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Pimax 8k / 5k VR headsets coming to Kickstarter this month!


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Pimax's Kickstarter campaign skyrocketed, they got the needed $200k funds in only an hour after active.

 

I don't have any VR yet as I think a good VR experience should have a high FoV vision and must sport good resolution to avoid SDE - none of the products available (Vive & Oculus) so far can accomplish. I hope that a new player with such a strong (at least in paper) product can get the ball really rolling.

 

Gotta watch the next chapters on this...

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It seems that there`s a lot of doubt about this in the air, because Pimax, the Chinese and so on.

 

I don`t care who or what company makes the device, if it has a chance to fix the main thing what stops me using VR, the horrible resolution. Bigger fov is only a bonus really. There has been satisfied customers of the previous Pimax 4k even on this site, flying the BoS. All that matters to me if it`s working with BoS and the resolution is satisfactory. I`m not expecting a full 8k, marketing speeches are what they are. With all companies, not just Pimax. And they seem to be working with eye tracking for example if I`ve understand correctly. I never had any nausea or anything with Oculus and don`t think it`s a problem with Pimax.

 

These are the reasons why this is very interesting to me. Of course it could be just another failure, it happens. But it`s very positive that we have some hope to get decent res for the VR in near future.

 

+1

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Marketing is marketing, even cv1 ocolus was said to to be like "best thing ever to put on my head". Even better than shampoo.

 

You mean it's not??

 

:cool:

 

I am hoping this gives Oculus/HTC a boost to get their newer technology out sooner than early 2019.

Edited by dburne
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No, you are definitely not an American, instead you are a giant knob trying to talk tough and look cool in front of your Continental friends... for no apparent reason at all.  

 

Ready for some "blunt talk" as you say?  If I was given only one wish from the magic Genie of Arabian lore; It would be to have left your refugee family in the hands of the Soviets long enough to have raised you with a better sense of decorum.     

 

I'm from Europe (Northern Ireland) and I did not find his post and racial stereotyping in the remotest bit cool.

Unfortunately I am not prepared to sink so much money into a kickstarter project, funded or not.  I will of course await final reviews for these when they are released, but I find it a bit worrying that some see these as nothing more than a push for HTC or Oculus to fast track their own next gen VR.  Frankly if the Pimax does tick most if not all the boxes and is (as is looking likely) a superior product to existing VR, then reward them with your custom.

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Pimax's Kickstarter campaign skyrocketed, they got the needed $200k funds in only an hour after active.

 

I don't have any VR yet as I think a good VR experience should have a high FoV vision and must sport good resolution to avoid SDE - none of the products available (Vive & Oculus) so far can accomplish. I hope that a new player with such a strong (at least in paper) product can get the ball really rolling.

 

Gotta watch the next chapters on this...

And they continue to get $60k per hour!

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I'm from Europe (Northern Ireland) and I did not find his post and racial stereotyping in the remotest bit cool.

Unfortunately I am not prepared to sink so much money into a kickstarter project, funded or not.  I will of course await final reviews for these when they are released, but I find it a bit worrying that some see these as nothing more than a push for HTC or Oculus to fast track their own next gen VR.  Frankly if the Pimax does tick most if not all the boxes and is (as is looking likely) a superior product to existing VR, then reward them with your custom.

 

 

I will certainly watch with interest on what their new device brings to the table, just like I did with their first offering.

But I am not ready to discard my Rift setup I purchased not all that long ago just yet, having way too much fun with it and want to wait and see what the next several months bring, and then make an educated decision on what might be best for me at that time. I will be watching the early reports from you guys that get one with interest though.

 

Maybe it will be Pimax, maybe it will be Oculus or HTC, or maybe even someone I would not even think about today.

I would be most interested in how it handles room scale, positional tracking,  hand tracking, and performance along with image clarity. Along with support.

 

All of this attention along with the successful kickstarter backing bodes very well for the VR genre also.

Edited by dburne
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I will certainly watch with interest on what their new device brings to the table, just like I did with their first offering.

But I am not ready to discard my Rift setup I purchased not all that long ago just yet, having way too much fun with it and want to wait and see what the next several months bring, and then make an educated decision on what might be best for me at that time. I will be watching the early reports from you guys that get one with interest though.

 

Maybe it will be Pimax, maybe it will be Oculus or HTC, or maybe even someone I would not even think about today.

I would be most interested in how it handles room scale, positional tracking,  hand tracking, and performance along with image clarity. Along with support.

 

All of this attention along with the successful kickstarter backing bodes very well for the VR genre also.

 

I had a rift and it broke, I didn't bother replacing it because the negatives (atrociously poor IQ) outweighed the positives IMHO.

 

Pretty soon we will have the MS Mixed reality headsets and early next year the new Pimax headsets.  So I'm hoping both improve upon what rift offers.  I'm only interested in sit down experience in cockpit sims with no touch controllers, as I personally found the roomscale and touch experience ultimately unimpressive.

Edited by ICDP
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Don't think the to be released mix reality headsets will do much for us given what I have seen with their specs.  The 8k Pimax on the other hand does tick the boxes even if it is only 1440p per eye upscaled to 4k per eye.

 

Not sure how HTC is going now with their recent acquisition by Google.

 

Anyway, today I committed to a base 8k headset on Kickstart. Not much more expesive than other alternatives including large screen monitor setup. I think the Pimax HMD would be better in that I fet depth perception over a monitor and that 200 DOV which will be great for rear checks in cockpit. The res being good enough for detail whilst still being driven by current hardware.  Tracking also better than their earlier efforts.

 

Can't wait. )

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I hope the Pimax does very well and delivers what they promise, which will be great for the VR industry as a whole. I really do.

 

What I don't care a lot for is their marketing.

 

Like say, 4K per eye = 8K. No it does not work that way.

Plus at least it sounds like this higher resolution they are touting, much of that is gotten through SS. Something we can do now, just at not maybe that high a level. And then there is the question of how they are achieving the 200 degree FOV. 

 

So I tend to be suspect when I see claims as this, but hey if they can pull it off then I will be one of the first to tip my hat to them. I certainly have no ill will toward them, just some ambiguity in their marketing speak. But if it is as great as it sounds, and I don't see anything on the near horizon with the big two, then I would likely get one as well. The only thing I have not seen any evidence of yet is their support system after the sale as well. 

 

And then there is the question of how a device like that is going to run a combat flight sim on our current rigs? If it can do all that but only get 20-30 fps in the sim, that will not be a very pleasant experience.

 

I do really look forward to hearing first impression reports from you guys that are getting in on this. 

And I really hope to hear a comparison from an Oculus user that got one of these.

Edited by dburne
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Plus at least it sounds like this higher resolution they are touting, much of that is gotten through SS. Something we can do now, just at not maybe that high a level

 

No, it's the other way around. With the rift we squeeze 1200 pixels x PD factor into 1200 pixels (vertical), they expand 1440 pixels to 2160 pixels. Super scaling is really just an expensive way of doing full-scene anti-aliasing.

 

But it makes me wonder if there is a point with that at the moment. Why not go for the 5K instead? I'm not sure 1440p upscaled to 2160p is better than 1440p on itself. Couldn't they manufacture 1440p panels that have as little space between pixels as the 2160p ones?

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I had initially backed the 5K for this reason until I read the SDE is considerably more noticeable.  The 5K still gets better resolution that Rift or Vive, enough to be noticeable according to reviews but I want SDE not to be an issue.

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To answer their after sales support record, from what I have seen on their forums they have been quite good. Not perfect but they communicate well with customers and try to resolve issues that arrise.

 

The 5k will have SDE, the 8k running same input res will not, the main reason for the in HMD upscalling. The 8kx will push 4k per eye from the computer but at this point you might need sli to run it. Also will require 2DP 1.4 connections because the in headset DP chip can not handle the signal.bandwith to do it at speed over a single DP 1.4 cable.

 

Maybe in future they will be able to perfect compression tech to be able to have the 8k run over single cable at native res. At the moment the tech isn't there. I also wonder anout the upgradability of the headsets them selves as it seems Pimax is going for a modular design to enable accessories and tech modules down the track. This could be a big win if they allow for easy upgrading of their tech as they develop it.

 

Remember, the 4k was a 1080p input scaled to 4k when first released but now they deveped the software to push 1440p to 4k.  This seems to be a good sign on the part of the customer and they have been very active developing their software although they needed to.

 

Personally, I can't wait but I will also be upgrading my PC at the same time the headset comes in. It would be nice to see BoX become multi threaded in the mean time to remove CPU bottleneck in rendering.

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The Chinese who are building the Pimax are probably short-sighted, like the large majority of Chinese are unfortunately these days, and dear Lord I hope they got some good testers with proper vision - because the worst case would mean that they just don't know what the heck they're actually doing.

 

 

 

1) That's racist

 

2) Virtually every electronic device you've owned in the last 20 years was made in China.

 

3) The rest of that post isn't any better. Whether one wears glasses or not has zero impact on depth perception if the lenses are correct.

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No idea if the supposed vision problems of Asians are real or not, but at least PiMax has made it so that you wear their headset with glasses on comfortably, and you can get custom made lenses that stay in place with magnets. They got that right, I'm amazed Oculus just ignored the issue. Don't they know they are selling to middle-aged men with less than perfect vision?!

 

My custom-made lenses in the OR don't stay in place too well in hot Echo Arena sessions.

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No idea if the supposed vision problems of Asians are real or not, but at least PiMax has made it so that you wear their headset with glasses on comfortably, and you can get custom made lenses that stay in place with magnets. They got that right, I'm amazed Oculus just ignored the issue. Don't they know they are selling to middle-aged men with less than perfect vision?!

 

My custom-made lenses in the OR don't stay in place too well in hot Echo Arena sessions.

Fitting my glasses is enough reason to buy it alone.

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@dburne most people don't understand that a screenshot of a rendering meant for 200 fov must be looked at through a device meant for 200 fov to look normal. Which a phone or a monitor aren't, unles you put your eye ridiculously close to the screen.

 

There are legitimate concerns gpu power needed to render these images, support in openvr and poorly coded games that assume 110 fov, but that's something time will solve. Or not. VR may yet fail, but that's nothing specific to pimax.

 

@cptjacksparrow I'd love that, but I won't be able to do that the next 4 weeks due to a broken wrist.

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  • 2 weeks later...

As has been stated, good luck trying to drive a headset with a resolution larger than a VIVE or RIFT. You'll need a PC with multiple flagship GPUs, water cooling and a seriously overclocked flagship CPU. There's a reason my HTC and OCULUS set the current res where it is. They could have gone higher but few if anyone would be able to run the headset. I'd buy a higher res headset overnight if I thought I could run it but the new £7000 pc (minimum) would stop me.

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SvAF/F16_radek

 

As has been stated, good luck trying to drive a headset with a resolution larger than a VIVE or RIFT. You'll need a PC with multiple flagship GPUs, water cooling and a seriously overclocked flagship CPU. There's a reason my HTC and OCULUS set the current res where it is. They could have gone higher but few if anyone would be able to run the headset. I'd buy a higher res headset overnight if I thought I could run it but the new £7000 pc (minimum) would stop me.

Many of us are already running a fair bit of supersampling with far less than a £7000 PC. If your gpu is a 980 or better you should give it a try with your Vive and Rift :) Even without water cooled Sli and all them fancy bits and pieces.

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SCG_Fenris_Wolf

1) That's racist

 

2) Virtually every electronic device you've owned in the last 20 years was made in China.

 

3) The rest of that post isn't any better. Whether one wears glasses or not has zero impact on depth perception if the lenses are correct.

You're calling my words racist? Ridiculous, but typical for the politically-correct culture that has infested the anglo-american sphere. That said, don't bring your politics in here and go around calling other people racist, that's a red-line when you will start getting reported. That goes for you, race-baiting BeastyBaiter, and for WISredcoat22 and his charming wishes to my family.

 

Facts cannot be racist, the Chinese have a real problem nationwide with extremely wide-ranged short-sightedness for academic young men and women, that I've been told by Chinese friends of mine. I am organizing accommodations voluntarily free time for exchange students and help them with papers. Such a racist thing to do, especially if my wife isn't even German. At the same time the Chinese are hellbound on solving these issues even on a political level, with various supportive state-programs in certain districts and cities for eye-school, surgery, recommendations on how and how long to rest your eyes during and after work, and so on.

 

Your point 2) isn't even any better either. It's not even an argument. It's true. That it's only true because of REMs being withhold by the Chinese intentionally for decades is for another discussion however. You can go fight on Wikipedia-forums about whether you are allowed to mention this in recorded history or not (because hurdur, some also claimed this was racist!) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare_Earths_Trade_Dispute  An interesting read by the way.

 

Your point 3) you are wrong. People wearing glasses have naturally worse depth perception than those without, exceptions marking the rule. Taller people are better at basketball, and nature is cruel. We know, an inconvenient fact indeed. If you're wearing contacts, you can circumvent that issue. Since I was into handball for a long while (until busting two laprums in my right shoulder) I was using contacts too, and later got myself lasered. Friendly hint for you.

 

 

On topic: So while you were annoying the heck out of me with that racist-remarks in my direction, the other folks on this forum continued talking about the topic. If we continue there it will be much more interesting. 

 

I am certainly interested on whether the Pimax will lead to a higher perceived pixel density per eye on the version supporting a normal 110° field of view and the high pixel screens. If that will be true, I will also be getting a Pimax. But until they start selling locally through Amazon/local outlets, ordering it would mean that we won't have laws backing us up to return it, in case it is not working correctly.

Edited by 2./JG51_Fenris_Wolf
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333.jpg

 

Click on picture for link

 

To me it seems I have waited for this, I was not entirely impressed by OR and the feeling of it should be something more prevent me from investing in new PC and VR device, might this tip me over?

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To me it seems I have waited for this, I was not entirely impressed by OR and the feeling of it should be something more prevent me from investing in new PC and VR device, might this tip me over?

 

Maybe, but I think a lot remains to be seen especially regarding performance for what we do.

 

I am taking a wait and see on this one, it will be interesting for sure.

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Yes, I understand from DCS they got performance trouble with low resolution OR , but in this game I understand it is more kind of OR restriction and not smoothness in game. Or am I wrong.

I would have been all over OR if it had not been for my panels and old PC , It just another form of immersion sitting in a pit compared to VR. Economical reasons render a mature point of view on the matter, witch left me to think VR should be able to perform better, and it somehow is in its infant stage right now

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Looks like an update next week

 

 

Q: We are in the middle of October(Only 17 days left) and when are we going to have the new prototype and videos of games using this new prototype to be able to evaluate it? 

 

A: Yes, we will show the latest prototype on the 20-24th this month.

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A number of people have tested Pimax 5K and 8K at tech events and have been posting positive reviews and even posting videos.

 

Some of the videos I saw showed no SDE, very impressive resolution and from what I can tell, no god rays.  Also people stated that there was no distortion at the periphery, just increased FOV.  I'm truly getting excited for what looks like an impressive VR headset that eliminates or reduces all of my main issues with Rift or Vive.

 

Videos in this thread.

http://forum.pimaxvr.com/t/videos-of-elite-dangerous-and-arizona-sunshine-running-on-the-8k/3498

 

Good review in this thread (video is in German).

http://forum.pimaxvr.com/t/voodoode-added-his-review-of-pimax-8k-and-5k-in-san-francisco-to-reddit-very-good/3503

 

Translation of pretty much everything he said:
1) He first tested the 5k model with the leap motion module. It is connected with magnets to the headset and comes with its own usb-C connector to connect to the pimax.
2) Minimum spec: GTX 980 according to Robin, the CEO
3) Test laptop was GTX 1080 and ran very smoothly
4) He first tests with the 5k headset. at 4:34 he puts on the 8k
5) Prototype controller was with cable
6) He tested fruit ninja
7) Robin the CEO came across as a very sweet & honest man which gave him a lot of trust in him as a company
8) Next he tested "BigScreen", the virtual desktop. He says everything looked really sharp
9) Colours were really good in the 5k and he saw no ghosting
10) The 8k was (obviously) sharper than the 5k. He says he couldn't see any pixels at all, Extremely sharp image. First time ever he enjoyed a headset without SDE
11) Some people said they found the 8k too dark, he says he disagrees, it wasn't dark at all according to him.
12) Both display's of the 5k and 8k are extremely good he says
13) He really loved the huge FoV, it almost felt like reality he says
14) SteamVR compatability is very good he says. He especially was focusing to see if the saw any stretched image in Fruit Ninja. He says that did not happen. IT was real FoV, not stretching
15) What he and other did see though were 2 vertical "stripes" (bands?). According to Robin this was a software problem.
16) The 2 lenses are really big he says, much bigger than the ones from the Rift.
17) He did not see any godray's
18) Tracking: same as vive he says, only difference he says 360 degrees tracking with just 1 base station. This because the HMD is really wide so they put camera's on it both sides backward and forward so that it has 360 view with just 1 basestation.
19) The Pimax controller was the only thing he didnt really like. He said it felt really cheap. He says he advises people not to buy the whole package, he says to exclude the Pimax controller and buy a Vive controller instead.
20) Leap motion module: comes with usb-C that connects to the pimax directly (so no seperate cable to the computer I understand from him)
21) They asked Robin if the wireless module was compatible with TP-link. He couldnt confirm that yet.
22) He stresses again that everything ran extremely smooth on the GTX 1080. No dropped frames
23) Robin said the headset design itself is final already. Only thing that will change is the head strap
24) Oculus compatibility via Re-vive
25) Weight of the headset was extremely light. It felt like the Rift to him.
26) he really liked the ergonomics. It didnt hurt him anywhere. He said what really was nice was that no light entered from underneath the headset while it still connected very nicely to his head.
27) He didnt notice any warmth/heat while wearing it
28) In conclusion he really really loved the headset and was extremely impressed with it. He does mention again in his conclusion that he would recommend to not buy the controller, although it still was a prototype of course.
29) He says he wasn't the only one who was extremely enthousiast. He said there were 13-15 people there, nobody said he didnt like the headset, everybody was impressed. One guy said he thought the pimax 8k display was too dark, he disagrees. 95% was extremely happy with the pimax he says.
30) Last thing he says the leap motion module was really nice.

Edited by ICDP
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SvAF/F16_radek

Sound promising, for me to good to be true just PR . I don't believe if I don't see it myself.

Still holding my breath so in the same boat. Still early but sounds very promising so far. Any mention of adjustable IPD? Or range of the same?

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Another viewpoint regarding the upcoming Pimax 8k.

 

http://riftdev.com/reality-checking-the-hype-train-on-the-pimax-8k-pc-vr-system/

 

Now I have no idea who to believe on much of this stuff, for me I will continue to enjoy my Rift and keep an eye on this new Pimax device and reports on it after the retail product starts getting into consumer's hands.

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Sound promising, for me to good to be true just PR . I don't believe if I don't see it myself.

 

 

Still holding my breath so in the same boat. Still early but sounds very promising so far. Any mention of adjustable IPD? Or range of the same?

 

The review I linked to is from an independent Youtube VR and game reviewer from Germany.  He is not in any way directly affiliated with Pimax.  The IDP will be adjustable on the final version.

 

 

 

Another viewpoint regarding the upcoming Pimax 8k.

 

http://riftdev.com/reality-checking-the-hype-train-on-the-pimax-8k-pc-vr-system/

 

Now I have no idea who to believe on much of this stuff, for me I will continue to enjoy my Rift and keep an eye on this new Pimax device and reports on it after the retail product starts getting into consumer's hands.

 

dburne, that link is to the rantings of a rift enthusiast who has never even tried a Pimax 8K.  If you want to ensure a fair and balanced view is highlighted, look elsewhere.  I accept the Pimax in it's current guise has issues that need resolved, but even in its current form it is a better HMD for simming than either Rift or Vive.I understand the irony of declaring his musing mostly worthless (after all I have not tried the Pimax 8K myself) but most of his points have been debunked further down the comments.  The fact he only focuses on what he perceives as negatives, while ignoring any positives should be a clue to his agenda.  I at least have listed the negative comments from the review I linked.

Edited by ICDP
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Sound promising, for me to good to be true just PR . I don't believe if I don't see it myself.

 

AFAIK the events are open, so anybody with a negative review could easily make themselves heard.

 

 

Now I have no idea who to believe on much of this stuff

 

One is a review, the other one is a fact sheet analysis by a renown fan of Oculus. His analysis is interesting, but take it with a grain of salt.

 

For example, did you know the arrangement of subpixels is such in the Rift that blue and red subpixels are shared between pixels? This means the 1200 lines are actually only 600 lines if you look only at the non-green components. That sounds worse than it is in practice, though. In these matters, experience is important, you can't just look at numbers.

 

I have fears when it comes to usefulness for IL-2. It will probably require code changes to work with the two non-planar projections of the 8k, and the wider FOV may be more than CPUs can provide at the moment. They are already on their knees with 110 degrees, 200 is almost twice that.

Edited by coconut
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AFAIK the events are open, so anybody with a negative review could easily make themselves heard.

 

 

 

One is a review, the other one is a fact sheet analysis by a renown fan of Oculus. His analysis is interesting, but take it with a grain of salt.

 

For example, did you know the arrangement of subpixels is such in the Rift that blue and red subpixels are shared between pixels? This means the 1200 lines are actually only 600 lines if you look only at the non-green components. That sounds worse than it is in practice, though. In these matters, experience is important, you can't just look at numbers.

 

I have fears when it comes to usefulness for IL-2. It will probably require code changes to work with the two non-planar projections of the 8k, and the wider FOV may be more than CPUs can provide at the moment. They are already on their knees with 110 degrees, 200 is almost twice that.

 

The moment I see a good review based on experience with BOX I will be ordering.. And as long as I can get 60+ fps 

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Recently posted: https://uploadvr.com/pimax-showcases-project-cars-2-arizona-sunshine-elite-dangerous-8k-headset/

 

Three other games filmed in the 8k: Arizona Sunshine, Elite Dangerous and Project Cars 2. Hard to tell how performance will be from a shaky hand-held camera, but one can at least notice that image quality seems OK, lenses look OK, and game support through SteamVR should be OK. No distortions that I could see in the headset, but it's hard to tell with the limited FOV of the camera.

 

From now on I'll refrain from buying stuff on the Oculus Store. If the Oculus SDK does not support the API needed by Pimax 8k (and why should it, Facebook has been annoyingly closed on cross compatibility so far), revive can't properly render Oculus only games.

 

Edit: They'll be doing DCS http://forum.pimaxvr.com/t/digital-combat-simulator/3149/57 . Great! If DCS works fine, so should IL-2 BOS.

Edited by coconut
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Another viewpoint regarding the upcoming Pimax 8k.

 

http://riftdev.com/reality-checking-the-hype-train-on-the-pimax-8k-pc-vr-system/

 

Now I have no idea who to believe on much of this stuff, for me I will continue to enjoy my Rift and keep an eye on this new Pimax device and reports on it after the retail product starts getting into consumer's hands.

 

We couldn't be on a better place to see good reviews than this forum.

 

It is not overcrowded to see too much information, possibly conflicting all the time.

Flight simmers are quite critical towards hardware.

Mostly grown-up people not over-excited children.

Probably some current Rift/Vive owners who will have the Pimax right from the start.

Reviews focusing on this Sim.

 

I'm very much interested to see the reviews.

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AFAIK the events are open, so anybody with a negative review could easily make themselves heard.

 

 

 

One is a review, the other one is a fact sheet analysis by a renown fan of Oculus. His analysis is interesting, but take it with a grain of salt.

 

For example, did you know the arrangement of subpixels is such in the Rift that blue and red subpixels are shared between pixels? This means the 1200 lines are actually only 600 lines if you look only at the non-green components. That sounds worse than it is in practice, though. In these matters, experience is important, you can't just look at numbers.

 

I have fears when it comes to usefulness for IL-2. It will probably require code changes to work with the two non-planar projections of the 8k, and the wider FOV may be more than CPUs can provide at the moment. They are already on their knees with 110 degrees, 200 is almost twice that.

Damn the CPUs, ignore the torpedoes... full speed ahead. i9 CPU. No problem. :biggrin:

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SCG_Fenris_Wolf

So an independent German guy in Germany used and tried the Pimax? I'm absolutely interested. Where is it possible to test this device in Germany ?

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