Variety of enemy planes met in careers.

[Cleo9]

4 hours ago, Sybreed said:

Planes I have never seen in career mode:

 

Macchi 202

Ju52

Ju88

P38

P51

 

Not sure if I've seen all the yaks in game.

 

I'm sure there are more that I'm forgetting. 

 

Has anyone seen Me262s?

 

Would it be hard to program their appearance? Feels a bit weird to not utilize these assets. 

 

Now that you are mentioning it, I don't remember seeing P51s or P38s... But I only completed 2 very short German careers in BoBP (I only played the final chapter of each, just 20 missions per career). 

 

I do remember seeing 262s (I even shot one down with a Tempests, that was cool)

Edited June 5, 2020 by Cleo9

[MarderIV]

9 hours ago, Avimimus said:

Do you know what happened to the scripted missions when they rebuilt the career mode?

 

I'm not so certain. I never bothered to try the packaged stuff in the Missions tab so I don't know if they were placed there.

 

I didn't miss much of it though. The scripted campaigns provided more value to me.

[Yogiflight]

5 hours ago, MarderIV said:

14 hours ago, Avimimus said:

Do you know what happened to the scripted missions when they rebuilt the career mode?

 

I'm not so certain. I never bothered to try the packaged stuff in the Missions tab so I don't know if they were placed there.

 

I didn't miss much of it though. The scripted campaigns provided more value to me.

I think Avimimus was talking about the scripted missions, which were part of the old campaign mode. You had to play them to be able to go on with the campaign.

[MarderIV]

3 hours ago, Yogiflight said:

I think Avimimus was talking about the scripted missions, which were part of the old campaign mode. You had to play them to be able to go on with the campaign.

 

Yeah that's right. I never tried to see if they were moved elsewhere is what I meant. 

[Yogiflight]

12 minutes ago, MarderIV said:

 

Yeah that's right. I never tried to see if they were moved elsewhere is what I meant. 

I think they were simply removed like one or two mission types as well. Maybe they didn't fit to the concept anymore.

[=CFC=Conky]

I've been playing the BoK camping on the Russian side. So far I've encountered 109's, 190's, Stukas and HS-129's. 

 

The weird thing is, the 109's (G-4), are always equipped with the 20mm gun pods. Was this normal in that theatre?

 

 

[2/JG26_rudidlo]

On 6/3/2020 at 6:00 PM, I./JG52_Woutwocampe said:

Bump.

 

As any of you ever seen a U-2 in a career? Wether you are flying russian (any other plane than a U-2) or german.

 

I really wish there will be a patch in the future to fix some issues about variety.

I've created and IronMan Career in BOS. I flew two hours with my leader, where I was shot down by enemy AAA. It was last time I was flying on hard difficulty.

[jeanba]

On 6/4/2020 at 11:40 PM, Sybreed said:

Planes I have never seen in career mode:

 

Macchi 202

 

I met some recently in a sept 42 9th GAP campaign (over Stalingrad)

Which is not historical

[Ram399]

On 6/4/2020 at 11:55 AM, I./JG52_Woutwocampe said:

Btw has anyone ever seen an AI flown La5FN in a Kuban career?

As of yet I have not seen an AI flown La5FN, though if I'm not mistaken there is only one unit equipped with them by the end of the career and they are somewhat far from the front which makes their appearance probably unlikely, I have encountered the standard La-5 ser. 8s on a semi regular basis though- primarily around the middle of the front in the airspace of the 3rd GIAP and 293rd IAP out of Abinskaya.

Oddly enough however, I have seen Yak-9s over Novorossiysk fairly recently, so those seem to have been implemented- though this raises some questions as at the time I encountered them the in game date was June 12, 1943 and no Soviet squadrons on the map appeared to be equipped with the Yak-9.

On a somewhat unrelated note/rant, the career treats the Ju-87 Stuka as a bomber along the same lines as the Ju-88 and He-111.
While this seems like it would be relatively fine, the end result is that Stukas are often dispatched to bomb facilities and other primarily static targets far behind enemy lines often with heavy flak defenses- missions which, while not without historical precedent, would be far more suited to higher altitude level bombing craft. 
This issue is compounded by the fact that when you are assigned to escort a bomber flight to a given target as a fighter, the game determines which bomber you will be escorting based only off of the proximity of the nearest bomber squadron. 
As a result of this system I haven't escorted a Ju-88 or an He-111 since Moscow, and in Kuban escorting Stukas far behind the lines through a swarm of hostile fighters and flak guns so they can bomb a supply depot is difficult to say the least, theres little I can do but watch as the flight I'm supposed to be protecting is completely thrashed by AA.

I can't help but feel the Stuka would fare better if the game treated it more as an attack aircraft rather than a bomber, and it was only sent to attack front line positions or supply convoys rather than 40 kilometers into the backlines to hit a factory facility.
Plus, assuming the Stukas manage to actually reach the target, generally only 3 or 4 planes actually drop their bombs (and they don't even go into a steep Stuka style dive to do it) while the rest just fly past harmlessly.
I've never personally flown a Stuka career so it might be somewhat different when the player is involved, but I can't help but groan every time I have to escort them in a Bf-109- which is every single time I receive an escort bombers mission.

This might be just me lol, but has anyone else noticed the general ineptitude of AI Stukas?

Pic related: a flight of Stukas trying to bomb Gelendzhik

Spoiler

 

Edited June 9, 2020 by Ram399

[LukeFF]

@Ram399, next time you see this odd behavior from Ju 87s, please copy the _gen mission files from /data/missions and post it in the Technicial Issues section of the forum. That's the best way for the guys to see where there may be a problem.

[oc2209]

I'd like to see something besides Tempests flying cover for P-47s as well. I've put about 60 sorties into Bodenplatte German careers.

 

The Tempest is a tough opponent, but in a 109K I can out turn it--only with emergency power on. Because of the difficulty in catching them, I don't shoot down nearly as many as I do of P-47s, which are about as difficult to track and hit as the Spruce Goose. A Spitfire or Mustang would be even more difficult to catch than a Tempest, so if I faced them often (or, at all), it'd drastically reduce my kill-per-sortie average.

[I./JG52_Woutwocampe]

Has anyone flying allies in the Bodenplatte career ever fought a Dora?

[Wolfpack345]

17 minutes ago, I./JG52_Woutwocampe said:

Has anyone flying allies in the Bodenplatte career ever fought a Dora?

I come across them quite frequently. 

[Alexmarine]

On 6/4/2020 at 5:55 PM, I./JG52_Woutwocampe said:

 

Btw has anyone ever seen an AI flown La5FN in a Kuban career?

 

Historically they shouldn't be there. Probably they are scripted like the Focke Wulf unit in Stalingrad: only if the players join that unit they will appear.

[SamVimes]

15 hours ago, I./JG52_Woutwocampe said:

Has anyone flying allies in the Bodenplatte career ever fought a Dora?

 

Yes, I have fought many in my P-51 career along with quite a few 262's.

[twilson37]

I think just as big a problem with Bodenplatte is not just seeing the same aircraft over and over again but seeing the same number of enemy aircraft over and over again.  I have flown the exact same mission 5 times in a row. Provide fighter cover over Njimegen and encountered the same number of A-8s coming from the same direction each time.  

[I./JG52_Woutwocampe]

19 hours ago, Wolfpack345 said:

I come across them quite frequently. 

 

4 hours ago, SamVimes said:

 

Yes, I have fought many in my P-51 career along with quite a few 262's.

 

Great to hear, but in my P-38 career I'm in late 44 (December I think) and I have yet to see one...at least Im starting to see G14s and Ks lately, for a while it was A8 non stop. 

[Bremspropeller]

Has anybody met Damon yet?

 

 

2 hours ago, twilson37 said:

Provide fighter cover over Njimegen and encountered the same number of A-8s coming from the same direction each time.

 

Must be Groundhog Day over at OKL then...

[Dutchvdm]

On 5/14/2020 at 9:35 PM, MarcoPegase44 said:

Hello,

On Stalingrad, we do not see the He 111 and Ju 88 and very rarely the Bf110. By conyre I meet them on Kuban. In fact their squadrons are based very far from the front in BOS like the JU 52 also.
 

 

Hi guys,

 

For the first time since (I think ever) i'm flying a soviet fighter career during the Stalingrad campaign and i like the fact that i get a lot of bomber intercepts, but i think it's unfortunate that those all groups with Ju-87's. I believe @LukeFF mentioned that the generator chosen the squadrons closest to you. But for Stalingrad and Kuban this is not ideal because the He-111 and Ju-88 unit's are all the way on the other end of the map. 

 

Would it be possible to change this behavior somehow? 

 

Grt M

[I./JG52_Woutwocampe]

After one year ; same problem, different planes

 

-since the Hurricane was added to BOM, its the only russian fighter I ever encounter. As enemy or friendly.

 

-its not true that the mustang never spawns in BoBP. Just go south and you'll see plenty. I mean plenty.

 

-Have yet to see a single Mark XIV. For that matter, I havent seen a Mark IX since forever.

 

-overall in a year the situation has improved related to variety. But theres more work to be done.

[Avimimus]

On 5/13/2020 at 3:28 PM, Jonttu1 said:

You're not supposed to see LaGG-3s in Moscow since the variant in game is a Post-Moscow production.

 

Wait! Does this mean we need an early LaGG? ?

[PatrickAWlson]

1 hour ago, Avimimus said:

 

Wait! Does this mean we need an early LaGG? ?

 

Just like the Stuka, I use the one that we have.  I do not see the current LaGG as a better plane than the MiG 3 so it's not like I'm dropping something in that is completely unbelievable performance-wise.  Even in a 110 a German pilot is competitive and in a 109 F2 or F4 the LaGG is not a problem at all.

 

But yes, A nice early war package would be really great.  Ju-87B.  Early LaGG.  Early Yak.  I-153.  Would be nice.  Until we have them I am willing to bend reality just a bit.

 

But let's say bending reality is an unacceptable design choice.  From what I have heard the in game career uses a "closest" algorithm.  If this is true then of course you are going to see the same thing over and over.  Substituting "closest" with "in range" and then randomly selecting from units in range would solve the problem to the extent that the plane set allows.

[Sybreed]

3 hours ago, PatrickAWlson said:

 

Just like the Stuka, I use the one that we have.  I do not see the current LaGG as a better plane than the MiG 3 so it's not like I'm dropping something in that is completely unbelievable performance-wise.  Even in a 110 a German pilot is competitive and in a 109 F2 or F4 the LaGG is not a problem at all.

 

But yes, A nice early war package would be really great.  Ju-87B.  Early LaGG.  Early Yak.  I-153.  Would be nice.  Until we have them I am willing to bend reality just a bit.

 

But let's say bending reality is an unacceptable design choice.  From what I have heard the in game career uses a "closest" algorithm.  If this is true then of course you are going to see the same thing over and over.  Substituting "closest" with "in range" and then randomly selecting from units in range would solve the problem to the extent that the plane set allows.

 

@Jason_Williams sorry to tag you but could pat's suggestion be done in career mode?

 

It would make a bigger use of the sim's assets,  everybody wins!

Edited August 28, 2021 by Sybreed

[LukeFF]

15 minutes ago, Sybreed said:

 

@Jason_Williams sorry to tag you but could pat's suggestion be done in career mode?

 

It would make a bigger use of the sim's assets,  everybody wins!

 

I'll step in here and say that's just not going to happen.  The LaGG-3, Yaks, and Ju 87 we have are clearly 1942 planes with performance and weapon characteristics that are entirely out of place for 1941. 

[Sybreed]

1 hour ago, LukeFF said:

 

I'll step in here and say that's just not going to happen.  The LaGG-3, Yaks, and Ju 87 we have are clearly 1942 planes with performance and weapon characteristics that are entirely out of place for 1941. 

 

You're missing the point.  We're talking how ju88s, p51, p38s are never seen in career mode yet they should be seen at least on occasion. 

[LukeFF]

12 minutes ago, Sybreed said:

You're missing the point.  We're talking how ju88s, p51, p38s are never seen in career mode yet they should be seen at least on occasion. 

 

Sorry, I thought you were talking about the appearance of 1942 planes in 1941. ? Yes, I would like to see a better determination for what sort of planes show up as well - the current system is too restrictive and so certain types end up being seen rarely or not at all.

[I./JG52_Woutwocampe]

As I said, for those who are dying to fight the mustang in BoBP, chose an airfield to the south. You'll fight plenty of them.

[Sybreed]

4 hours ago, I./JG52_Woutwocampe said:

As I said, for those who are dying to fight the mustang in BoBP, chose an airfield to the south. You'll fight plenty of them.

What you suggest helps to see the mustang more often,  but it won't do anything to see mc202, ju88, etc. 

[I./JG52_Woutwocampe]

2 hours ago, Sybreed said:

What you suggest helps to see the mustang more often,  but it won't do anything to see mc202, ju88, etc. 

 

I have seen a fair amount of Mc202 in late Stalingrad when flying 190A3. I mean not a LOT but you shouldnt see a lot anyway. Agreed with the Ju88, they need to find a way to make it appear way more often. The p-38 is simply nowhere to be found, so is the Ju52. Finally, the spitfire should be seen more often in BoBP.

[Feathered_IV]

I wonder how they are going to make this arrangement work on the pre D-Day Normandy career when every unit is a long way away?   Are the Devs thinking about this?  Is there a plan?

[sevenless]

It is actually pretty easy and not more than 5min work to make the plane you want to see appear as AI planes in career mode. All you need to do is edit the squadrons2.cfg file and integrate the plane you want to see into the fake_XX_fighter squadrons.

 

By example in my mod I added the following planes to the AI squadrons of BOBP:

 

added SpitfireMkVb and P51D15

for fake 090_fighters, fake 095_recons

added C47A

fake 097_transports

added TyphoonIB

fake 098_attackers, fake 099_attackers, fake 990_heavy_fighters, fake 994_light_bombers

added P38J25

fake 099_attackers, fake 991_heavy_fighters, fake 995_light_bombers

added Ju88A4 and He111H16

fake 093_bombers, fake 094_bombers

added Fw190A5, Bf110G2 and Ju87D3

fake 098_attackers, fake 099_attackers

 

By doing this, you occasionally have to intercept Ju87s or Ju88s/ He111s as flying your allied career or more frequently see P51s or P38s as flying a german career.

 

 

Edited August 30, 2021 by sevenless

[LukeFF]

6 hours ago, sevenless said:

It is actually pretty easy and not more than 5min work to make the plane you want to see appear as AI planes in career mode. All you need to do is edit the squadrons2.cfg file and integrate the plane you want to see into the fake_XX_fighter squadrons.

 

There are a whole bunch of airfield database files that also need to be updated - it's not just a simple matter of updating the squadrons2 file. 

[sevenless]

14 hours ago, LukeFF said:

 

There are a whole bunch of airfield database files that also need to be updated - it's not just a simple matter of updating the squadrons2 file. 

 

Not really. I can populate the whole BOBP career with WW1 planes only. Only thing I have to do is edit three *.cfg files.

 

 

Edited August 31, 2021 by sevenless

[Airborne506]

I just wanted to echo what others have said I've been running through a few different allied careers in the last 6 months, only intercepted stukas for bomber intercept missions. I feel like the russian side had a decent variety for friendly AI planes I'd encounter but the P38 career I'm in now for autumn 44 I've gone 6-7 missions and have seen nothing other than P38s. I'm also curious if because of the long range of the 38 the missions are generated further away? I'm wondering why in the hell we're being sent from Florennes to just outside Nijmegen to hit an armored column and flying over the whole damn RAF on the way. In other careers the distance did not seem so far - granted Florennes is not the closest airfield but there's enemy units much closer that could be attacked.

[PatrickAWlson]

@Airborne506 I don't think being sent to support the troops engaged in Market Garden is at all unrealistic.  Might be inconvenient from your current base but Market Garden was a big deal.  That was the focus of the U.S. as well as the British while it lasted. From the point of view of a P-38 it's not that long of a mission.

 

[LukeFF]

5 hours ago, Airborne506 said:

I'm wondering why in the hell we're being sent from Florennes to just outside Nijmegen to hit an armored column and flying over the whole damn RAF on the way. In other careers the distance did not seem so far - granted Florennes is not the closest airfield but there's enemy units much closer that could be attacked.

 

It's a limitation of the mission types available right now. Realistically, P-38s and other Allied fighter-bombers would be sent on armed recon missions to look for enemy traffic on the roads, rail lines, and rivers - rather than being sent to attack a column that had been sighted an hour ago. So, in the absence of having armed recon missions, vehicle and armor column attack missions will have to stand in. 

[MarcoPegase44]

Hello

 

the career mod is very incomplete when it comes to the variety of missions offered and enemy units based too far from the player's unit are never called upon, which explains the absence of certain types of aircraft.

 

By the way in BOPT if you play English you never meet US planes and if you play US you never meet the RAF.

It's like you never live with an allied.

 

I do not understand this limitation !!!

[Lord_Strange]

On 9/7/2021 at 8:40 PM, MarcoPegase44 said:

Hello

 

the career mod is very incomplete when it comes to the variety of missions offered and enemy units based too far from the player's unit are never called upon, which explains the absence of certain types of aircraft.

 

By the way in BOPT if you play English you never meet US planes and if you play US you never meet the RAF.

It's like you never live with an allied.

 

I do not understand this limitation !!!

I haven't played a US career yet but I have met P-51s on occasion while flying an RAF career.

[I./JG52_Woutwocampe]

Personnally, everytime I flew allied in BoBp career, all AI flights had the same plane as I did. I flew P-51, everyone was flying a P-51. Now that I fly Tempest, its Tempests everywhere. 

 

Its a different matter when flying Luftwaffe though. Even though I fly Dora I still see plenty of 109 AI flights.

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by I./JG52_Woutwocampe