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Posted (edited)

This thread is not about the migoto mod.

 

I wonder if it happens to you the following behaviour. When you zoom in the plane that it's at a distance of 2-4 km it shrinks. 

 

Is there any workaround? I don't use the zoom as I see less zoomed in.

 

Regards

 

 

In your startup.cfg, search under Key = Camera

vr_zoom_speed = 1

Edited by E69_Qpassa_VR

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The game upscales distant  contacts to compensate for the non-retina resolution of our monitors/hmd’s. The higher the resolution you run it in the less of this handicap you get. Zooming on the other hand can disable that upscale and you get a weird shrinking effect at certain distances.
 

This is also the reason why supersampling or running high resolutions on small monitors won’t help spotting.

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have you tried turning off the alternate spotting setting?

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5 hours ago, E69_Qpassa_VR said:

This thread is not about the migoto mod.

 

I wonder if it happens to you the following behaviour. When you zoom in the plane that it's at a distance of 2-4 km it shrinks. 

 

Is there any workaround? I don't use the zoom as I see less zoomed in.

 

Regards

 

I find it absolutely hilarious that you are asking about the exact problem that necessitated "the mod which shall not be named". Maybe you should talk to your good friend @E69_geramos109¬†ūü§£

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Posted (edited)

Haha although we are squad mates we have different points of view regarding this topic¬†ūüėĄ. My question is after the new rendering we have in this update.

1 hour ago, OrLoK said:

have you tried turning off the alternate spotting setting?

This happens in any kind of spotting config

Edited by E69_Qpassa_VR

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31 minutes ago, E69_Qpassa_VR said:

Haha although we are squad mates we have different points of view regarding this topic¬†ūüėĄ. My question is after the new rendering we have in this update.

This happens in any kind of spotting config

maybe you have different points of view because one of you have actually seen and used the zoom on VR and the other is pretending to know how the zoom is on VR.

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1 minute ago, Prancingkiller said:

maybe you have different points of view because one of you have actually seen and used the zoom on VR and the other is pretending to know how the zoom is on VR.

please don't do a train wreck of this thread too please

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, E69_Qpassa_VR said:

please don't do a train wreck of this thread too please

/Amen

Point: I get you QB; not aimed at you, just playing referee again.

Edited by JG51_Beazil

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, E69_Qpassa_VR said:

please don't do a train wreck of this thread too please

sorry if i can't enjoy the game i bought (same for everyone) because people doesnt have the required amount of braincells to understand things, and here i stop.

 

Edited by Prancingkiller
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To answer the OP,  yes I think we all have this problem, and yes there WAS effectively a workaround, but now it is gone. Now all we have in VR is a broken, useless zoom. Which, if you care about multiplayer  equates to a broken game. What a shame.

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Posted (edited)

Things will be fair again for VR players in the near future. This argument needs to stay off the forums though. 

Edited by SCG_Wulfe
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Posted (edited)

@ E69_Qpassa_VR Yes, same issue here... I can spot contacts from afar but no way to ID until I get close enough to use the default VR zoom. If I use it too soon, I get nuthin'.

Edited by TWC_NINja

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Posted (edited)

With current zoom, you can effectively make your plane unrecognizable to VR players by putting on nav lights because of how current VR zoom scales at long to medium ranges.

 

The current VR support in this game is travesty in a product that fancy itself as a "leading simulation game out in the market". 


How does it feel to have to rely on a modder, who is working for free, to play this game competitively in MP for the last few years :rofl:

 

 

6 hours ago, SCG_Wulfe said:

Things will be fair again for VR players in the near future. This argument needs to stay off the forums though. 

 

If VR came out last year, and was a hot new tech that no one heard before, you would had a point.

 

But VR is entering elementary education, and will register to vote and draft in another short years...

Gen 3 headsets are rolling out, the VR software ecosystem has been standardized.

 

And while one can argue VR is niche in some markets, sim market is one of its MAIN niches. Lions share of VR owners are avid Simmers. More and more simmers, every year are getting VR headset. Headset count went from low when Vive came out, to now 50% in some squads with plethora different brands. The trend will only go up. VR simming is so much more immersive that is is no brainer... And simming community is no stranger to expensive peripherals with all that other junk annoying your wife...

Edited by Cpt_Siddy
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Guys I can not find any more, where can I set vr zoom speed from slow to instant??

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2 minutes ago, Brzi_Joe said:

Guys I can not find any more, where can I set vr zoom speed from slow to instant??

In your setup.cfg, search under Key = Camera

vr_zoom_speed = 1

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3 minutes ago, Brzi_Joe said:

Guys I can not find any more, where can I set vr zoom speed from slow to instant??

in startup.cfg, set zoom speed to 1.0

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25 minutes ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

With current zoom, you can effectively make your plane unrecognizable to VR players by putting on nav lights because of how current VR zoom scales at long to medium ranges.

 

The current VR support in this game is travesty in a product that fancy itself as a "leading simulation game out in the market". 


How does it feel to have to rely on a modder, who is working for free, to play this game competitively in MP for the last few years :rofl:

 

 

 

If VR came out last year, and was a hot new tech that no one heard before, you would had a point.

 

But VR is entering elementary education, and will register to vote and draft in another short years...

Gen 3 headsets are rolling out, the VR software ecosystem has been standardized.

 

And while one can argue VR is niche in some markets, sim market is one of its MAIN niches. Lions share of VR owners are avid Simmers. More and more simmers, every year are getting VR head set. It was down to no one when Vive came out, to now 50% in some squads with plethora different brands. The trend will only go up. VR simming is so much more immersive that is is no braner... And simming community is no stranger to expensive peripherals with all that other junk annoying your wife...

 

VR support that this sim offers is quite good. Yes, VR Zoom could be better. And maybe someday it will. I am sure the mod will eventually come back, Jason 

has pretty much stated that while the new rendering changed the Mod ability to work, they are not stopping it from working in the future.

And no, majority of VR owners are not flight or racing sim players.

 

 

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Posted (edited)
44 minutes ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

 

 

If VR came out last year, and was a hot new tech that no one heard before, you would had a point.

 

But VR can vote and drink and have sex in few short years...

 

I think you misunderstand me. I'm saying that I'm certain a solution is in the works.  Causing a heated debate over this all over again may jeopardize that. 

Edited by SCG_Wulfe
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9 minutes ago, dburne said:

 

VR support that this sim offers is quite good. Yes, VR Zoom could be better. And maybe someday it will. I am sure the mod will eventually come back, Jason 

has pretty much stated that while the new rendering changed the Mod ability to work, they are not stopping it from working in the future.

And no, majority of VR owners are not flight or racing sim players.

 

 

 

Most VR head set owners have either racing, space or flight sim on their system with peripherals for them... I think that counts as a simmer. VR was in range of 1000 dollars before not too long, that was squarely in simmers range until now. 

 

The VR support this sim offers is a jury rigged on legacy track IR, it have seen improvements only lately. This game cannot add a proper VR support because it was not designed for two screen two eye stereo rendering in mind and changing the game engine from ground up is a pain (probably impossible if no DX12). Working VR is not "good VR support", its a slapped on after tough with no optimization for VR rendering in mind. LoD scaling and all that jazz is optimized for flat screens.  It is obvious you have not laid your hands on proper, multi GPU supporting game that is made for VR ground up... 


Now, the game engine i can understand, it is old and changing it is pain and unreasonable expectation, but having own LoD scheme, lighting and shared scheme designed for VR goggles is something totally in the power of the devs, seeing how a modder can do a semi decent job at it.

Least they can do is see what modders are doing, why they do it and try address those issues in house, so that every patch dont turn game in to bedlam for VR MP crowd. 

I am not saying this because i want to be mean, i am merely saying that you can get lots of improvement squeezed out of VR experience with fairly small investment in time, and be taken seriously when you say you have VR supported. 

16 minutes ago, SCG_Wulfe said:

 

I think you misunderstand me. I'm saying that I'm certain a solution is in the works.  Causing a heated debate over this all over again may jeopardize that. 

 

Yes, because silence solves stuff. Heated debate just means there are people here that care. Having a bad things in game with no one caring means a dying game in most part. 

 

If this community would have been silent, we would prolly still have XP grind mod unlocks in game. Imagine that, a full priced AAA game with Pay to win Wart Thunder mechanics. 

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22 minutes ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

 

Most VR head set owners have either racing, space or flight sim on their system with peripherals for them... I think that counts as a simmer. VR was in range of 1000 dollars before not too long, that was squarely in simmers range until now. 

 

The VR support this sim offers is a jury rigged on legacy track IR, it have seen improvements only lately. This game cannot add a proper VR support because it was not designed for two screen two eye stereo rendering in mind and changing the game engine from ground up is a pain (probably impossible if no DX12). Working VR is not "good VR support", its a slapped on after tough with no optimization for VR rendering in mind. LoD scaling and all that jazz is optimized for flat screens.  It is obvious you have not laid your hands on proper, multi GPU supporting game that is made for VR ground up...

 

I do not run multi GPU's. Never will.

I do however have and enjoy many "made for VR" titles thanks for asking.  And yes many of them are awesome.

 

What you are saying about 1CGS support for VR and optimization is just false. They have been quite pro-active with their VR support. I remember a time just having the HUD on would halve the framerates. Not so anymore.

They have optimized it quite well since support was introduced in early 2017 and it has come a long away in that period of time.

If you are waiting for them to rebuild this sim from the ground up just for VR, then that is a waste of time, not gonna happen.

 

I would say if anyone ( taking the Zoom mod out of equation) is not happy with the VR support they are getting with this sim , then it probably is not for them.

As for the zoom mod, it will be back.

And yes I do agree it would be nice if 1CGS could add another zoom level.

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, [CPC]Giledhil said:

In your setup.cfg, search under Key = Camera

vr_zoom_speed = 1

wow! didn't know it, thanks!!!!

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45 minutes ago, SCG_Wulfe said:

 

I think you misunderstand me. I'm saying that I'm certain a solution is in the works.  Causing a heated debate over this all over again may jeopardize that. 

 

We'll see if your optimism is justified... but the reason why we should walk on tiptoes frankly escapes me ūüėĄ

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, dburne said:

 

I do not run multi GPU's. Never will.

I do however have and enjoy many "made for VR" titles thanks for asking.  And yes many of them are awesome.

 

What you are saying about 1CGS support for VR and optimization is just false. They have been quite pro-active with their VR support. I remember a time just having the HUD on would halve the framerates. Not so anymore.

They have optimized it quite well since support was introduced in early 2017 and it has come a long away in that period of time.

If you are waiting for them to rebuild this sim from the ground up just for VR, then that is a waste of time, not gonna happen.

 

I would say if anyone ( taking the Zoom mod out of equation) is not happy with the VR support they are getting with this sim , then it probably is not for them.

As for the zoom mod, it will be back.

And yes I do agree it would be nice if 1CGS could add another zoom level.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, and you have not contradicted my statement in any way. Nothing i said is false, as you self said that it was mess in 2017 and only gotten better recently. So did i. 

First implementation of VR was a spit and bailing-wire contraption, no two ways around it. And it has been steadily reaching passable standards on performance side. So why prostrate yourself before mediocrity that we get every time new patch rolls and all mods that elevates this to decent VR experience, stop working? 

 

The VR was ok with mods, the VR is NOT ok without mods (doubly so in competitive MP), and the fact that there is huge threads about them every time this get changed or challenged should prolly at least raise some eyebrows in QA department. 

 

The thing is, its not about Zoom, but a LoD on intermediate levels. 

 

You will see planes far out, and you will see planes at knife fighting ranges. At intermediate ~3km to 800m the LoDs are wrong for VR pixel densities for proper rendering and the Zoom mod was a band aid solution for that. 

Also, the way how light is wonky on some lighting conditions just makes this even more frustrating. Anyone who dont have Oled screens suffer immanency from this.   

Edited by Cpt_Siddy
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Posted (edited)

Implement a proper smart scaling, then remove every zoom from the game, no one will look for visibility "exploit" of any kind, problem fixed and everyone is happy.

Zoom can't be fair? well it's wrong in first place, make people be able to play without, just like the way every flight sim should be played.

Edited by Prancingkiller
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11 minutes ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

 

 

Yes, and you have not contradicted my statement in any way. Nothing i said is false, as you self said that it was mess in 2017 and only gotten better recently.

 

I am not even going to read the rest of your post.

What you said above I highlighted is blatantly false, you are putting words in my mouth. No where did I say it was a mess, and no where did I say it only gotten better recently.

Have a nice day.

 

 

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Posted (edited)
48 minutes ago, dburne said:

 

I am not even going to read the rest of your post.

What you said above I highlighted is blatantly false, you are putting words in my mouth. No where did I say it was a mess, and no where did I say it only gotten better recently.

Have a nice day.

 

 

 

You said it was "less than optimal" just now, i merely colored that with more expressive language. Objectively, it was sub optimal, or there would have been no need for optimization and fixes, right? No need for mods that make things better, right? You look really off your game when you are trying to say that "its was always ok" and "it got better since 2017"... Well which one is it? Was it OK? Did it get better from OK? What does that make it now? 

 

Sadly, it obvious to me at this point that your standards are below mine or you have so much emotional investment in this game that you fail to acknowledge any shortcomings or think objectively. Good day to you. 

52 minutes ago, Prancingkiller said:

Implement a proper smart scaling, then remove every zoom from the game, no one will look for visibility "exploit" of any kind, problem fixed and everyone is happy.

Zoom can't be fair? well it's wrong in first place, make people be able to play without, just like the way every flight sim should be played.

 

There is not enough pixels in screen or HMD to have that as plausible solution. This problem is as old as Simming itself. Until you get stupendously high resolutions, you just have way too little pixels to work with to not need zoom without making distant planes look like duplo blocks. 

Edited by Cpt_Siddy

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36 minutes ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

There is not enough pixels in screen or HMD to have that as plausible solution. This problem is as old as Simming itself. Until you get stupendously high resolutions, you just have way too little pixels to work with to not need zoom without making distant planes look like duplo blocks. 

not true, go check BMS smart scaling

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Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, Prancingkiller said:

not true, go check BMS smart scaling

 

Jesus lend me strength.

 

Smart scaling does not address the issue of pixel scarcity most if not all current HMD suffer from, even the "8k" ones. 

If you have 4 pixels to work with, no amount of scaling will fix it, you need to have zoom to decrease the FoV angle and increase pixels available to work with. 

Anything else will mean that you will have to make distant objects take more pixels and that causes its own problems. 

Zoom is a fix that address both of these problems. Having a generally ok environment with ability to resolve distant objects by zooming on them. 

Edited by Cpt_Siddy

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Just here to let a lighted candle wishing lefuneste is making a new version. Maybe we can start a Sanctuary on another topic.¬†ūüēĮÔłŹ

I sniped a friendly P51¬†yesterday on Combat Box training server¬†ūüė¨

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In principle, Jason and Lefuneste are already in contact, they reach an agreement that those who use VR really lack, a zoom equal to those of the monitor, some adjustment to remove blur from aircraft in clouds, a decrease in excessive reflection of the sun and as they pass some structures, better optimization of the zoom, so as not to lose fps in the rescaling, many of the things that we suffer every day, I trust that they are working on it and that they can reach an agreement in a NATIVE implementation

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18 minutes ago, Ala13_UnopaUno_VR said:

In principle, Jason and Lefuneste are already in contact, they reach an agreement that those who use VR really lack, a zoom equal to those of the monitor, some adjustment to remove blur from aircraft in clouds, a decrease in excessive reflection of the sun and as they pass some structures, better optimization of the zoom, so as not to lose fps in the rescaling, many of the things that we suffer every day, I trust that they are working on it and that they can reach an agreement in a NATIVE implementation

Yes, I believe the same, just be patient, this thread is about some workaround in the mean time.

ūüēĮÔłŹ for the p51 @ECV56_Lubermatz

 

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I would be in favor of a coloured dot showing up above the bogey at a distance the game decides is an average recognition range for the plane type (size) at the current aspect facing relative the viewer.  Then regardless of the player's resolution quality, identifying a bogey as either friend or foe would be made equal.  Allow settings so the player can turn this dot off once the bogey is within a certain distance.

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I dont get the idiocy of this at all. 

Wasnt the simplest solution to address the whiny babies and meet the VR community need to delete the x10 option and intro a x5 or x7 option?

The longer term solution which should have been handled in the last update would be the developer option addressing the disparity for VR users? (if that was an option at all)

 

No doubt, 'the mod that shall not be named' will return given the willingness of its thoughtful creator to further contribute and not get slain by the foolishness so far having taken place and I havent seen anything (bit hard with the thread moderated) that suggested the developers were opposed to the 'the mod that shall not be named' as an aid to VR users.  This simply means a short period of VR users hurting until 'the mod that shall not be named' is reintroduced.

 

Where does it say we cannot speak of 'the mod that shall not be named.'?

 

 

 

'

1 hour ago, Drum said:

I would be in favor of a coloured dot showing up above the bogey at a distance the game decides is an average recognition range for the plane type (size) at the current aspect facing relative the viewer.  Then regardless of the player's resolution quality, identifying a bogey as either friend or foe would be made equal.  Allow settings so the player can turn this dot off once the bogey is within a certain distance.

 

Please god no. Lets not and say we did eh?

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9 hours ago, Cpt_Siddy said:

And while one can argue VR is niche in some markets, sim market is one of its MAIN niches. Lions share of VR owners are avid Simmers. More and more simmers, every year are getting VR headset. Headset count went from low when Vive came out, to now 50% in some squads with plethora different brands. The trend will only go up. VR simming is so much more immersive that is is no brainer... And simming community is no stranger to expensive peripherals with all that other junk annoying your wife...

The actual number of flight sim players using VR is 11-12%

https://download.navigraph.com/docs/navigraph-flightsim-community-survey-2018-final.pdf

https://download.navigraph.com/docs/flightsim-community-survey-by-navigraph-2019-final.pdf

 

FAA10B3C-731F-4620-A5A6-1A580D180C8C.jpeg

7 hours ago, Prancingkiller said:

Implement a proper smart scaling,

Smart scaling looks horribly stupid... it’s making the aircraft visibly 2-3x larger and you’ll see the scaled aircraft against unscaled objects.  

6DED7394-0F81-4F87-9951-257DC55DC1A7.jpeg

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12% if nothing to sneez at, considering how these things go.

 

12% just in few short years is faster rate of adoption than most other high investment hardware like washing machines or cars, when they first came out. And it will more than likely increase and not decrease, as the tech matures. 

I remember, back in 90's when joystick was a not nearly as commonplace in simming, and many played with keyboard and mouse or just keyboard.

And Joysticks had horrible interface ports and other stuff. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, TWC_Sp00k said:


 whiny babies 

 

 

I believe in America, they are called customers.

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2 hours ago, TWC_Sp00k said:

Where does it say we cannot speak of 'the mod that shall not be named.'?

 

In the below thread it states "...discussion of this topic suspended until further notice."

 

I recommend we stay on topic with discussion relating to 'Current VR Zoom'.

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