New Pico Neo4 standalone device: Pancake lenses, 2160x2160 per eye and 429€.

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Yeah but be patient.

 

I'll take my time, even if it arrives, end of week the earliest. Don't know about chili, but he's also a busy man afaik.

[simfan2015]

OK, thank you.

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

13 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

These are the routers recommended by ggodin:

 

Asus AX1800S (69$)

Netgear WAX202 (49$)

TP-Link C6/A6 (38-45$)

By the way, I just checked the terms. 

 

I said I bought the Asus RT AX55. That is the one you quoted as "AX1800S", with S indicating a plural. Ax1800 is a standard though, which however does not reflect the actual router's capabilities, there is also Xiaomi AX1800 which we want to avoid, and more.

 

So I got the #1 recommendation. The model / product is called Asus RT AX55, if you want to get it. 

 

It's a bit more expensive in Europe than he quoted..

 

 

Edited October 17, 2022 by SCG_Fenris_Wolf

[simfan2015]

My PICO 4 is here.

I have taken some quick pictures of the headset.

It is even smallet than I thought (I am new to VR though).

Still charging.

The quick and so called 'full manual' is in the box, but if people (like me) have

 to figure things out with it ... then I'll never get into IL-2 VR.

But ... Google is our friend and the people here are of course very knowledgable about all this.

If this PICO 4 is not what I hope for then ... there are always kids that would cherish this for sure !

 

Since I have never seen (in life) nor used a VR headset I won't be able to report it being better -or- worse than a.o. the HP G2, Quest 2 ...

 but I do have an LG OLED and game in 4K Ultra so I am ready to be ... disappointed.

 

Fingers crossed.

 

 

 

  

 

[chiliwili69]

Comparing the three nice contenders: (In the DCS the Pico4 images look so ugly, but it the other the Pico looks nice)

 

1 hour ago, simfan2015 said:

the people here are of course very knowledgable about all this

Sure! let us know how it goes with IL-2. We can help you.

My first VR device was the Oculus DK1 (640x800 per eye and 60Hz) and I was blown away. I can not imagine if my first device have had 2160x2160 and pancake lenses!

[simfan2015]

Chiliwilly69.. Thanks. 

I have been able to get it all up and running, but not IL-2... Yet. 

Blown away... Sure, indeed, without any doubt... But about VR yes... But unfortunately not the... pico 4. 

It does work fine, as designed I am sure. 

But, sorry for my rant because of ignorance, with this so called 105 degrees FOV I, personally, still feel kind of claustrofobic... tunnel-vision like. 

Sharpness, brightness and resolution are also not what I hoped it might have been. 

Also the pico 4 lenses seem only Sharp in the center, but not at the edges. 

That is Strange because these pancake lenses are not supposed to be like that? 

If the hp reverb g2 edge sharpness is worse then.... Oh my! 

I use virtual desktop over wifi 6, but I think there are a lot of settings stil not optimal. 

I will have to learn and experiment. 

But again VR itself feels like Magic. 

Especially No Man’s Sky VR was a completely other experience. 

I hope I will be able to start il-2 in VR asap. 

I bought il-2 and dcs from the 1c and ED stores, so these are not recognized by SteamVR!? 

Because it was not started by SteamVR itself it hangs after VR is selected in the il-2 launcher !? 

Believe it or not but despite my very initial personal Impressions about the pico 4 I will go through with it and will try to make VR with the pico 4 as good as it gets. 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 18, 2022 by simfan2015

[Drum]

In the Video Chilli just posted, the Pico4's screen clarity looks the same from center to the edges, while both the Index and G2's lenses get blurrier the further from center viewed.  The pancake lenses will present a more natural viewing experience because you can view everything equally clear everywhere on the lenses with eye movement only.  My G2 required me to move my whole head like an owl's even within the initial narrow confines of what the lenes can view without head movement.

 

That little change alone will make your experience better then you'd know otherwise, trust me.  That's one of the two reasons I like the Aero HMD; it feels natural to turn my head when my eyes reach the outer edges of the lens area because of the consistency of clarity, as opposed to the improved clarity alone.

 

[simfan2015]

Thanks for the explanation Drum. 

The Aero... learned about it here. 

In time I might upgrade to it or similar HMD, but first I have to try to adapt the settings for the pico 4 because I am not yet using it properly. 

My vr settings are most probably far from what those should be. 

I bought the pico 4 for il-2, so if can get il-2 to work in VR I will be very happy, regardless of whether this PICO VR headset is great or not (I can't compare being a VR newbie). 

Edited October 19, 2022 by simfan2015

[Drum]

The tweaking is still the worse part.  ?

[chiliwili69]

10 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

with this so called 105 degrees FOV I, personally, still feel kind of claustrofobic... tunnel-vision like.

 

Yes, almost all devices reduce your human natural FOV. (Pimax headsets is another story).

This is something you will get used to, but according to the users the Pico4 has better FOVs (specially vertical) than all other devices except Index (and Pimax of course).

In the Index heaset you have a system to change the distance to the lenses, so the closer the more FOV. Have to tried to remove the mask in the Pico4?

Do you use glasses? There is a tool in Steam called RovTest where you can measure FOVs, just to be sure they are aligened with other people.

10 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

Also the pico 4 lenses seem only Sharp in the center, but not at the edges. 

That is Strange because these pancake lenses are not supposed to be like that? 

If the hp reverb g2 edge sharpness is worse then.... Oh my!

 

Yeap, people claim the Pico4 is best in edge-to-edge clarity. So, perhaps is something related to configuration.

One of the biggest problems (in most of people) of the G2 is lack of clarity on edges.

Do you suffer that when using VD or also in other standalone apps/games of Pico4?

10 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

I bought il-2 and dcs from the 1c and ED stores, so these are not recognized by SteamVR!? 

Because it was not started by SteamVR itself it hangs after VR is selected in the il-2 launcher !?

 

You need to set the IL-2 settings to use VR (in VR launcher or in game menu), then launch the game and SteamVR should launch automatically.

 

You need previously to install Steam in your PC, so Steam installs also SteamVR.

3 hours ago, Drum said:

My G2 required me to move my whole head like an owl's even within the initial narrow confines of what the lenes can view without head movement.

Yes, This is one of the main reason why I discarded the G2 in favour of Index. Let´s see this Pico4. It should arrive this week hopefully.

1 hour ago, simfan2015 said:

In time I might upgrade to it

According to people in this section the Aero is the greatest device regarding resolution and clarity. But they said it has a reduced vertical FOV. For, being this a combat flgiht sim, have a good FOV is a priority. Perhaps one day the Varjo people create an Aero with better FOV.

[simfan2015]

Thank you chilliwilly.

Quite some remarks that ... I will have to double-check asap.

I don't have any standalone PICO Store VR game yet (only PICO VD on my PICO 4).

I do have Steam as well as SteamVR (works fine with a.o. NMS and yesterday I bought "Warplanes : Pacific ...", on steam, a VR-only game to test my PICO controllers).

I use Virtual Desktop, that is where I may have a problem ???  

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Which router do you use to transmit the data stream?

 

Step by step man.

 

Have a PC capable of driving the necessary FPS at high resolution.

Have the right router as a dedicated device.

Set up router first, properly.

Set up the Pico 4.

Set up VD properly with the dedicated router.

When comparing to other headsets, keep ceteris paribus intact (e.g. same res, same refresh rate).

[simfan2015]

@SGC : Router should be OK (?), I get around 500 Mbps speed (reported in VD).

No Man's Sky VR with EPIC settings works fine on my PICO 4.

I hope to get IL-2 running like that too (?).

The router is from my internet provider.

Maybe I should buy the WiFi dongle that PICOXR will release one of the coming months !?

Edited October 19, 2022 by simfan2015

[dburne]

4 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

According to people in this section the Aero is the greatest device regarding resolution and clarity. But they said it has a reduced vertical FOV. For, being this a combat flgiht sim, have a good FOV is a priority. Perhaps one day the Varjo people create an Aero with better FOV.

 

Yes specifically the edge to edge clarity is phenomenal. The vertical FOV does not really bother me probably due to the clarity.

I have flown many hours with the Aero and flight sims since getting it in late Jan. Judging by the comments on Discord it is not much an issue.

I do look forward to hearing more reports on the Pico 4.

[simfan2015]

1 hour ago, dburne said:

I do look forward to hearing more reports on the Pico 4

@dburne. But if you already have one-of-the-best HMDs, this "Aero" then what do you hope could possibly improve upon it by any cheap 'PICO 4' HMD ?

That Varje Aero headset is just ... what I long for.

Sorry, just curious.

I hope other people here will report on the PICO 4 experience as well because I am too ignorant about VR and headsets in general,

 but I will try.

Edited October 19, 2022 by simfan2015

[dburne]

3 minutes ago, simfan2015 said:

@dburne. But if you already have one-of-the-best HMDs, this "Aero" then what do you hope could possibly improve upon it by any cheap 'PICO 4' HMD ?

That Varje Aero headset is just ... what I long for.

Sorry, just curious.

 

No not for my consumption but just my curiosity and keeping up with what is out there and what it can do. No I don't see anything replacing my Aero on the horizon yet. Thankfully lol. My wallet is enjoying a well deserved break at the moment.

Edited October 19, 2022 by dburne

[BOO]

Well after my grand re-entry into MP I can honestly say that the ability to spot in VR is not something I have to worry about! It cant be any worse!!

[simfan2015]

The PICO 4 now performs marvelously !

The IPD setting was wrong, seems I have an IPD of more than 70.

Everything looks tack sharp now, almost till the edges.

Elite Dangerous is simply out-of-this-world.

But please help me regarding IL-2 ! ...

If I start it using the normal non-steam il2 exe (I bought everything on the 1C website) then it does not

 trigger SteamVR and simply hangs (black screen).

If I add it to Steam and then have it added to SteamVR (in options) then it does appear as 

 a VR game in the SteamVR desktop, but before it starts -in-VR it first request to go online and 1C "link" my Account

 to Steam.

I did not buy Bos on Steam though, everything from the 1C Website !

Should I now be forced to again buy every module and collector's planes/vehicles from Steam to make IL-2 work in SteamVR ???).

Do you need 2 installs of IL-2 ... 1 from Website and 1 from Steam to play IL-2 in VR ???

Please help. 

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by simfan2015

[firdimigdi]

8 minutes ago, simfan2015 said:

The PICO 4 now performs marvelously !

The IPD setting was wrong, seems I have an IPD of more than 70.

Everything looks tack sharp now, almost till the edges.

Elite Dangerous is simply out-of-this-world.

But please help me regarding IL-2 ! ...

If I start it using the normal non-steam il2 exe (I bought everything on the 1C website) then it does not

 trigger SteamVR and simply hangs (black screen).

If I add it to Steam and then have it added to SteamVR (in options) then it does appear as 

 a VR game in the SteamVR desktop, but before it starts -in-VR it first request to go online and 1C "link" my Account

 to Steam.

I did not buy Bos on Steam though, everything from the 1C Website !

Should I now be forced to again buy every module and collector's planes/vehicles from Steam to make IL-2 work in SteamVR ???).

Do you need 2 installs of IL-2 ... 1 from Website and 1 from Steam to play IL-2 in VR ???

Please help. 

 

 

Don't bother with Steam at all - close it. Simply start SteamVR before you start IL-2.

 

To be clear: run <path to Steam Library>\steamapps\common\SteamVR\bin\win64\vrmonitor.exe - you don't need Steam to be active for this.

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by Firdimigdi

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

6 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

@SGC : Router should be OK (?), I get around 500 Mbps speed (reported in VD).

No Man's Sky VR with EPIC settings works fine on my PICO 4.

I hope to get IL-2 running like that too (?).

The router is from my internet provider.

Maybe I should buy the WiFi dongle that PICOXR will release one of the coming months !?

That's quite the suboptimal setup. Given that you're still amazed by the results fills me with hope.

 

My Pico is still on its way. Our local DHL broke down, they got high Corona infection rates, have trouble delivering, as there are no replacement drivers. I'm supposed to pick mine up tomorrow from a centralised warehouse... 

 

I'll test the TP-Link Archer C6 and Asus RT-AX55 with it. 

1 hour ago, simfan2015 said:

The PICO 4 now performs marvelously !

The IPD setting was wrong, seems I have an IPD of more than 70.

Everything looks tack sharp now, almost till the edges.

Elite Dangerous is simply out-of-this-world.

But please help me regarding IL-2 ! ...

If I start it using the normal non-steam il2 exe (I bought everything on the 1C website) then it does not

 trigger SteamVR and simply hangs (black screen).

If I add it to Steam and then have it added to SteamVR (in options) then it does appear as 

 a VR game in the SteamVR desktop, but before it starts -in-VR it first request to go online and 1C "link" my Account

 to Steam.

I did not buy Bos on Steam though, everything from the 1C Website !

Should I now be forced to again buy every module and collector's planes/vehicles from Steam to make IL-2 work in SteamVR ???).

Do you need 2 installs of IL-2 ... 1 from Website and 1 from Steam to play IL-2 in VR ???

Please help. 

 

Wait until next week, will help.

 

I got to push something, I'm working on it until Monday morning. I hope to get the work done before the weekend though. 

 

Before that, neither you nor Boo should judge it yet, send it back, or do any knee-jerk reactions, because it's not easy to setup VR properly especially with IL-2 - as you have noticed.

 

And don't rebuy the game, what the hell is going through your head sometimes? Have patience young padawan, go prepare the garden for winter or something. 

 

P.S.

Out of all the through-the-lens shots Tyriel has taken, it's only the DCS one which is out of focus for the Pico 4. How did he not notice that? Simply compare it to the other games' shots... 

[chiliwili69]

3 hours ago, BOO said:

Well after my grand re-entry into MP I can honestly say that the ability to spot in VR is not something I have to worry about! It cant be any worse!!

 

So, are you talking about Pico4 VR? did IL-2 work for you?

2 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

Should I now be forced to again buy every module and collector's planes/vehicles from Steam to make IL-2 work in SteamVR ???).

Do you need 2 installs of IL-2 ... 1 from Website and 1 from Steam to play IL-2 in VR ??

 

No, you don´t need two IL-2.

The one you bought from 1C website is the one that should work.

I understand that IL-2 works normal with your monitor, right?

 

Normally when I launch IL-2 (I also bought it from 1C website) then SteamVR launch automatically. And from there it goes to the login section of IL-2.

 

You can lso try to leave SteamVR open and then launch IL-2 from the IL-2 launcher but checking the VR checkbox.

 

 

Deeper analisis of Pico4 (in spanish):

https://www.realovirtual.com/articulos/6157/analisis-pico-4

 

Some impression of a user of FS:

 

So the Pico 4 arrived, quick set-up and software update. Feels different to wear than what I am used to - very light and also very small so the nosepiece touches your nose (tried the glasses spacer but couldn’t get on with it). I think it’s something I will get used to and overall very light and comfortable to wear, I feel the mask cushion will soften quite quickly.
Bear in mind I only have the G2 and Q2 to compare - never tried anything else. The picture quality is excellent, very rich and deep colours and the interface is just like Q2 home.
Downloaded Virtual Desktop and fired up MSFS 2020. First impressions are excellent, picture quality is very crisp, clear with ‘deeper’ colours - a better picture than my G2 in my opinion. Steam VR was running the resolution at 3800 x 3800 and performance was excellent.

Tried wired streaming with a ‘for purpose’ usb cable using the wired streaming app. Resolution very poor - so still seems a work in progress.

However, in Virtual desktop I get a crackly ‘glitch’ every few seconds so there is still some work to be done. Don’t have time to experiment any more for a day or two but overall impressions very positive - a definite step up in my opinion from both the G2 and Q2 in terms of picture quality and comfort. Oh and the controllers are capacitive and excellent.

 

source: https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/pico-4-what-do-you-think/546978/17

Edited October 19, 2022 by chiliwili69

[simfan2015]

Thank you all so much... Problems solved!!! 

Il-2 GB and DCS now are booting fine in VR with PICO4 and Virtual Desktop ! 

As people here instructed I now only started vrmonitor for SteamVR and not Steam itself. That made it work. 

Il-2, DCS and elite dangerous became new far superior games in VR, not comparable to my former pancake versions. 

There is still a very annoying glitch... the il-2 and DCS loading screens jump/jitter/shiver all over the place until the game and or missions are completely loaded. 

My guess is that my rtx 3070 GPU can't keep up!? 

But I feel that my 'investment' in sims is now worth twice as much. 

Who knows, Imay now also be joining those people shouting... No VR, no Buy! ?

Of course, although thanks to advice I got VR is now also my gaming habit there are, imho, still all those drawbacks that make VR way more difficult to fully enjoy and relax. 

The pico 4's resolution and sharpness, as well as FOV is a far Cry from my experience in 4K 2D epic settings. 

Il-2 epic settings in pancake 120 fps, vr same setting 2820x2820... 45 fps @90 hz... at most. 

DCS is far worse... 20 up to 40 fps in ultra settings (unchanged 4k 2d settings). 

But I expected no more with an rtx 3070 OC, 12700k, ddr5. 

1 problem with Star Wars Squadrons... VR does not seem to work with the pico 4, whatever I tried (suggestion in forums). 

The 'Warplanes' (Arcade! ) SteamVR only games are, of course, superb in VR. 

Those are also pico store launch titles.

I bought those just to test the new controllers. 

No man's sky also looks superb in VR, but there is still , AFAIK, no gamepad nor hotas support in VR! 

Using the pico 4 controllers in NMS somehow feels 'wrong' to me. 

I will, of course, keep my pico 4. 

But I do believe that an HMD like the Aero or Pimax might still be an insanely better experience !? 

In addition a faster pc system would, as we all know, be iceing on the cake. 

Thank you all again. 

 

 

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by simfan2015

[BOO]

2 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

So, are you talking about Pico4 VR? did IL-2 work for you?

 

Oh sorry no. Mearly commenting that even win 2D my spotting ability is awful so VR will hardly impact there! 

[SCG_Redcloud111]

10 hours ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

And don't rebuy the game, what the hell is going through your head sometimes? Have patience young padawan, go prepare the garden for winter or something. 

Hilarious! 

6 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

No man's sky also looks superb in VR, but there is still , AFAIK, no gamepad nor hotas support in VR! 

I am interested to know how it works in NMS. Have you checked to see if there are any custom configurations for the Pico controllers?

[simfan2015]

@SCG_Redcloud. I can check how I can re-map the PICO 4 controllers to be more intuitive (for me personally) in NMS.

I did not get my gamepad (xbox like, a Logitech F710) to work.

NMS 2D was made with the XBOX controller in mind, but not NMS VR it seems.

AFAIK NMS VR is made with Quest 2 controllers in mind and will thus be re-used for the NMS PS5/PS VR2 controller setup.

On Youtube I found some instruction videos on how to re-map a hotas (for flight only of course) to make it look like a Quest 2 controller ... work-arounds.

Will further look into re-mapping (searching on the Web, forums), but I was far more interested how I could get IL-2 , DCS and ED to work in VR and with my HOTAS.

@SCG_Fenris_Wolf Believe it or not but I would re-buy IL-2 to get it to work in VR. I tought I had to (only) buy BoS again and link my Steam Account to the 1C account !

After having 'invested' quite a bit of money (like everyone around here I guess) in simming ... spending a bit more is no issue.

If not for Virtual Desktop PICO 4 support I would never have bougt this headset, but VD HEVC works wonders at 150 Mbps.

I see NO glitches/artifacts using VD because of HEVC (de-)compression -my wifi router can go up to at least 900 Mbps- but I do feel native PICO 4 menu visuals are sharper.

I also bought an active USB-C cable, but reading here (see thread above) wired connection still being an 'after-tought', unlike Q2 Airlink, I better stay with VD !?

Interested to get some in-depth and genuine PICO 4 feedback from VR experts here.

[chiliwili69]

9 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

Thank you all so much... Problems solved!!! 

Il-2 GB and DCS now are booting fine in VR with PICO4 and Virtual Desktop

Congrats!  Glad to see that IL-2 is fully functional with Pico4!

9 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

There is still a very annoying glitch... the il-2 and DCS loading screens jump/jitter/shiver all over the place until the game and or missions are completely loaded.

Yes, this is a known problem of some devices (not Index). The solution is to close the eyes. Unless someone know how to solve this.

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

VD performs better than airlink or link for the Q2 as well. What router are you using? 

 

Pimax and Aero both have their downsides, e.g. for the former of them being very fiddly and not working with almost anything out of the box, a lot of time spent maintenance, a bleak picture regarding colors and low brightness with grey blacks, breaking at times by bricking itself, bad sound quality, high weight and cumbersome, light leakage, or the latter the tiniest FOV you've ever seen, no sound, uncomfortable to wear or take off especially with added headphones, both without passthrough, a geometrically unstable picture, no motion smoothing, an inefficient distortion profile, high weight to the front, hearing the fan especially when turning head fast. Both require extremely strong GPUs to get an acceptable pictures that reflect their theoretical capabilities.

 

Some people run them using NIS or the AMD's upscaler - defeating the purpose of a high-resolution headset to begin with, or run at just balanced/lower game details, or accept lower refreshrates than 90Hz (which is the worst hit on moving image quality you can take, affecting gunnery and identification like nothing else).

 

Due to these compromises, depending on how the distortion profile performs, the color range and contrast is, how stable the picture is, how stable the wireless solution, how comfortable the headset is, the Pico 4 might turn out to be better than these two regarding the full package. Resolution and framerate depend on the hardware in the big box and on how efficient distortion profile is.

 

For comparison, you can get an 8K IPS screen but if you run it at 8K*30Hz or at 4K*60Hz and if it's just 45" in size, it's not going to beat one that is closer to OLED color-wise at 4K*60Hz and runs at the same overall performance while offering 65"...

 

 

...so my point is, you don't need to feel like you were missing anything. We'll have unbiased experience reports soon. 

 

 

P.S. Did you have the Aero as well @chiliwili69 ?

Edited October 20, 2022 by SCG_Fenris_Wolf

[chiliwili69]

10 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

Il-2 epic settings in pancake 120 fps, vr same setting 2820x2820... 45 fps @90 hz... at most.

 

Your CPU i7-12700K is quite capable of running IL-2 VR at 90Hz, but you bottleneck here is your GPU.

You can try to run the Pico4 at 72Hz, this change not only help to reduce your GPU load but also produce a bit better images for the same bitrate of VD (150Mbps HVEC).

I see also that 2820x2820 is having about 170% StreamVR SS. This is too much as well for your GPU. Try to lower that until you are at 72fps (with 72Hz mode).

10 hours ago, simfan2015 said:

I will, of course, keep my pico 4. 

But I do believe that an HMD like the Aero or Pimax might still be an insanely better experience !? 

Glad to see you liked, but as you see, VR mode is like a drug, nothing is enough good, we always want more. The perfect device doesn´t exist yet.

[simfan2015]

Warning : if you get your PICO 4 and try to use the Quick SeeThrough feature by double clicking on the right hand side of the HMD then do not think it is malfuntioning

 if, initially, it does not seem to work.

I already thought to RMA my PICO until I read on a website (but about other headsets, not the PICO 4) that you have to doble-tap REAL HARD to make this work !

I wish there was a way to reassign the PICO controller button for e.g. taking a screenshot to allow for this see-through feature instead.

It is not easy to double tap that hard with controllers in both hands !

 

@chilliwilly69. thank you for those tips, I will reduce from 90 to 72 Hz again (until I ever get that RTX 4080). 

4 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

Yes, this is a known problem of some devices (not Index). The solution is to close the eyes. Unless someone know how to solve this.

There is a MOD for DCS :

https://forum.dcs.world/topic/289206-solved-disable-loading-screen-for-vr-new-mod/

I did not test it yet though.

Don't think this will really be necessary for IL-2 since of course loading in general does not take that long as in DCS !?

[simfan2015]

Pro and Enterprise pico 4 models not available outside of China!... 

https://uploadvr.com/pico-4-pro-not-outside-china/

 

[dburne]

A pretty in depth review of the Pico 4.

 

 

[chiliwili69]

9 hours ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

P.S. Did you have the Aero as well @chiliwili69 ?

I didn´t took the Aero because the limited vertical FOV.

[firdimigdi]

9 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

The solution is to close the eyes. Unless someone know how to solve this.

 

With SteamVR this option allowed me to simply look down or to the side and it would fade to the SteamVR environment while loading:

 

With OpenComposite there is no such problem as the image turns black and shows a loading indicator.

[WIS-Redcoat]

On 10/19/2022 at 3:33 AM, chiliwili69 said:

 

Yeap, people claim the Pico4 is best in edge-to-edge clarity. So, perhaps is something related to configuration.

One of the biggest problems (in most of people) of the G2 is lack of clarity on edges.

 

 

I can attest that edge to edge clarity is often undervalued.  Being able to move your eyes and not your head is a huge comfort gain.  If the Pico gives you that it'll pay off in spades.

 

9 hours ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

 

  the latter (AERO)  the tiniest FOV you've ever seen, no sound, uncomfortable to wear or take off especially with added headphones, both without passthrough, a geometrically unstable picture, no motion smoothing, an inefficient distortion profile, high weight to the front, hearing the fan especially when turning head fast. Both require extremely strong GPUs to get an acceptable pictures that reflect their theoretical capabilities.

 

 

 

...so my point is, you don't need to feel like you were missing anything. We'll have unbiased experience reports soon. 

 

 

Yep, very unbiased!   Spoken like a man not on a weird crusade.  

 

1. Most comfortable I've ever owned. 

2. Using my own audio ended up being a (surprising) blessing

3. Passthrough?  seriously that made your list?  I have never used a "passthrough" once in my life but if that makes your list of critical items... cool.  

4. I don't know what "geometrically unstable" means.  Are you making things up?

5. Edge to edge clarity made the FOV seem fine ( I wish it was bigger)

6. I never used motion smoothing, never like the drawbacks.  However it is literally a month away for those that want it.

7. inefficient distortion profile?  Are you just writing things again?  Are you suggesting performance is bad or something?

8.  high weight to the front?  Nah.  Maybe you couldn't figure out the complex adjustments?

9. hearing the fan especially when turning head fast?  What?  Is this like you claiming index audio flings around your head when you look?  Might simply be you at this point.

10.  Both require extremely strong GPUs    - Performance is identical to the G2, so if that is a metric to list as "bad" then ok.

 

Strangely, you didn't mention that it's expensive and you can't turn it off!   That actually annoys me.

 

9 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

VR mode is like a drug, nothing is enough good, we always want more. The perfect device doesn´t exist yet.

 

I doubt it ever will exist.  I almost wish I still had the old Oculus so I could remember how far we have come.  that first time I put it on and was sitting in the cockpit was a transformative moment for me.

[dburne]

2 hours ago, WIS-Redcoat said:

 

1. Most comfortable I've ever owned. 

2. Using my own audio ended up being a (surprising) blessing

3. Passthrough?  seriously that made your list?  I have never used a "passthrough" once in my life but if that makes your list of critical items... cool.  

4. I don't know what "geometrically unstable" means.  Are you making things up?

5. Edge to edge clarity made the FOV seem fine ( I wish it was bigger)

6. I never used motion smoothing, never like the drawbacks.  However it is literally a month away for those that want it.

7. inefficient distortion profile?  Are you just writing things again?  Are you suggesting performance is bad or something?

8.  high weight to the front?  Nah.  Maybe you couldn't figure out the complex adjustments?

9. hearing the fan especially when turning head fast?  What?  Is this like you claiming index audio flings around your head when you look?  Might simply be you at this point.

10.  Both require extremely strong GPUs    - Performance is identical to the G2, so if that is a metric to list as "bad" then ok.

 

Strangely, you didn't mention that it's expensive and you can't turn it off!   That actually annoys me.

 

 

I doubt it ever will exist.  I almost wish I still had the old Oculus so I could remember how far we have come.  that first time I put it on and was sitting in the cockpit was a transformative moment for me.

 

 

Yep I am with  you on the Aero the above pretty much sums up my experience with it as well. And normally I use my Aero several hours each day. Have had a little break here recently due to health reasons but should be back in it full bore in next week or two. I am so loving the aero. I am so used to the FOV it does not bother me at all. Horizontal I think is little better than Reverb G2, vertical is fairly small. But I will take image clarity over FOV any day. And that edge to edge clarity is supreme.  If the Pico 4 delivers similar as well then that would be great. Just a shame they did not include native display port with it. 

 

I still have my original Oculus CV1 but just don't have the heart to hook it up again. Yeah we have come extremely far.

[simfan2015]

Everyone is requesting DP uncompressed connection and with good reason. But I, personally, will never go wired after my pico 4, even if it means IQ is worse. Wireless and good color passthru are a match made in heaven. 

I am because of this so glad I chose the pico 4 over the hp reverb g2, even if IQ suffers a bit. 

I am now blown away by my pico 4 vr experience. 

Thanks to advice from experts here like advice to select 72 hz over 90 hz because of my rtx 3070 OC Visuals are now sharper indeed! 

Il-2 GB and DCS is a blast in VR, also with the pico. 

Virtual desktop : il-2 will not start in VR if full screen is selected... It hangs (because of different resolution between my vr headset and my windows desktop?) 

Virtual desktop does not allow star wars Squadrons to be played in VR, but with the pico streaming app it works fine (but Visuals are noticeably less Sharp compared to VD streaming !) 

But at least I can now play star wars Squadrons in VR with the native pico software. 

VD is far better though regarding IQ, so I will use it as much as possible. 

VR is indeed a drug. 

I will never go back to pancake I guess and will select or reject sims and games because it either has or lacks VR support. 

IMHO Buying everything il-2 GB, clod and dcs has proven a wise 'investment', also because of superb VR support. 

 

PS. Another reason why I picked the pico 4 over the hp reverb g2 is that hp may very well stop selling vr headsets next year : 

https://uploadvr.com/rumor-hp-reverb-g2-exiting-vr/

 

 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2022 by simfan2015

[BOO]

@chiliwili69

@SCG_Fenris_Wolf

Am I right in thinking both you chaps ordered the PICO4? If so I await your opinion with interest. 

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Picked mine up today and after a few silly questions of mine, ggodin the maker of Virtual Desktop helped me set it up. Without him, with onboard streaming or usb cable, it would've looked like a Q2... night and day difference now. All praise to him. Great chap, lucky he was there!!

 

I'm very busy IRL right now, I'll write a guide how to properly set it up and a review both on Monday. I'm sure to get some spicey comments as already happened above, as it seems to be offering the same degrees of clarity as the Aero while coming with a higher FOV, a great binocular overlap, and several other advantages - as well as some disadvantages I'll also point out. Spoiler: Compression is not one of them, the IQ is as with a DP cable using the freshly released new Virtual Desktop version. Several dozen settings to possibly set wrong though!

 

 

The dedicated router the guide to setup will cover will be a TP Link Archer C6. If you do not have one but ordered a Pico 4, I suggest getting one.

 

P.S. If you drive this thing to the max transmission wise, it won't stay wireless for long. Needs power connected, but hey, that's for IL-2 anyway. So noo.. it's not wireless in this use-case 

Edited October 20, 2022 by SCG_Fenris_Wolf

[dburne]

1 hour ago, simfan2015 said:

Everyone is requesting DP uncompressed connection and with good reason. But I, personally, will never go wired after my pico 4, even if it means IQ is worse. Wireless and good color passthru are a match made in heaven. 

I am because of this so glad I chose the pico 4 over the hp reverb g2, even if IQ suffers a bit. 

I am now blown away by my pico 4 vr experience. 

Thanks to advice from experts here like advice to select 72 hz over 90 hz because of my rtx 3070 OC Visuals are now sharper indeed! 

Il-2 GB and DCS is a blast in VR, also with the pico. 

Virtual desktop : il-2 will not start in VR if full screen is selected... It hangs (because of different resolution between my vr headset and my windows desktop?) 

Virtual desktop does not allow star wars Squadrons to be played in VR, but with the pico streaming app it works fine (but Visuals are noticeably less Sharp compared to VD streaming !) 

But at least I can now play star wars Squadrons in VR with the native pico software. 

VD is far better though regarding IQ, so I will use it as much as possible. 

VR is indeed a drug. 

I will never go back to pancake I guess and will select or reject sims and games because it either has or lacks VR support. 

IMHO Buying everything il-2 GB, clod and dcs has proven a wise 'investment', also because of superb VR support. 

 

PS. Another reason why I picked the pico 4 over the hp reverb g2 is that hp may very well stop selling vr headsets next year : 

https://uploadvr.com/rumor-hp-reverb-g2-exiting-vr/

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nice feedback I am sure it will be very helpful to folks considering getting one of these headsets.

[simfan2015]

@SCG_Fenris_Wolf I am so looking forward to your feedback and expert advice ... can't wait to also be able to fine tune my VD and other settings 

 like yours ! Wow, you got feedback from ggodin himself ... can't get better than this.

8 hours ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

drive this thing to the max transmission wise,

I would like to exceeds the transmission/compression limits too, I don't care if it kills the battery sooner either : I would prefer the best IQ from my PICO 4 !

There are still so many settings I have set wrong, no doubt, but even now IL-2 and DCS already look fine in VR.

As soon as I get your information/settings/assessment I will immediately mimic everything in my setup.

Unfotunately not only those settings are subpar in my case ... my IL-2 and DCS installs are still using the old 4K EPIC settings for my 'pancake' LG OLED display.

 

@chiliwili69

I hope you get your PICO 4 HMD soon so you may also share your findings !?

 

Thank you all.