SimShaker - Wings support thread for IL-2 users

[Andre]

@OCA_LoneStar May I see screenshots of all your SimShaker - Wings tabs with settings (except Credits)?

Edited February 5, 2020 by Andre

[Alonzo]

This seems very interesting. I currently have a custom flight rig with bass-shakers attached to a 2-channel amp with low-pass filter, and I use Voicemeeter to send game audio to the amp, which then sends the bass to my shakers.

 

Do I need to buy any more hardware in order to try the SimShaker software? For example a USB sound card? Or can I continue as-is? (I use motherboard headphone-out as dedicated bass shaker output). If using bass shakers, is it better to just use the 2-channels of the stereo amplifier and its left/right outputs, rather than the bass outputs?

[Andre]

You will need another sound output device (like a sound card or LCD sound output or something like that), since SimShaker produces its own low frequency sounds to feed the bass-shakers and you will not want to mix it with the game sound. I recommend to use stereo line output (green circle connector) rather than  sub-woofer output.

12 hours ago, OCA_LoneStar said:

I have not been able to find any information on the internet about this error.

https://www.hresult.info/FACILITY_AUDCLNT/0x8889000A

The endpoint device is already in use. Either the device is being used in exclusive mode, or the device is being used in shared mode and the caller asked to use the device in exclusive mode

Edited February 5, 2020 by Andre

[ATAG_SKUD]

Hi Andre,

Having a bit of trouble getting this to work. I have a SoundBlaster AE-9 card with headphones plugged into DAC and the audio feed to the Buttkicker is fed through a Y connector on my headphones. It seems I can only get test sound from SimShaker when there is no sound from the game or vice-versa. I can get either one to work by changing some setting and restarting either SimShaker or my SoundBlaster  Command software . But not both at the same time.

I tried enabling the on-board audio device and plugged the Buttkicker into the sub-out on the mobo. Then selected mono or stereo in SimShaker and the on board audio in the drop down. I didn’t give me any sound or output to the Buttkicker.

If I selected 5.1 I heard sound through headphones but killed game sound.

If I run the game with sound card working and I get output to the Buttkicker from Y connector on the headphones but I don’t think SimShaker is outputting because TEST doesn’t work.

BTW it looks like my emails are being rejected now as spam

Thanks Skud

[Andre]

Hi Skud,

SimShaker - Wings by default doesn't use subwoofer channel to provide effects, except Test button sample, please try with the line output.

Y-splitter is not a solution, dedicated sound output is required.

[hayraddin]

Hey @ATAG_SKUD,

If I understand correctly, you have 2 sound card devices, your SoundBlaster AE-9 and the on-board audio device (guessing its a realtek).

If you only ever use the SoundBlaster for any audio output in your computer, movies, music, games etc, and the on-board audio is unused, what you may do is the following:

 - Enable the on-board audio device, but keep your default audio output to the SoundBlaster.
 - Plug the 3.5mm jack cable that goes to the Amp of the buttkicker in the green line (stereo output) of the On-Board audio output (back of the computer, not the front headphones one in the computer case), no need to use Y-splitter since this device will just be used to drive the buttkicker but not to listen to anything.

 - Make sure the volume output of the On-Board audio is set to a high volume or max volume, to do this, swap for a moment the default output of windows from the Soundblaster to the On-board audio, increase volume and now switch back to the Soundblaster as default.
 - In SimShaker select 1 channel output, and the device is the On-board audio device. This should now give you vibrations in the SimShaker while still being able to listen to everything from your SoundBlaster.

Cheers, hope it helps.
 

[dburne]

This all just sounds so complicated to me... still considering though.

[SCG_motoadve]

13 minutes ago, dburne said:

This all just sounds so complicated to me... still considering though.

Super easy really .

You buy a new external sound card, plug the Buttkicker and select this external sound card it in the Sim Shaker software, then you get the effects.

[dburne]

37 minutes ago, SCG_motoadve said:

Super easy really .

You buy a new external sound card, plug the Buttkicker and select this external sound card it in the Sim Shaker software, then you get the effects.

 

Ok but that will not affect the sound I get through my earbuds in the Rift S right?

So I would need a Jet Seat, a Butt Kicker, and an external sound card?

[HappyHaddock]

Just a thought worth mentioning but people keep talking about needing a separate sound card for the bass shakers, given that a bespoke sound card is most likely going to deliver better quality audio than the basic motherboard sound chip most may otherwise be using, isn't it better to talk of using a new sound card for audio, and plugging the bass shakers into the basic motherboard sound out put most already have?

 

It's certainly the way I set things up as I already owned a decent quality sound card with built in amp I was using for audio and so I  had a redundant sound output on my motherboard!  It doesn't get around the need to have two sound outputs but surely it is advantageous to use the best quality of these for audio?

[spitfirejoe]

48 minutes ago, dburne said:

 

Ok but that will not affect the sound I get through my earbuds in the Rift S right?

So I would need a Jet Seat, a Butt Kicker, and an external sound card?

 

Yes that is correct. ONE Soundcard for your Audio, Your Rift S and a second Soundcard for Jet Seat or Buttkicker. I use a cheap external USB 5.1 Soundcard for the Buttkicker, that is easy.

[DragonDaddy]

It’s really easier than you think but you do need two separate sound outputs. This is how I have mine setup and it works perfectly. You don’t need to have the very best equipment to make this work. The setup I have uses headphones but also will work with speakers. 
 

My headphones are plugged into an external sound card. I use the Creative Sound Blaster X. It plugs into a USB port on your computer. Mine is plugged into a dedicated USB hub and works fine. 
Opinion: If you have extra money to spend, do it here for the sound card. For me, game sound quality is important. Some sound cards offer software with customizable sound and game modes that (to me) add much to gaming. 
 

I use the onboard sound supplied by my motherboard. It is enabled in bios. The ButtKicker is plugged into the headphone port (the green one) on the back of my computer. My EVGA Z390 motherboard has good sound quality but the low bass frequencies used by the ButtKicker don’t demand high-quality sound output. 
If you have onboard sound (included in your motherboard), it should work well. 
 

After this, you need to experiment with the SimShaker software. It is also easy to use and set to your taste. I started by putting all available sliders to 100%, did some test flights, then adjusted the sliders to my liking. I began with low volume until I heard how the effects sounded on my system. I adjusted the volume up until it felt slightly too loud but wasn’t causing any damage to any of the components mentioned above or my ears. I like to fly a little loud and love when the rumbling effects scare the hell out of me. 
 

There are other ways to set up your bass shakers and other brands and options you can use. A dedicated internal sound card will also work. The key is having two separate outputs to keep bass shaker sound apart from headphones/speakers sound. 
 

This is what works for me based on my system. I hope you can setup yours to your liking because it’s a lot of fun. 
 

Happy flying and rumble on!
 

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by DragonDaddy
Removed potentially offensive word

[JG1_Labroisse]

2 hours ago, SCG_motoadve said:

Super easy really .

You buy a new external sound card, plug the Buttkicker and select this external sound card it in the Sim Shaker software, then you get the effects.

 

You can also use HD Audio from your graphics card.  Plug your buttkicker into your monitor audio out and choose HD Audio in Simshaker.  Works perfectly and don't need a second sound card.

Edited February 5, 2020 by II./JG1_Labroisse

[Andre]

54 minutes ago, spitfirejoe said:

 

Yes that is correct. ONE Soundcard for your Audio, Your Rift S and a second Soundcard for Jet Seat or Buttkicker. I use a cheap external USB 5.1 Soundcard for the Buttkicker, that is easy.

I don't quite agree.

Talking about using JetSeat with SimShaker - Wings for IL-2 it has nothing in common with soundcard and sounds. That's just pure telemetry and control of JetSeat via USB.

Of course if you haven't got enabled Sound Sensor feature for some (weird) reason.

Edited February 5, 2020 by Andre

[dburne]

Ok thanks guys, I think I have a little clearer picture.

[spitfirejoe]

Hello Andre, Maybe I was wrong with the Jet Seat, I can not talk for a Jet Seat, because I don´t own one. But a Buttkicker does not work without the second soundcard.

 

Are the Signals for a Jet Seat more sofisticated, more detailed than for a Buttkicker with a Soundcard for your Software "Sim Shaker Wings for IL-2" ?

 

To be honest the whole subject might be a bit confusing for some people including me sometimes.

 

I would be glad if there would be a tutorial Video on Youtube, explaining the Sim Shaker Wings Software, the Hardware Setup and all possibilities. That would bring some light into Darkness for many Gamers who are interested and not experienced with all that stuff.

 

I just flew now with my Sim Shaking and it is really amazing how many details get transfered…..the Engine Vibrations for instance are so very detailed, after shutting down the engine I even felt the shaft cranking the Propeller for a few revolutions after the engine quit already, that feels amazing.

 

 

[dburne]

Yeah a tutorial might be very helpful as I still seem to be a little cloudy on this.

 

[ATAG_SKUD]

19 hours ago, hayraddin said:

Hey @ATAG_SKUD,

If I understand correctly, you have 2 sound card devices, your SoundBlaster AE-9 and the on-board audio device (guessing its a realtek).

If you only ever use the SoundBlaster for any audio output in your computer, movies, music, games etc, and the on-board audio is unused, what you may do is the following:

 - Enable the on-board audio device, but keep your default audio output to the SoundBlaster.
 - Plug the 3.5mm jack cable that goes to the Amp of the buttkicker in the green line (stereo output) of the On-Board audio output (back of the computer, not the front headphones one in the computer case), no need to use Y-splitter since this device will just be used to drive the buttkicker but not to listen to anything.

 - Make sure the volume output of the On-Board audio is set to a high volume or max volume, to do this, swap for a moment the default output of windows from the Soundblaster to the On-board audio, increase volume and now switch back to the Soundblaster as default.
 - In SimShaker select 1 channel output, and the device is the On-board audio device. This should now give you vibrations in the SimShaker while still being able to listen to everything from your SoundBlaster.

Cheers, hope it helps.
 

  Thanks Hayraddin. Yes I have SB card and RealTek on-board.  I did most of that but used Sub out on the Realtek audio. I also turned the volume to the max on it. I have a Line Out front speaker jack I will try it it works!

thanks

skud

 

Edited February 6, 2020 by ATAG_SKUD
added on board audio jack layout

[ATAG_SKUD]

21 hours ago, Andre said:

Hi Skud,

SimShaker - Wings by default doesn't use subwoofer channel to provide effects, except Test button sample, please try with the line output.

Y-splitter is not a solution, dedicated sound output is required.

Got it-it works!

skud

[Andre]

Guys, unfortunately I'm not good at making tutorials. Please do not expect a lot from me on that matter.

Maybe someone else, who's caught the idea well,  could do that? 

[ATAG_SKUD]

Sorry -one more question. I have two buttkickers one Gamer2 on the joystick mount and one mini concert mounted on the rear of the seat. How do I change from left/right outputs to front/rear?  I'm guessing most folks using two bass shakers in a cockpit are set up this way.

skud

Edited February 6, 2020 by ATAG_SKUD

[spitfirejoe]

23 minutes ago, Andre said:

Guys, unfortunately I'm not good at making tutorials. Please do not expect a lot from me on that matter.

Maybe someone else, who's caught the idea well,  could do that? 

 

I am not a Video Editor or YouTube guy, I have no Talent and skills for that…..maybe someone else here is a bit more talented in producing Videos?! 

 

Is anyone willing to do a nice and clean tutorial Video about the subject?

[Andre]

11 minutes ago, ATAG_SKUD said:

Sorry -one more question. I have two buttkickers one Gamer2 on the joystick mount and one mini concert mounted on the rear of the seat. How do I change from left/right outputs to front/rear?  I'm guessing most folks using two bass shakers in a cockpit are set up this way.

skud

The answer stays the same:

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/57925-simshaker-wings-support-thread-for-il-2-users/?do=findComment&comment=886839

 

[Andre]

17 hours ago, spitfirejoe said:

Are the Signals for a Jet Seat more sofisticated, more detailed than for a Buttkicker with a Soundcard for your Software "Sim Shaker Wings for IL-2" ?

That's a bit tricky.

From one hand vibration motors have more inertia than bass-shakers and due to that may "eat" short signals. 

From the other hand in JetSeat we have 8 motors to control and maintain space separation. Have many of us got 6 - 8 bass- shakers at their rigs?

 

[Lombra]

Don't know about a tutorial, but I can try to put it plainly.

• The game outputs telemetry that can be used to produce haptic feedback.
• Haptic feedback can be delivered mainly in two different ways:
  • A massage cushion, such as the JetSeat
  • A tactile transducer (or "bass shaker", essentially a subwoofer), such as the ButtKicker
• In order to produce haptic feedback based on the telemetry from the game, an interface is required; that's what SimShaker is. SimShaker transforms the telemetry data into something the haptic feedback devices can use.
• If you use the JetSeat:
  • You need no additional hardware. Since it connects via USB, SimShaker controls it directly.
• If you use tactile transducers/bass shakers:
  • Since they are regular speakers, SimShaker controls them by producing regular sound signals.
  • This means that you need a regular (analog) sound output device dedicated to SimShaker - be it a sound card integrated onto the motherboard, a dedicated internal sound card, or an external USB sound card - to which the sound signal can be sent.
  • You will also need one or more (depending on how many bass shakers you plan to use) amplifiers to drive the bass shakers, because a sound card does not provide enough power to drive them in its own.
  • SimShaker lets you decide to which sound device the signals will be sent.
  • SimShaker sends sound signals on the same outputs that you connect your speakers or headphones, why you can't use the same sound device for it.
    • If you have a free analog sound output device - maybe because you use some digital output, such as USB or HDMI - you can use that for SimShaker, and do not need to buy an additional sound card.
    • If you only have the onboard sound card, and you use that for your speakers or headphones, you do need to buy an additional sound card.

As you can see, there is a lot more to take into consideration when going for bass shakers, compared to JetSeat.

 

Hopefully it helps someone.

[dburne]

47 minutes ago, Lombra said:

Don't know about a tutorial, but I can try to put it plainly.

• The game outputs telemetry that can be used to produce haptic feedback.
• Haptic feedback can be delivered mainly in two different ways:
  • A massage cushion, such as the JetSeat
  • A tactile transducer (or "bass shaker", essentially a subwoofer), such as the ButtKicker
• In order to produce haptic feedback based on the telemetry from the game, an interface is required; that's what SimShaker is. SimShaker transforms the telemetry data into something the haptic feedback devices can use.
• If you use the JetSeat:
  • You need no additional hardware. Since it connects via USB, SimShaker controls it directly.
• If you use tactile transducers/bass shakers:
  • Since they are regular speakers, SimShaker controls them by producing regular sound signals.
  • This means that you need a regular (analog) sound output device dedicated to SimShaker - be it a sound card integrated onto the motherboard, a dedicated internal sound card, or an external USB sound card - to which the sound signal can be sent.
  • You will also need one or more (depending on how many bass shakers you plan to use) amplifiers to drive the bass shakers, because a sound card does not provide enough power to drive them in its own.
  • SimShaker lets you decide to which sound device the signals will be sent.
  • SimShaker sends sound signals on the same outputs that you connect your speakers or headphones, why you can't use the same sound device for it.
    • If you have a free analog sound output device - maybe because you use some digital output, such as USB or HDMI - you can use that for SimShaker, and do not need to buy an additional sound card.
    • If you only have the onboard sound card, and you use that for your speakers or headphones, you do need to buy an additional sound card.

As you can see, there is a lot more to take into consideration when going for bass shakers, compared to JetSeat.

 

Hopefully it helps someone.

 

Yes it does, thank you!

That is what I was looking for, all this talk on using separate soundcards etc had me a little confused.

I prefer simplistics, so knowing all I need is the Jet Seat and the Sim Shaker software is of great help to me.

[Ala13_UnopaUno_VR]

24O€ EL JET SEAT?????

[Alonzo]

So I got it to work, no new soundcard required:

• I was already using Voicemeeter Banana to route game audio to my bass shaker, but to not send Discord audio there. People talking wobbling my seat is weird.
• In SimShaker, I selected Voicemeeter AUX as the sound card.
• In Voicemeeter, I directed Voicemeeter AUX to my headphone jack on my motherboard (I use digital audio out to an under-monitor speaker + Rift S audio, so this port was free)

This works great. It does seem like some of the effects are awesome and some are personal preference. I like the engine drone, and I like the stall buffet (although I need to figure that out some more). The "roll" effect seems weird -- do airplanes vibrate when you roll them fast? I've turned that down a bit, I might turn it down even more. Do other people enjoy that?

 

Anyhow, from a very quick test this seems like quite a promising piece of software, even for someone who has a simple 1-channel bass shaker setup. Mine is actually 2-channel but front/rear rather than left/right -- if anyone has this thing working for front/rear please let me know so I can copy your setup.

[Andre]

1 hour ago, Alonzo said:

The "roll" effect seems weird -- do airplanes vibrate when you roll them fast?

Good question. I think actually they do not. I wil try to explain.

The Pitch and Roll Motion effects were the very first and the only effects provided in March 2019 when telemetry output for motion platforms was implemented in IL-2 by the developers.

The telemetry data set was not intended for SimShaker needs. So, that was an attempt to get something for JetSeats in IL-2. And that was better than nothing.

 

I would say it feels pretty different with JetSeat than 1 - 2 bass-shakers and it's not half to bad in combination with VR helmet. Adding a bit of imagination one can perceive vibration applied directly to the body like a kind of pressure provided by the manoeuvring aircraft. That's why I decided to keep those 2 effects despite it took some effort.

[SCG_motoadve]

I un selected those two effects.

Planes do not vibrate when pitching or rolling.

The rest I like them all.

Great job.

[Andre]

I think I will make Pitch and Roll Motion effects disabled by default in the next version.

[chiliwili69]

Good to know that I will not need an extra soundcard. (With JetSeat)

 

Just for clarification, how we should call it "JetSeat" or "JetPad"?

Those names confused me when ordering, but there is only one single hardware to buy it in your web. In the images I read JetPad, but people is using Jetseat wording. Maybe it was a previous name.

[Talisman]

46 minutes ago, Andre said:

I think I will make Pitch and Roll Motion effects disabled by default in the next version.

 

Andre,

 

If you do disable this for pitch, will we still get stall shudder with high AOA?

I expect we will, but would not like to lose the stalled airframe shudder in a turn or a climb.

 

Happy landings,

 

Talisman

[40plus]

<<<EDIT, Nevermind, saw that the question has been asked and answered>>>>

 

 

I've been using a home-build bass shaker for the past year or two running just off the game sound alone. I can't fly without it now. the games feels too flat without my seat shaking in response to the action. I've just purchased Simshaker and the option so that I can get a more tuned performance out of my setup. I'd also like to add a second transducer but have a question.

 

Can I, using the stereo setting, select which channel (left or right) is used for which effect?

I'd like to mount one transducer to my flight stick and send all aerodynamic effects like stall to that channel, (for example left) and send all the engine, guns and other effects to the second transducer (right) that is mounted to my seat.

 

Is that possible?

 

 

Oh, and....

Thanks to Andre and the IL2 team for bringing us this capability! 

Edited February 6, 2020 by pfrances

[spitfirejoe]

Good Andre that you will disable Pitch and Roll for Sim Shaking, I also don´t see any need for such an option.

 

I have another question!

 

Is it possible to use Motion Platform and Sim Shaking at the same time with IL-2?

 

Because since I use Sim Shaking my motion rig does not move anymore! Maybe it has to do with the changed startup.cfg file?

 

How must I edit the startup.cfg file to make BOTH work at the same time, motion and shaking?

 

Thanks

Edited February 6, 2020 by spitfirejoe

[40plus]

53 minutes ago, spitfirejoe said:

Good Andre that you will disable Pitch and Roll for Sim Shaking, I also don´t see any need for such an option.

 

I have another question!

 

Is it possible to use Motion Platform and Sim Shaking at the same time with IL-2?

 

Because since I use Sim Shaking my motion rig does not move anymore! Maybe it has to do with the changed startup.cfg file?

 

How must I edit the startup.cfg file to make BOTH work at the same time, motion and shaking?

 

Thanks

 

Isn't that what this is for?

[spitfirejoe]

Thanks pfrances,

 

I got it now......I checked the TICK MARK "IL-2 UDP Retransmission" and changed the "Destination Port" number from default 29999 to 4321 and hit "Check and Save"

 

I also changed the startup.cfg file to the following.......

 

[KEY = motiondevice]
      addr = "127.0.0.1"
      decimation = 2
      enable = true
      port = 4321
[END]

 

now both works, my motion rig and shaking, thanks for the help!

Edited February 6, 2020 by spitfirejoe

[IRRE_Axurit]

 

1 hour ago, spitfirejoe said:

now both works, my motion rig and shaking, thanks for the help!

It must be amazing !!!

[spitfirejoe]

12 minutes ago, -IRRE-Axurit said:

 

It must be amazing !!!

 

To be honest....the Sim Shaking by Andre is really amazing. My motion rig is optimized for Sim Racing and not for flying. My Hyperaxis actuators can move only 100mm, which is enough for racing, but not enough for flying, especially not when you do aerobatics with high pitch and bank angles. For flying there are better motion rigs available than I have.

 

Back to topic Sim Shaking Wings.......I would request @Andre that we get maybe less "power output" of your software, as stated before, my Buttkicker is shaking very strong with only 2% "Engine Shake" and crazy as hell with only 1% of "Damage", when I get shot my chair nearly explodes, so strong is the effect, I wish I could fine tune betterall effects better for my Buttkicker, but less than 1% is 0%, not the best option.

Edited February 6, 2020 by spitfirejoe

[SCG_motoadve]

31 minutes ago, spitfirejoe said:

 

To be honest....the Sim Shaking by Andre is really amazing. My motion rig is optimized for Sim Racing and not for flying. My Hyperaxis actuators can move only 100mm, which is enough for racing, but not enough for flying, especially not when you do aerobatics with high pitch and bank angles. For flying there are better motion rigs available than I have.

 

Back to topic Sim Shaking Wings.......I would request @Andre that we get maybe less "power output" of your software, as stated before, my Buttkicker is shaking very strong with only 2% "Engine Shake" and crazy as hell with only 1% of "Damage", when I get shot my chair nearly explodes, so strong is the effect, I wish I could fine tune betterall effects better for my Buttkicker, but less than 1% is 0%, not the best option.

Please dont reduce the output Andre.

Everyone can reduce it at the Buttkicker console.