Now what?

[Adger]

1 minute ago, Bonnot said:

That sounds Wisdom and there is a lot to do with minimal investment ....real value for IL2 fans, but for advertising ????

Ps : for a change of Stuks , you can try challenge U2 vs JU52  ( don't forget Mg on both ! )

 

 

Maybe so @Bonnot but I’m sure there’s a few like myself that WOULD invest more into the series if SP “fixes” were dealt with.

 

Enemy AC STILL following back to your own airfield, Ground attack missions “broken” ,communications as flight lead largely inadequate Enemy AC spawning in at your altitude and “knowing” your perceived course from many kilometres away. Breaks the immersion, certainly for me. Honestly pal if some or all of these issues were dealt with I’d invest a serious amount of cash into the series.

[Gambit21]

25 minutes ago, JG7_X-Man said:

I have no idea...

 

 

Yes, we're all aware.

This is the unwritten yet understood preface to every post you've ever made here...ever.

[JG7_X-Man]

I am very confused what TD actually is.

• (Off-line) When your CPU can't keep up with your game graphic settings - the game slows down i.e. loss in frames rates per second.
• (On-line) poor upload/download speeds in addition to when your CPU can't keep up with your game graphic settings - the game slows down i.e. loss in frames rates per second.

Lowering your graphic settings to match your hardware will take care of any issues that are attributed to TD. SSDs are not a bad idea to as they greatly increase load times.

[jojy47jojyrocks]

So many great possibilities with IL2 GB brands. 

 

I have bought the FC1 and now looking forward for an expansion to FC2 and also looking to get the Career possibility of the WW1 front.

 

As for the WW2 era, depending on the availability of data content. I believe the Mediterranean/Italian front can bring a lot of content possibilities and, looks to me like Pacific front has hit a block with carriers and Japanese planes. There is still other late WW2 battles than can be added and bring in more better faster, fresh content too.

 

The expansion of SP career missions like recon spot, photo recon plus even adding some map tools can be great. Career SP really needs some overhaul.

 

 

[Gambit21]

5 minutes ago, JG7_X-Man said:

I am very confused what TD actually is.

• (Off-line) When your CPU can't keep up with your game graphic settings - the game slows down i.e. loss in frames rates per second.
• (On-line) poor upload/download speeds in addition to when your CPU can't keep up with your game graphic settings - the game slows down i.e. loss in frames rates per second.

Lowering your graphic settings to match your hardware will take care of any issues that are attributed to TD. SSDs are not a bad idea to as they greatly increase load times.

No

[JG7_X-Man]

So TD is when the the game's rate of time elapse isn't the same as rate of time in IRL. So to mission builders: objectives that migrate to from night to dawn and dusk to night might no function as intended? If this is incorrect - please enlighten me.

[BlitzPig_EL]

I have better specs than most of the BlitzPigs, yet when I host time on my machine runs slower.  Also when flying at say and indicated 250mph my team mates will blow by me and they are indicating in the low 200s.  When one of them hosts the same mission the tables are reversed and my aircraft are noticeably faster than theirs are.

 

Also when looking at the elapsed time stat for the mission, when I host it shows I have played for minutes less than my team mates, even though I was the first one to spawn in and I always play for a longer time. 

 

Frame rates and stutter are not an issue. 

[DBFlyguy]

3 hours ago, Jaws2002 said:

Why? what's wrong with late war eastern front? Everyone, but the Russians have late war fighters. Why shouldn't they get some? 

USA has late mustangs, Jugs and Lightnings. Britain has late spit 14 and boosted tempests. The Germans have Dora, K4 and 262...They even have a jet bomber. 

The best the Russians have is early 1943 planes.

 I'm perfectly fine with the Russians getting some late war fighters. I'd like the Yak-9U/UT, but i know the Yak3 and La7 are more popular, so I'm fine if we get those.

 

I wouldn't call the Mustangs or Jugs we currently have in game as "late war".  We have the D-15 for the P-51D. The D-20 (K-14 standard), D-25 (HVAR rocket attachment points) or D-30 would be more "late war".   The P-47D-30,-40.... or P-47M (no point mentioning the N...) would be "late war", we currently have the D-28. 

 

Your most likely gonna get your wish though, it's gonna be back to the eastern front.  I'll be passing on an eastern front release if that's what they go with. To each their own, I hope it works out financially if they go there... guess we'll see.

Edited November 1, 2022 by DBFlyguy

[Kapteeni]

I wish that they would do at least one map for Finnish Gulf. No matter how small. Plus more early war planes. I doubt though.

Mediterranean addon is more likely..

Anyways. Normandy map is beautifull

[=621=Samikatz]

33 minutes ago, DBFlyguy said:

 

The P-47D-30,-40.... or P-47M (no point mentioning the N...)

 

A D-30 with the R-2800-57 as a modification to bring it up to M-1 standard would be a collector plane I'd buy

[Bonnot]

38 minutes ago, Kapteeni said:

Mediterranean addon is more likely..

Anyways. Normandy map is beautifull

I agree.

And if I'm not totally wrong a "late war Ostfront"  will put the borders to Poland,  Hungary,  Germany _ BERLIN _ ...., which seemed off limits, new maps, etc.... ?

[JG7_X-Man]

1 hour ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

I have better specs than most of the BlitzPigs, yet when I host time on my machine runs slower.  Also when flying at say and indicated 250mph my team mates will blow by me and they are indicating in the low 200s.  When one of them hosts the same mission the tables are reversed and my aircraft are noticeably faster than theirs are.

 

Also when looking at the elapsed time stat for the mission, when I host it shows I have played for minutes less than my team mates, even though I was the first one to spawn in and I always play for a longer time. 

 

Frame rates and stutter are not an issue. 

 

? As I have never hosted nor joined a user hosted mission since HyperLobby days - I forgot this was/still an issue. As long as the host isn't flying the mission, all is well.

This always happened on HyperLobby during those VEF and Bellum War days - when people were bring falsely accuses falsely cheating.

 

This is obviously and network issue where server data transfer is take precedent over client data transfer. However, the term Time Dilation (TD) is probably being misapplied here as it's less of a Theory of Relativity issue.

 

But what do I know 

[CountZero]

1 hour ago, Kapteeni said:

I wish that they would do at least one map for Finnish Gulf. No matter how small. Plus more early war planes. I doubt though.

Mediterranean addon is more likely..

Anyways. Normandy map is beautifull

Finnish Gulf map area was planed to be made by player moders team from Finland, if and when that is planed to be finished who knows.

 

7 minutes ago, JG7_X-Man said:

 

? As I have never hosted nor joined a user hosted mission since HyperLobby days - I forgot this was/still an issue. As long as the host isn't flying the mission, all is well.

This always happened on HyperLobby during those VEF and Bellum War days - when people were bring falsely accuses falsely cheating.

 

This is obviously and network issue where server data transfer is take precedent over client data transfer. However, the term Time Dilation (TD) is probably being misapplied here as it's less of a Theory of Relativity issue.

 

But what do I know 

its not just host problem it happends to players on dedicated servers, it was more noticable before one of the updates in 18 or 19 (update that fix bullet delay data).

You could see it if you had tm8 on coms, when you compare clock in airplane it was showing wrong time, i remenber on WoL when missions had moving ground objects ppl would just avoid missions as time was delayed at start , untill some targets got destroyed and missions start to run ok. 

Edited November 1, 2022 by CountZero

[Hotaru_Ito]

@Wardog5711 Don't know if this is the official place to post our wish lists, but that's what people seem to be doing, so here's mine...

 

1. Option to disable engine timers.

2. Make FM files moddable.

3. Time dilation fix. Maybe have simpler physics kick in at high warp or when TD occurs.

4. Malfunctions.

5... well, I could go on, but I won't. But I could.

 

Long and boring version...

Spoiler

2. As an alternative to 1., make all or most files moddable, especially flight models. Currently there are several FM issues that the devs won't fix and modders can't fix, including engine timers, Tempest and Mosquito turning rates, etc.

 

3. Time dilation fix. I don't really know what I'm talking about here, but I wonder if one possible solution would be to add simplified flight and damage models for planes, tanks, guns, bullets, etc. that kick in during timewarp or when time dilation starts happening. Basically, trade fidelity for performance. Start with the ones that make the least impact on gameplay (e.g. have flak bursts just happen in midair rather than tracing the trajectory of the shell), end with ones that have the most (e.g. simplified flight physics models). Also (in SP anyway), start with entities further from the player and end with ones closer. Not perfect, but would allow for much better timewarp speeds and more complex missions than are currently possible, and might open the door to AI 4-engine bombers, etc. down the line.

 

4. (Just a fantasy.) Malfunctions. Jammed guns (not just misfires), engine failures, etc., made more or less likely by a global quality setting for the whole plane. This would allow us to simulate, for instance, the declining build and maintenance quality of German planes in the late war. Would also allow a more reasonable approach to engine timers--the longer you go over the limit, the more likely the engine is to overheat, develop leaks, etc. rather than just instantly fail. Obviously should be enabled/disabled as a difficulty setting, with mission authors and server hosts able to set global, per-side, and per-plane multipliers.

 

Thanks for listening!

Edited November 1, 2022 by Hotaru_Ito

[Gambit21]

46 minutes ago, JG7_X-Man said:

 

 

But what do I know 

TBD - as Time Dilation is frequent in single player missions and not specifically a multiplayer issue.

[Voidhunger]

Well, we all have old PCs and this game was designed for future hardware...

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/66558-easy-mission-generator-for-tank-crew/?do=findComment&comment=1226569

[JG7_X-Man]

13 minutes ago, Voidhunger said:

Well, we all have old PCs and this game was designed for future hardware...

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/66558-easy-mission-generator-for-tank-crew/?do=findComment&comment=1226569

Thank you for this post!

• Time Dilation (TD), in the theory of special relativity, the “slowing down” of a clock as determined by an observer who is in relative motion with respect to that clock.
• TD can be implied in video games when there isn't 1:1 relationship b/w GAME and IRL time elapse.

Apparently, cranking your setting up to 11 where it should be at 5 and network issues can create weird occurrences including the above issues.

Looks like I am not wrong @Gambit21.

[Gambit21]

?

[Picchio]

Jesus...

[AEthelraedUnraed]

5 hours ago, JG7_X-Man said:

I am very confused what TD actually is.

• (Off-line) When your CPU can't keep up with your game graphic settings - the game slows down i.e. loss in frames rates per second.
• (On-line) poor upload/download speeds in addition to when your CPU can't keep up with your game graphic settings - the game slows down i.e. loss in frames rates per second.

Lowering your graphic settings to match your hardware will take care of any issues that are attributed to TD. SSDs are not a bad idea to as they greatly increase load times.

I'll elaborate a little beyond the simple "no" Gambit said. Graphics settings have nothing to do with time delay, whether offline or online (and CPU has little to do with graphics settings, but that's besides the point). TD happens if your CPU cannot keep up with the AI and mission logic.

Similar for online. Poor upload/download speeds result in other problems. Below a bare minimum, I expect servers to simply kick you. Slightly above that, I expect you might see jerky behaviour or planes suddenly "teleporting" a bit. Again no TD.

 

SSDs also don't matter for TD. They greatly decrease load times, yes, and might reduce things like stutter and other visual issues when you load in a city or part of a map. But TD is mostly a CPU issue and is caused by objects that are more likely than not already in RAM.

 

2 hours ago, JG7_X-Man said:

Apparently, cranking your setting up to 11 where it should be at 5 and network issues can create weird occurrences including the above issues.

Only if those "settings" include things such as the campaign difficulty (results in more aircraft) or frontline density (more ground objects and mission logic). But as explained above, cranking the graphics settings up to 11 will cause things like low FPS and stuttering, but not time delay.*

 

EDIT: yes, I'd very much like to hear the Devs' stance on TD, and some possible solutions. E.g. have simpler AI and/or physics for faraway aircraft and vehicles.

 

* Since a small part of graphics processing requires CPU processing and conversely some non-graphic stuff such as physics calculations may well be run on the GPU (not sure if this is the case for IL2), lowering graphics settings *might* slightly improve time delay and conversely, having less AI/logic intensive mission *might* improve your FPS. But these are secondary effects, and time delay is mainly a CPU issue while FPS is mainly a GPU issue.

Edited November 1, 2022 by AEthelraedUnraed

[FuriousMeow]

6 hours ago, Hotaru_Ito said:

2. Make FM files moddable.

 

Sweet baby jebus, no!

[Guest deleted@83466]

Clearly X-Man is in space traveling close to the speed of light, so maybe his clock really is running a little slower than the rest.

[Leftenant_Soap]

19 minutes ago, FuriousMeow said:

Sweet baby jebus, no!

 

Spoiler

 

[Hotaru_Ito]

3 hours ago, FuriousMeow said:

Sweet baby jebus, no!

 

Why not? It's not like people could cheat any harder by modding the FM than by modding the weapon files, and those are already moddable. As long as the "mods off" mode works as advertised, modding should have no effect whatsoever on multiplayer, and single-player folks like me could finally have our P-39s and P-40s actually flyable slightly more fun than they currently are and our Tempests and Mosquitoes not feel like cheating.

Edited November 2, 2022 by Hotaru_Ito
OK, I'll lose the hyperbole.

[AndyJWest]

I've been 'actually flying' the P-39 & P-40 for years....

[Hotaru_Ito]

6 minutes ago, AndyJWest said:

I've been 'actually flying' the P-39 & P-40 for years....

 

OK, I'll rephrase it. I would enjoy them more if I could just disable the engine timers, just like I'd enjoy the Mosquito more if I could make its roll rate more plausible.

 

As long as "mods off" mode works in multiplayer, moddability is a way for everyone (or at least more people) to get what they want without ruining things for anyone else. You can have things your way in your single-player game, and I'll have them my way in my single-player game, and if we play against each other in multiplayer, we play without mods and it's a level playing field when it matters.

Edited November 2, 2022 by Hotaru_Ito

[Guest deleted@83466]

FM’s created by this company are probably also their intellectual property, so it’s not odd that some things would be modable, and some things very proprietary.

[Hotaru_Ito]

Just now, SeaSerpent said:

FM’s created by this company are probably also their intellectual property, so it’s not odd that some things would be modable, and some things very proprietary.

Of course I have no idea what the IP situation looks like, who owns what, and so on, so you may very well be right about that. There might also be some unknown technical reason why some files can't or shouldn't be modded.

 

It's just something I've always thought would be cool, coming from highly moddable games like Skyrim, KSP, and X-Plane, not to mention Rise of Flight and Il-2 1946. In my wildest fantasies, we'd even be able to mod in our own planes and maps. Meanwhile, in the real world, I'd be more than happy with a simple difficulty option to switch off the engine timers--the other suggestions are more daydream territory.

 

Honestly, I'm a little surprised it's the modded FMs folks are balking at--I thought it'd be the random malfunctions people would be saying "sweet jebus no" to.

[Boogdud]

7 hours ago, Hotaru_Ito said:

Honestly, I'm a little surprised it's the modded FMs folks are balking at

They're balking because it would make online an absolute nightmare. Can you say 'hacked flight models ruining everyone's day'?

[Koziolek]

1 hour ago, Boogdud said:

 because it would make online an absolute nightmare. 

an how many online servers allow mods-on?

[Boogdud]

40 minutes ago, Koziolek said:

an how many online servers allow mods-on?

Once they become mod-able, every server will have mods on (even if they try to block them), people will find a way. I believe that's the concern.

[CountZero]

10 hours ago, Hotaru_Ito said:

 

OK, I'll rephrase it. I would enjoy them more if I could just disable the engine timers, just like I'd enjoy the Mosquito more if I could make its roll rate more plausible.

 

As long as "mods off" mode works in multiplayer, moddability is a way for everyone (or at least more people) to get what they want without ruining things for anyone else. You can have things your way in your single-player game, and I'll have them my way in my single-player game, and if we play against each other in multiplayer, we play without mods and it's a level playing field when it matters.

If you turn on unbrakable option in realisam youll turn of timers. Airplane can be damaged by bullets and so on, but when you crash in ground it cant be destroyed. If your playing SP and hate Engine Timers its better then nothing.

 

56 minutes ago, Boogdud said:

Once they become mod-able, every server will have mods on (even if they try to block them), people will find a way. I believe that's the concern.

Now with mods you can make your .303 to shoot 40mm ammo, if its that easy to brake into mods off with mods on you would have ppl doing it with ammo hacks. It dosent happend, so even if devs are mental and alow players to mod FM of airplanes or other stuff that is now locked, i doubt players with mods would be able to get into nods off servers.

[Strewth]

Some obviously don't remember the debacle on MSCFS years ago.
You would go online in a spit or something similar and have a WWI biplane zoom in and out rapidly, turning on a dime and firing the equivalent to 88mm shells at you.
It lost its fun instantly and killed the game.

This is still {IMHO} the best flight sim available and yes, it has a couple of quirks. But let the people who own and develop the software do their job.

"Please sir". "May I do my own mods?"
"I only want to tweak the settings in order to make the aircraft more "realistic" in my opinion."
"I promise no one will try to take advantage of it online."
"Honest Mister."

[Hotaru_Ito]

Of course, if FM mods would affect multiplayer, that's a good reason for not allowing them. And if they're legally or technically off the table, that's another thing. But how could they be abused on "mods off" servers, when existing weapon mods apparently aren't?

 

PS. Just to be clear, I don't seriously expect moddable FMs to happen. I assume if it were going to, it would have long ago. It's just an item on my wish list, and I'm not being sarcastic when I say it shouldn't be done if it really would foul up multiplayer.

Edited November 2, 2022 by Hotaru_Ito

[Gambit21]

51 minutes ago, Strewth said:

This is still {IMHO} the best flight sim available and yes, it has a couple of quirks. 

 There isn’t a better flight game around. 

 

It’s also a very good flight sim - doing both well is unusual.

[FuriousMeow]

1 hour ago, Hotaru_Ito said:

 But how could they be abused on "mods off" servers, when existing weapon mods apparently aren't?

 

 

 

I don't know what the data transfers are for multiplayer, but if its just each client sending very basic data like "hit with 30 7.62mm to x part" and that's it, then the side being damaged can lookup on its own that its been hit by the appropriate weapon. This is a very basic explanation and I don't know how damage is transmitted in multiplayer, but in singleplayer it could easily go with the local values that are locally set for damage.

 

FM is local no matter what, so there is no data being sent that could be contradicted by the receiving side. So locally it could be a Me262 powered Nieuport 17 and there's nothing the other side could say about it because that isn't being transmitted.

 

That's a lot of assumption, but I've never seen anything good coming about by allowing FM to be unlocked.

[Hotaru_Ito]

15 minutes ago, FuriousMeow said:

 

I don't know what the data transfers are for multiplayer, but if its just each client sending very basic data like "hit with 30 7.62mm to x part" and that's it, then the side being damaged can lookup on its own that its been hit by the appropriate weapon. This is a very basic explanation and I don't know how damage is transmitted in multiplayer, but in singleplayer it could easily go with the local values that are locally set for damage.

 

FM is local no matter what, so there is no data being sent that could be contradicted by the receiving side. So locally it could be a Me262 powered Nieuport 17 and there's nothing the other side could say about it because that isn't being transmitted.

 

That's a lot of assumption, but I've never seen anything good coming about by allowing FM to be unlocked.

 

Thanks, that's a good explanation! It didn't occur to me that there might be a difference in how data is transmitted between weapon and damage info and flight models. If so, that could explain why weapon mods are OK but FM mods are not.

[DBFlyguy]

@Wardog5711

 

Questions for the ENG Q & A next week:

 

• What is the status of fuel system update and drop tanks implementation? Will they be released this year (2022)?
• Has "Air Marshall" be shelved indefinitely?
• Is there any consideration with doing away with engine timers?
• Are there any concrete plans to make a flyable allied medium bomber (B-25 or B-26) in the near future?
• What helps determine the next collector plane/battle of? Do customers have any input in the decision process?

[CountZero]

Regarding engine timers:

Why recharg is differant on differant airplanes when its something that didnt exist in real world, and it dosent seam like better build engines have faster recharg or less powerfule engines have less recharg time, it look totaly random, some airplanes recharg 1min in 1min, some 1min in 3min, and then some 1min in 13min. Unhistorical thing that heavy dictates flow of airbattle.

Why messages about when timers run out and get recharged dont show up in techchat when techchat is turned on, why they show up only when instrument panel is turned on also. Instrument panel option have nothing to do with techchat and is not used , as it turns on other options that are not liked like techchat options is, so why pair thouse two together. Player should be informed about this crutial info that kills its engine, and as it was not so strickt in real world, or recharg didnt even exist, if this messages dont work, no way to know when timer run out or is recharged.

Edited November 3, 2022 by CountZero

[Guest deleted@83466]

7 minutes ago, CountZero said:

Regarding engine timers:

Why recharg is differant on differant airplanes when its something that didnt exist in real world, and it dosent seam like better build engines have faster recharg or less powerfule engines have less recharg time, it look totaly random, some airplanes recharg 1min in 1min, some 1min in 3min, and then some 1min in 13min. Unhistorical thing that heavy dictates flow of airbattle.

Why messages about when timers run out and get recharged dont show up in techchat when techchat is turned on, why they show up only when instrument panel is turned on also. Instrument panel option have nothing to do with techchat and is not used , as it turns on other options that are not liked like techchat options is, so why pair thouse two together. Player should be informed about this crutial info that kills its engine, and as it was not so strickt in real world, or recharg didnt even exist, if this messages dont work, no way to know when timer run out or recharged.

 

If it has to be done by timers at all, maybe it’s a good thing that timer info doesn’t show up in tech tips, because if people aren’t sure if they’ve run the engine too hard, it’s an incentive not to push it any more than necessary.  It’s not like theres some Crew Chief waiting on the ground, that’s going to kick your butt for being too hard on his engine.

 

 

Edited November 3, 2022 by SeaSerpent