Is Great Battles platform still developed?

[Stelcio]

I'm back to playing the game after a long hiatus and I'm completely out of the loop, so I'd like to ask if GB is still being developed? So are there any more modules in development? Are Japanese to make an appearance for example? I can see that there was a new Korea project announced, so is the development focus shifting entirely towards that new project and Great Battles will move more towards so called "maintenance mode"?

[R33GZ]

1 hour ago, Stelcio said:

I'm back to playing the game after a long hiatus and I'm completely out of the loop, so I'd like to ask if GB is still being developed? So are there any more modules in development? Are Japanese to make an appearance for example? I can see that there was a new Korea project announced, so is the development focus shifting entirely towards that new project and Great Battles will move more towards so called "maintenance mode"?

There is a 3rd party map of Odessa in development and a few new aircraft for that map such as the I-153 that will come along in the future (sometime this year if I remember correctly). I think there may also be some FC aircraft coming, but not 100% sure about that. There a still some tweaks and changes coming through with the updates, but yes, GB is slowly crawling it's way to a life support mode.

 

There is no Japanese, even though the rising sun flag is shown in the axis logo and a midway type airbattle picture for the multiplayer dogfight 'button' so you would forgiven for being at least a little confused.

 

Long story short, it would appear, and has been stated that, most effort and personnel are being invested to the new Korea project, which will be incompatible with the current GB series.

 

Having said all that, the online scene is still alive, perhaps not as vibrant as it used to be, but still lots of fun to be had. While the SP experience still has many detractions, it is arguably better now than it was a few years ago.

 

Hope that helps 😉

[LukeFF]

Yes, support for Great Battles is planned to continue for the foreseeable future. 

If Japanese forces are to make an appearance, it will be in the new series, not in GB.

[No145_Bunny]

I wonder, as the WW2 GB game heads towards the end of its development life, if there is now an argument to be had for opening up the whole MODS thing ?

It would be great if we can "open" the current game to the clever MOD people to add new aircraft and maps etc...  That way interest in GB WW2 continues, more software sold (of what will be a dead title) and us players get new content. Doubt it will happen but this situation still keeps IL2 1946 alive 🙂

 

S! Bunster

[Avimimus]

There is already a 'mods' option. We're also getting slightly expanded tools based on the map tools.

 

I think the developers said it was easier to keep flight model modelling and damage model modelling done by staff. I could see a situation like what happened with Team Daidalos being a possibility though - that might be just within the realm of possibility.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

22 minutes ago, No145_Bunny said:

I wonder, as the WW2 GB game heads towards the end of its development life, if there is now an argument to be had for opening up the whole MODS thing ?

It would be great if we can "open" the current game to the clever MOD people to add new aircraft and maps etc...  That way interest in GB WW2 continues, more software sold (of what will be a dead title) and us players get new content. Doubt it will happen but this situation still keeps IL2 1946 alive 🙂

 

S! Bunster

I would like them to first open Rise of flight, this game also have potential to grow if team like one responsible for WOFF would learn that tech and add /fix content.

[BMA_FlyingShark]

I wonder how long it will take until we get WWII European Theater content in the new series.

Pacific is very nice but in a WWII sim you can't get around 109's vs Spits and Mustangs.

 

Have a nice day.

 

[BlitzPig_EL]

We haven't even got to Mustangs and Corsairs vs. Tonys, Franks, and Georges yet.

Edited July 25, 2024 by BlitzPig_EL

[Enceladus828]

4 hours ago, 1PL-Husar-1Esk said:

I would like them to first open Rise of flight, this game also have potential to grow if team like one responsible for WOFF would learn that tech and add /fix content.

Agree. As FC looks to have the same fate as RoF and didn’t even get as far as RoF did with the Channel and Tarnopol maps then RoF should be opened up to modders so an Eastern Front Pilot Career can be added along with more Central Powers and Russian planes. Maybe even more planes and maps.

1 hour ago, FlyingShark said:

 

I wonder how long it will take until we get WWII European Theater content in the new series.

 

Probably after the Pacific installment(s). Sicily would be great and some GBs planes can be ported over. I would want to see new content first before IL-2 GBs maps got brought over.

[BlitzPig_EL]

Because of DX 12 old GB planes won't be able to be ported to the new engine.  They will all have to be built from scratch.

[Avimimus]

1 hour ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Because of DX 12 old GB planes won't be able to be ported to the new engine.  They will all have to be built from scratch.

 

There are also probably other significant improvements (based on what is being said). It was PBR which forced the decision to create new models - but once they decided to do that it looks like they felt there was nothing holding them back from making other improvements (e.g. reworked damage model, first person view of the pilot's body).

[LukeFF]

6 hours ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Because of DX 12 old GB planes won't be able to be ported to the new engine.  They will all have to be built from scratch.

 

Yes, anything for a forthcoming WWII title is going to be new content built from the ground up. A lot of the assets in GB right now are over 10 years old and at a level of detail that's just not up to par with current gaming standards.

[Avimimus]

7 hours ago, LukeFF said:

Yes, anything for a forthcoming WWII title is going to be new content built from the ground up. A lot of the assets in GB right now are over 10 years old and at a level of detail that's just not up to par with current gaming standards.

 

*With the exception, it seems, for content being developed by some third parties (e.g. Odessa) which will be released for the current version of the game engine, which is still supported by the developers.

 

I'm personally hoping that third parties manage to turn Odessa into a full release - although that would require them making eight aircraft (maybe they could get by with six? We know three fighters are tentatively planned and the Ju-87D5 - so that is four... just need a few more). But there is a thread for that:

 

[the_emperor]

There are still some historical inaccuracies regarding DM&FMs  I´d like to see corrected before this series is finally closed.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

1 hour ago, the_emperor said:

There are still some historical inaccuracies regarding DM&FMs  I´d like to see corrected before this series is finally closed.

Hope so. Some old FC FMs are waiting years to be fixed. Data is there but manpower and time is not

Edited July 26, 2024 by 1PL-Husar-1Esk

[the_emperor]

55 minutes ago, 1PL-Husar-1Esk said:

Hope so. Some old FC FMs are waiting years to be fixed. Data is there but manpower and time is not

 

Yeah..unfortunately "years" is the correct time frame...which makes me not too optimistic for the future of this series...it certainly feels as its currently fading out slowly .

[RNAS10_Mitchell]

On 7/26/2024 at 10:03 AM, the_emperor said:

 

Yeah..unfortunately "years" is the correct time frame...which makes me not too optimistic for the future of this series...it certainly feels as its currently fading out slowly .

Agreed.  IMO,  much depends on the success of the Korean module.   I'm hoping it will be a huge success for them. 

 

 Regarding the original poster's question,   the "official response" that I've read is that after FC4, there may or may not be a FC5. (Purposely vague) Additional Great Battles content will be limited to 3rd party development,  and possibly a few collector planes/variants.   So imo, that means it's pretty much dead as far as official content is concerned.   They are winding down, and will not be putting any significant effort into after FC4.   

[Avimimus]

It looks like they are only focussing on single engined planes and variants for Great Battles, collaborating with third parties and the Odessa (and possibly Karelia) projects to fill in some gaps. As for FC4, the remaining Western Front land planes were announced as 'Collector Aircraft' rather than as a complete FC4. I'm personally hoping that they do expand it with a couple of additional aircraft and produce a proper Vol.4 but I have my doubts.

 

I do think there is room for a third party to step in after FC stops development to do an Vol.5 though... the engine is still pretty modern, and there aren't any significant competitors for WWI on a similar engine. There are also a number of very interesting WWI aircraft remaining.

[RNAS10_Mitchell]

Curious why if FC4 is just collector planes,  why it is being called FC4?   Will they be packed together,  or sold individually?

[BMA_FlyingShark]

14 minutes ago, RNAS10_Mitchell said:

Curious why if FC4 is just collector planes,  why it is being called FC4?   Will they be packed together,  or sold individually?

Maybe they haven't decided yet how to release it.

 

Have a nice day.

 

[LukeFF]

2 hours ago, RNAS10_Mitchell said:

Curious why if FC4 is just collector planes,  why it is being called FC4?   Will they be packed together,  or sold individually?

 

The plan is to release everything in Volume 4 as one package. 

[Avimimus]

2 hours ago, LukeFF said:

The plan is to release everything in Volume 4 as one package. 

 

I'm glad to hear that. It might be the best approach for overall sales. I'm low-key hoping for one or two additional aircraft in order to reach the usual number of eight. The Roland D.VIb would be a good pick (very high performance, compared to the early war types), or the Fokker D.II (fits with the early war theme), or Airco D.H.5...

 

Although, of course, a pair of slower 1916 two-seaters would be ideal! But we all know that by now!

 

That said, I'll pick up a copy in any case.

[ST_Catchov]

It'd be nice to get a few extra collector planes after the FC4 release along with map improvements. That's probably about it if we're lucky .... although it may depend on how sales of the FC series go. FM reviews/changes? Unlikely to nope. Which is a disappointment. Still, WW1 enthusiasts are persons of high calibre and any decisions taken by the Devs are always taken with good grace and elegant reserve. As any gentleman of class would.

[Enceladus828]

Wish we could get a coherent reason for why there are no plans for the Channel Map at the very least to be added to FC. E.g. Ugra is doing other projects and don’t have time right now.

[BMA_FlyingShark]

37 minutes ago, ST_Catchov said:

Maybe one day, when they go forward to the past in their new engine.

I hope they will, for the WWI content as well as for the WWII content but I'm not gonna hold my breath for it.

 

Have a nice day.

 

[PatrickAWlson]

On 7/25/2024 at 9:04 AM, 1PL-Husar-1Esk said:

I would like them to first open Rise of flight, this game also have potential to grow if team like one responsible for WOFF would learn that tech and add /fix content.

 

I doubt that is going to happen.  GB is not all new code.  It was created using ROF code as a baseline.  I can almost guarantee you that the new code used GB code as a baseline.  The break to a new product comes when the later code base diverges so much that the original can't run on it anymore, which is different from completely abandoning a set of code.  

With the idea that new product is a heavily modified GB and GB is a heavily modified RoF, you're not going to see RoF released publicly because it forms the foundation of the product line.  Too much proprietary information about the product in that code base. 

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

38 minutes ago, PatrickAWlson said:

 

I doubt that is going to happen.  GB is not all new code.  It was created using ROF code as a baseline.  I can almost guarantee you that the new code used GB code as a baseline.  The break to a new product comes when the later code base diverges so much that the original can't run on it anymore, which is different from completely abandoning a set of code.  

With the idea that new product is a heavily modified GB and GB is a heavily modified RoF, you're not going to see RoF released publicly because it forms the foundation of the product line.  Too much proprietary information about the product in that code base. 

Yes I know,  I was thinking about  calloboration , legal agreement with 3rd party rather than open the code for public.

Edited July 30, 2024 by 1PL-Husar-1Esk

[ITAF_Rani]

Hope that same great 3rd parts come out to help Devs to bring us new scenarios and planes....

GBattles and WW2 theatre cannot be abandoned it is too mutch important and don t think module Korea will have the force to get all the WW2 comunity interest....

Edited July 31, 2024 by ITAF_Rani

[Trooper117]

I can't see them bothering too much with anything GB or FC wise once they have delivered what they have already announced... it would make no sense when they should be going full bore with the new engine and all that entails.

If I was them, I'd be show casing everything to do with the Korea project, plus a look forward to where they intend to go next... there is no real point in looking backwards when they are launching the next generation of the game...

[Russkly]

3 hours ago, Trooper117 said:

I can't see them bothering too much with anything GB or FC wise once they have delivered what they have already announced... it would make no sense when they should be going full bore with the new engine and all that entails.

If I was them, I'd be show casing everything to do with the Korea project, plus a look forward to where they intend to go next... there is no real point in looking backwards when they are launching the next generation of the game...

 

I agree with you that that is probably what will happen.

 

Some sort of licensing agreement is my best hope for GB & FC - at least that way they could generate some additional profit from what I imagine is now fully-amortised IP whilst still retaining control of that IP (per @PatrickAWlson's point re: code above).

 

Otherwise all that money and effort to develop GB & FC simply stop producing revenue, which seems a waste; as well as potentially disenfranchising part of a very loyal and long-standing customer base, for which Korea is of little or no interest (yes, that's a personal point of view!).

 

So, 1CGS, please don't let GB & FC wither on the vine because of Korea - the R&D money's already been spent developing these great games, and there must be potential revenue streams still available to 1CGS for GB & FC without compromising their commitment to the Korea thing.

 

It would also keep people like me happy to see these games continue to develop, regardless of who's dong the work and publishing the titles (yes, I appreciate that N=1 isn't great for marketing strategy development!).

[=MERCS=JenkemJunkie]

They're not abandoning WWII, just taking a break from it. When they're back to WWII (probably Pacific) in an upgraded engine you'll wish they dumped GB earlier.

[BMA_FlyingShark]

9 minutes ago, =MERCS=JenkemJunkie said:

When they're back to WWII (probably Pacific) in an upgraded engine you'll wish they dumped GB earlier.

I would agree with you if the planes and at least a few of the maps would get upgraded to the new engine too.

But we'll probably have to wait for years again to get certain planes in the new series.

I don't see them modelling Spitfires, 109's, 190's etc... in the foreseeable future.

 

Have a nice day.

 

[Trooper117]

WWII wise, if they do the Pacific, I doubt they will do Midway/Guadalcanal arena as that will already have been done,... for me to buy anything Pacific, it would have to be another battle, say  Malaya/Singapore or Burma.

But who can say? They could just as easily dump the Pacific idea and go back to the Eastern Front again... 

 

edit... they have confirmed they are doing the Pacific!  

Edited July 31, 2024 by Trooper117

[=MERCS=JenkemJunkie]

1 hour ago, FlyingShark said:

I would agree with you if the planes and at least a few of the maps would get upgraded to the new engine too.

But we'll probably have to wait for years again to get certain planes in the new series.

I don't see them modelling Spitfires, 109's, 190's etc... in the foreseeable future.

 

Have a nice day.

 

If losing them is the price we have to pay for desperately needed engine upgrades, then its a price I'm willing to pay. We've had 5 expansions of that already, so I think we're due for a break to something different anyways. I've only been playing since late Bodenplatte and if I never see another German plane again, I'll be just fine with that.

Edited July 31, 2024 by =MERCS=JenkemJunkie

[LukeFF]

Well, for those who have not seen it yet and are wondering what we plan to do after Korea, I highly suggest you watch our latest video. 🙂

[Russkly]

14 hours ago, LukeFF said:

Well, for those who have not seen it yet and are wondering what we plan to do after Korea, I highly suggest you watch our latest video. 🙂

 

@LukeFF Which one? Some of the longer dev vlogs aren't easy to sit through

 

[Aapje]

1 hour ago, Russkly said:

@LukeFF Which one? Some of the longer dev vlogs aren't easy to sit through

 

He said the last one. But to save you time, they said that they plan to make a DLC for Korea with an aircraft carrier before moving on to the Pacific.

 

My speculation is that it will be a a shared map, although they might expand the map a little for the carrier DLC. So mostly the carrier plus a bunch of airplanes.

[Avimimus]

1 hour ago, Aapje said:

 

He said the last one. But to save you time, they said that they plan to make a DLC for Korea with an aircraft carrier before moving on to the Pacific.

 

My speculation is that it will be a a shared map, although they might expand the map a little for the carrier DLC. So mostly the carrier plus a bunch of airplanes.

 

They didn't say that! They said they are working on deck operations (i.e. Carriers) for the next module - and that opens the possibility to eventually bring them into Korea...

(This was with regard to the Sea Fury being more likely than the Meteor F.8 - which doesn't appear to be planned, although they invited us to collect reference material for the Meteor)

[Aapje]

They said that bringing carriers to Korea is easier than to develop the entire Pacific module. But you are correct that the idea that a carrier DLC will come to Korea before the Pacific module is what I read between the lines, rather than what was explicitly said.

 

But I noticed that they didn't call the Carrier DLC a module, which fits perfectly with them bringing a carrier to Korea first, since they can just argue that they kept their promise that the Pacific is the next module, since the Carrier DLC is not a full module, but a DLC.

[Enceladus828]

On 7/30/2024 at 2:31 PM, 1PL-Husar-1Esk said:

Yes I know,  I was thinking about  calloboration , legal agreement with 3rd party rather than open the code for public.

I believe the devs did look into this  before 2017 but realized that it would be too time consuming to train new developers out of house and then come back every now and then to evaluate their work (much like GBs right now) and when these new developers faced a challenge or problem. Other things would have to be considered like ROI and if it was worth doing for this new team. I’d also point out that they likely would be stuck making content for RoF, another game engine, and would have to spend the time learning the GBs code in order to make content for it. Maybe if this new team consisted of WW1 aviation junkies who were totally in for adding new WWI planes and maps for and were okay working part-time on this then it could have panned out.

 

Really the only other option would be if the devs had gone back in there in 2015 and done as much work as possible (some fixes and more SP content for the Tarnopol map) before officially signing off.

That’s my two cents on this