Tactical Air War

[JG7_X-Man]

To the topic above, I am re-reading JG26 Top Guns of the Luftwaffe! My favorite book of on the WW II air war! It was very interesting the Luftwaffe were claiming aircraft shot down in good faith. However, the fact is a lot of the aircraft claimed as "destroyed" either crash landed and were repairable or limped back to base to be repaired and reentered into service. The RAF with Ultra had true figures of the Luftwaffe losses (...all they had to do was count the number of aircraft that were reported lost in the days operation to HQ).

[SCG_Syn]

X-Man, you didn't damage him according to the logs

Also ditched is used if they were inside friendly lines and they put her (the aircraft) down with repairable damage but not on the airfield.

[SCG_Schneemann]

Nice picture Siddy  I've gotten a few VR blackouts when Steam VR decides it's had enough and needs some TLC, usually at the most inopportune times, like on approach in a He111... Could hear the crunch of the gear, doofus "I'm wounded", and of course damaging the airframe past repair. One of those "you've got to be kidding me..." moments, after an hour bombing mission.

[1./JG42flesch]

[Guest deleted@103832]

I can do that too, so what's your point?

 

[HR_Tumu]

flesh , same situation succes yesterday.... on true no have impact to map... Red lost  this map from start ( until kuban is added this current map go to blues 99% )  yesterdat was more funny, blue have viselky on greay many hours... yes . If both sides play whit same oportunities maybe viselky was re-conquer... anyway , i repeat, current map is lost from start.

 

* sry, there are one consequence; reds losing planes with no sense   and blues dont lose planes 

Edited October 16, 2018 by 666GIAP_Tumu

[FTC_Riksen]

The rare moments VVS has an advantage lol ... cmon man, u have better AC and numbers 90% of the time. 

[=LG/F=Kathon]

On 10/15/2018 at 2:16 AM, SCG_Riksen said:

I agree with Zombie. We need to limit the server to 40 Blue vs 44 Red. VVS should have a slight advantage with numbers as well as number of planes. It s fine to keep the models more historical but VVS pilots should have more numbers available to them. I believe this is the best way to keep things more balanced and to stimulate people to fly red ... just my 2 cents

 

I will think about it. Limiting one side to ~40 players would solve the problem with 50:34 ratio (which doesn't happen too often).

 

The bigger problem is with lower number of players e.g. 25:5. Maybe the solution where excessive players (here 20) are not allowed to spawn on the front line airfields would help a little bit. 

 

On 10/12/2018 at 11:15 PM, 7.GShAP/Kamm said:

Hey guys, I know that a lot of us have been having a bit of trouble getting IL2MissionPlanner to work the past few days, but a workaround to at least get it onto the Kuban map right now is to replace the #stalingrad in the URL to #kuban and then press enter,  then refresh the page. 

 

IL2MissionPlanner is working now 

 

 

 

The issue with no AK is a game bug. I hope devs will repair it in the next update.

 

 

On 10/15/2018 at 9:03 AM, Krauz said:

First change that we need in the balance is to separate Ju52 for the special operations and for the cargo missions.

 

If you lose your Ju52, you should get it in the usual way (+3CM or more if your hangar is not full). That will reduce the number of these missions drastically.

 

Second change: the repair option for the airfields should use the number of the players for the calculation of the repair...

 

For example, it was 40: 30... Then the repair should be calculated as 40/30*n for the team that had 30 players in the prev. mission.

 

Third change: the damage level for the AF should use the number of the damaged/destroyed planes that started there (for the fighters). 

 

20 planes lost :  AF damaged 10%..20%  (20% is too much...10% seems not so bad)

 

Interesting ideas

Edited October 16, 2018 by =LG=Kathon

[JG7_X-Man]

The map is working again! Awesome! No more getting lost - maybe

Edited October 16, 2018 by SCG_X-Man

[SCG_Syn]

8 hours ago, =LG=Kathon said:

 

I will think about it. Limiting one side to ~40 players would solve the problem with 50:34 ratio (which doesn't happen too often).

 

The bigger problem is with lower number of players e.g. 25:5. Maybe the solution where excessive players (here 20) are not allowed to spawn on the front line airfields would help a little bit. 

 

 

A game developers have learned that its better to give positive enforcement rather then negative, the community as a whole reacts better to an encouragement instead of a discouragement. Both strive to create a style of game play and community that you want. Ex. You give a time limit on death to prevent players from taking death casually and thinking about their decisions. Perhaps encourage people to fly by giving the team with substantially less players more benefits, like extra xp, more cm, even giving the side with less people signed up more planes/pilots to make up for it. I don't know how hard it is to implement this but just what I've thought out.

[Giovanni_Giorgio]

5 hours ago, SCG_Sinerox said:

A game developers have learned that its better to give positive enforcement rather then negative, the community as a whole reacts better to an encouragement instead of a discouragement. Both strive to create a style of game play and community that you want. Ex. You give a time limit on death to prevent players from taking death casually and thinking about their decisions. Perhaps encourage people to fly by giving the team with substantially less players more benefits, like extra xp, more cm, even giving the side with less people signed up more planes/pilots to make up for it. I don't know how hard it is to implement this but just what I've thought out.

That is a very smart observation, I think.

[Guest deleted@103832]

I would like to make a proposal for slightly revised scoring of ground target kills. My logic is as follows:

 

Currently, destruction of any tank, regardless of type results in the award of 15 pts., which is only slightly more points than one would get for strafing two trucks (14).

 

But that's not all; there is a significant difference in the amount of skill, effort, and weaponry required to destroy a KV-1, which can only be taken out with heavy cannons (and a considerable amount of ammunition), and it pretty much laughs at any bombs other than a direct hit - and a Pz. 38t, which can be destroyed with the .50 cal MGs of an A20B. In terms of armor thickness, it's a glorified armored car.

 

Additionally, AAA guns are lumped into the "Other Ground Kills" category, but I submit that any ground target that can shoot back should be worth more than a truck.

 

This is what I propose:

 

KV-1: 25 pts

T-34: 22 pts

Pz III, IV, and Stug III: 20 pts

BT-7, T-70: 18 pts

Pz 38t: 15 pts

 

Flak 36, K-61 - 12 pts

All other AAA gun types: 10 pts

 

Thank You - - - - - -

 

 

[Flamboyant_Flamingo]

Does the server log update mid-flight?  I landed what the game said was a kill for me but the server has it awarded to another player, so I landed too early to get a CM for it.  

[Cpt_Siddy]

Make limited supply of AAA assets, once they are gone, you only get half of them on the targets and fields 

 

/puts on asbestos suit 

[7.GShAP/Silas]

49 minutes ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

/puts on asbestos suit 

 

RIP Steve McQueen

[Garven]

3 hours ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

Make limited supply of AAA assets, once they are gone, you only get half of them on the targets and fields 

 

/puts on asbestos suit 

Cry Havoc, and let slip the Weasels of war.

 

Spoiler

 

 

[Haza]

Just now, StG77_HvB said:

I would like to make a proposal for slightly revised scoring of ground target kills. My logic is as follows:

 

Currently, destruction of any tank, regardless of type results in the award of 15 pts., which is only slightly more points than one would get for strafing two trucks (14).

 

But that's not all; there is a significant difference in the amount of skill, effort, and weaponry required to destroy a KV-1, which can only be taken out with heavy cannons (and a considerable amount of ammunition), and it pretty much laughs at any bombs other than a direct hit - and a Pz. 38t, which can be destroyed with the .50 cal MGs of an A20B. In terms of armor thickness, it's a glorified armored car.

 

Additionally, AAA guns are lumped into the "Other Ground Kills" category, but I submit that any ground target that can shoot back should be worth more than a truck.

 

This is what I propose:

 

KV-1: 25 pts

T-34: 22 pts

Pz III, IV, and Stug III: 20 pts

BT-7, T-70: 18 pts

Pz 38t: 15 pts

 

Flak 36, K-61 - 12 pts

All other AAA gun types: 10 pts

 

Thank You - - - - - -

 

 

 

In that case, with the same logic, can downing a Pe2 be worth 1000 pts please?

 

Regards

 

 

[=OKT=Muas]

The web site mission planner seems to be improved and fully working which is great, but I'm still not able to export a mission plan on MS Edge...

And it's strange when I try to close the browser, it says it is still downloading a file...

On Chrome though, the export function works flawlessly.

 

Just to report this small issue.

 

The planner is very useful, thank you.

[=LG/F=Kathon]

12 hours ago, wandering_man said:

Does the server log update mid-flight?  I landed what the game said was a kill for me but the server has it awarded to another player, so I landed too early to get a CM for it.  

Yes.

 

I plan to give CM also for assists in the next campaign.

 

3 hours ago, Haza said:

 

In that case, with the same logic, can downing a Pe2 be worth 1000 pts please?

 

Regards

 

 

Sounds reasonable.

 

1 hour ago, Muas said:

The web site mission planner seems to be improved and fully working which is great, but I'm still not able to export a mission plan on MS Edge...

And it's strange when I try to close the browser, it says it is still downloading a file...

On Chrome though, the export function works flawlessly.

 

Just to report this small issue.

 

The planner is very useful, thank you.

Please pm 19//curiousGamblerr he provides il2missionplanner.

[Pedersen]

I don't know if this is possible, but I think it would be good to disable the "plane spotted near xyz" when the server is above a certain number of players. I guess it is ok when there is few playing but I have often been saved by this message when climbing to a target or have been able to intercept peshkas attacking a train. 

More complicated - perhaps a single plane would have a lower chance of being reported compared with 3-4. 

 

Another thing I was wondering if was possible would be to lock a pilot to the first airfield chosen at the start of the mission, unless of course he lands elsewhere, then he would have to take off from there. Maybe this would be unpopular but I think it could create some interesting situations and give the one team a way to sort of suppress the other. Either one would risk a take off to defend the field or have to stay grounded until it is safe. 

[StG77_Kondor]

Since we're in the mood to make suggestions:

• If you receive damage from an enemy player, before making the cut off of 15 or 25 mins depending on what you're flying - you should be able to get a CM if you land back at base. This campaign more than any other I've been intercepted shortly after take off only to have to limp back to base. 
• Blue should realize the quicker they win the map, the less time they have to fly their super planes.

[Flamboyant_Flamingo]

5 hours ago, =LG=Kathon said:

I plan to give CM also for assists in the next campaign.

 

Thanks!

[AKA_Relent]

I know it’s a lot of work to set up/tweak each of the 8 maps currently in each TAW round.  However, I’d like to see another map (or two!) added at the end that has the same/similar plane set as map 8 - which can possibly be tweaked with regards to numbers of each type.

 

Given the flow of the campaign where early war/maps favor the German aircraft types, it seems the fitting that as improved Russian designs were put into production that we should have more maps with mainly those advanced designs as well.  For example, have a max of 2 La5FN, Yak-1b and Yak-7b, etc instead of 1, similarly for the corresponding German aircraft.

Edited October 18, 2018 by AKA_Relent

[JG4_dingsda]

@=LG=Kathon These chatcommands would be nice:

 

::give <plane> [<player> | pool]

  Takes a plane that is available in the map and not a +1 and moves it either to the specified player or to the pool of the squadron. Squadron-Pool consists of planes that are available in the map and not +1 and starts with everything 0 at the beginning of the campaign.

::take <plane>

  Takes plane (if available) from Squadron-Pool and adds it to the issuing player's planes.

 

And while we are at it:

::time

  Sends Servertime to chat (player-uid) of issuing player.

 

(I'd know how to implement that -- if the idea itself is not considered a bad one)

Edited October 18, 2018 by JG4_dingsda

[Psyrion]

CM for Assists will be a good change.

[AKA_Relent]

Another suggestion is to limit (on both sides of course) the number of pilots that can spawn from one base.  Maybe there is a limit right now, but I think it’s only limited by the number of spawn points that are currently occupied.  Thus, as soon as someone moves forward, that spawn point becomes available.

 

The reason is simple - in real life, an airbase wouldn’t have a seemingly endless supply of aircraft and pilots.  There might be one squadron, such that other squadrons from other airfields would need to fly from all of the disparate airfields if they wanted to have a large group (I.e. more than one squadron) flying together toward some objective.

 

Unless I’m mistaken, right now, if for example, an airfield is captured, and the side capturing has say a 50-25 advantage in pilots, potentially all 50 from that side could spawn from that airfield (given the scenario described above with pilots moving forward off the spawn point), and swarm an area.

 

In reality, any aircraft would have to first be flown in, and likely it would just be a squadron (depending on the size of the airfield).  So it should be here - maybe have a CAP of 12 or 16 pilots that can spawned at any given airfield - except maybe the “border” airfields since they are usually the last to be captured.

 

@=LG= for your consideration, and thanks again for all you do to provide this campaign experience.

[Pedersen]

Maybe we could let red gain some ground to prolong the campaign?  

[7.GShAP/Silas]

Please just end the hell that is this map.

[Alonzo]

1 hour ago, AKA_Relent said:

Unless I’m mistaken, right now, if for example, an airfield is captured, and the side capturing has say a 50-25 advantage in pilots, potentially all 50 from that side could spawn from that airfield (given the scenario described above with pilots moving forward off the spawn point), and swarm an area.

 

I was under the impression that the aircraft available at each field is limited, both by what's at the field and whether each individual pilot has that plane in their 'inventory.' I don't think you can just spawn 50 109's if the airfield only has a stock of a dozen.

[AKA_Relent]

6 hours ago, Alonzo_ said:

 

I was under the impression that the aircraft available at each field is limited, both by what's at the field and whether each individual pilot has that plane in their 'inventory.' I don't think you can just spawn 50 109's if the airfield only has a stock of a dozen.

 

It would be good for LG to verify this.  However, I know that sometimes I’ve tried to spawn at a busy airfield and I’ve gotten a message “airfield conditions have changed”, and I can’t spawn.  But, as soon as someone has moved out of the spawn point I can then spawn.  I’m not sure about aircraft stock at an airfield.

 

So 50 at one time spawned in together - no, I know you probably can’t do that.  But if pilots keep spawning and then taxi a little to leave their spawn point uncovered, that’s what I’m talking/wondering about - you could then theoretically have 50 pilots “eventually” spawned and up flying from that single airfield.

Edited October 19, 2018 by AKA_Relent

[Alonzo]

3 hours ago, AKA_Relent said:

 

It would be good for LG to verify this.  However, I know that sometimes I’ve tried to spawn at a busy airfield and I’ve gotten a message “airfield conditions have changed”, and I can’t spawn.  But, as soon as someone has moved out of the spawn point I can then spawn.  I’m not sure about aircraft stock at an airfield.

 

So 50 at one time spawned in together - no, I know you probably can’t do that.  But if pilots keep spawning and then taxi a little to leave their spawn point uncovered, that’s what I’m taking/wondering about - you could then theoretically have 50 pilots “eventually” spawned and up flying from that single airfield.

 

I guess it needs to be verified. I've seen that message before too, usually means there's no parking spots and as you said it clears once someone moves. The *intent* is clearly to limit planes available at each airfield, I guess we'd need to test (couple of people in voice, a/c type with only 1 left) and try to have two people take it at once.

[=EXPEND=Tripwire]

12 minutes ago, Alonzo_ said:

 

I guess it needs to be verified. I've seen that message before too, usually means there's no parking spots and as you said it clears once someone moves. The *intent* is clearly to limit planes available at each airfield, I guess we'd need to test (couple of people in voice, a/c type with only 1 left) and try to have two people take it at once.

The game mechanic works. Only one will be able to select the plane.

 

Furthermore,  if the player returns the plane to this airfield, it will be added back into the pool.

 

Fly your plane to an airfield that doesn't start with your plane will lose the plane. 

 

Also flying your plane with special mods not available at another airfield also wastes the plane I believe. 

 

 

[Leutnant_Artur]

5 hours ago, AKA_Relent said:

 

It would be good for LG to verify this.  However, I know that sometimes I’ve tried to spawn at a busy airfield and I’ve gotten a message “airfield conditions have changed”, and I can’t spawn.  But, as soon as someone has moved out of the spawn point I can then spawn.  I’m not sure about aircraft stock at an airfield.

 

So 50 at one time spawned in together - no, I know you probably can’t do that.  But if pilots keep spawning and then taxi a little to leave their spawn point uncovered, that’s what I’m taking/wondering about - you could then theoretically have 50 pilots “eventually” spawned and up flying from that single airfield.

That is true.

[Talon_]

4 hours ago, Alonzo_ said:

 

I guess it needs to be verified. I've seen that message before too, usually means there's no parking spots and as you said it clears once someone moves. The *intent* is clearly to limit planes available at each airfield, I guess we'd need to test (couple of people in voice, a/c type with only 1 left) and try to have two people take it at once.

 

Frontline airfields are limited in plane number. Rearward bases such as those we usually use are not.

[FTC_DerSheriff]

3 minutes ago, Talon_ said:

 

Frontline airfields are limited in plane number. Rearward bases such as those we usually use are not.

only if the airfields are damaged. If a airfield is damaged to like 35% there are 20 aircraft per type available. At 50% there are 5 per type available.

[Talon_]

1 minute ago, DerSheriff said:

only if the airfields are damaged. If a airfield is damaged to like 35% there are 20 aircraft per type available. At 50% there are 5 per type available.

 

Yes sorry I forgot to include this (and for what it's worth, they're often damaged ^_^ )

[Blackhawk_FR]

Have you ever discussed (I guess yes) about the possibility of offering an aircraft to a teammate? 

[StG77_Kondor]

2 hours ago, F/JG300_Faucon said:

Have you ever discussed (I guess yes) about the possibility of offering an aircraft to a teammate? 

Interesting idea, but I don't think I like it. It gives people who solely fly either bombers or fighters basically double the # of planes in the hangar, if their friend flies the other type of plane. I thought the whole point of TAW was to curb the reckless behavior that is found in just about every other MP server. If you know you can just talk to your bomber buddy for another 109F-4 then no problem. Same with bomber pilots. If you know you'll get a Ju-88 replaced, you are more likely to take stupid risks. Additionally, as it's currently set up, you could just make multiple pilot profiles, and keep borrowing planes from these profiles at will. 

 

I would be more inclined to have changes to the current hangar system with respect to how many planes can be stored, and the plane set itself can always be tweaked. For example, if you have a streak of 25? 50? CM without death or capture, maybe you get a bonus plane of your choice. I'd much rather reward pilots for surviving than relying on a buddy to constantly feed you new fighters/bombers.

Edited October 19, 2018 by StG77_Kondor

[JG4_dingsda]

@StG77_Kondor This is assuming that everybody gets all plane types. If you'd only get planes specific to your role, the situation would change. As a bomber you could still fly as fighter now and then by getting a fighter from your fighter body and vice versa. Or get a plane of the other type from the squadron hangar.

 

3 hours ago, StG77_Kondor said:

Additionally, as it's currently set up, you could just make multiple pilot profiles, and keep borrowing planes from these profiles at will. 

This is a bigger problem, though.

 

But you are right: Together with the current hangar system it would probably not work out and take away from what makes this server unique.

[7.GShAP/Silas]

If you segregate pilots by aircraft type then you'll have 99% of people in fighters rather than 94%(literally) as it is now.