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Reverb - new offering from HP

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If you can live with the rift for a bit longer, and from your comments seems to be doing alright, might want to wait and see what the htc cosmos is all about and also if valve actually has anything to show here soon.

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11 hours ago, Alonzo said:

I have a Rift and an RTX 2080. What's the best way to check if I'll be able to run this HP headset at appropriate resolution? Use OTT 1.5 (=Steam 225%) ?

 

I you go to the "SS per device" page you can see the resolution and SS values for all devices:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gJmnz_nVxI6_dG_UYNCCpZVK2-f8NBy-y1gia77Hu_k/edit#gid=1836884624

 

We still don´t know the internal supersamlping applied in the Reverb, but If we assumed it is 1.22 (like all other WMR except Odyssey) the resolution for the default SS=100% would be 2390x2390 per eye, so that´s 11.4 million pixels. To reach that in the Rift you will need to set SteamVR_ss=266% or use 1.63 in OTT.

 

I think that you will not want to apply any extra SS (above 100%) in the Reverb. We need to see if HP is going to use new FFR techniques to reduce the GPU load.

 

Let´s see more deeper reviews, but If I would buy a headset in April I will go for the Reverb (599$ with controllers) for that price is more worth than the Pimax (699$ only device + you need one basestation 150$).

Although the Pimax FOV is a very very nice thing.  :happy:

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The only part of the reverb that is lacking is the software based ipd adjustment. They are even using two separate screens unlike the rift s, so the lack of ipd adjustment is completely unwarranted.

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This is also important, the subpixels per pixel: 

 

For one, the Reverb has LCD panels, instead of OLED like the Vive Pro or Rift. John Ludwig, global lead VR headsets at HP Inc., told Tom’s Hardware this is because LCD has an RGB subpixel stripe, meaning each pixel gets a red, green and blue subpixel. This differs from the OLED competitors, which use a PenTile layout, where there are only two subpixels. And, Lugwig said, each pixel can’t make every color. LCD also allows for a more pixel-dense display, which lends to smaller headgear overall, he added.

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The new Rift S uses LCD also.

Downside of LCD is the blacks from what I hear. Have not seen personally an LCD VR display yet.

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29 minutes ago, dburne said:

The new Rift S uses LCD also.

Downside of LCD is the blacks from what I hear. Have not seen personally an LCD VR display yet.

I haven't used one myself either. Both the rift and odyssey are oled. I have used LCD monitors though. Definitely just wait a bit and see how things shake out. Who knows maybe the rift is great once real people get their hands on it. 80hz can't hurt in il2.

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LCD screens are acceptable in IL-2, for day missions. They are pretty bad though in predominantly dark environments, like Elite Dangerous. You do  adjust after a while. Popping on my Vive Pro after spending some time with the Pimax 5K+ was like woaaaah, the colour and contrast were making me trip. Like going from LCD to LSD screens.

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3 hours ago, scrapmetal said:

LCD screens are acceptable in IL-2, for day missions. They are pretty bad though in predominantly dark environments, like Elite Dangerous. You do  adjust after a while. Popping on my Vive Pro after spending some time with the Pimax 5K+ was like woaaaah, the colour and contrast were making me trip. Like going from LCD to LSD screens.

Elite is hands down the BEST looking game in my odyssey, if the game wasn't so damn boring and dry I'd be playing it all the time. It's incredible.

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Posted (edited)

Looking at the Reverb over the last few days, and having dismissed the rift S at birth, I think the HP hi-res offering will be my next purchase to replace my CV1. I`m becoming a bit jaded at the low-res of my rift, and  it`s time to move on. Oculus just aren`t at the races for simmers atm. I have no experience of WMR but I`ll give it a chance for the clarity.

18 hours ago, scrapmetal said:

LCD screens are acceptable in IL-2, for day missions. They are pretty bad though in predominantly dark environments, like Elite Dangerous. You do  adjust after a while. Popping on my Vive Pro after spending some time with the Pimax 5K+ was like woaaaah, the colour and contrast were making me trip. Like going from LCD to LSD screens.

I have always found the rift very poor for night missions in DCS and IL2, with the SDE especially noticeable. I really can`t see how it could be any worse with the HP tbh.

Edited by Wulfen
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I thought the Rift didn't switch the OLED pixels off any more because of smearing? Am I imagining reading that somewhere? I seem to remember reading that in newer firmware the "black" is actually the pixel switched on but at the lowest possible intensity level.

 

The Reverb does actually look quite nice. If I was in the market for a VR headset today (ok, next month) it's probably what I would buy. As it stands I'm probably going to keep using my Rift until the end of the year and then see what the options are. I've had my Rift for less than two months, and while I bought it with the intent of upgrading fairly frequently I feel like I should use it a bit more yet 😛.

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I am in the market, been holding out since the first Rift due to not being able to stand SDE... I will be buying a reverb, the increased resolution outweighs the increased FOV from the Pimax 5k+ 

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Posted (edited)

Same I've been on the fence for a while but the reverb doesn't sound too bad though. Just need a new gfx card  which is the real issue.

Edited by Tyberan

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After using the Vive pro and Rift.....NOW the Odyssey plus......I am looking Forward to some Hands on Reviews of the HP Reverb soon.

I hope that some users here can post a Review using the Reverb with IL-2 soon.

 

I am not sure if I like an LCD Panel after having OLED´s only in VR. But the Resolution of 2160x2160 is tempting.

The WMR inside oute tracking is not an issue for me, I am happy how my Odyssey plus does handle tracking, it does well.....in IL-2 even sometimes better than my Rift did.

 

I am not sure if IL-2 will run smooth with my 1080Ti  i7-8700k 32Gb Ram with an HP Reverb!?

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4 hours ago, spitfirejoe said:

I am not sure if IL-2 will run smooth with my 1080Ti  i7-8700k 32Gb Ram with an HP Reverb!?

 

I think it'll run ok, but maybe not with everything cranked to max xD

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4 hours ago, spitfirejoe said:

After using the Vive pro and Rift.....NOW the Odyssey plus......I am looking Forward to some Hands on Reviews of the HP Reverb soon.

I hope that some users here can post a Review using the Reverb with IL-2 soon.

 

I am not sure if I like an LCD Panel after having OLED´s only in VR. But the Resolution of 2160x2160 is tempting.

The WMR inside oute tracking is not an issue for me, I am happy how my Odyssey plus does handle tracking, it does well.....in IL-2 even sometimes better than my Rift did.

 

I am not sure if IL-2 will run smooth with my 1080Ti  i7-8700k 32Gb Ram with an HP Reverb!?

 

I have a similar system, but I have my doubts. At this moment in time it's really impossible to say; best wait for a review of the HP Reverb by someone actually playing IL2.

My view is that the reverb is more a business oriented product, and as such it was not designed for fluid gameplay, but for professional applications where resolution matters more than high fps.

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Posted (edited)

The HP REverb has two business lines: Pro and consumer. They are the same but changing some cover foams thinking on multiple users or always same user.

Clearly they also room for for heavy gamers. In May I have to go to Houston, I will try to buy one. Just to personally know if it is better or worse than Pimax5K+.

Edited by chiliwili69
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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, chiliwili69 said:

The HP REverb has two business lines: Pro and consumer. They are the same but changing some cover foams thinking on multiple users or always same user.

Clearly they also room for for heavy gamers. In May I have to go to Houston, I will try to buy one. Just to personally know if it is better or worse than Pimax5K+.

 

Looking forward to your review chili, but consider HP is apparently planning for worldwide availability from day one

Edited by Nibbio

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Hello Nibbio,

 

well yes, I will wait for reviews of actual gamers who try IL-2 and other titles, besides IL-2 I do sim racing in VR.

I just fear that a VR resolution of 2160x2160 will be hard to reach high FPS in sims like IL-2 or some racing sims like iRacing.

We have to wait and see. I just read online that a consumer version of the reverb will NOT be available in Germany and Austria, but the professional version will be available by May for 629.- Euro

 

Chiliwili69, I expect the reverb to be available in Spain.

 

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Yes, the consumer version will be available in Spain at 629€+21%VAT=761€ which is 855$.

In US the consumer will be 599$, so 256$ saving!

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1 hour ago, chiliwili69 said:

Yes, the consumer version will be available in Spain at 629€+21%VAT=761€ which is 855$.

In US the consumer will be 599$, so 256$ saving!

OK then good luck that you can buy one in a shop in USA. I guess we are all waiting for your review for us then.

 

I personally would hope for foveated rendering feature with the reverb, because it would save a lot hardware power......but it will not happen, damn.

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Kind of mind boggling they think they can sell such an expensive device that is hard-set to only a percentage of the population (those with 62mm IPD). And even for the guy testing it, who's IPD is on the nail, it's still not great.
Maybe they're getting their market research done by a company domiciled in the Twilight Zone.

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2 hours ago, Uffz-Prien said:

Kind of mind boggling they think they can sell such an expensive device that is hard-set to only a percentage of the population (those with 62mm IPD). And even for the guy testing it, who's IPD is on the nail, it's still not great.
Maybe they're getting their market research done by a company domiciled in the Twilight Zone.

 

the pimax 5K+ in the latest pitools introduced a software based IPD adjustment.  I tried it out and it works.. it does modify something that adjusts the picture to your IPD offset making the viewing comfortable and without strain. I have no idea how it's implemented, but whatever their concept is it is definitely working...  One can hope that HP will produce something similar. But the ultimate test for any VR headset is always:  1) buy it  2) try it  3) keep or return it.    It's very subjective and personable.

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10 hours ago, spitfirejoe said:

good luck that you can buy one in a shop in USA

 

I am not sure I will be able to buy it in a shop by the week of 13th-May, since it won´t be still at physical stores or shops. Too early.

I was thinking more on ordering it at HP online store (when available) and put the Hotel as the address.

 

43 minutes ago, -332FG-moosya said:

But the ultimate test for any VR headset is always:  1) buy it  2) try it  3) keep or return it.    It's very subjective and personable.

 fully agreed. It is very personal. This is what I did with the VivePro, just sold it after try it.

With the Reverb I will do a similar thing, keep the Pimax5K or keep the Reverb.

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Yes, I also tried the Vive Pro and did not like it at all. I liked the Rift very much and now the Odyssey plus. I am always happy when an upgrade is available. Maybe I will try the Reverb myself aswell, depends on the availability and the Price.

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Posted (edited)

I've heard they are not planning to sell the Consumer Version in Germany, at least not at the start. The notion was that our consumer laws are too overkill, people would just buy headset after headset, use them and return them within 30 days each. No idea if that was true though.

Edited by SCG_Fenris_Wolf

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How is WMR support from IL2?  Will the Reverb work from day one?  Really excited about upgrading from my Rift.

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I have the WMR Odyssey+ and the tracking is fine in IL-2

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WMR support in IL 2 is okay.

 

It's not perfect nor unusable.

 

It comes with false IPD settings making the world too small by about 0.9* of what it should be, but this is IL 2's fault. The mod by lefuneste has a global shift variable X6 in it, which can be used to fix the world scale.

 

I use x6 = 0.005 or 0.006. You can check my thread in the signature to find the mod and settings for WMR too.

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The latest update I could find is this.

It seems like it will be available for order early next week. It has already been listed on Amazon for a few days now.

Being Norwegian, I guess I'll have to wait for it to turn up in a store that ships to Norway.

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roadtovr has a review:

 

https://www.roadtovr.com/hp-reverb-review-vr-headset/

 

" Unfortunately, overall clarity is held back in a large way by plainly visible mura. Mura looks a lot like the screen door effect but is actually the result of poor consistency in color and brightness between pixels. There’s also a few other curious visual artifacts. There’s a considerable amount of chromatic aberration outside of the lenses’ sweet spot. "

 

If it is what I think it is then the picture quality 'mura' effect will be similar to the Odyssey+.  Lots of folks were ok with it, I personally didn't like the 'constant fog' feeling I got from it.

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Posted (edited)
On 4/9/2019 at 11:53 PM, spitfirejoe said:

I just fear that a VR resolution of 2160x2160 will be hard to reach high FPS in sims like IL-2 or some racing sims like iRacing.

I'm rendering 3760x3120 per eye with my Pimax 5k in IL 2 ( Strix RTX 2080TI)

BTW:

"Fear is the path to the dark side...."

Edited by TWHYata_PL

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VR is the goggled pathway to the dark side. 😀

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On 3/23/2019 at 9:20 AM, chiliwili69 said:

 

I you go to the "SS per device" page you can see the resolution and SS values for all devices:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gJmnz_nVxI6_dG_UYNCCpZVK2-f8NBy-y1gia77Hu_k/edit#gid=1836884624

 

We still don´t know the internal supersamlping applied in the Reverb, but If we assumed it is 1.22 (like all other WMR except Odyssey) the resolution for the default SS=100% would be 2390x2390 per eye, so that´s 11.4 million pixels. To reach that in the Rift you will need to set SteamVR_ss=266% or use 1.63 in OTT.

 

I think that you will not want to apply any extra SS (above 100%) in the Reverb. We need to see if HP is going to use new FFR techniques to reduce the GPU load.

 

Let´s see more deeper reviews, but If I would buy a headset in April I will go for the Reverb (599$ with controllers) for that price is more worth than the Pimax (699$ only device + you need one basestation 150$).

Although the Pimax FOV is a very very nice thing.  :happy:

To reach that in the Rift you will need to set SteamVR_ss=266%

Which slider in settings would I need to adjust & does it work?

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44 minutes ago, Blitzen said:

To reach that in the Rift you will need to set SteamVR_ss=266%

Which slider in settings would I need to adjust & does it work?

 

You need to open SteamVR (When you close IL-2 steamVR is left open, so you can go to SteamVR). Otherwise you can open SteamVR from Steam.

 

then go to Settings/Video, check Manual Overrride and change the slider bar to 266%.

 

This is explained with pictures in the benchmark link, in the section 2 of settings: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/29322-measuring-rig-performance-common-baseline-for-il-2-v3010/

 

 

Of course it works, you can even put 500% SS if you like to see how your GPU handle to 21million pixels with your Rift.

 

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Not sure about 21 million pixels...😕

xx.jpg

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