Jump to content
Jason_Williams

Discussion of the Battle of Normandy Announcement

Recommended Posts

10 hours ago, dhillr said:

I look forward to flying over Normandy and English Channel. :) Thanks for another awesome news!

 

Get Blitz, only 7 euro's now, has the same map as Normandy it seems ..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

17 pages with lots of moaning and groaning riddled throughout... C'mon chaps, it is what it is. Just get on with it.

I look at it this way. We have had 3 GB's set in the Eastern Front.

We have now got 2 GB's on the Western front... if they did a third it would even things up, that's fair.

Then, to make it right, they should do 3 GB's set in the PTO, and by that time they may have solved all the problems holding them up on the tech side along with all the required info on the Japanese aircraft and shipping...

I'm sure the Pacific will come, Jason has said he really wants to do it!

  • Upvote 10

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you check the current map borders you will notice it ends just before London in the north and Paris in the south, extending the map south up to Argentan would already require most of Paris to be created.

 

They could make Paris an noflyzone like they did with Moscow but they will have to find an solution to make the noflyzone only affect Paris and not the entire borderline like has been done with Moscow since if it affects the entire border line, the entire section east of Calais would become part of the noflyzone.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Trooper117 said:

17 pages with lots of moaning and groaning riddled throughout... C'mon chaps, it is what it is. Just get on with it.

I look at it this way. We have had 3 GB's set in the Eastern Front.

We have now got 2 GB's on the Western front... if they did a third it would even things up, that's fair.

Then, to make it right, they should do 3 GB's set in the PTO, and by that time they may have solved all the problems holding them up on the tech side along with all the required info on the Japanese aircraft and shipping...

I'm sure the Pacific will come, Jason has said he really wants to do it!

95% comments are praise, maybe you're in a wrong thread!

Btw Jason isn't funding il2 development from his pocket so his wishes have little impact on it.

It's a business with big publisher not family business he's running!

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, DD_Fenrir said:

The Ju-88C6a was not soley used by Nachtjagdgeschwader; it was also used by long range Zerstoer Geschwader based in Brittany who would patrol the Biscay Bay area providing U-boats Kreigsmarine and merchant shipping with air-cover from RAF Coastal Command aircraft.

 

So it was in the late afternoon on D-Day that I./ZG.1 had orders to dispatch at least 8 a/c towards the Normandy bridgehead; they had the misfortune to run across 135 Wings Spitfire IXs and suffered heavily.

 

Ju-188s were employed largely at night (as with the majority of the Kampfgeschwader at this time of the war). Without any confirmed plans by Jason and team to implement Air interception Radar it would seem that night combat is not really to be represented for the Western theatres and thusly the -188 would be largely irrelevant.

 

 

What about Ju 88S or Do 217Js? were those more relevant than the Ju 88C-6?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Danziger said:

Except for the Ju52. The poor sales figures indicate nobody bought the Ju52 and it was a waste of resources.

 

Well, I did so I'm one of those nobodies... and I really don't regret it. To be honest, I bought all collector planes available (even twice as gifts too),

which sadly isn't displayed like those bars for the sequels of BOX. That said, the one I enjoy most is actually the Junkers Ju52 - fantastic plane!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Bloodflowers said:

Shit, i also bought the Ju 52... And i really like this plane!

 

Did you get the Richard Burton mod?

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Sgt_Joch said:

I know everyone likes the heavies, but 9th AF B-25s and B-26s (which we will now have) carried out many long range strikes against targets in France, Belgium and Germany in 1943-45

 

p.s. - personally very happy with the inclusion of the B-26 and was hoping it would be included at one point, since the B-25 and B-26 were the mainstay of the 9th AF medium bomber force and were involved in most of the important missions.

 

If I might offer a correction with some additional information. In late August 1943 9th AF transferred from North Africa to the UK leaving its medium bomber units with 12th AF. For the sake of discussion, 9th AF was not equipped with B-25s whilst operating from the UK.

 

UK based 9th AF bomber units were as follows:

409th BG (A-20 until Dec 1944 converting to A-26) -- 640th BS, 641st BS, 642nd BS, 643rd BS

410th BG (A-20 until just before V-E day converting to A-26) -- 644th BS, 645th BS,646th BS, 647th BS

416th BG (A-20 until Nov 1944 converting to A-26) -- 668th BS, 669th BS, 670th BS, 671st BS

 

323rd BG (B-26) -- 453rd BS, 454th BS, 455th BS, 456th BS

387th BG (B-26) -- 556th BS, 557th BS, 558th BS, 559th BS

394th BG (B-26) -- 584th BS, 585th BS, 586th BS, 587th BS

397th BG (B-26) -- 596th BS, 597th BS, 598th BS, 599th BS

 

[edit forgot my second page of notes :blush:]

 

322nd BG (B-26) -- 449th BS, 450th BS, 451st BS, 452nd BS

344th BG (B-26) -- 494th BS, 495th BS, 496th BS, 497th BS

386th BG (B-26 until Jan 1945 converting to A-26) -- 552nd BS, 553rd BS, 554th BS, 555th BS

391st BG (B-26 until Apr 1945 converting to A-26) -- 572nd BS, 573rd BS, 574th BS, 575th BS

 

However RAF 2nd Group had four squadrons (98 Sqdn, 180 Sqdn, 226 Sqdn, 320 Sqdn) equipped with Mitchell IIs and IIIs.

 

All of this is my way of saying, B-25s should wear RAF markings in BON.

Edited by busdriver
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

you are correct, only the RAF was operating the B-25s, not the USAAF, I was conflating with 2TAF. However, the B-25s and B-26s did do most of the medium bomber missions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, busdriver said:

All of this is my way of saying, B-25s should wear RAF markings in BON.

 

Absolutely. Here is an overview of 12th and 9th AFs mediums:

 

 

9th_AF_Mediums.jpg

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Leifr said:

 

 

The Falaise pocket isn't even on the map.

 

Not on the image posted. ;)

 

We plan to have two versions of the map. There will be both pre-Invasion and post-Invasion versions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All the woebegone PTO'ers!  I'd like to see it too, but I'm going out on a limb and saying we can have BoN complete in probably another six months or so, or we could have been told we'd see PTO in 2021, with limited new planes, maps, vehicles, etc... in the meantime.  Several of these planes are indeed rehashed - modifications of models that exist in the sim - but this lets the devs get them too us quicker.  That coupled with the balance improvements that having fast, capable medium bombers on both sides brings is worth a ton for MP.  My spend on this platform thus far is dwarfed by my much more poorly chosen investments into WT.  I'll support the devs here and know that they are working towards what they feel they can achieve in a reasonable amount of time, at a reasonable budget and modest risk.  Far better that than a too grandiose failed project and the whole business comes crashing down.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Sgt_Joch said:

you are correct, only the RAF was operating the B-25s, not the USAAF, I was conflating with 2TAF. However, the B-25s and B-26s did do most of the medium bomber missions.

 

No worries. :good: I agree with you.

 

11 minutes ago, sevenless said:

Absolutely. Here is an overview of 12th and 9th AFs mediums:

 

Thanks for posting that chart. It reminded me I had omitted four B-26 Bomb Groups. :salute:

Edited by busdriver

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

regarding map size/area its said its not final, and if you see how it was done ith bobp map map area will probably be modified as they collect more info about bases neccesary for airplanes they are making and campaign they will build, size will probably differ from what we see, bobp map area grew in size from first example considerably so no fear this one will also to include neccesary stuff.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, =GM=GJL2 said:

What kind of new rendering tech will be? DX12???

i'm also excited to hear more about that. I'm a sucker for PBR, it just makes planes look so much better, especially bare metal one but really all if i'm honest, maybe some day we'll have it in IL-2 :) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fighter set is pretty much in favour to the Allies which it was at that time but ingame both sides should have balance.

So any chance to see in the "G6late" a ingame mod with a MW50 like G6/AS ?  G10 would have be nice too . They tried hard to fight Mossies up high with these 109 versions. Would be nice !

The whole series is  more  about groundbattle theatre of the eastern front ,imho

They should switch and think more into western allies high flying bombers too.

Edited by kubanloewe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

190 A-6 was always my favourite 190: the dash of the earlier models with the update - but less weight - of the later examples.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, kubanloewe said:

Fighter set is pretty much in favour to the Allies which it was at that time but ingame both sides should have balance.

So any cahnce to see in the "G6late" a ingame mod with a MW50 like G6/AS ?  G10 would have be nice too

I'm pretty sure the G-6 they give us is going to have enough differences to make it worthwhile to have in addition to the collector G-6. I would be very surprised if they didn't include MW50. I'm sure we will see more information on specific production blocks and variants as things progress.

A late G-6 is very close to a G-14 and should still be competitive with P-47D, Typhoon and P-51B. Not really much worse for the Luftwaffe than the BoBP plane set. The only allied 'superplane' we'll see is the Spit XIV. The Arado 234, on the other hand, will be the real war winner online if sides are balanced and the Luftwaffe commits to flying bomber missions, the thing will be nigh-on uninterceptible.

Really, the game has never had 'balance'. Axis had significant advantages in fighters right up until the La-5FN and BoBP, where they have rough parity depending on mods available and timeframe. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

 

What about Ju 88S or Do 217Js? were those more relevant than the Ju 88C-6?

 

My point was at least there is record of the 88C-6 in use in daylight over the beachhead, therefore it's inclusion makes sense.

 

The lack of game infrastructure to support night ops renders all night bombers, including the 188 and those you listed, as practically irrelevant, if prototypical ops is the aim.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, kubanloewe said:

Fighter set is pretty much in favour to the Allies which it was at that time but ingame both sides should have balance.

So any chance to see in the "G6late" a ingame mod with a MW50 like G6/AS ?  G10 would have be nice too . They tried hard to fight Mossies up high with these 109 versions. Would be nice !

The whole series is  more  about groundbattle theatre of the eastern front ,imho

They should switch and think more into western allies high flying bombers too.

since when do we need balance? IL-2 is a combat flight sim, it shows a fairly representative cut of the protrayed theaters of war. The Germans have superior equipment in pretty much all of the eatern front expansions. In BOBP the Germans have the 262 and the Allies can handle it without having a truly equal opponent like the Meteor. I like that we don't have clear cut 1:1 plane sets.

  • Like 2
  • Upvote 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After near 30 years ! of purchasing flight sims i wonder if at least 1 developer will make that nice Dornier 24 waterplane which was widely used as a recon and red cross plane even after wartime from netherlands and spain. imho.   

THAT would be a nice addon plane in BoN !!!

Edited by kubanloewe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Odd that suddenly that the Luftwaffe side isn't unquestionably superior, like they were for the majority of the BOS/BOM/BOK expansions...that suddenly there's a need for balance. 

 

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, sonicapollo said:

G6 late = tall wood tail and the option for mw50

..... so basically a g14 with the old canopy is what we will get. 

there is a reasonable chance that there will be an DB 605 AS engine mod available which will give the late G-6 pretty good high altitude performance, that way it can fill that gap in the Normandy and early half of the BOBP career 

 

  

1 minute ago, 357th_Dog said:

Odd that suddenly that the Luftwaffe side isn't unquestionably superior, like they were for the majority of the BOS/BOM/BOK expansions...that suddenly there's a need for balance. 

 

can we stop that "axis side" "allies side" bullshit, there have been enough people asking for balance during the BOS-BOK timeframe. Stop pretending it's only Axis drivers who like to have performance on their side.

Edited by Asgar
  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Asgar said:

there is a reasonable chance that there will be an DB 605 AS engine mod available which will give the late G-6 pretty good high altitude performance, that way it can fill that gap in the Normandy and early half of the BOBP career 

that will do the job indeed and perhaps some missions for it trying to catch up with fast high altitude Mossie .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the main reason I would love to see a B24 or 17 included is just simply to see how amazing it is above an overcast sky, weaving in and out of the bomber stream contrails, looking out for the enemy in the deep blue. Sat in the cage of my Mustang or Razorback.... oh the scale and majesty of what could be 😢

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Asgar said:

there is a reasonable chance that there will be an DB 605 AS engine mod available which will give the late G-6 pretty good high altitude performance, that way it can fill that gap in the Normandy and early half of the BOBP career 

 

  

can we stop that "axis side" "allies side" bullshit, there have been enough people asking for balance during the BOS-BOK timeframe. Stop pretending it's only Axis drivers who like to have performance on their side.



 It's not the axis side alone that has been complaining, but they've been complaining the loudest the last few weeks 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Will you consider adding IAR 80/81 to the game? Romania participated on the eastern front as axis biggest ally and IARs soldiered in Stalingrad and Odessa campaigns in large numbers.

It will be nice to have another radial engine dive bomber/fighter in the game. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For those complaining about balance. One reason I chose Normandy and the Hurricane is because you can make mid-war scenarios that are not as slanted as the late-war was towards the Allies. But let's not pretend that the LW didn't have superior planes and a lot of good pilots for half the war. And quite frankly the late war was more of less equal as far as tech and even then the LW had some better stuff like the 262. We all know that we don't play our sim as it was in real-life where pilot training, spare parts, fuel shortages and numerical superiority affected operations. And as we build more planes we see how the Allies with simply more nations involved ganged up and killed Germany. I mean in hindsight, it seems madness to take on France, GB, USA and USSR almost entirely by yourself. Italy was knocked out early and didn't have the industrial might and Japan was on the other side of the world and in the end also didn't have the industrial might. Anyways, we can't always balance things as you may want, but if you take the entire war, our products on the whole are quite balanced as far as choices. Please look at our entire catalog, not just each product. And remember, war isn't fair.

 

:salute:

Jason

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
  • Upvote 23

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A wellington would be awesome as it only has 2 engines.

 

Mick. :)

f_exclusive_box_artwork_featuring_new_airfix_vickers_wellington_a08019_on_airfix_workbench_blog.jpg

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, CUJO_1970 said:

The Arado flew over all 5 beach heads and photographed the allied landing sites in Normandy in the summer (early August) of 1944. There were 214 built and Arados flew many recon and bombing missions in the last year of the war - it is perfectly relevant for the Normandy (and Ardennes) maps.

 

No idea however, why the developers chose Ju88C-6 over the Ju-188.

Only two(!) Ar 234 prototypes(!) were utilized for reconnaissance flights during the Battle of Normandy timeframe. The first bombing sortie was conducted by regular B-2 models on 24 December 1944. I'm positive they are not going to model an unarmed prototype version pressed into service as a recon, but the regular B-2 model - which doesn't fit BoN at all.

The prototypes in question still used the take-off trolley and landing skids instead of a conventional landing gear and do not fit BoBP.
Including this aircraft instead of a Ju 88 S-1, Ju 188A-2/E-1 or even Do 217M-1 is super weird and it's not going to fit BoN and BoBP, only one of the two.

1131523533_Ar234.jpg.15500676d43a88bf1b57a58ab2827449.jpg

 

The Ju 88 C-6 operated over the Bay of Biscay from airfield far outside the proposed map area; the few missions countering Overlord were an unsuccessful act of desperation.

There's no Spitfire Mk. IXc, but a (straight-)flying V-1 and a Spitfire Mk. XIV to counter it.

The only bomber is yet again going to be an AI-only version, this time of the B-26.

Finally, the AI C-47 are going to conduct the famous airdrop at night, so nobody is going to witness it.

 

Good for those who are satisfied.

  • Thanks 1
  • Confused 2
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, the collector planes have generally been things that are interesting but might not quite fit the given battle (see the Fw-190A-3 in Stalingrad), and honestly it is a perfect pick for this battle given this precedent, since 

1. A variation did operate in the area

2. A lot of people have asked for it

3. it meshes well with another of the battles (ie Bodenplatte) 

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, CUJO_1970 said:

Wow, go outside and get some fresh air maybe.

Its raining here.....😣

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

also, from a production standpoint. the created jet tech for the 262, the 234 uses the same engines, it's a logical step to put it in a game seeing as that part of the work is already done. plus: the 234 is super cool :D (although i'd buy a Ju-188 or 88S Collector plane *wink wink*)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, =27=Davesteu said:

Only two(!) Ar 234 prototypes(!) were utilized for reconnaissance flights during the Battle of Normandy timeframe. The first bombing sortie was conducted by regular B-2 models on 24 December 1944. I'm positive they are not going to model an unarmed prototype version pressed into service as a recon, but the regular B-2 model - which doesn't fit BoN at all.

The prototypes in question still used the take-off trolley and landing skids instead of a conventional landing gear and do not fit BoBP.
Including this aircraft instead of a Ju 88 S-1, Ju 188A-2/E-1 or even Do 217M-1 is super weird and it's not going to fit BoN and BoBP, only one of the two.

1131523533_Ar234.jpg.15500676d43a88bf1b57a58ab2827449.jpg

 

The Ju 88 C-6 operated over the Bay of Biscay from airfield far outside the proposed map area; the few missions countering Overlord were an unsuccessful act of desperation.

There's no Spitfire Mk. IXc, but a (straight-)flying V-1 and a Spitfire Mk. XIV to counter it.

The only bomber is yet again going to be an AI-only version, this time of the B-26.

Finally, the AI C-47 are going to conduct the famous airdrop at night, so nobody is going to witness it.

 

Good for those who are satisfied.

 

You don't seem to realize that we when it comes to planes, we can only build what we can SOURCE properly. Understand that, and you'll understand why sometimes I have to get creative and not give you exactly the exact plane-type that was found where. I can't build a totally new 410 (which is gonna be a bitch to make) and a Ju-188 with the resources and time I have available to me. Hmm... what other cool twin engine plane can I make reasonable fast that is interesting and was plausibly on the Western Front in 1942 to late 1944. 

 

Welcome to my world of budgets, deadlines and yes limits of what is possible. Battle of Normandy is the theme of the title and when possible we adhere to that, but when needed I will find other options to offer an entertaining package. Also, note my caveat in my announcement about planes. Further research might make one or two of these impossible. We shall see.

 

Jason

  • Thanks 5
  • Sad 3
  • Upvote 25

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Asgar said:

also, from a production standpoint. the created jet tech for the 262, the 234 uses the same engines, it's a logical step to put it in a game seeing as that part of the work is already done. plus: the 234 is super cool 😄 (although i'd buy a Ju-188 or 88S Collector plane *wink wink*)

 

Sure. Also there is the undisputable factor of being the only sim developer who offers a flyable Arado 234 for two historically accurate settings (BoN and BoBP). That alone combined with the Me 262 being present could be argument enough for some new folks to get into the series. As for Ju 88S and JU 188, absolutely, but another one technically more interesting which also was used on the eastern front comes to mind and that is the HE 177 which was used during Operation Steinbock and would fit perfectly the BoN timeframe. And as V1s were announced...were are those HE-111 H-22s which launched those doodle bugs with KG 53 in 1944? Well there always seems to remain a plane or two left to be wished for.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...