Combat Box by Red Flight

[56RAF_Stickz]

Hi Talisman

as I got no other way to contact you at present, have you tried enquiring under the forum hardware & controller section where it has specific VR help pages?

[Talon_]

 

 

I don't get to fly much, but when I do... ? 

[RedKestrel]

Anyone got video of killing a 262 on CombatBox yet? I need something to warm the cockles of my shrivelled little allied heart!

[Barnacles]

22 minutes ago, RedKestrel said:

Anyone got video of killing a 262 on CombatBox yet? I need something to warm the cockles of my shrivelled little allied heart!

I've got a track of that. Maybe it's time for me to learn how to do the whole video thing. (After I've slept)

[Talisman]

1 hour ago, 56RAF_Stickz said:

Hi Talisman

as I got no other way to contact you at present, have you tried enquiring under the forum hardware & controller section where it has specific VR help pages?

Yes, thanks Stickz.  That sub forum is where I learnt about the fix for this problem being unchecking the limit VR view.  Great I thought, problem solved, wrong!  Fixed for off-line play yes, but for MP servers mostly no fix

 

This limit VR view is unique to IL-2 as I understand it, but it is causing VR problems as far a I can see.  If someone has found a fix for this issue I would love to know what it is.

 

Happy landings,

 

Talisman

[Talisman]

2 hours ago, RedKestrel said:

What other servers do you go on? I seem to recall that  at least at one point the 'limit VR view' is enabled when external views are disabled, so its impossible to allow free-er head movement in VR without also allowing people to use external cameras, which can be a problem in MP. Not sure if this has been changed though, it was a while ago.

Yes RedKestrel, I think you make a good point.  The other server I am thinking of does allow external views; I have used it for training and practise, but my real interest is the servers like Combat Box with no external views.

 

So, if I understand you correctly, if a server has external views disabled then it has to enable limit VR view, but if a server allows external views it can disable limit VR view?

 

Oh dear, if that is the case then it is going to mean I can't fly any full real servers in VR unless I can solve the cockpit and airframe distortion issues another way.

 

As I understand it, this limit VR view is unique to IL-2; however it looks like it may be causing issues for VR users like me.

 

This is a shame because I only got into the flight sim world to fly on-line in MP with other people as part of a community, that is why I am a long standing member of an active on-line squad.  Looks like I won't be able to fly with them any more because in am using VR

 

Happy landings,

 

Talisman

[RedKestrel]

37 minutes ago, 56RAF_Talisman said:

Yes RedKestrel, I think you make a good point.  The other server I am thinking of does allow external views; I have used it for training and practise, but my real interest is the servers like Combat Box with no external views.

 

So, if I understand you correctly, if a server has external views disabled then it has to enable limit VR view, but if a server allows external views it can disable limit VR view?

 

Oh dear, if that is the case then it is going to mean I can't fly any full real servers in VR unless I can solve the cockpit and airframe distortion issues another way.

 

As I understand it, this limit VR view is unique to IL-2; however it looks like it may be causing issues for VR users like me.

 

This is a shame because I only got into the flight sim world to fly on-line in MP with other people as part of a community, that is why I am a long standing member of an active on-line squad.  Looks like I won't be able to fly with them any more because in am using VR

 

Happy landings,

 

Talisman

I believe the external views is related to VR head position server side, not 100% sure if its causing your issue, as I've never played VR.

@[TWB]Sketch you play in VR on CombatBox right? Do you have the issue he has, or some way to resolve it?

[Alonzo]

41 minutes ago, 56RAF_Talisman said:

Yes RedKestrel, I think you make a good point.  The other server I am thinking of does allow external views; I have used it for training and practise, but my real interest is the servers like Combat Box with no external views.

 

So, if I understand you correctly, if a server has external views disabled then it has to enable limit VR view, but if a server allows external views it can disable limit VR view?

 

Yes, unfortunately what we want is a "disable spectator mode, but be more lenient with VR head views". There is no such mode currently. I much prefer to fly in VR where my head is not so limited, but I have to make do because otherwise people will cheat with spectator mode. (And people do cheat -- I banned a player who was using speed hacks today ? . )

 

Edit: Also, I think you have some kind of setup problem. Maybe the other Pimax guys like @chiliwili69 will know of a solution to the problem. When I am just sitting straight in the cockpit (and not trying to lean into instruments or out the window) the VR works fine even with spectator views disabled.

Edited June 12, 2019 by Alonzo

[56RAF_Stickz]

15 minutes ago, Alonzo said:

And people do cheat -- I banned a player who was using speed hacks today ? . )

whilst its a shame that dawinism doesnt deal with these - its nice to hear they can be found and dealt with

[RedKestrel]

3 hours ago, Alonzo said:

 

Yes, unfortunately what we want is a "disable spectator mode, but be more lenient with VR head views". There is no such mode currently. I much prefer to fly in VR where my head is not so limited, but I have to make do because otherwise people will cheat with spectator mode. (And people do cheat -- I banned a player who was using speed hacks today ? . )

 

Edit: Also, I think you have some kind of setup problem. Maybe the other Pimax guys like @chiliwili69 will know of a solution to the problem. When I am just sitting straight in the cockpit (and not trying to lean into instruments or out the window) the VR works fine even with spectator views disabled.

Some guy was using a speed hack? With the 262 available, why bother?

[Talon_]

5 hours ago, 56RAF_Talisman said:

This is a shame because I only got into the flight sim world to fly on-line in MP with other people as part of a community, that is why I am a long standing member of an active on-line squad.  Looks like I won't be able to fly with them any more because in am using VR

 

Just FYI this is an issue that will be immediately solved if we get the option. Pretty much half of Red Flight fly in VR at this point.

[Sketch]

Agreed, almost all of TWB fly in VR. Damnit @[TWB]Reagan-LW

[Reagan505]

5 hours ago, [TWB]Sketch said:

Agreed, almost all of TWB fly in VR. Damnit @[TWB]Reagan-LW

I’ll go back to VR someday.. Big 4K monitor is making it hard though.

[Haza]

Alonso,

 

Thanks for including the Me262, however, any chance of having some spawn points on paved runways so we can use the 500kg bomb and extra fuel, please?  

 

Regards

[Psyrion]

49 minutes ago, Haza said:

Alonso,

 

Thanks for including the Me262, however, any chance of having some spawn points on paved runways so we can use the 500kg bomb and extra fuel, please?  

 

Regards

The inclusion of the 262 will change anyway. For now it´s included to allow everyone to take a stab at flying the (awesome) plane.
I saw Scharfi managed to take off with full fuel, 2x250 and all the armor she could take by dumping the flaps down to 100% at the end of the runway. Maybe that could work as a stopgap for now. 

[Haza]

32 minutes ago, Psyrion said:

The inclusion of the 262 will change anyway. For now it´s included to allow everyone to take a stab at flying the (awesome) plane.
I saw Scharfi managed to take off with full fuel, 2x250 and all the armor she could take by dumping the flaps down to 100% at the end of the runway. Maybe that could work as a stopgap for now. 

 

Some airfields are easier than others to get airbourne. Will wait!

 

Regards

 

[RedKestrel]

On 6/12/2019 at 10:53 AM, Talon_ said:

 

 

I don't get to fly much, but when I do... ? 

You drink Dos Equus?
/he is...the most interesting spitfire pilot

[Alonzo]

6 hours ago, Haza said:

Some airfields are easier than others to get airbourne. Will wait!

 

I spent some time trying to find bigger, paved airfields for the 262, but unfortunately on most of the current maps there isn't really a good airfield near the existing play area. For some maps we could add a 262 base with a long runway but it might be quite far from the action (maybe not a problem at 700km/h!).

 

What I think is maybe the best option is to have at least one map that is designed around the 262 as a strategic gameplay element. We have some ideas on how to do that. It would include a dedicated 262 base with a very long runway. Having said that, the small paved runways are 1200m, most grass fields are 1200-1400m, and the longest paved runways I could find are 1500m. So it's a bit more runway but not much!

[MeoW.Scharfi]

13 minutes ago, Alonzo said:

I spent some time trying to find bigger, paved airfields for the 262, but unfortunately on most of the current maps there isn't really a good airfield near the existing play area. For some maps we could add a 262 base with a long runway but it might be quite far from the action (maybe not a problem at 700km/h!).

 

What I think is maybe the best option is to have at least one map that is designed around the 262 as a strategic gameplay element. We have some ideas on how to do that. It would include a dedicated 262 base with a very long runway. Having said that, the small paved runways are 1200m, most grass fields are 1200-1400m, and the longest paved runways I could find are 1500m. So it's a bit more runway but not much!

 

You can even take off at the smallest airfield in BoX with 100% fuel.

[Reagan505]

2 hours ago, MeoW.Scharfi said:

 

You can even take off at the smallest airfield in BoX with 100% fuel.

True story. Just have to be at the right speed bringing the nose off the ground and be smooth on the controls during rotation. 

[JimTM]

7 hours ago, RedKestrel said:

You drink Dos Equus?
/he is...the most interesting spitfire pilot

 

He once did a barrel roll with actual barrels on the wings (full of Dos Equis).

He once steered a proper course using the most interesting compass in the world.

He can turn so tight that he once accidentally got on his own tail and shot himself down.

...

Edited June 13, 2019 by JimTM

[VBF-12_Snake9]

2 hours ago, JimTM said:

 

He once did a barrel roll with actual barrels on the wings (full of Dos Equis).

He once steered a proper course using the most interesting compass in the world.

He can turn so tight that he once accidentally got on his own tail and shot himself down.

...

Mostly just read don't reply much but I really laughed at that 3rd line.  That was great.  ?

[Haza]

Alonso,

 

I realise and appreciate that you try and keep the maps level regarding aircraft types, however, any chance of a few more Me262s please?  On one map (OP PARAVANE Sep '44) there was only one Me262 available with the same guy continually using it! At least other players appear to tell others when they have landed so it can be shared, rather than being selfish. 

 

Regards

[Hawk-2a]

@Haza Latest changes taken from CB discord:

 

„**All maps updated:** Removed Me262 from Crimean Offensive and Operation Frantic. Reduced numbers of 262s on Battle for Kalinin, Operation Eisenhammer and Operation Paravane: Initially just one 262 is available, until enough opposing players join and more 262s open up. Even when enough opposing players are present, 262s are much more limited than previously.“

 

so i guess there were just not enough guys online to activate more 262s

 

cheerio

 

[56RAF_Roblex]

45 minutes ago, =FC=SteelFalcon said:

 

 

so i guess there were just not enough guys online to activate more 262s

 

 

To be accurate,  Not enough *opposition* online to activate more 262s ?       Maybe they should only activate 262s when the Blues are outnumbered? ? ?

 

[Haza]

1 minute ago, 56RAF_Roblex said:

 

To be accurate,  Not enough *opposition* online to activate more 262s ?       Maybe they should only activate 262s when the Blues are outnumbered? ? ?

 

 

Well blue were outnumbered 2:1

[56RAF_Roblex]

1 minute ago, Haza said:

 

Well blue were outnumbered 2:1

 

Well that sounds odd.  You are saying Blues were outnumbered 2 to 1 and still only allowed one 262?

 

[Hawk-2a]

I don‘t know how many reds it needs for more 262s. But a 2:1 can also be both sides having less than 10 players, in which case more than 1 262 would be pretty unfair, thus leading to reds leaving and the server staying empty

[Alonzo]

6 hours ago, Haza said:

I realise and appreciate that you try and keep the maps level regarding aircraft types, however, any chance of a few more Me262s please?  On one map (OP PARAVANE Sep '44) there was only one Me262 available with the same guy continually using it! At least other players appear to tell others when they have landed so it can be shared, rather than being selfish.

 

6 hours ago, =FC=SteelFalcon said:

@Haza Latest changes taken from CB discord:

 

„**All maps updated:** Removed Me262 from Crimean Offensive and Operation Frantic. Reduced numbers of 262s on Battle for Kalinin, Operation Eisenhammer and Operation Paravane: Initially just one 262 is available, until enough opposing players join and more 262s open up. Even when enough opposing players are present, 262s are much more limited than previously.“

 

so i guess there were just not enough guys online to activate more 262s

 

5 hours ago, 56RAF_Roblex said:

To be accurate,  Not enough *opposition* online to activate more 262s ?       Maybe they should only activate 262s when the Blues are outnumbered? ? ?

 

5 hours ago, Haza said:

Well blue were outnumbered 2:1

 

5 hours ago, 56RAF_Roblex said:

Well that sounds odd.  You are saying Blues were outnumbered 2 to 1 and still only allowed one 262?

 

5 hours ago, =FC=SteelFalcon said:

I don‘t know how many reds it needs for more 262s. But a 2:1 can also be both sides having less than 10 players, in which case more than 1 262 would be pretty unfair, thus leading to reds leaving and the server staying empty

 

Hey all, thanks for commenting on this. We needed to do something quickly because the previous situation (six 262s available at map start, plus 6 per hour) was obviously not fair and reds weren't logging in to fight. The current setup should be that on maps where the 262 is available (Kalinin, Paravane, Eisenhammer) then one is available at map start and once it's used up that's it, until at least a certain number (I am not being specific, deliberately) of players join the red side and start flying. At that point the plane set should switch to having 3 x 262s available with several more per hour. If the switch to 3 is not occurring then that's a bug and I'll look into it.

 

If you're playing a map where you feel that the 262s should have opened up and they have not, please take a screen shot of the map screen and maybe the player list so I can look more closely. After the mission if you're able to find it on the missions list on the stats website, that would help too, as I can what everyone flew on that map.

 

Game balance is a tricky thing. Obviously people want a chance to fly the new plane, that's totally reasonable, but a coordinated squad with (say) one 262 and a couple of D9/K4's can absolutely dominate an airspace. We needed to do something to make it fairer. If I've overshot and now there's no 262s available then it's unintended and I'll check the map logic.

 

We are working on a map that's more directly designed to accommodate the 262, with mechanics that make the availability of the 262 more of an in-game thing, as well as targets that are more suited to the 262s primary roles, but since it's a new map it'll be a while before it's available.

 

Edit: I should also add that if a 262 is safely landed at the 262 airfield, it will become immediately available again, so there is a benefit in flying safe or nursing a wounded bird back to base. This is true whether the field has just one 262 available or an increased number.

Edited June 14, 2019 by Alonzo
Clarified airplane return mechanic.

[Hawk-2a]

Thanks for the effort, really great stuff you guys are doing on CB. Looking forward to fly on it on sunday again  

[RedKestrel]

48 minutes ago, Alonzo said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hey all, thanks for commenting on this. We needed to do something quickly because the previous situation (six 262s available at map start, plus 6 per hour) was obviously not fair and reds weren't logging in to fight. The current setup should be that on maps where the 262 is available (Kalinin, Paravane, Eisenhammer) then one is available at map start and once it's used up that's it, until at least a certain number (I am not being specific, deliberately) of players join the red side and start flying. At that point the plane set should switch to having 3 x 262s available with several more per hour. If the switch to 3 is not occurring then that's a bug and I'll look into it.

 

If you're playing a map where you feel that the 262s should have opened up and they have not, please take a screen shot of the map screen and maybe the player list so I can look more closely. After the mission if you're able to find it on the missions list on the stats website, that would help too, as I can what everyone flew on that map.

 

Game balance is a tricky thing. Obviously people want a chance to fly the new plane, that's totally reasonable, but a coordinated squad with (say) one 262 and a couple of D9/K4's can absolutely dominate an airspace. We needed to do something to make it fairer. If I've overshot and now there's no 262s available then it's unintended and I'll check the map logic.

 

We are working on a map that's more directly designed to accommodate the 262, with mechanics that make the availability of the 262 more of an in-game thing, as well as targets that are more suited to the 262s primary roles, but since it's a new map it'll be a while before it's available.

 

Edit: I should also add that if a 262 is safely landed at the 262 airfield, it will become immediately available again, so there is a benefit in flying safe or nursing a wounded bird back to base. This is true whether the field has just one 262 available or an increased number.

I think a map around the 262s and their airbase as a strategic resource would be a great scenario!

[RedKestrel]

As a follow-up to the idea of how you could make a Me-262 airfield a strategic objective, here's my idea on a scenario. Not sure it would work or how complex the mechanics would be but could be interesting:

The scenario is a late summer/early autumn situation in 1944. Allied bomber streams are taking heavy casualties from the new Me-262s and the top brass want them put out of action. The allies have a radar installation set up that notifies friendly combat aircraft when a 262 has taken off from the airfield. 

The axis start the map with two or three airbases.  One of the airbases would be for the 262s only, the others for conventional aircraft. The 262 airbase would be very heavily covered with flak, making attacking risky. The axis would start with a small amount of Me-262s, and more would be added as time went on. The allies start with the same number of airbases, one exclusively for bombers that is also a target for the Luftwaffe. 

Targets for the Allies are the 262 base as a primary target, and several other infrastructure targets as secondaries: A factory facility, a rail yard with trains, and fuel storage/processing facility. Destroying one secondary target reduces the respawn rate of the Me-262 or the total number available by half. Destruction of two secondary targets or the 262 airbase closes the airbase and prevents the use of the Me-262s. Winning condition for the allies is destruction of the airbase and one secondary target OR all three secondary targets.

Targets for the axis are the radar station, bomber base and a forward emergency landing zone for crippled aircraft. Destroying the radar installation removes the early warning available. You could make this a relatively small, lightly defended target but far to the rear, necessitating a long sortie by 262 schnellbombers to take it out and speed for home. Axis must destroy the bomber base and one secondary target to win the map. 

Obviously you guys are more experienced with balancing missions and making sure things work, but I think  scenario like this would be interesting and challenging for both sides, encouraging the careful use of the 262s, but at the same time making them a threat the allies can't safely ignore. 

 

[Alonzo]

8 hours ago, RedKestrel said:

The scenario is a late summer/early autumn situation in 1944. Allied bomber streams are taking heavy casualties from the new Me-262s and the top brass want them put out of action. The allies have a radar installation set up that notifies friendly combat aircraft when a 262 has taken off from the airfield. 

 

These are some great ideas, thank you for detailing them! I like the idea of trying to mimic reality at least a little bit -- historically most 262s were destroyed on the ground, or during takeoff or landing. So far on the current maps I've basically only gently encouraged people to do that, by giving the takeoff and landing notifications for the jets. Having a map with an explicit objective to shut down the 262 base is pretty interesting. We're still sketching mission designs, and I definitely appreciate you taking the time here to give ideas.

[Alonzo]

Filmed on Combat Box, in inimitable Scharfi.

 

 

[Talisman]

10 hours ago, Alonzo said:

 

These are some great ideas, thank you for detailing them! I like the idea of trying to mimic reality at least a little bit -- historically most 262s were destroyed on the ground, or during takeoff or landing. So far on the current maps I've basically only gently encouraged people to do that, by giving the takeoff and landing notifications for the jets. Having a map with an explicit objective to shut down the 262 base is pretty interesting. We're still sketching mission designs, and I definitely appreciate you taking the time here to give ideas.

When we get the Mustang and Tempest V maybe, but at the moment it is a bit too early until we get the full BoB IMHO.

 

Happy landings,

 

Talisman

[FTC_Riksen]

I played on the server for the first time today and I gotta say I'm impressed. Very good server with well designed missions and plenty of late aircrafts. Thank you for hosting!

[Alonzo]

10 hours ago, SCG_Riksen said:

I played on the server for the first time today and I gotta say I'm impressed. Very good server with well designed missions and plenty of late aircrafts. Thank you for hosting!

 

Thanks Riksen! We've put a lot of work into it, many minds have collaborated on the mission design, testing, and so on. Glad you like it.

[Alonzo]

Some more videos shot on Combat Box.

 

From Manu:  

 

 

And from 77th_FlyingBull: 

 

[Alonzo]

From Buddy in the 332nd, shot on Combat Box on PSVR on PC.

 

 

[Talon_]

On 6/12/2019 at 4:01 PM, RedKestrel said:

Anyone got video of killing a 262 on CombatBox yet? I need something to warm the cockles of my shrivelled little allied heart!

 

Finally got my admin hacks up and running long enough to kill an Me262, my first ever! ?  

 

 

Edited June 20, 2019 by Talon_