CHANGES TO THE 109E-7'S AND 109F'S FOR NEXT PATCH.

[ATAG_Pattle]

A number of changes will be incorporated in the next patch which should be released next week.

---

Overhead Pilot armour

 

The 109E-7's and 109F's had overhead pilot armour installed at the factory.

 

Some pilots removed this, leaving the back seat and headrest armor. These were mostly the 'Experten', or Schwarm/Staffel/Gruppe Leaders who had to be able to see around and make decisions. Most Nachwuchs or Average pilots left it.

 

We are unable currently to allow the player the option to keep or remove the armour... the code needs a re-write. We were going to leave the armour in place until we did the re-write, but its clear the majority of the players want the armour removed.

 

So we are removing from all E-7's and all 109F's. As mentioned, in the future we will re-write the code to allow the player the choice.

----

Auto Radiators on 109F's

 

It has become clear the 109F's were significantly down in performance over what they should be.

 

The 109F's are the first aircraft in the game with automatic radiators and it looks like the code for this, (left over from the original developers) is not completely accurate.

 

The radiators open too soon, before they need to, and stay open longer than they need to. This creates additional drag and affects top speed on the 109F's

 

We have adjusted a number of elements on the radiators to reduce the early opening effects.

 

This reduces the excess drag effects and brings up the speed to historical levels.

 

These changes will not affect the climb rate significantly.

---

109F Propellers

 

The 109F props, the VDM 9-11207 for the F-1/F-2 and VDM 9-12010 for the F-4 had their drag a little high, this has been lowered improving the overall Lift/Drag ratio on the props. This has also helped with the speed.

---

Overheat

 

The 109F-4's have had their overheat schedule redone... this means they will not overheat as fast, especially at low speed. This will allow the players to use full power longer in a climb.

[=FEW=Hauggy]

I do hope that this will also make the pilot more vulnerable.

Can't wait for some cool multiplayer missions to be created the default servers are kinda boring atm.

 

[ATAG_Pattle]

Hi Haugy, Yes it will and they are coming.

[Yardstick]

Good news.  I've been flying the E-4 in preference to the E-7 or any of the Fs due to the overheating issues and a perceived lack of performance.  Good to hear it wasn't just my imagination. 

 

Curiously, I find the armour plate much more restrictive in terms of rearwards view than it is in GB.  There it limits the rear view but in Blitz it completely blocks it to the extent that there's no point checking your six.   

[Barnacles]

@ATAG_Pattle

Speaking of rear visibility.

What's the reasoning behind allowing the pilot's head to be rotated 180 degrees in the Spitfire and 109s, but restricting it to 150 degrees in the Tomahawk and Warhawk (and others)?

T

[Barnacles]

Here's a shot trying to look behind be in a Tomahawk.

The canopy is open but because the head movement is so restricted this is the best I can do.

Is it possible to let the head be moved over to one side and rotated a bit more?

 

In fact the area in which you can move your head is less restricted if the canopy is closed!

Has there been a mix up in the modelling?

 

 

[danperin]

17 hours ago, =FEW=Hauggy said:

I do hope that this will also make the pilot more vulnerable.

Can't wait for some cool multiplayer missions to be created the default servers are kinda boring atm.

 

 

Take a look here, mate!

 

 

[69thSpiritus]

@71st_AH_Barnacles

 

This is being looked at. 

[dazako]

4 hours ago, 69thSpiritus said:

@71st_AH_Barnacles

 

This is being looked at. 

 

Same goes for the Gladiator, which is an excellent model but very difficult to see out of. It's not only head turning restriction, both lateral and forward / backward movement are limited making seeing around frames / struts etc very difficult.

Not a TF complaint as overall there's always been disparity in 'freedom of movement' across aircraft from stock to imported. Trackir was still a new ability back in 2011. Fighters have the full ' Linda Blair' turn, a wide lateral 'lean out' and 'lean to/fro' while the Blenheim for eg has little movement in all axes, with certain controls un-viewable. 

I appreciate there's a compromise in depth of field / peripheral vision. Some fly in a 'zoomed out' mode but I don't like the fish eye effect. I've no VR experience and can only assume there are no such restictions ?

 

Daz

Edited August 11, 2020 by dazako

[Trooper117]

1 hour ago, 69thSpiritus said:

@71st_AH_Barnacles

 

This is being looked at. 

 

Good news, many thanks!

[Wolfstriked]

First off I am deeply immersed into Tobruk and wanna thank you guys for making me buy a whole bunch of Virpil products LOL.

 

This sim has some simple QOL things that I just find so warming to my heart after years of flying other sims.First is trim that works so well and is so intuitive in feel where I can actually trim a plane out for level flight.DCS as example of bad trim has it so that no matter how small you tweak the movement of trim wheel per button press the plane is either climbing or diving slightly.Second is the old IL2 way of zoom with 30/70/90 degrees with 3 button presses.Simple yes but in terms of immersion for me its huge! That said if possible a way to change that function to 2 presses with one zoom in and one zoom out but tied to the 30/70/90 zoom levels.

 

Some things I noticed in my super quick evaluation runs.

 

First is when you press move to gunsight button your restricted to what feels like 90deg to each side. I wanna fly all the time in some planes with head close to gunsight but find the restricted views force me to move away from gunsight to dogfight and just look around.Design choice?

 

Second is IMO some of the more extreme head shake effects are just a tad overdone.Like firing the gun pods on some planes makes the whole plane move too violently where I always feel if this was toned down a wee bit it would feel better.

[Barnacles]

1 hour ago, Wolfstriked said:

 

 

First is when you press move to gunsight button your restricted to what feels like 90deg to each side. I wanna fly all the time in some planes with head close to gunsight but find the restricted views force me to move away from gunsight to dogfight and just look around.Design choice?

 

 

I would definitely second having the shift F1 lean to gunsight view a bit less restricted. What I'd also like to see changed with that feature, is the short animation when you select it. With a head tracker it doesn't really make sense. to have your view snapped right ahead and locked there for half a second whilst the view moves forward, only for it to instantly jerk away back to the direction your head tracker is pointing.

[Hawk-2a]

7 hours ago, 71st_AH_Barnacles said:

I would definitely second having the shift F1 lean to gunsight view a bit less restricted. What I'd also like to see changed with that feature, is the short animation when you select it. With a head tracker it doesn't really make sense. to have your view snapped right ahead and locked there for half a second whilst the view moves forward, only for it to instantly jerk away back to the direction your head tracker is pointing.

^^ this.

additionally, i‘d like to be able to get into the same spot on the gunsight like with „lean to gunsight“ but without having to press the button. Atm we kind of hit an „invisible wall“ when trying to move the head towards the sight. We cannot get as close as with the leaning function, which is weird when using any headtracking.

 

take BoX for example, i can lean very far in towards the gunsight and generally have more „space“ to move around in the cockpit.

[Wolfstriked]

Maybe have a new option only in planes with offset gunsights where the view just shifts to center the reticule but view behaves the same for trackir functionality.

[JG-1_Ludwig]

Quote

I do hope that this will also make the pilot more vulnerable.

Can't wait for some cool multiplayer missions to be created the default servers are kinda boring atm.

 

Quote

Hi Haugy, Yes it will and they are coming.

 

Not wanting to be a jerk but if the armor is removed, will the airframe be lighter for the loss of the weight?

 

[easterling77]

20 hours ago, 71st_AH_Barnacles said:

Here's a shot trying to look behind be in a Tomahawk.

The canopy is open but because the head movement is so restricted this is the best I can do.

Is it possible to let the head be moved over to one side and rotated a bit more?

 

In fact the area in which you can move your head is less restricted if the canopy is closed!

Has there been a mix up in the modelling?

 

 

yup i noticed that i could't look at the wing fuel gauge in fornt of the Pilot seat. I barely made it to the most upper edge of the gauge

[ATAG_Pattle]

Head movement improvements will be in the next update ?

[easterling77]

8 minutes ago, ATAG_Pattle said:

Head movement improvements will be in the next update ?

Thx a lot

 

It was only a report, the sim is allready great and with some little adjustements like this....it makes it even more a joy to fly

[I/JG54_chuishan]

15 minutes ago, ATAG_Pattle said:

Head movement improvements will be in the next update ?

 

Reaaally glad to hear that Pattle! 

 

But when you say 'improvement', what feature will be improved?

 

Does it mean that we can have more freedom in moving our head in cockpit? Can we lean to the gunsight without pressing that key bind?

Edited August 12, 2020 by I/JG54_chuishan

[Sokol1]

On 8/11/2020 at 6:45 AM, 71st_AH_Barnacles said:

 

Here's a shot trying to look behind be in a Tomahawk.

 

"Sum Ti wong!"

 

What I achieve with canopy open in Hurricane, that have poor rear vision than Tomahawk, and this just using joystick POV HAT + JoyTokey, not TrackIR "perks".

 

 

Edited August 12, 2020 by Sokol1

[Buzzsaw]

16 hours ago, LarryLudwig said:

 

 

Not wanting to be a jerk but if the armor is removed, will the airframe be lighter for the loss of the weight?

 

Yes.

[I/JG54_chuishan]

@Buzzsaw Just installed the updating patch, having issue in MG151's sound effect. In external view I can hear the cannon firing, but in cockpit I can only hear machine guns.

 

Edit: I notice all the cannons suffer from a serious sound volume reduction. 

Edited August 13, 2020 by I/JG54_chuishan

[Dirtbag_Jim]

On 8/12/2020 at 3:32 PM, ATAG_Pattle said:

Head movement improvements will be in the next update ?

 

Great to hear this!

 

If head movement in the Tomahawk's are being improved, I was wondering if head movement in the Martlet's might be improved as well?

It also has the same issue of very limited head turn range (can only look directly to the sides at most), so you can't turn around and look up to check your high six, and even with open canopy you can't turn around to check your six. Will be an especially big disadvantage compared to 109's with their newly removed head armor.

 

On a side note: been really appreciating how on the ball TFS is with listening to player feedback and actually quickly implementing changes/fixes/improvements! Honestly stellar work.

[9./JG52_J-HAT]

Thanks for the patches so far. Keep them coming!

 

Regarding the 109E-7 specifically, I posted a couple of points under the bug reporting thread a while ago. Just making sure it hasn't gone unseen.

From what I recall, it was the animation of the toe brakes missing and the bombs arming panel behind the control stick not being clickable. From what I saw it is still like this after the latest patch.