Invisible objects

[LachenKrieg]

2 hours ago, DD_Arthur said:

 

Hi LachenKrieg.  Yes, I am aware of other flyers that have hit invisible objects.  I am certainly NOT implying that someone has either hacked the game or added this as a 'feature.' It's a bug.

 

As far as I am aware this only occurs online and I've always attributed it to the mysterious world of netcode.  Thats why it seems to come and go and why I think it'll be a difficult bug to squash.

 

Thanks for your reply. That is interesting, but if the game itself is able to generate map objects on its own without the Developers intending it, or even knowing about it, then they obviously have bigger problems then most here realize.

[FlyingH]

Didn´t see any birds there, othetrwise it could have been a birdstrike! (The landing scene)

[-DED-Rapidus]

23 hours ago, LachenKrieg said:

Thanks for your reply. That is interesting, but if the game itself is able to generate map objects on its own without the Developers intending it, or even knowing about it, then they obviously have bigger problems then most here realize.

No need to come up with conspiracy theories) just give the coordinates of the objects.

[LachenKrieg]

45 minutes ago, -DED-Rapidus said:

No need to come up with conspiracy theories) just give the coordinates of the objects.

My apologies @-DED-Rapidus, but I'm not making up any conspiracy theories. I am simply commenting on something someone else suggested in a post. But thanks for the heads-up, and thanks for taking the time to respond to these posts.

[JG1_Vonrd]

Bumping this thread... Rapidus, any ideas from the Devs? This is a most annoying bug. There are so many invisible objs that it seems fruitless to attempt to map them all.

 

Thank you

[315_R2r]

On 12/14/2020 at 5:51 AM, -DED-Rapidus said:

As for invisible trees, or as they are also called invisible stumps, then Yes, there are problems for which work is planned after the new year to find and eradicate them, so I will be happy to get any help in finding them.

Any progress, needs some tracks? Examples?

[-DED-Rapidus]

@315_R2r, yes, if you have encountered an invisible object on the map.

[LUZITANO]

Hello dear developers. Today I was playing and the planes were invisible. I thought it was just the planes, but the enemy tanks were also invisible. I saw planes and tanks fighting, but I could only see the ammunition exploding on the ground, or the bombs ...

 

Tank Crew is becoming popular and I hope that many people will play this tank simulator, but I must remember that the bugs create a negative image for the game.

I expect an update to resolve this bug soon, thanks.
 

[TP_Silk]

I've been wondering whether the 'invisible tree' thing may be due to differences between the season maps and precisely where trees are positioned on them.

[TP-Bloomster]

Just sign into Finnish server drive through a forest and I guarantee you will hit at least two of these invisible objects. It was laughable the other night, four tanks going through a forest all of us hitting the cloaked objects every few minutes  that breaks your  transmission, damages engine and damages tracks. 
 

great game aspect but it is fundamentally flawed at the moment by this issue.

[von_Tom]

 

I can spawn in and see aircraft and tanks.  At some point tanks will disappear and occasionally reappear.  There seems to be no rhyme or reason behind it, or anything I can isolate as causing it to happen.

 

Finnish Loosen Deuce server.

 

Valve Index headset, though a squad mate in a G2 also experienced the same thing.  Another squad mate in 2D had no problems.

 

I will try to record a track.

 

von Tom

 

 

[WWBayonet]

It's a massive piss-off.  An alt-F4 pissoff.

 

[jollyjack]

I often wondered about while in game play how to pinpoint the location one is at as player, or viewer, to find it on the map in the ME.

Maybe with a tool, or plugin showing the exact sector? Some camera option? Otherwise it would be hard to report invisible objects.

 

@Rapidus; If you find such a spot, can you start recording at the location, and is it reported then for the bug hunting department if i send the track?

[-DED-Rapidus]

@jollyjack, usually a screenshot from the map with an indication of the sector of the square and a screenshot where the impact on an invisible obstacle was recorded is enough.

[jollyjack]

yep, i did that before, but in the game it's hard to see (of find) the sector number, why my question ..

[-DED-Rapidus]

Unfortunately, there are no game tools for players to find out the exact coordinates of X,Y.

[jollyjack]

OK. Actually my Q was: if i rerun the spot after starting recording that one spot, stop recording after that, if that's any use for you?.

[-DED-Rapidus]

@jollyjack, yep, quite well.

[coconut]

I would also suggest that people who know how to use the editor, when they encounter an invisible object, create a simple mission on the same map, without any static objects, put a tank in the same place and then check if the collision with an invisible object still happens. If not, then it's a static mesh collision issue, and if that static object is not one of the detailed blocks meant to be used in tank missions, then it's a mission design issue.

[Fritz_Faber]

Question to the developers:

 

As to fix the invisible object bug seems to be a bit difficult, is it possible to reduce the effect of collision with objects?

 

Now the damage effects are injuries to crew, engine damage... even with low speed.

Not only caused by invisible objects even caused by visible objects like little stuff in villages between houses.

A tank, especially a middle or heavy one, should overrun such objects without such consequences.

 

To fix the collision effect in such way would help the tank community a lot.

Imagine your plane is flying into invisible obstacles three times per hour, and you have to respawn all the time, nobody would accept this. 

Maybe to reduce the collision consequences for tank and crew is much easier than to fix all the invisible objects!?
 

?‍♂️

 

Edited April 19, 2021 by Fritz_Faber

[-DED-Rapidus]

@Fritz_Faber, thanks, this approach is undesirable, because it is "healing" the consequences of the problem, and not its cause.

[Fritz_Faber]

Thank you for your answer.

[JG1_Wittmann]

I believe -DED-Rapidus  has  mistakenly thought that this topic was only dealing with invisible objects.  Hitting an invisible object and having your tank stopped is an annoyance.  THat seems to be a problem that is going to take a very long time to fix, if it ever can be. 

 

The issue that these objects bring to the forefront is the  incorrect damage model the tanks have when striking these objects.   No tank going off-road speed should have engine, transmission, steering, track and Crew damage.  Especially if you are going  10mph, 15 kph.  Totally unrealistic  and way off.  It is very cartoonish to be in commander, unbuttoned and see your side skirts come apart at a 15 or less kph collision.   It would seem to me, and probably many others playing tanks that fixing the unrealistic damage from collisions, with both visible and invisible objects,  should be the primary concern and needs to be adressed, not blown off or sidestepped.  I would imagine this is a potential sales killer if people look into this game and read about  unrealistic collision damage. 

[JG1_Vonrd]

12 hours ago, -DED-Rapidus said:

@Fritz_Faber, thanks, this approach is undesirable, because it is "healing" the consequences of the problem, and not its cause.

Understood... but how far off is the fix of the root cause? We're under the impression that it's not to be in the near future. I think that the consensus among the players here is that it would be more palatable to remove or tone down the collision damage until the root cause is

 fixed.  

[Fritz_Faber]

2 hours ago, JG1_Wittmann said:

I believe -DED-Rapidus  has  mistakenly thought that this topic was only dealing with invisible objects.  Hitting an invisible object and having your tank stopped is an annoyance.  THat seems to be a problem that is going to take a very long time to fix, if it ever can be. 

 

The issue that these objects bring to the forefront is the  incorrect damage model the tanks have when striking these objects.   No tank going off-road speed should have engine, transmission, steering, track and Crew damage.  Especially if you are going  10mph, 15 kph.  Totally unrealistic  and way off.  It is very cartoonish to be in commander, unbuttoned and see your side skirts come apart at a 15 or less kph collision.   It would seem to me, and probably many others playing tanks that fixing the unrealistic damage from collisions, with both visible and invisible objects,  should be the primary concern and needs to be adressed, not blown off or sidestepped.  I would imagine this is a potential sales killer if people look into this game and read about  unrealistic collision damage. 

Yes thank you Wittmann, that is what I was saying besides the invisible object bug:

 

The collision effect is not realistic, it should be reduced in general.

 

To fix it would make the invisible objects less annoying.
 

Edited April 20, 2021 by Fritz_Faber

[JG1_Kaiser]

On 4/20/2021 at 4:05 PM, Fritz_Faber said:

Yes thank you Wittmann, that is what I was saying besides the invisible object bug:

 

The collision effect is not realistic, it should be reduced in general.

 

To fix it would make the invisible objects less annoying.
 

Why not just fix the invisible objects in general??  It's like a doctor, treating symptoms but not curing anything.

 

[-DED-Rapidus]

@J30_Kaiser,It will be fixed by one task, so I attached this topic. It is necessary to generalize all the found objects into one task.

[Sonntagskind]

15 hours ago, TIGRE88 said:

 

1: the turret is blocked by itself during the game and it is impossible to unlock it " it can happen after 10 minutes of play"

 

2: there is an invisible wall in the middle of the bridge in the city of cologne, the tank gets smashed into it. 

 

3 : the tank moves like a boat in a rough sea, yet it rolls in the flat streets of a city. "this is not a bug but a problem of realism,  

   driving in town is unpleasant" 

 

Apparently, there is an invisible object on the bridge in cologne (I did not check myself, just quoting from the tank crew forum) 

[2/JG26_rudidlo]

1 hour ago, Hermod said:

Apparently, there is an invisible object on the bridge in cologne (I did not check myself, just quoting from the tank crew forum) 

Apparently, there are some forum threads focused to specific bugs and issues (like this one). I tried to point @TIGRE88 to them before, but I failed

[stupor-mundi]

On 4/14/2021 at 9:27 AM, -DED-Rapidus said:

Unfortunately, there are no game tools for players to find out the exact coordinates of X,Y.

I'm unsure whether this collection of examples is meant to be, to have a few examples which can be investigated, or whether the expectation is to fix those examples by hand.

If the former, good idea. If the latter, it would mean a misconception about the scale of the problem/the total number of invisible objects.

If it's the goal to fix not only the Prokhorovka map, but the maps in general, you're looking easily in the order of tens of thousands or so. Not a good idea to try to fix them by hand.

Near the example which Rivaldo has posted, at the east riverbank in Seversk there are a few, which can be found by driving as close to the water as possible.

Interestingly I never bumped into one on the west riverbank.

 

On 12/21/2020 at 3:04 PM, DD_Arthur said:

As far as I am aware this only occurs online and I've always attributed it to the mysterious world of netcode.

I can't attest to the invisible objects found by planes, however, regarding those found by tanks, I once wondered whether the invisible trees which are present in EFront's Seversk mission were in the mission due to maybe how the mission was designed or some multiplayer related thing, or, whether they are part of the underlying landscape, which we can assume is the same offline.

So I created a tiny offline mission where I placed a tank in Seversk. I had no trouble finding the invisible objects in the familiar locations, i.e. they are baked into the maps, and not some sort of fleeting, netcode related phenomenon.

[jollyjack]

Rheinland winter map, Cologne, about the middle of the middle RW bridge. Checked the bridge blocks, seems OK.

https://www.mediafire.com/view/nf2juh6wjbxj2v8/Cologne_middle_RW_bridge_hidden_obstacle.jpg/file

 

There's also one at the same spot one on the right bridge, speeding to it causes the tank to jump across it.

Edited May 1, 2021 by jollyjack

[JG1_Wittmann]

What is annoying  about any feeble response rapidus has made  is there seems to be a total lack of recognition  that there is a serious damage model problem that accompanies the invisible object issue,  and that is the collision damage model or tanks at off-road or any speed.  I wonder if some of the devs  watched  too many phony documentaries  where  claims are made by tank crews that they disabled another tank by driving their tank into it when their gun was damaged or out of ammo.  Never happened,  speeds off-road are too slow to make it possible to happen,  and lies or tall tales that sound good often get repeated as true.  

 

Invisible, and Visible objects  should not do any damage to a tank.  I ran into a well house  in the middle of the road, dog wanted me to throw his basketball, I didn't turn enough or the right way.   The damage to my tank was engine, both tracks, transmission, steering, and seriously injured all  crewmen.  Basically had to end the mission as commander and gunners vision was shot.    Now whether or not  that well can be made a destroy-able object  is beside the point.  It should do no damage to my tank.  I it stopped me,  that would be a slight nuisance, but to basically disable the tank is  ridiculous.   I have run into a building going slow,  or hit the porch and suffered damage,  again, ridiculous.   2 tanks  going full speed on the road  @ 30mph each  would likely receive some damage  but I don't think that   both would be disabled to the extent that they are now.  

 

Calling a fix  for a ridiculous collision damage model  undesirable  is  a telling statement.  On the one hand  the dev team  wants it to be known that the sim is the most realistic, yet on the other the clinging to an erroneous collision damage model  is  confusing.  It's way off  and  less realistic than the unrealistic off-road terrain model,  which is also ridiculous.  It is  probably a fact now that not all buildings  can be destroyed.  But a porch, or a well, or a house, a tree,  or debris left over from a tank destroying it should not damage or flip the tank over.  That should be the case whether or not the objects are visible.   Some objects might be enough to stop the tank,  some might stop it briefly,  and in those cases you would expect the tracks to churn up the off-road plowed ground,  instead of catastrophic damage and all crew injured.

 

I may have missed it but I have yet to see any  of the dev team acknowledge that the collision damage model  needs  "tuning" .   I haven't heard much on this from the dev team  fanboys  on here either ( if they are not actually paid employees )  Why is it so difficult  for some official word to come out on collision damage or injuries  being looked at ?    Does the dev team actually believe the collision damage is even close  at all ?   Is what is going on in game with the collision damage/injuries  so bad that any from the team are embarrassed to talk about it ?   What exactly is it,   do you think this damage and injuries are even close to reality, at all ?  Please give the tank players some kind of acknowledgement on collision damage.   Enough of  the locations of objects  fix the damage/injuries,  then go after the invisible objects.

[JG1_Wittmann]

This is the type of  poor tank collision damage model  being referred to.   This will happen whether the object is  visible, like this small well,  or invisible   at any speed  over @ 10KPH.   See below :

 

 

 

I got lucky here  and didn't  suffer the normal left and right track damage  adding a good amount of repair time.   21 KPH,  13MPH,    really guys ?

Hopefully we can do better than this  in upcoming  updates.

Edited May 11, 2021 by JG1_Wittmann

[DD_Perfesser]

I haven't seen it mentioned here but all the invisible objects I've hit were on the edges of forests except for just a very few. I'll slow down about 100' before reaching trees and go slowly leaving trees. Very rarely a problem inside the forest itself. Never travel along a tree line except the ones lining roads or defining fields- they seem to be OK. The edges of larger irregular forests seem to be where most of the invisible walls are.

 

I don't mind so much repairing the tank but after a few solid crashes the crew is so injured it's pointless to continue.

Edited July 7, 2021 by DD_Perfesser

[Remontti]

Screenshots of map and my location after collision

 

[IckyATLAS]

There are some issues also with the Kuban map in cities where you have roads with 90 degree turns between buildings. In certain places the tanks will start hitting the building and never be able to do the turn.

I even moved the buildings to leave more space and it did not work. 

Now by reading this thread I understand that there was probably an invisible object there which made the tanks try to go around an obstacle and hit the building and even if the building was moved and they had enough room they tried to continue going out of the road like trying to avoid something on the road.

I solved the problem using other streets and in general avoiding to go with tank and truck columns through the middle of the cities with a lot of buildings.

 

 

[-DED-Rapidus]

@IckyATLAS, please specify a place on the map or a mission for an example.

[Fritz_Faber]

my message from april 17th:

 

"The tank community is growing up, good news for the developers of Tank Crew.

Unfortunately the bug of invisible objects (trees) isn‘t fixed, which is annoying.

To run with your tank into an invisible tree ruins your engine, in a few cases with high speed you even could be killed.

Mostly it causes a respawn, which on online servers means very often, you loose one of the limited heavier tanks and have to continue mission with a papertank.

Same happens with the visible little wooden stuff in a village between the houses, which should be overrun by a tank so smooth that the crew shouldn’t notice that.

I ask the developers, why is it so difficult to fix these bugs as they are known since start of TC?

If so, could you please change the damage model script - maybe that is easier - that a collision with such objects doesn’t ruins your engine?

TC is great, we have lot of fun, it has potential to be the best WWII tank simulator.

But that bug sometimes drives you crazy."

 

Since the introduction and sale of TC to us customers, the product still can only be used to a limited extent.
Hundreds of complaints and suggestions for remedying or defusing this problem have led to nothing after so many months.

The developers of this game ignore it, nothing happens.

Instead, things are spruced up with a lot of effort - skins, clouds, grenade impact holes on the surface of tanks.
All beautiful make-up, nice to have, but it would be more important to gradually make the product playable first, or not? 

Edited November 2, 2021 by Fritz_Faber

[CCG_Pips]

On 12/22/2020 at 4:23 PM, -DED-Rapidus said:

No need to come up with conspiracy theories) just give the coordinates of the objects.

Impossible...there are everywhere on all maps except (May be....not tested)  Rheinland.

You have to Works not only on invisible objects, but on survavibility of crew when hiting an invisible object.

 

From Last update it is worst.....driving at 15 km/h and hiting an invisible object is enough to kill the tank driver......this is simply not acceptable.

On Moscow map at this point ....see the screenshot

Edited December 22, 2021 by CCG_Pips

[Roland_HUNter]

I found the place of it:(Moscow, Autumn 1941)