Does IL-2 GB need to return to the Eastern Front?

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

8 hours ago, InProgress said:

I would like some expansion where germans are on defense.

 

Can you really tell the difference with how this game actually plays?

[Weegas]

Speaking from a newcomer's perspective, the thought of lesser known theaters like East Africa, Spain and China appearing in GB interests me more than the popular ones. Not because these don't get enough attention in flight sims, but because they hardly get any attention in video games as a whole. I discovered this series through Steam, and had a much greater interest in military games than planes when I bought 1946. I imagine there's a large contingent of people who just want a unique game to play, and wouldn't have any issues with said game being a flight sim.

[falle96]

On 10/30/2018 at 5:52 PM, Legioneod said:

You serious? I'm sorry for the off topic post but that's just a very misguided statement, it's called a world war afterall, it was fought everywhere. Russia didn't do it all by themselves. I'm not downplaying the significance of the eastern front but to say that it was the focal point of WW2 is false.

 

Sorry, this is days late at this point, but I'd like to disagree rather strongly. The goals of the Second World War, from the Nazi perspective, was to gain lebensraum for German settlers by removing ethnic populations east of Germany. That meant making war against those governments. The Eastern Front was, by far, the largest theater in the ETO and it was where the war was won (or lost, depending on what flag you fly) - not in the West. That isn't to say that the Normandy landings, the war in North Africa, and the invasion of Italy were not important - far from it - but they were not where the majority of the fighting was done. One can prove this to themselves by looking at casualty ratios, equipment attrition, the like. Inside of the Soviet Union was where the Heer died, and with it the ambitions of Nazi Germany.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Great;

 

But that doesn't make it any more interesting after already having had three Eastern Front releases.

 

The Eastern Front was important; but what happened elsewhere was just as important, and maybe moreso, in shaping the post-war world, and setting the stage for the conflicts that would follow.

[Legioneod]

51 minutes ago, FarflungWanderer said:

 

Sorry, this is days late at this point, but I'd like to disagree rather strongly. The goals of the Second World War, from the Nazi perspective, was to gain lebensraum for German settlers by removing ethnic populations east of Germany. That meant making war against those governments. The Eastern Front was, by far, the largest theater in the ETO and it was where the war was won (or lost, depending on what flag you fly) - not in the West. That isn't to say that the Normandy landings, the war in North Africa, and the invasion of Italy were not important - far from it - but they were not where the majority of the fighting was done. One can prove this to themselves by looking at casualty ratios, equipment attrition, the like. Inside of the Soviet Union was where the Heer died, and with it the ambitions of Nazi Germany.

The war wasn't won when Germany surrendered, it continued on until the end of august. Your completely forgetting another portion of the war, and the eastern front had nothing to do with it.

All I'm saying is, without the west, russia would not have won, and to say that the west was less significant to the outcome of the war is just wrong.

[Jade_Monkey]

1 hour ago, hrafnkolbrandr said:

Great;But that doesn't make it any more interesting after already having had three Eastern Front releases.

 The Eastern Front was important; but what happened elsewhere was just as important, and maybe moreso, in shaping the post-war world, and setting the stage for the conflicts that would follow.

 

Exactly!

[MasserME262]

I always wanted a "Battle of Berlin" (or something like that). I remember in old 1946 IL, I used to play a campaign where you were a pilot of a Ta 152, while your missions were mainly protect Me262's at landing/taking off (IIRC) or intercepting bombers at high altitude.

I would definitely give devs all the money I can just to see that happen. But I guess next is Pacific theater (after BoBP).

I hope I'm wrong, since the only planes of Pacific theater im interested in are the tony and, in a so much lesser degree, the zero.

Edited November 12, 2018 by ME-BFMasserME262

[Gambit21]

Most of the fighting and dying took place on the Eastern Front - that doesn’t mean I’m not done paying for Eastern Front releases. Enough already.

[EAF19_Marsh]

2 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

Most of the fighting and dying took place on the Eastern Front - that doesn’t mean I’m not done paying for Eastern Front releases. Enough already.

 

Air-war wise, that is only true 1941-43 and even by 2nd-half '42 you see a lot of German resources in other theatres (maybe 30-40%?) and after Kursk it goes down-hill fast. Nothing wrong with other EF maps and aircraft, but there is a lot of fighting and dying in aircraft elsewhere.

 

EF is 'easier' to do in terms of the series' coherence, but I suspect there may be a degree of 'Steppe fatigue' creeping in.

[Danziger]

I would like to see the series make a move to the Pacific. Doing carrier operations in the GB fidelity would be a really awesome experience. It would also be pretty cool to torpedo some boats.

[Ribbon]

15 or so years ago when i was kid PTO was the reason i started flying il2:1946.

I didn't have joystick, only m+k and on easy settings shooting on enemies from 1km distance.

I didn't knew anything about ww2 planes or theatres but i was drawn by B17, B25, il2, Corsair, P51, Jug and Yak3.

Those were my fav planes even i didn't knew anything about them.

I loved taking off and landing big planes on those Pacific islands, not to mention carrier landings and sinking ships with torpedos (IJN).

I'm form EU and PTO was the reason i got into il2, still is.....cos i grown up on those battle of Midway movies.

Lesser known battles like Spanish Civil war, China and similar are last i would go into.....still no interested in them!

 

Let them make popular theatres first and later fill it with less known.

BoBp is proof, many new players arrived with it even it's in EA, and what will be when p51 is out.....every kid want that plane!

Remember how dead forum was 18 months ago and look at it now...all cos of BoBp and BoK Spitfire.

I can only imagine how popular PTO will be and how many players it will drawn into il2 GB.

Edited November 12, 2018 by EAF_Ribbon

[Herne]

1 hour ago, EAF_Ribbon said:

15 or so years ago when i was kid PTO was the reason i started flying il2:1946.

I didn't have joystick, only m+k and on easy settings shooting on enemies from 1km distance.

I didn't knew anything about ww2 planes or theatres but i was drawn by B17, B25, il2, Corsair, P51, Jug and Yak3.

Those were my fav planes even i didn't knew anything about them.

I loved taking off and landing big planes on those Pacific islands, not to mention carrier landings and sinking ships with torpedos (IJN).

I'm form EU and PTO was the reason i got into il2, still is.....cos i grown up on those battle of Midway movies.

Lesser known battles like Spanish Civil war, China and similar are last i would go into.....still no interested in them!

 

Let them make popular theatres first and later fill it with less known.

BoBp is proof, many new players arrived with it even it's in EA, and what will be when p51 is out.....every kid want that plane!

Remember how dead forum was 18 months ago and look at it now...all cos of BoBp and BoK Spitfire.

I can only imagine how popular PTO will be and how many players it will drawn into il2 GB.

 

 

I get what you are saying, but I don't think its necessarily true. My favourite theatre for instance would almost certainly be Battle of Britain if it was made in this game engine. Yet I have hardly touched Cliffs of Dover. The most significant draw to the sim for me was VR, combined with the excellent stick and rudder feeling of flight. I am excited for PTO for many reasons, new unique birds to fly, and carrier landings being among them, but I'm pretty sure that I would get just as much entertainment from any theatre that provides new birds, with all there nuance and quirks.

[Meteor2]

1 hour ago, EAF_Ribbon said:

15 or so years ago when i was kid PTO was the reason i started flying il2:1946.

I didn't have joystick, only m+k and on easy settings shooting on enemies from 1km distance.

I didn't knew anything about ww2 planes or theatres but i was drawn by B17, B25, il2, Corsair, P51, Jug and Yak3.

Those were my fav planes even i didn't knew anything about them.

I loved taking off and landing big planes on those Pacific islands, not to mention carrier landings and sinking ships with torpedos (IJN).

I'm form EU and PTO was the reason i got into il2, still is.....cos i grown up on those battle of Midway movies.

Lesser known battles like Spanish Civil war, China and similar are last i would go into.....still no interested in them!

 

Let them make popular theatres first and later fill it with less known.

BoBp is proof, many new players arrived with it even it's in EA, and what will be when p51 is out.....every kid want that plane!

Remember how dead forum was 18 months ago and look at it now...all cos of BoBp and BoK Spitfire.

I can only imagine how popular PTO will be and how many players it will drawn into il2 GB.

 

Exactly my thoughts. ??

The only difference is, that I am waiting for the Me 262 and not for the P 51. ?

But nevertheless, you are right!

[IckyATLAS]

No

[Meteor2]

14 minutes ago, IckyATLAS said:

No

?

But why?

Don't you think, that this PTO scenario will attract new player groups, which have not been present here until now?

I think, PTO will exactly do this and that can only be good for revenues (hopefully) and for the growing player base, of course. 

[Gambit21]

8 hours ago, EAF19_Marsh said:

 

Air-war wise, that is only true 1941-43 and even by 2nd-half '42 you see a lot of German resources in other theatres (maybe 30-40%?) and after Kursk it goes down-hill fast. Nothing wrong with other EF maps and aircraft, but there is a lot of fighting and dying in aircraft elsewhere.

 

EF is 'easier' to do in terms of the series' coherence, but I suspect there may be a degree of 'Steppe fatigue' creeping in.

 

I was speaking in the totality of the war, on the ground etc.

In that sense it holds true no matter how you break it down (beginning, middle, end)

 

That said, yes the fatigue creeped in quite some time ago...as far as more releases I mean.

The current releases are great, especially Kuban.

[TheFace]

PTO and Med please, eastern front has 3 already.

[Algy-Lacey]

On 10/9/2018 at 8:49 PM, PA_Spartan- said:

I cannot agree more. The Pacific is a must now. It opens another branch of the tree.

 

Considering the MASSIVE amount of work needed in the development of a Pacific theater of operations - Aircraft Carriers: Landing system (flags), Wires etc... Japanese Naval and Army Aircraft with scarce historical sources of info, few existing Aircraft for theater (P-40, P-38, P-39), Huge new maps...

 

 

I think it would be very prudent for 1C to deliver a 2nd western front release:

 

IL-2 Battle of the Mediterranean (they'd have to think of a new accronym as BoM is already taken!)

This would cover the Naval battles 1941 to 1943, the map could be huge without being too resource hogging, with masses of sea around the Island of Malta as far north as Sicilly for Italian / German airbases and South West for North African Airbases, both Sicily and N. Africa were involved in the Malta campaign, I believe. (See my attached Map) (estimate map size 500,000 Square kilometres)

 

The first battles would be against shipping in the Med, then the air defence of Malta, and finally the invasion of Sicily in 1943.

 

Aircraft already modelled include:

 

Allies:

Spitfire Mk.Vb,

Spitfire Mk.IXc

Curtiss P-40

Lockheed P-38J

Douglas A-20

 

Axis:

Bf109e7

Bf109f2

Bf109f4

Bf109g2

Bf109g4

Bf109g6

Macchi Mc.202

Heinkel He.111

Junkers Ju88

Junkers Ju87

Bf110c4

Bf110g2

 

Aircraft needed to flesh out the lineup:

 

Allies:

Spitfire Mk.Vb Aboukir Filter                     (slight modification of existing Mk.Vb)

Spitfire Mk.Vc Tropical Vokes Filter        (slight modification of existing Mk.Vb)

Spitfire Mk.Vc Trop. 4 x 20mm cannon  (slight modification of existing Mk.Vb)

Spitfire Mk.VIII                                            (extensive modification of existing Mk.IX?)

Seafire Mk.Ib                                               (modification of existing Spitfire Mk.Vb)

Seafire Mk.IIc                                              (modification of Spitfire Mk.Vc)

Hurricane Mk.IIb 'Hurribomber'

Hurricane Mk.IIc 4 x 20mm cannon

Lockheed P-38F through to H                  (modification of existing P-38J)

Consolidated PBY Catalina Maritime Patrol

North American B-25 AI

Consolidated B-24 AI

 

8 x new aircraft

4 x adapted from existing aircraft

 

Axis:

Fiat.G50

Macchi Mc.200 Saetta                             (modification < Macchi Mc.202)

Reggiane Re.2001 Falco

Macchi Mc.205 Veltro                              (modification > Macchi Mc.202)

Bf109's with Tropical Air Filter

CANT z.506 Maritime Patrol

CANT z.1007 Bomber AI

Savoia-Marchetti SM.79 Bomber AI

 

5 x new aircraft

2 x adapted from existing Mc.202

 

16 x Allied aircraft total

19 x Axis aircraft total

 

Ok, that is FAR more aircraft than other IL-2 Battles, but if you only count new aircraft then it's

 

12 x Allied (including variants)

8 x Axis (including variants)

 

The other GREAT thing about this era is that 1C Games could add 1 Aircraft Carrier for the Seafire's to operate from without needing to model 2 x whole fleets of different types of Aircraft Carriers, Battleships, Frigates, Destroyers etc: American, British and Japanese.

 

The number of ships would be vastly reduced for a Battle of the Med, but would allow the created Ship Types to be used again for the Pacific expansion.

 

Ok, I've been working on this post for well over an hour now. Please do post an 'upvote' if you would like to see this development also.

 

 

Algy Lacey

 

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Nah.

[Guest deleted@83466]

8 minutes ago, Algy-Lacey said:

 

<snip>

 

 

I think Med and North Africa would be great, but I've been under the impression (correctly or incorrectly) that those are not going to happen because CloD is going to do them.

 

[falle96]

17 hours ago, Legioneod said:

The war wasn't won when Germany surrendered, it continued on until the end of august. Your completely forgetting another portion of the war, and the eastern front had nothing to do with it.

All I'm saying is, without the west, russia would not have won, and to say that the west was less significant to the outcome of the war is just wrong.

 

You are right about the Pacific theater, and again I'm not saying that the war could not have been won without the West's involvement, but the reverse is also true - the Allies could not have won the war without the Soviets. Again - by 1944, Germany was very much on its last legs, and that had very little to do with the relatively limited campaigns in North Africa and Italy. It was in Russia that the Germans lost the war.

 

I should also mention that the War in the Pacific was in many ways entirely separate from the War in Europe. Japan and Germany/Italy acted fairly independently of each other aside from the occasional U-boat or the transfer of technological advances. They simply didn't trust each other to coordinate on a grand scale. Also it is worth mentioning that even if the British had lost the War in the Pacific, it would not had lead to a sudden and irrevocable collapse in Europe. Japan's goals, despite its rhetoric, was not world conquest. Plans of an invasion of the United States were hopelessly optimistic at best, and Japan could and would not provide any measure of troops to aid their European allies.

 

And as a final edit, let me remind you of the "Europe First" policy that the Allies held throughout the war. The Pacific conflict was major, both in material and manpower losses and in stakes, but to everyone other than the United States and Japan, the "major" belligerents held only colonies in the Pacific and Indonesia and did not see it as nearly as much of a priority or the "main event". They could afford to have that drag on when they dealt with the most pressing threat - Germany.

Edited November 12, 2018 by FarflungWanderer

[Legioneod]

13 minutes ago, Algy-Lacey said:

 

 

I wouldn't do Africa. I'd go north and do Anzio and areas around the winter line. Maybe even include the island of corsica to have P-47s flying sorties north of the lines.

[IckyATLAS]

2 hours ago, JG4_Meteor2 said:

?

But why?

Don't you think, that this PTO scenario will attract new player groups, which have not been present here until now?

I think, PTO will exactly do this and that can only be good for revenues (hopefully) and for the growing player base, of course. 

My answer No (for a few years) was to the main question of the thread: Does IL2 need to return to the Eastern Front.

The Pacific Theater with at least four to five different battles (Solomon Islands, Marianas, Leyte, Midway, Okinawa etc.), The Mediterranean Theater with various battles North Africa, Italy etc.. and Central Europe with the battle for Berlin, all this will occupy the devs for the next 10 years ? at least

[Algy-Lacey]

9 minutes ago, Legioneod said:

 

I wouldn't do Africa. I'd go north and do Anzio and areas around the winter line. Maybe even include the island of corsica to have P-47s flying sorties north of the lines.

 

So something more like this? It would include Malta to the South and Rome in the North, but bigger map size and more of Italy with dense populated areas: A Resource Hogging Map?

[Legioneod]

35 minutes ago, FarflungWanderer said:

 

You are right about the Pacific theater, and again I'm not saying that the war could not have been won without the West's involvement, but the reverse is also true - the Allies could not have won the war without the Soviets. Again - by 1944, Germany was very much on its last legs, and that had very little to do with the relatively limited campaigns in North Africa and Italy. It was in Russia that the Germans lost the war.

 

We may not think so today but those campaigns were very important to the war effort and to the russians. I don't think the war would really have been won against Germany without the Russians but I do think it would have resulted in a peace treaty and not necessarily a loss. The outcome in the Pacific would most likely be the same since russia played no real part in the Pacific.

 

I'm just thankful the Axis lost since we could be looking at a very strange world otherwise. (stranger than it already is at least.)

20 minutes ago, Algy-Lacey said:

 

So something more like this? It would include Malta to the South and Rome in the North, but bigger map size and more of Italy with dense populated areas: A Resource Hogging Map?

 

More like this. (excuse the crappy editing)

Maybe even a little further east as well.

 

Edited November 12, 2018 by Legioneod

[Algy-Lacey]

25 minutes ago, Legioneod said:

 

More like this. (excuse the crappy editing)

Maybe even a little further east as well.

 

 

Hmmm, your map area does miss out Malta in the south as well as Sicily, the allies first landing point. Your map would be good for a late war Italy 1943 to 1944 expansion.

 

Algy Lacey

 

[Legioneod]

4 minutes ago, Algy-Lacey said:

 

Hmmm, your map area does miss out Malta in the south as well as Sicily, the allies first landing point. Your map would be good for a late war Italy 1943 to 1944 expansion.

 

Algy Lacey

 

Yeah that's what I was thinking, 43-44. The only early war scenarios that interest me are in the Pacific, in Europe 43-45 are my main interest. I'd rather not put a large gap in the allied planeset, going backwards in order would be best imo.

Edited November 12, 2018 by Legioneod

[falle96]

1 hour ago, Legioneod said:

 

We may not think so today but those campaigns were very important to the war effort and to the russians. I don't think the war would really have been won against Germany without the Russians but I do think it would have resulted in a peace treaty and not necessarily a loss. The outcome in the Pacific would most likely be the same since russia played no real part in the Pacific.

 

I'm just thankful the Axis lost since we could be looking at a very strange world otherwise. (stranger than it already is at least.)

 

On that we can be agreed. An Axis victory would have lead to unimaginable suffering. Good riddance.

 

As for the actual history, you are right that the Allied campaigns had a real effect against Germany and aided the Russians immensely. I suppose I was arguing against what I thought you said rather than what you were actually saying, so I'm sorry for being a little haranguing.

[Legioneod]

15 minutes ago, FarflungWanderer said:

 

On that we can be agreed. An Axis victory would have lead to unimaginable suffering. Good riddance.

 

As for the actual history, you are right that the Allied campaigns had a real effect against Germany and aided the Russians immensely. I suppose I was arguing against what I thought you said rather than what you were actually saying, so I'm sorry for being a little haranguing.

It's only natural. Sorry if I came off as a bit argumentative, It's definitely hard to have these types of discussions without getting emotional, this war did effect the whole world afterall.

[Algy-Lacey]

Outline of a smaller more feasible Malta campaign. Much more likely than Mediterranean 1941 through to 1943 with areas of North Africa (N.Africa being covered by Team Fusion and CloD)

 

 

I've modified my proposal to suit...

 

The first battle would be the air defence of Malta 1942

Then combat against shipping in the Med, in the area around Malta 1942

And finally the invasion of Sicily in 1943. (this battle brings the later war Italian fighters into play: Mc.205, G.55 also Allied Spitfire Mk.IX, Spitfire Mk.VIII, P-38J)

 

Aircraft already modelled include:

 

Allies:

Spitfire Mk.Vb

Spitfire Mk.IXc

Curtiss P-40

Lockheed P-38J

Douglas A-20

 

Axis:

Bf109f4

Bf109g4

Macchi Mc.202

Heinkel He111

Junkers Ju88

Junkers Ju87

Bf110g2

 

Aircraft needed to flesh out the lineup:

 

Allies:

Spitfire Mk.Vb Aboukir Filter                     (slight modification of existing Mk.Vb)

Spitfire Mk.Vc Tropical Vokes Filter        ( modification of existing Mk.Vb)

Spitfire Mk.VIII                                            (extensive modification of existing Mk.IX?)

Seafire Mk.IIc                                              (modification of Spitfire Mk.Vc)

Hurricane Mk.IIb 'Hurribomber'

Hurricane Mk.IIc 4 x 20mm cannon

Bristol Beaufighter? Or Fairey Firefly?

Consolidated PBY Catalina Maritime Patrol

North American B-25 AI

Consolidated B-24 AI

 

8 x new aircraft

2 x adapted from existing aircraft

 

Axis:

 

Reggiane Re.2001 Falco                          (No Re.2005 Sagittario, very limited numbers delivered)

Macchi Mc.205 Veltro                              (modification > Macchi Mc.202)

Fiat G.55 Centauro

Bf109f4 with Tropical Air Filter               (slight modification of existing f4)

Bf109g4 with Tropical Air Filter              (slight modification of existing g4)

Fieseler Fi.156 Storch                               (A slow flying field aircraft that would be SO fun to fly!)

CANT z.506 Maritime Patrol

CANT z.1007 Bomber AI

Savoia-Marchetti SM.79 Bomber AI

 

6 x new aircraft

3 x adapted from existing aircraft

 

Only counting new aircraft it's

 

10 x Allied (including variants)

9 x Axis (including variants)

 

The other GREAT thing about this Battlefront is that 1C Games could add 1 Aircraft Carrier (HMS Argos?)for the Seafire's to operate from without needing to model 3 x whole fleets of different types of Aircraft Carriers, Battleships, Frigates, Destroyers etc: American, British and Japanese.

 

The number of ships would be vastly reduced for a Battle of the Med, but would allow the created Ship Types to be used again for the Pacific expansion.

 

Here is my revised Map Area:

[Weegas]

I like the overall idea of this campaign, but I do have some suggestions. I don't know why the CR.42 would be left out in such an expansion, considering it was used in the North African campaign extensively, and was also one of the most prolific Italian planes of the war. I also feel that the SM.79 is important enough to be a flyable aircraft for the same reasons. I think the timeframe would have to be bumped up to 1943-45(?) and focus shifted to the Italian theater to warrant the 5-Series Italian fighters appearing. This would also allow for the inclusion of the Italian Co-Belligerent Air Force, which flew all of the aforementioned aircraft in some capacity.

Edited November 13, 2018 by Weegas

[EAF19_Marsh]

That is a lot of work, including the IXc which is not yet modelled.

 

Look at your list of things to so - that is one reason why this is not happening vs. Pacific

[RAY-EU]

The Battle of Kursk 1943 with +some  other more planes , other  Tanks ... like Tank Destroyers Panzerjäger I 47mm & Amphibious Vehicles like the T-40 .

& Armoured Cars :

like Panzerspähwagen SdKfz 231 68 km/h with machine gun & 1 cannon  KwK of 38 mm  produced 1.000 units .

and the Soviet BA-10 87 km/h ,  machine guns and 45-mm cannon turret of the T-26-B produced 1.200 units .

 

Edited November 15, 2018 by RAY-EU

[klebor]

On 11/12/2018 at 7:50 AM, Gambit21 said:

Most of the fighting and dying took place on the Eastern Front - that doesn’t mean I’m not done paying for Eastern Front releases. Enough already.

 

Luftwaffe Aircraft Losses By Theatre September 1943 - October 1944

4.06 times as many aircraft were lost in combat in the West than were lost in the East.

During the period a constant 21-24% of the Luftwaffe's day fighters were based in the East when 75-78% of the day fighters were based in the West. 

[Gambit21]

Doesn’t change what I said - most of the fighting and dying didn’t happen in the air. I thought that was obvious but maybe I wasn’t clear.

[EAF19_Marsh]

24 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

Doesn’t change what I said - most of the fighting and dying didn’t happen in the air. I thought that was obvious but maybe I wasn’t clear.

 

True, but this is mostly (for now) a flight sim. Where the air forces fought is generally considered a priority.

[blitze]

Yeah, once the Eighth Air Force started operating out of England, the Luftwaffe ramped up aerial defense in the West to counter it.  As for how the world would look if the tide went the other way in WW2, who can tell.  For millions of people in Asia, Africa, Middle East and now parts of Europe, it has not been a very pleasant time since WW2. 

 

The Living room the Germans sought in the East was primarily due to 2 things, 1 to stamp out Bolshevism and 2 food security. 

Look into the famine in Austria at the hands of the British Blockade post WW1 and who the N.S.D.A.P fought against during the German Wiemar Republic era and their sponsors in the East.

 

Ignore the propaganda and follow the facts and money.

 

[-TBC-AeroAce]

I would love Malta but I don't think a lot of people realise how densely populated it is and how diverse the arcatecture is. 

 

Velleta would be a challenge by its self and that is even before the ancient town of Medina etc.

 

Malta was also notorious for pilots as every open space of which there are not too many, are surrounded by dry stone walls making forced landing almost always fatal. These walls adding to the complexity/number of objects of the map.

 

Long story short to have a Malta map to the standard the devs aspire to may simply be too much work

 

Don't get me wrong, I would love it but if we could not get to over fly a capital city like Moscow because of performance/Dev resources I can't see them doing whole country of Malta regardless of its relatively small size. 

 

Edited November 16, 2018 by AeroAce

[sevenless]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Courland_Pocket

 

Courland would make a great map and setting for a late war east front release. The pocket was fought over from July 1944 until the end of the war. German planes we have already from BoBP, we only need the VSS stuff and the map. So bring it on! ?

[Bearcat]

9 hours ago, blitze said:

Yeah, once the Eighth Air Force started operating out of England, the Luftwaffe ramped up aerial defense in the West to counter it.  As for how the world would look if the tide went the other way in WW2, who can tell.  For millions of people in Asia, Africa, Middle East and now parts of Europe, it has not been a very pleasant time since WW2. 

 

The Living room the Germans sought in the East was primarily due to 2 things, 1 to stamp out Bolshevism and 2 food security. 

Look into the famine in Austria at the hands of the British Blockade post WW1 and who the N.S.D.A.P fought against during the German Wiemar Republic era and their sponsors in the East.

 

Ignore the propaganda and follow the facts and money.

 

 

 

That's your story? It probably would have been an even far less pleasant time had things gone the other way ..

 

WW2 happened for a lot of reasons .....  this post borders on apologist revisionism ..  Let's just not go there at all ok or your posts will be removed if they continue down that direction.