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IL2 Sturmovik: Battle of Guadacanal/Midway

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I know I had posted this a long time ago, but worth adding again I suppose.

 

Guadalcanal and Stalingrad overlap the same exact time period (give or take a week on each end).

 

F4F, Dauntless, Avenger, Duck, P-39/P400, Hudson, PBY, P-38 (F4U's first showed up at Henderson Field a few weeks after the battles were over)

 

A6M2, A6M2-N, A6M3, GM4, D3A1, B5N2

 

Guadalcanal isn't all just carrier ops either.  Sure there is plenty of water to be found, plenty of land too especially compared to Midway.  It matches the Stalingrad timeframe, has a pretty interesting set of planes and best of all NO SNOW :P

 

Personally Midway would be nice, but there is a much bigger selection of planes for Guadalcanal and land bases for those completely adverse to carrier landings.     

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Working through this old campaign again for the old IL2...  'Cactus Diary'  anyone remember it?

 

post-75-0-26475800-1431329934_thumb.jpg

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Hello

 

Carrier operations were most interesting missions during "old IL2" what I have flown.

But I think that we never see PTO to this sim. Problem is Northop Grumman and

their licence policy.

If we think the old IL2 after Wildcat and Hellcat NG started to demand licence charge

from 1C / Maddox Games.

Thats way after Wildcat and Hellcat we saw a Avenger when Mods came to IL2.

There are more about:

http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/7241-pacific-theater/

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That's why New Guinea works better, you can avoid Grumman license because main aircraft used in the area were P-40s, , Spitfire Vc/trop and eventually also P-47Ds. Bigger problem is that used in huge numbers were also Bell P-39s/P-400s and Lockheed P-38s which apparently also require license. 

Edited by =LD=Hiromachi

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General Motors built also a WildCat and a Avenger for FM1 / FM2 and TBM versions and they could be licence free

but what is NG's reaction to use these planes.

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General Motors built also a WildCat and a Avenger for FM1 / FM2 and TBM versions and they could be licence free

but what is NG's reaction to use these planes.

 

Don't think it works that way, still Grumman planes, just licensed to be built by GM.   

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[Edited] their license policy. I mean really... It's a [Edited] 3D model in a GAME!

Edited by Bearcat
Profanity
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Would be cool, 90% would fly axis, the carrier would be sunk in a hurry.... 

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Fuck their license policy. I mean really... It's a fucking 3D model in a GAME!

With a greedy company, which knows that even after 70 years they still can make money on their products. 

 

 

Would be cool, 90% would fly axis, the carrier would be sunk in a hurry.... 

Never was like that in actual Pacific Fighter, there was always a strong group of allied pilots. You could always find someone flying Hellcat, Corsair, P-38 or Wildcat. Those were iconic warbirds and people just wanted to fly them :)

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Yeah, Northrop Grumman are greedy. I bet Roy Grumman wouldn't mind using his aircraft in a sim. Grumman had signature aircraft in the pacific, welp if this gonna be a problem, I would be okay with Med battles, agreed on the S.M. 79 "Sparrowhawk" and maybe JU-88s and Stukas? Not really a bomber pilot but StG can be fine, question: did the Spitfires during 1942-3 had carbuetors?

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Working through this old campaign again for the old IL2...  'Cactus Diary'  anyone remember it?

 

attachicon.gif2_cdflyer.jpg

One of my favorite campaigns.

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Early Sino-Japanese, CBI, New Guinea Pacific yes please! Dollars hanging lose for pre-order here. If we ever get that lucky.

 

JF

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I don't think the Grumman issue is gonna be as big of a deal as we are making it out to be. They were pissed at two game companies who didn't do their due dilligence and have any kind of an agreement to use their images/names. Both tried to tell Grumman, "tough nuts," and got spanked in the process. The original Il2 used the Grumman name without permission and another used an aircraft image prominently on their packaging after Northrop Grumman specifically told them not to.

 

I don't think the 3d model is as much of an issue as it is about how the Grumman name is used in the marketing side of things. They do have an absolute right to control that aspect of it. I'd protect my name as well. I'm sure a reasonable agreement will be worked out or a solution found. While it is a delicate matter after those last fiascos it is not insurmountable.

 

Doesn't Jason come from a law background in gaming before he got into development as well?

 

Out of curiosity I just checked Squadron Shop for Hellcat models. There seems to be no shortage of them available. It is interesting to note, all but one use the F6F designation but do not have Grumman on the box art. WarThunder, XPlane and FSX all have F6F's.

 

Like I said, I think there will be an agreement. I'm sure it is an issue and there will be negotiations/due dilligence but we're gonna have Grumman products in the game. I have confidence in the team to do it right.

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Well if we can't fly 'em I can always take the 16' Grumman I have sitting in the back yard down to the lake and pretend, although the other fishermen might be puzzled by my fancy hat with reflectors on it, it's the lastest in fish finding technology, i swear!

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Would be cool, 90% would fly axis, the carrier would be sunk in a hurry.... 

 

 

In Pacific Fighters and beyond in the original IL2, the Luftwaffe pilots mostly flew the American late war planes. 

 

Remember, it's not that it's about being German, it's about picking the ride that will net you the most points in an non historical online environment that masks any real world deficiencies that  the Bf 109 and FW 190 had in service, such as dwindling numbers of experienced pilots, low fuel supplies, poor build quality of late war aircraft, etc...

Edited by BlitzPig_EL
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In Pacific Fighters and beyond in the original IL2, the Luftwaffe pilots mostly flew the American late war planes.

 

Remember, it's not that it's about being German, it's about picking the ride that will net you the most points in an non historical online environment that masks any real world deficiencies that the Bf 109 and FW 190 had in service, such as dwindling numbers of experienced pilots, low fuel supplies, poor build quality of late war aircraft, etc...

No, every bit of it is about being German. It's about the Luftwaffe, its successes and its failures, its technical achievements and logistical blunders, Staffeln history and comradery, the foundation in violation to the Treaty of Versailles and the larger-than-life "personalities" that it fostered (See account picture...).

 

On the other hand, I would fly American in the Pacific Theatre. Just like I have no personal interest in the Yak, I have none for the Zero... Now the P-38 on the other hand... Gimme, gimme.

Edited by 4./JG26_Adler

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On the other hand, I would fly American in the Pacific Theatre. Just like I have no personal interest in the Yak, I have none for the Zero...

What about Ki-61 ? Sort of Japanese 109 E-7, with a bit lower rate of climb but higher top speed, greater range and with better turn radius. 

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What about Ki-61 ? Sort of Japanese 109 E-7, with a bit lower rate of climb but higher top speed, greater range and with better turn radius. 

I'm not sure about this "Better turn radius" as the emil actually has a very low stall speed of 75 mph IAS clean, what's the Ki 61's stall speed?

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Indeed, but that is for the Bf 109 E-3 captured November 1939 and tested in Britain in 1940.
http://kurfurst.org/Tactical_trials/109E_UKtrials/Morgan.html
It had weight of 5580 lb ( 2531 kg - about 80 kg below the specs) at the time of the test. And you quoted what pilot saw on his instruments, not the actual stall speed which in section Indicated Airspeed V (from trailing static) which as you can see is about 20 mph higher - that is an actual stall speed of an aircraft. It can be taken as CAS and be accurate enough as-is for the engineer's tolerances.

So you are correct for the 1939 109 E-3. 

 

Besides, other document gives 81 mph - http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/me109/me109e-aaee.pdf

 

But anyway, I referred to 109 E-7. Even later E-3 or E-4 was heavier, partially due to application of the armor ( two 8 mm thick bolt on armor plates and head protection plate of about 13 kg and a back plate of 25 kilograms) and at least some of the 109's sice July 1940 were equipped with bulletproof glass.

 

I have only data for Ki-61-I with four fuel tanks which gives 84-87 mph clean /power off and 81-84 mph clean power on at the weight of 3200 kg. Although the 4th fuel tank was rarely used, after all there was no need to carry 750 liters of fuel internally when one had to intercept or provide a cover. Back at Wewak pilots just removed it and eventually in that place was mounted armored plate protecting radiator.

 

But anyway, there is more than just stall to take into account with turn, for example very important is power. Ki-61 had more optimized airfoil for maneuvers with high aspect ratio. According to Takeo Doi, in his book "飛行機設計50年の回想" in July 1942 a series of comparative tests began at Hiko Jikkenbu in Fussa and Kogiken in Tachikawa. The fly-off involved the Ki-61-I, three Bf-109 E-7's and a captured US Curtiss P-40E. In tests there were also involved Ki-43-II and Ki-44-II. Kawasaki fighter received top marks during the tests. Compared to the Bf-109 E-7, it demonstrated better maneuverability (shorter turn radius), higher top speed and a greater range. In terms of top speed and rate of climb Ki-61 was only beaten by the Ki-44-II and in maneuverability by Ki-43-II. 

 

 

I also found an interesting material from 1940 presenting landings and take-offs in slow motion on USS Enterprise :

https://archive.org/details/NPC-3270

 

Landing on aircraft carrier was really not an easy thing !

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What about Ki-61 ? Sort of Japanese 109 E-7, with a bit lower rate of climb but higher top speed, greater range and with better turn radius. 

 

To be honest, I don't care about similarities. I have no interest in Imperial Japan's history, wartime nor otherwise.

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I personally would want it to stay in Europe. I can mostly relate to the eastern front, but anywere in Europe/Africa would be fine. .

Right in the last days of the war the red army reache the village I live in.

The castle in our village should have been bombed by the VVS but they didn't find it and attacked the wrong village. 

 

I just cannot relate to the Pacific at all

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In Pacific Fighters and beyond in the original IL2, the Luftwaffe pilots mostly flew the American late war planes. 

 

Remember, it's not that it's about being German, it's about picking the ride that will net you the most points in an non historical online environment that masks any real world deficiencies that  the Bf 109 and FW 190 had in service, such as dwindling numbers of experienced pilots, low fuel supplies, poor build quality of late war aircraft, etc...

Blitz, you often take us down this gamer route loosely disguised as politics. Can we stay, more or less, on topic? It's wish list. 

 

There are cat people and dog people. Just because some like cats doesn't mean they are anti-dog or only interested in cat points. I like both cats and dogs in the Pacific. I like cats in the East. Wait, what..............?

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Blitz, you often take us down this gamer route loosely disguised as politics. Can we stay, more or less, on topic? It's wish list. 

 

There are cat people and dog people. Just because some like cats doesn't mean they are anti-dog or only interested in cat points. I like both cats and dogs in the Pacific. I like cats in the East. Wait, what..............?

 

Something about a Shiba Inu.

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Working through this old campaign again for the old IL2...  'Cactus Diary'  anyone remember it?

 

attachicon.gif2_cdflyer.jpg

Yes, I flew it less than one year ago

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What ever comes after BOM if anything IMO needs to be based on what will attract the most amount of people. I.e PTO might be cool for Americans, Australia's and Japanese but small envolvment from UK and none from most European contries.

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UK

There were plenty of British pilots involved in Burma. Some were also involved in air defense of Australia and later on in New Guinea campaign, they even used Spitfire V there.

 

 

 

most European contries.

Well, that is correct. Not many European countries had there colonies. Most important from those smaller forces would be Dutch. KNIL operated P-40s, CW-21s and few other types of aircraft.

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KNIL planes: :cool:

-Brewster Buffalo

-CW-21 / 22

-Hawk 75 (P-36)

-Lockheed 212

-DC-3

-Do 24

-Catalina

-B-10

-Grumman Goose

-FK 51

-Ryan STM

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I don't mean to make this overly personal but I'm confused. You were offended by my tongue in cheek reference to the kamikaze but then post a video about them? I didn't respond then but now it seems a bit odd?!

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I'm not fan of them but to say that I was offended is exaggeration, I just said it is a delicate matter - because it is. But that does not mean they did not exist. All I wanted to present some mission variation from the old Il-2.

Weather that would be with Okha or with radio controlled flying bomb I-go :

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For early '42: Borneo, Singapore and Java campaigns

 

brewster%20NEI_zpsi8amfdww.png

 

boat_kxiv_x35_zpsmueof5sb.jpg

 

 

Ryan%20trainers%20NEI_zpsoso308bs.jpg

 

Also: I have a number of books on the campaign in the Dutch east Indies (mostly in Dutch). This one also (English). Nice reading material.

 

NEI%20navy_zpsukunnkfr.jpg

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Lets try with a smaller pond first :

 

Mediterranean or Channel ;)

Agreed, We already had Pacific Theatre in Pacific fighters.

Something new = Italy? , Western Desert? or European theatre IE France.?

Edited by voncrapenhauser

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Agreed, We already had Pacific Theatre in Pacific fighters.

Something new = Italy? , Western Desert? or European theatre IE France.?

and by that logic, we already had all those other settings in other flight sims as well.

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and by that logic, we already had all those other settings in other flight sims as well.

How about Space?? I can't wait to fly my Asgard mother ship  ;)

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Sorry for late replies, been at school and such. Just checking in. 

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I want to say only one thing: when I read this thread, I'm resting. Resting from russian forum, where 80% do not know anything about CBI, Pacific and MTO but say that these theaters of war are unknown and uninteresting. :\

 

F4U-1 from VMF-124 and 213, A-36A and P-51A from "Air Commandos", Ki-43, Ki-44, B6N and many others, this is my dream. Naive dream. :Р

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Exactly. 

 

And from the nicer things, there is a youtube channel with some original records of various Japanese Army aircraft :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_vj7tcDqw8&feature=youtu.be

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYRcZ5nYnz0&feature=youtu.be

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CyqOhImtKw

 

Thought this might be interesting, especially considering that there are no flying examples of Tony or Frank :(

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Exactly. 

 

And from the nicer things, there is a youtube channel with some original records of various Japanese Army aircraft :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_vj7tcDqw8&feature=youtu.be

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYRcZ5nYnz0&feature=youtu.be

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CyqOhImtKw

 

Thought this might be interesting, especially considering that there are no flying examples of Tony or Frank :(

 

 

You can always find Luftwaffe USAF and RAF guncam footage but I don't think I've ever seem Japanese Airforce guncam...is there any out there?

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