rotten in the state of Denmark when it comes to that module's coding. 

 

Such a shame as it is great in so many other ways. 

 

Ah well, there's always the Bug. May as well learn the one thing that everything else in DCS is being F'd over for ?

 

Yeah for some reason today, even though I am doing the exact same process as yesterday firing Maverick's with the TPOD, my bombs are falling way short every time today.

Just when I think I had it, now I don't for some reason. Crazy. Hanging it up for the day, maybe will try again tomorrow.

[BOO]

3 hours ago, raaaid said:

dont they in todays plane something like siri?

 

siri spot for targets

 

siri lock targtes

 

siri shoot rockets

 

come on that can not be modern airwarfare but ancient one

 

what you want in war is german eficiency in murdering

 

Hmm. In a siri equipped cockpit what you actually need is a Siri that understands you

 

"Siri, Spot Targets"

 

"Here is a recipe for Hot Crumpets"

[AndyJWest]

 

[CanadaOne]

"Let there be light."

[DD_Arthur]

Dark Star!  Oh my Lordy, that’s a film I’d forgotten all about?.

 

Great, something I can force the kids to watch over the weekend ?

[RedKestrel]

3 hours ago, BOO said:

 

Hmm. In a siri equipped cockpit what you actually need is a Siri that understands you

 

"Siri, Spot Targets"

 

"Here is a recipe for Hot Crumpets"

You jest, sir, but crumpets have a superior taste past Mach 0.9 or so. 

[CanadaOne]

I haven't flown in a while and I just took the Harrier out for a cruise and try them fancy APKWS rockets. Oh dear... 

 

It was like your great-grandmother trying to navigate Facebook. 

 

 

[Bremspropeller]

Pfft...Darkstar....

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

Wondering if we are to set up an "IL-2 BoX DCS Team" to meet up an play together.

It's most probably not going to hurt worse than clowning around on a normal server and being teamkilled by a SPAMRAAM-volley, launched by a dude who is new to the game.

 

Do the Dawgs have a special DCS night?

 

What about the others?

Edited January 28, 2021 by Bremspropeller