Jump to content

Advance And Secure (Planes And Tanks)


super-truite
 Share

Recommended Posts

RIVALDO

I believe that the"arrow" on the map(GPS) helps new players to figure out where in the hell they are and where to go. I personally do fine without it and prefer no GPS for both tanking and flying. Also a lot not so new players do not go on servers that don't have the GPS. Is right or wrong, i don't know. Most of the AI does what it is supposed to but yeah,sometimes you see a sherman drive by a panther as if they were buddies ūüėÜ.Also you'll see a tiger ramming the wall of a building for an hour ūü§£.¬†

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite
Posted (edited)

Alright angry Stalin, you win, I am finishing the little script to remove AI when there is enough players :biggrin:. I think I will activate it starting from 3 players on each side.
Regarding the GPS I think it is mandatory for two reasons:
-The server is kind of "arcadish" and really fast paced and will attract similar players as wings of liberty. I see this in the future as "the Wings of Liberty of tanks" (The Wheels of liberty maybe :biggrin:)?
-The maps are not detailed enough, especially for cities. If you do not have the GPS in tanks, you could get lost really easily. It's ok in planes to get lost because you can quickly find a city, forest or other recognizable areas and then understand where you are at. In tanks it can be quite difficult to to find such landmarks.

 

Yeash some AI tanks have a really weird behavior (especially in the city). I guess it is because they encounter enemy tanks at close range and the 30sec time or so that is needed for them to acquire the target looks really silly in that kind of situation. Tigers in Koln should stop ramming buildings (At least I tried to fix their waypoints recently)

 

Edit: small update to the stat website. I use this mod now :

 

Edited by super-truite
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

=FEW=Revolves
3 hours ago, super-truite said:

 

Edit: small update to the stat website. I use this mod now :

 

 

Hey super-truite, thanks for installing my bundle! Hope you like it :)

 

I was looking through your server to see if everything has gone alright, and I noticed a bug - the aircraft killboard calculations (and Elo) were taking AI kills by turret gunner into account. (the killboard does not take AI kills from the main gun into account) You can notice the bug by how high the Elo on the IL-2 is on your server. Or by this page: http://www.aas-il2.com/en/aircraft_killboard/191/NO_FILTER/?tour=4

 

I've pushed an update to the bundle which fixes the problem. You might want to update :) (just copy over the src)

 

Unfortunately the update doesn't fix it for the stats that has already been calculated (just for future sorties).  If you want to fix the data you've already got, you can either reset all the stats (be sure to backup your DB if you do this, and only do it if you've kept your logs, the script is called reset_stats in your run folder) and then just recompute all the data - or, if that's not an option, you can ask me to write you a small script which basically tells the system to recompute only the aircraft stats. (I'd get back to you in a couple days on that)

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite
Posted (edited)

thx ! will update right away.
I do not mind having some mistakes in the historical data.

Edited by super-truite
  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

LUZITANO
7 hours ago, super-truite said:

Regarding the GPS I think it is mandatory for two reasons:
-The server is kind of "arcadish" and really fast paced and will attract similar players as wings of liberty. I see this in the future as "the Wings of Liberty of tanks" (The Wheels of liberty maybe :biggrin:)?
-The maps are not detailed enough, especially for cities. If you do not have the GPS in tanks, you could get lost really easily. It's ok in planes to get lost because you can quickly find a city, forest or other recognizable areas and then understand where you are at. In tanks it can be quite difficult to to find such landmarks.

super-truit when I wrote that "letter" I thought about it a lot and I agree with you.

I heard about your server in the most famous video out there promoting Tank Crew, he mentions AI as something characteristic and positive on your server. I think it's cool to have a couple of AI tanks hanging around, AI can be good in limited quantities.

The video:

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fritz_Faber

Reducing  the AI starting from three players each side would be great!

Today evening we were 23 Players in mission prelestnoye and AI was still a bloody thing.

I was killed 6 times, 5 times were AI kills, just one was caused by a human player.

The AI planes are too deadly, each attack is one kill.  
As a tankman you don‚Äėt have any chance against them. It is frustrating and undermines your efforts to¬†play ‚Äěreal‚Äú by surviving as long as possible.

The missions are great and getting better and better. 
Sometimes - it depends on the players preferences - there are more pilots in the area than tankers.

Then your survival time are just¬†minutes, or you will be killed at spawn point before you have started your engine ūüė†.

My wishes and hopes are that we will have one time a server focusing tank battles, minimizing the influence and effectivness of planes to the result of mission and your skills as a tankman.

 


 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite

I already launched the AI monitoring script for testing but unfortunately the command is not received by the server. Will fix it this week-end if I have time.
I will set the ground attack AI planes difficulty to high instead of Ace. But AI planes should be way less annoying because they now move from one attack area to another. Also they do not attack (or really rarely) in the forest because I tried to avoid forests in the attack areas.
I might try a few events with tank only in the future, but I think the server is not popular enough to completely remove planes. In my team, players join with planes to coordinate with the ones in tanks and it would be less interesting without planes for us (would split the team in several servers). Also, it has the advantage of letting plane players try tanks from time to time. Some bought TC by trying the different positions in my tank for instance. Besides I think it will be fun when the AA vehicles are released.
So my vision would be: 
- Keep planes and tanks, with maybe some small balancing actions (limit number of planes or weapons sets as was discussed on discord yesterday)
- Create some punctual  events with tank only
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fritz_Faber

You are right and I'm sharing your opinion that 'combined arms' - tanks AND planes AND AA vehicles in future - are more interesting than just tanks.

That will give us an authentic feeling of the complexity of war.

Otherwise I'm thinking about how to realize a typical REAL WWII Tank-battle.

In the moment there is a big disproportion, it is completely unreal:

In WWII was the risk for a tanker to be killed by an enemy pilot in proportion to be killed by an enemy tank - for example - 1:20 (depending on time and location: 1941 east was another scenario than 1945 west, for sure).

On AAS server the ratio is about 10:1, the opposite of reality.

Yesterday evening on prelestnoye - I told you - I was killed 6 times, 5 AI kills and 1 human.

The only human kill was caused by an IL2 (I don't want to tell the player name, but he is always the same pilot ūüėĚ).

 

I know the problem of balancing (in TAW we discuss such topics since years, campaign by campaign, it will never end and never come to a happy end) and I don't have a solution to solve it. Maybe the community have ideas how to make the missions more real ... ?

 

A tank server should have the focus on tanks, tanks against tanks.

All other stuff (planes, artillery, AA vehicles, infantry, cows, barking dogs ...) should be 'accessoires'.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ST_Bump

Anyone using the IL2 SRS communication app? haven't had time to read thru the instructions.

Just wondering if it works with this server.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite

Not sure if people are connected to it, but it runs on my server: If you install it and launch it before starting the game, it should connect you automatically when joining the server.
You can ask people to join in chat. But there are a lot of people whose mother tongue is not english. Most of the people I see on the server seem to be french, german,  spanish, italian and russian . 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

RIVALDO

Definitely keep the planes on the server.¬† Also reducing down from Ace is good. ūüėÄ

If you get killed by the AI tanks that means you're rushing in to the battle to fast or expose your vulnerable flanks. I've been killed by the AI through the building and trees. It doesn't feel good. But that means we gotta use more caution. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fritz_Faber

Yes I agree, reducing AI planes from Ace, and reducing AI when number of 3 players each side is reached, will be fine. 

More caution?

Rivaldo, sometimes your team is pushing forward, and you can't stay in defensive position for your own.

Then you have to stay on the side of your comrades and have to die ūüėĒ...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

RIVALDO

Sooo true!!! But you have to be aware of those sneaky AI bots! I look for them more than i look for a real player ūüėā. Somehow they tend to kill you when least expected ūüė•ūüė£

Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite
Posted (edited)

I see that the server is more and more giving the "mission server overload" message. It is weird because the mission did not change much and I even decreased the number of AI ... 
Anyway, to fix it I think I will need to replace the 'playable' AI tanks (the same as the player but controllable by AI) by regular AI tanks that are supposed to cost less in terms of computing resources. 
One issue I have with that is that I think the armor is quite broken on those ones. 
I will create a topic in the general discussion to see if people feel the same.

 

Edit:

 

Edited by super-truite
Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite

Small experiment: The Köln map will now feature AI non playable tanks (jagdpanzer, stug etc.). And I removed one AI plane on each side. Let's see if it improves the performances.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

ickylevel

Salut super truite. Thank you for your mod. Without it playing tanks in multiplayer wouldn't be a thing in this game. The finnish sever, without the gps feature makes it painfully difficult to find the objectives. On top of that, there are too many objectives and they are too far appart. And they don't take into account roads. But your gamemode addresses all these issues.

Do you have a game balance mechanism in place to address the fact that tigers panthers and ferdinands are much better tanks than the su 152?

Like giving less of them to the team, or making them deplete quicker. You could also leverage the fact that the base tank for german, the panzer 3, is weaker than the sherman. Maybe all tank types but one could be depletable, and you'd end up with shermans or t34 vs panzer 3. That would give the russians an advantage in late game, and the germans an advantaqge in early game.

Edited by ickylevel
Link to comment
Share on other sites

RIVALDO
2 hours ago, ickylevel said:

Salut super truite. Thank you for your mod. Without it playing tanks in multiplayer wouldn't be a thing in this game. The finnish sever, without the gps feature makes it painfully difficult to find the objectives. On top of that, there are too many objectives and they are too far appart. And they don't take into account roads. But your gamemode addresses all these issues.

Do you have a game balance mechanism in place to address the fact that tigers panthers and ferdinands are much better tanks than the su 152?

Like giving less of them to the team, or making them deplete quicker. You could also leverage the fact that the base tank for german, the panzer 3, is weaker than the sherman. Maybe all tank types but one could be depletable, and you'd end up with shermans or t34 vs panzer 3. That would give the russians an advantage in late game, and the germans an advantaqge in early game.

If you reduce the numbers of blue tanks-no blues will come to the server ūüėÜ. Its hard enough to keep them interested with tigers and panthers already.¬†¬†

Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite

Salut ickylevel! Currently it works as follows: panthers, Tigers, Ferdinand are limited (respectively 5, 1, and 1 per flag spawns). Russians heavies are also limited but a bit less (plenty of su122, because not really good at AT combat, 5 or 6 KV1 and similar for SU152s). It's not perfect but  everyone (russians and germans) are complaining, which means it is more or less balanced :rolleyes:. You can also forbid a team to use heavies by destroying the factory behind ennemy lines.
One issue I have is that sometimes the front gets stuck and the two teams end up playing only with t34 and pzIV rather quickly because all the heavies are depleted. I could maybe speed up the resupply time for panthers and for SU152s. It would be great if one could get some new tanks by completing some secondary tasks. Any ideas ?
The main issue is not balancing tanks but balancing planes vs tanks. I have some ideas and we discussed this on discord with some players, but before overthinking it I will wait for the flak trucks to be released as it might completely change this aspect.

 

PS: New AI tanks in Köln seem to be even more retards than before and do not save a lot on resources, so I guess I will go back to the previous version soon

Link to comment
Share on other sites

LUZITANO
1 hour ago, super-truite said:

It's not perfect but  everyone (russians and germans) are complaining, which means it is more or less balanced :rolleyes:

Germans have an advantage with the "big cats", but at the beginning of the war it was the other way around... 
The balance is not possible, I think... But, a battle with just the medium tanks could be a lot of fun. Pz.3 and Pz.4 T-34, M4 and even the Su-122.
If you want to do a battle simulating the war in 41 with the Panzer IIIM / L vs the T-34 and KV I would be happy.
 

1 hour ago, super-truite said:

The main issue is not balancing tanks but balancing planes vs tanks. I have some ideas and we discussed this on discord with some players, but before overthinking it I will wait for the flak trucks to be released as it might completely change this aspect.

The Soviet vehicle will arrive first. Will the German team be able to use the Red Truck (maybe in winter camo) until the Flak arrives?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite
Posted (edited)

I would rather say that they are supposed to get an advantage. In practice, there are not a lot of cats and players tend to focus more on them (il2s, flanking with t34s or sniped by Navigator and his SU152 :biggrin:). Rather quickly, the germans are left only with PzIVs. It could be nice to simulate an early war scenario indeed!

Yes, both teams will have the AA vehicle with a different camo.

Edited by super-truite
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fritz_Faber

To be honest, I wouldn‚Äėt play German side with just Pz IV.
I guess Pz IV isn‚Äėt modeled correct, it is a paper tank.

Even single hits usually causing total explosion, mostly. There are several stories of real WWII German tankmen reporting damaged or destroyed own tanks, but no explosions at all.

Some tankman survived the whole war, in TC (AAS) in Pz IV¬†I‚Äėm surviving 10 minutes, 30 minutes are great, one mission rarely.

Something is going wrong with that tank in TC.

 

Please let us get the cats, we have payed for it ūüėČ.

As I suggested before, I would recommend balancing - if needed - by more AI tanks for red side.

In WW II German side was outnumbered all the time, so that would be historical correct.

On AAS server we have often just Pz IV, due to limitation.

Red side has experienced players, they often win the mission, even when outnumbered.

Their T34 are fast and hard to discover in ambush situations in forests.

Balancing isn‚Äėt so bad ... or what do you think?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite
Posted (edited)

no worries, I was just thinking of making one early operation barbarossa mission. So it would appear only once in a while in the mission rotation. Not even sure I will do it.
And no, I do not think the balancing is bad. It is close enough to balanced so that only the most organized team wins in general. The only caveat is when a group of good attack planes are playing on one side and when you have no fighters opposed to them. In this case it can really be a problem, but let's wait for the AA trucks before touching anything regarding planes

Edited by super-truite
Link to comment
Share on other sites

ickylevel

The panzer IV is indeed a paper tank, no matter what realistic game you play (see graviteam tactics). The reason they introducd squirts to the panzer IV and III is because AT rifles were effective against them... The t34 is better than the panzer IV, it's common knowlege.

 

Everyone complains about everything, but overall I think the gamemode favours germans, at least on low player counts.

 

BTW, is there an issue with the server at the moment? I click join but nothing happens.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite

I restarted, but there was no problem on the server a priori. Will check later

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ickylevel

Now I can connect, thank you.

Il y avait vraiment un probleme, maintenant les gens commencent a se connecter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ickylevel

The main problem at the moment is the lack of player count balance between the two teams and allowing so many german heavy tanks to be in play.

I'd rather play on a balanced server with fewer people than to play as cannon fodder as ally because everyone goes to german so they can be invincible.

As long as they loose their tanks (which is only possible on certain maps with enough people taking the risk of joining allies) they leave anyway, so the player count becomes unbalanced the other way around. Moral of the story, let the people who absolutely want to play a tiger vs t34 one to one matchup, go to another server.

 

I joined a server with 6 players on it, no one was in the russian team. Wide open map, no cover. They all had heavies. I couldn't do anything, if I flanked one tank another one or AI would kill me. A few player joined the server and tried to play as russian but they left as we got spawn camped.

 

 

Possible solutions:

- Move 'good germans tanks' spawn to a location behind the last german flag. So that the further they progress in the cap, the more time they have to travel (it will help with german winning in the beginning because they have a lot of good tanks).

- Have only one good tank available a the start, then after 20 switch to a different tank pattern that will give one more tank, and so on. So that the german team can accumulate good tanks if they are careful enough, and potentially have as many as they want, but cannot start with good tanks for their entire team.

Edited by ickylevel
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1./JG42flesch

The greatest Problem for Tankers on your Maps ar the AI Planes.

They dropped their Bombs with a GPS Radar Laser guided Acurassy what no Human Player can do!!!!!

Modern Planes as a F16 ore so can do it, but not Planes from the 1941-1945.

Has nothing to do with real Bomb dropping, Totally BS.

Edited by 1./JG42flesch
Link to comment
Share on other sites

RIVALDO

I like how AI planes kick my ass if i either sit in the ambush for too long or not paying attention and not checking¬†the skies once in a while. So here's a lesson. Don't sit in an ambush for too long! Cuz you've been spotted and you're gonna die!move,move,move.Even if you're one of them Blue players, who loves to sit in one spot in a tiger and spawn camp,then after all of the heavy tanks are gone-jumps in the plane and brings bombs to the last known enemy's location ūüėÜ.Then i don't feel bad at all.

Edited by RIVALDO
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fritz_Faber

New mission "Kerch" ... nice, great!

AI tanks seems to be powerful, killed several times after few minutes ;-(

Server problems actually, can't spawn ...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite

it happens sometimes, no idea why though. Only fix so far was to skip the mission. @1./JG42flesch I see you are on the discord. I can give you admin rights to skip the mission since you are often on the server (same for other regular players if you want). You just need to write !skip on the discord channel "servercontrol".

Removed one attack plane on this map, will do the same on other missions where they are a bit too aggressive. Will not be removed completely just to cut the pie in half :biggrin: . The new mission is obviously  WIP. AI is a bit too annoying because of trees (they see us and flank a lot and we do not have a lot of awareness because of trees). I guess I will make them use some more "stupid" axis of attack to avoid that (like road only where they are too much trees). 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ST_Bump

Link to server must be broken.

Tried entering multiple times with no luck! brought me back to the screen coop or dog flight join sever page.

No problem entering over severs.

 

If it helps the Kerch mission was running.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1./JG42flesch

thanks for the offer and the trust. however, I must decline, because I am never of use discord.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ickylevel

I have the same problem which is when I try to join the server, the loading screen gets to the end but then I go back to the main menu.

A server restart helped last time, but this time there are players connected.

Edited by ickylevel
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Fritz_Faber

I guess there are no players connected, server list stucks with 5 players. Look AAS Homepage, there are no players.. ?!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite
Posted (edited)

hmm interesting... just restarted

 

Edit: still not working ... investigating :russian_ru:

Edited by super-truite
Link to comment
Share on other sites

super-truite

Temporary fix: server will be hosted on my machine for now :rolleyes:. Stat will not be updated

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • super-truite changed the title to Advance And Secure (Planes And Tanks)

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...