Need Help with Squadron Dates and Plane Types

[LukeFF]

II/JG 52 was equipped with Bf 109 G-6 on July 13

 

I would put the ones for II./JG 52 sometime near the end of June, per the quote above: Prien/Jagdfiegerverbänder 12/II writes that the first 2 Bf109G6 reached II/JG52 in the last days of June, another 13 in July

 

Plus, http://www.ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/biijg52.html states pretty much the same thing: no G-6s at the beginning of June 1943 but that 2 were on hand by the end of the month. So say, something like this?

• G-2s up to the 29th of June and then disappear after this date.
• G-4s the whole month of June and remaining for the rest of the campaign.
• G-6s starting on the 30th of June and remaining for the rest of the campaign.

Edited October 10, 2017 by LukeFF

[Farky]

I/JG 52 was equipped with Bf 109 G-6 ~ on June 25

 

 

Sounds good to me.

 

 

II/JG 52 was equipped with Bf 109 G-6 on July 13

 

 

I agree with LukeFF on this one. Maybe rather at beginning of July, mixed with Bf 109G-4 until the end of the campaign in October (if will be possible to have two types of airplane in one unit of course).

[LukeFF]

(if will be possible to have two types of airplane in one unit of course).

 

It's already possible in ROF (heck, one can have as many aircraft types as one wants in a squadron), so I don't see it being a problem here. 

Edited October 11, 2017 by LukeFF

[BlackSix]

Ok, thanks, now we've such situation for JGs without AI units (dates - DD.MM.YY):

 

[Uufflakke]

I can not help you with all this but why not asking assistance from our member csThor?

 

From what I remember of his posts he seems to be very well documented in relation to the Luftwaffe, their planes, squadrons, theatre of operations, etc.

   

[csThor]

I'm currently in hospital and far away from my sourdes. What the others have put together looks solid with the internet stuff I can access from here.

[BlackSix]

I can not help you with all this but why not asking assistance from our member csThor?

From what I remember of his posts he seems to be very well documented in relation to the Luftwaffe, their planes, squadrons, theatre of operations, etc.

All works were completed in March of this year and csThor provided us with great help. Now we just need to add Bf 109 G-6 to the existing tables.

 

I'm currently in hospital and far away from my sourdes. What the others have put together looks solid with the internet stuff I can access from here.

Get well soon!

[LLv24_Zami]

Ok, thanks, now we've such situation for JGs without AI units (dates - DD.MM.YY):

 

Looks good to me.

[LukeFF]

Ok, thanks, now we've such situation for JGs without AI units (dates - DD.MM.YY):

 

Untitled-1.jpg

 

Looks good to me!

[Ropalcz]

Letka 13 gave its remaining Me-109G-4 to the Chroatian 15./JG52 29.10.1943 on Bagerowo airfield (they were not property of Slovak government.Germans lent them to Slovak Air Arms). Same day personnel moved to airfield Nikolaewo and were transported home. 12.11.1943 most of them arrived to Slovakia.

From the last report of Letka 13 commander stotnik Jan Palenicek,24.10.1943,there were 6 Me-109G-4 left. 5 airworthy,1 in repair shop to change the engine.

 

Me-109G-6 were officially bought by Slovak government 17.1.44. Contract for 15 Me-109G-6 worth 3.3mil RM,manufacturing plant Wiener-Neustadt. First machines received at Piestany airfield 11.2.1944. 

 

From 31.1.1944 Letka 13 has been also called Pohotovostna letka 13 (Emergency flight) with task to protect capital city. From june 1944 included in Reichsverteidigung as part of 8.Jagddivision. 

  There was an unwritten order not to attack americans and to save gustavs for planned uprising against germans (29.8.1944). Emergency flight didnt attack americans 16.6.1944,when they bombed our capital Bratislava (oil rafinery Apollo and Winter harbor on Danube river). They were strongly criticized for that. Germans simply called it cowardness. There was another air raid anounced 26.6.1944. This time deputy commander decided to go against americans.

   8 gustavs from Pohotovostna letka tried to intercept B-17s and B-24 of 15.USAAF. The plan was to climb above bombers,do just one pass and head home. 1 B-24 was shot down and 1 B-17 damaged.untill escorting mustangs (52nd FG) and lightnings (82nd FG) caught up on messers. 3 pilots were killed,4 messers heavily damaged and only one got back home without damage.  Pohotovostna letka practicly ceased to exist.

I will add some more details about the 26.6. 1944 

 

Pilots killed: 1) nadporučík (oberleutnant) Juraj Puškár 

                    2) rotník (feldwebel) Štefan Jambor - killed by escort fighters on parachute

                    3) rotník (feldwebel) Gustáv Lang (the only SVZ pilot to claim USAAF plane - he was shot down few seconds after claiming one B-24)

 

One was severely wounded - zástavník (oberfeldwebel) Pavol Zeleňák crash - landed near Brunovce in high speed and he broke his spine. 

[707shap_Srbin]

I will add some more details about the 26.6. 1944 

 

Geletko's G-6 W.Nr.161722

 

Zelezniak's G-6 W.Nr.161717

[Ropalcz]

Geletko's G-6 W.Nr.161722

Geletko_Bf_109G-6_W_Nr_161722_biela_1_letisko_Isla.jpg

 

Zelezniak's G-6 W.Nr.161717

Messerschmitt-Bf-109G4-13.JG52(Slow)-White-6-Pavel-Zelenak-WNr-161717-Russia-26th-Jun-1943-03.jpg

 

That first one is from crash of Karol Geletko during the landing on airfield Išla in eastern Slovakia, few weeks after destruction of Letka 13. He was supposed to ferry that plane on Išla in order to make air support for East-Slovakian divisions located near the well-known Dukla pass. Those defensive plans were later aborted because of the Slovak National Uprising. The remaining G-6´s were efectivelly used by insurgents - veterans from the eastern front like Rudolf Božík and František Brezina used them well - they managed to shoot down several bombers and recon planes and destroy many German ground targets 

 

Rudolf Božík standing on G-6 W.Nr. 161725 at Tri Duby airfield during the uprising.

 

[BlackSix]

Hello,

I'm working on the Prokhorovka map airfields for the "Tank Crew" and I can't find info about Feldflugplatz "Uhu"

 

III./JG 3 airfields:

26.4.43 - 19.5.43  - Kramatorskaja

20.5.43 - 7.43 - Feldflugplatz "Uhu"

7.43 - 15.7.43  - Bessonowka

15.7.43 - 28.7.43  - Feldflugplatz "Uhu"

28.7.43 - 1.8.43  - Makejewka

 

I've checked book "Osprey - Aircraft of the Aces 116 - Jagdgeschwader 3 'Udet'" but I didn't find any info about that airfield or I missed smth...

Do you know anything about Feldflugplatz "Uhu"?

[BlackSix]

Thanks to all for the help, we've found it

It's Часов Яр (Tschassof-Jar (german translation); 20 km southeast Kramatorskaja)

 

https://www.google.ru/maps/place/Часов+Яр,+Донецкая+область,+Украина,+84551/@48.6361552,37.8369196,9.25z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x40dfc265770420a7:0x6ebab1caadedcdb5!8m2!3d48.5884808!4d37.8354218

[Talon_]

@BlackSix

 

I did some research because there is some confusion in IL-2 communities about what version of the Tempest we should be getting. I have found that the upcoming Hawker Tempest V should have a +11lbs rated Sabre IIB engine. 

 

The Heritage Trust website here notes that the Sabre IIB was introduced to combat the flying bombs of June 1944, which is a mission that all Hawker Tempest squadrons took part in at that time as part of 150 Wing RAF. It was not until the V-1 campaign was over that Nos. 3, 486, 56 and 80 (all the active Tempest squadrons) were moved out to the Continent in September, so all of their engines would have been +11lbs Sabre IIBs by then thanks to the V-1s. It should be noted that +11lbs was the maximum boost attained by the Sabre IIB on normal avgas, and +13 was obtained with 150 octane, though I doubt we'll see that.

 

The only other Tempest wings were formed after the move to the continent so they should have the IIB too except for 501 sqn, which formed in August but remained in the UK.

 

Thanks

Edited June 17, 2018 by Talon_

[BlackSix]

Sorry, I can't say anything about Tempest modification

[BlackSix]

Guys, do you have any information about use of Bf 109 G-2/R-6 with 2x20 mm MG151/20 in Battle of Stalingrad in September - October 1942?

 I./JG 3 I./JG 52 and I./JG 53 had Bf 109 G-2s that time.

[LukeFF]

@BlackSix, I./JG 53 was known to use gunpods on their 109s during this time.

Edited June 20, 2018 by LukeFF

[HubertMeyer]

3.JG3 Uffz. Heinrich Blauth 14.October 1942 Picture Bf109G-2/R-6

 

Source : Stab und I.Jagdgeschwader 3, Prien + Stemmer ISBN 3-923 457-38-3

[Talon_]

On 6/19/2018 at 9:02 AM, BlackSix said:

Sorry, I can't say anything about Tempest modification

 

Hi BlackSix

 

+11lbs shouldn't be a "modification" as +9lbs doesn't appear to have been used by the 2nd TAF on the Continent. I haven't found a source that suggests Tempests were de-rated after they made the journey in September (in fact some were up-rated further to +13lbs with 150 grade!) 

[TP_Silk]

Talon_ mate - you're basically talking to the wrong part of the team. BlackSix'w response to you indicates that he is not involved in the area you are trying to provide information for. Give the guy a break  

 

My suggestion is that you try the Developer Assistance > Historical Data forum or possibly the History > Aviation or Weaphons and Equipment forums. Links below

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/forum/11-historical-data/

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/forum/14-aviation/

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/forum/15-weapons-and-equipment/

[BlackSix]

On 6/20/2018 at 8:14 PM, LukeFF said:

@BlackSix, I./JG 53 was known to use gunpods on their 109s during this time.

 

On 6/20/2018 at 9:28 PM, HubertMeyer said:

3.JG3 Uffz. Heinrich Blauth 14.October 1942 Picture Bf109G-2/R-6

 

Source : Stab und I.Jagdgeschwader 3, Prien + Stemmer ISBN 3-923 457-38-3

Thanks, this is very useful information and I already know how to use it)

 

HubertMeyer, if you have Prien books about JG 3, could you check when I./JG 3 and III./JG 3 left Pitomnik?

At present in the career I./JG 3 move to Morozovskaya on Nov 28 and III./JG 3 move to Oblivskaya on Nov 22 but I have some doubts about III./JG 3...

[csThor]

According to "Die Jagdfliegerverbände der Deutschen Luftwaffe 1939 - 1945" Vol 9/II III./JG 3 transfered to Oblivskaya under direct orders of VIII. Fliegerkorps at noon of November 21 1945 (Flugbuch Wilhelm Lemke - between 12.40 p.m. and 13.15 p.m.) in abysmal weather conditions. Operations from Oblivskaya resumed only the next day but weather remained abysmal throughout the next 7 days so that only low level attacks on advancing soviet ground forces north of the AF were flown.

 

I./JG 3 was pulled from Pitomnik on November 28 on orders of VIII. Fliegerkorps.

[HubertMeyer]

Thx csThor,

 

you are faster

[BlackSix]

Thank you very much, I was afraid they left Pitomnik on Nov 28, together with I./JG 3 after reading John Weal "Aces of Jagdgeschwader 3 ‘Udet’"