Game version 4.705 discussion: Mosquito and some improvements

[derrick263]

7 hours ago, Han said:

 

We will fix that soon.

If you will just wait a bit - it will be closed automatically and mission will start.

Yes, that works fine. Thanks.

[Eisenfaustus]

37 minutes ago, Yogiflight said:

This is different between infantry and tanks, even if it is only an IFV, like in my case. In infantry, the platoon leader, who has the command over the platoon's fire, can not always see, what is happening. So, like you said, after the first shot, the soldiers fire on their own, until he gives order to stop. In a tank, the gunner calls out enemy, he recognized, but the commander gives the order to fire. Only in absolute selfdefense, so close distance and the enemy's gun already pointing at you, the gunner is allowed to shoot on his own. But this is the only exception.

I prefer my gunner to report kills rather then threats

Of course if situations where friendlies are expected in front (recon or screening forces) I‘d do it like you suggest - but otherwise our styles of leadership obviously differ

I‘m pretty sure Allies and Soviets handled it like you suggest - but for Wehrmacht units gunners engaging at will might be plausible. 

[Knochenlutscher]

I solved my Game no start Issue, I had to deactivate the stuff in JSGME.

I didn't found out, until I deinstalled Game and looked up remaining folders.

 

Deleted all Mods I had there, reinstalled everything, now fine.

 

Thanks for the Mossie Update, really exciting plane

[Regingrave-]

22 часа назад, J5_Winkelmann_VR сказал:

Issues I've encountered IN FC: balloons (both sides) remain at 50 mtrs alt. No winch-trucks visible. Ground-MG's are invisible but also cannot be damaged. I shot up an MG-nest, got good hits on the invisible Hotchkiss mdl.1914 but no joy. Instead it pumped my engine full of lead, again without any visible trace, no gun, no muzzle-flash, no tracers. I also saw a 13-pounder AA-gun nest without the gun firing, buth there were shell-burst in the sky above it.

Was it single player or multiplayer? Arras map in QM seems to be fine.

[Yogiflight]

28 minutes ago, Eisenfaustus said:

‘m pretty sure Allies and Soviets handled it like you suggest - but for Wehrmacht units gunners engaging at will might be plausible.

As I posted above, I was commander of a German IFV. The way fighting was trained in the Bundeswehr back then, is very close to how the Wehrmacht was fighting as the manuals were mainly taken over from the Wehrmacht.

 

33 minutes ago, Eisenfaustus said:

but otherwise our styles of leadership obviously differ

It has nothing to do with style of leadership. The commander leading the fire of his tank, is what is trained in Bundeswehr. The commander is the one, who has the best overview over the scenery, not the gunner through his gunsight.

 

 

1 hour ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

The problem is that IL2 caters to the desired play style of everyone. That includes people who like to drive, rather than be the gunner/commander. For those people, it is necessary to have the tank commander give the fire order whenever the mission logic says so, as otherwise the tank wouldn't ever fire. Having the gunner only fire after a human player would manually confirm the orders given by the mission logic would preclude the possibility of being a driver while the commander and gunner take care of the rest.

I get your point, but why did it work at the beginning of TC, that I was driving in commander position and changing to gunner position for shooting, without the gunner taking over control of the turret. It worked in all scripted missions.

[Eisenfaustus]

27 minutes ago, Yogiflight said:

As I posted above, I was commander of a German IFV. The way fighting was trained in the Bundeswehr back then, is very close to how the Wehrmacht was fighting as the manuals were mainly taken over from the Wehrmacht.

 

It has nothing to do with style of leadership. The commander leading the fire of his tank, is what is trained in Bundeswehr. The commander is the one, who has the best overview over the scenery, not the gunner through his gunsight.

I know, Kamerad - we both learned it there - just had differnt instructors obviously   

[jollyjack]

23 hours ago, Sneaksie said:

What particular bug you're talking about?

 

 

Might be the turret auto rotating thing, see Tigre88 extensive posts about this?

[senseispcc]

Thanks You! 

[150_GIAP-Red_Dragon]

The new mosquito is an impressively well done job! But I feel like I would like to get another option in the setting of this plane. I would like the option "engine sound in the cockpit like a hurricane" ?

[simfan2015]

I am so thrilled I am now able to fly the iconic mossie in DCS as well as il-2! 

The loadout and liveries here in il-2 are easier to pick and setup. 

Thank you for 4.705b, I have no problems with it AFAIK (but glad I waited for the hotfix before installing this update). 

Edited June 2, 2022 by simfan2015

[Bilbo_Baggins]

19 minutes ago, simfan2015 said:

I am so thrilled I am now able to fly the iconic mossie in DCS as well as il-2! 

The loadout and liveries here in il-2 are easier to pick and setup. 

Thank you for 4.705b, I have no problems with it AFAIK (but glad I waited for the hotfix before installing this update). 

 

Does the FM for the DCS machine differ much from our IL2 GB one? I was quite surprised by the very quick roll rate on this big kite!

[Praetorious]

19 hours ago, CountZero said:

On british engines its 3:1 , so you get 1 min of combat (or any other) timer back if you dont use combat for 3min. On american engines its 2:1.

Thank you Count,good formula to remember!!

[J99_Sizzlorr]

Balloons refuse to follow waypoints in multiplayer now. I can not make them go up and down anymore. With or without winch doesn't make any difference.

[Art-J]

8 hours ago, Bilbo_Baggins said:

 

Does the FM for the DCS machine differ much from our IL2 GB one? I was quite surprised by the very quick roll rate on this big kite!

 

Before simfan replies, I can chime in. Based only on my few brief flights on release day, It seems that in terms of initial FM impressions GB Mossie vs DCS Mossie is pretty much like GB Spit IX vs DCS Spit IX.:

a) GB Mossie is less responsive to elevator and rudder inputs, on the other hand...

b) GB Mossie picks up speed in shallow dives MUCH faster than DCS one. With econo power settings (7 lbs @ 2600) In typical shallow strafing run dives it goes up to 320 mph at pullup (DCS struggles to get to 280);

c) energy loss in turns seems to be similar - when climbing from the aforementioned strafing run and turning sharply for another, GB Mossie drops to 180-200 (DCS one to 140-160). So delta is comparable, but GB's higher entry speed makes a difference.

d) low altitudes speed performance seems comparable (keeping in mind that DCS Mossie represents non-shrouded exhaust config, but its FM seems to be based on shrouded one);

 

Apart from that, DCS Mossie is noticeably less directionally stable and more prone to adverse yaw, which makes aiming somewhat more challenging compared to GB version.

 

All and all, if you're silly enough to try to mix it up with '44-'45 single engine fighters, GB Mossie will delay your death sentence by a few minutes compared to DCS one :D, but both have similar overall feel anyway.

Edited June 3, 2022 by Art-J

[Yogiflight]

15 hours ago, TIGRE88 said:

 

they dont fire they see ??  

It makes me think of the tank turret bug... am I right? 
when the gunner is ordered to stop firing he doesn't shoot anymore but the turret starts to move by itself, as if the gunner sees a target that is invisible... because moreover he doesn't even point the gun at a present target but rather in the void. 

This is a bug that I've been fighting with for months... and that has been present for more than 1 year... and that I'm still waiting for the promise that it will be fixed after July as a member of the TC team told me.    

 

and I say it again and again, this bug only appears if the player's tank is linked to one or more tanks.  
in fact if the player's tank has no waypoint linked to it the problem does not appear. 
the waypoint is necessary to move a platoon of tanks linked to the player's tank.  

 

 

 

In your video, was the autopilot activated? If yes, then the turning of the turret, done by the AI gunner, makes sense, as he keeps the gun in enemy direction. This is what I, as tank commander would expect from my gunner, this is what gets trained. If you didn't activate the autopilot, then yes, the turret should stay in the position you leave it. Nice would be a key to get it back to 12 o°clock position without having to use the command menu (as you don't have the AI activated by autopilot).

[Pierre64]

[Regingrave-]

3 часа назад, J99_Sizzlorr сказал:

Balloons refuse to follow waypoints in multiplayer now. I can not make them go up and down anymore. With or without winch doesn't make any difference.

Thank you for the report! Yes, unfortunately, the problem is there, will be fixed in the coming hotfix.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

12 hours ago, Bilbo_Baggins said:

 

Does the FM for the DCS machine differ much from our IL2 GB one? I was quite surprised by the very quick roll rate on this big kite!

Try compare  in game FM  to NACA MEASURMENT OF FLYING QUALITIES OF A DEHAVILLAND MOSQUITO  wartime report, that would give you an answer how far or close game is to the real life. Comparing to other  game  is fine but both can be wrong. I think we all want  that in game  FM  be as close to real as possible with all quircs and uniqe behavior.

 

I - LATERAL AND DIRECTIONAL STABILITY AND CONTROL CHARACTERISTICS

https://ntrs.nasa.gov/api/citations/19930093652/downloads/19930093652.pdf

 

II - LONGITUDINAL STABILITY AND CONTROL CHARACTERISTICS

https://ntrs.nasa.gov/api/citations/19930092589/downloads/19930092589.pdf

Edited June 3, 2022 by 1PL-Husar-1Esk

[blitze]

On 6/2/2022 at 6:22 AM, Charon said:

@Ala13_UnopaUno_VR @=VARP=Ribbon, others with FPS problems... are you using openvr_fsr by any chance? This update overwrote my copy of openvr_api.dll (correctly, as I told Steam to repair the installation). Try restoring the fsr version. I initially lost about 30fps, but only because I was rendering at a much higher resolution than I meant to.

The Open VR-FSR App is a good option.

 

Haven't had any issues with the update overwriting what is required to run it.

[TIGRE88]

7 hours ago, Yogiflight said:

 

In your video, was the autopilot activated? If yes, then the turning of the turret, done by the AI gunner, makes sense, as he keeps the gun in enemy direction. This is what I, as tank commander would expect from my gunner, this is what gets trained. If you didn't activate the autopilot, then yes, the turret should stay in the position you leave it. Nice would be a key to get it back to 12 o°clock position without having to use the command menu (as you don't have the AI activated by autopilot).

 

I don't know what the auto pilot is? 
in the game I select the command "cease fire " 
but it doesn't work, the shooter doesn't keep an eye on the target by turning the turret, he keeps an eye on nothing at all, the gun is pointing to the void.

look well at the video, there are targets right next to it at 50 meters even towards the end of the video, yet the turret is pointing somewhere else or there is nothing.  

when you select "cease fire" the gunner stop shooting, just this.    

 

What you don't understand is if there is a waypoint connected to the player's tank, then this bug manifests itself, even if the target is very far away, more than 3000 meters, out of firing range, the bug is triggered, it's the fact that there is a waypoint and an enemy presence. 

 

so in the game you find yourself with targets that are in front of you and your slow tank turret points at 90° to the right .very practical......

the path is not necessarily straight you continue to drive with the turret that spends its time always turning in the same direction, you find yourself with

 the cannon that points back and enemy tanks that are in front of the complete opposite of the cannon mouth.. you are dead....

this is where the game is if the player's tank is linked to a waypoint to advance a platoon of tanks or a convoy.

 

you think it makes sense that as a tank commander your gunner keeps an eye on the target, but which target? the T34 at 3H or the three SU152 located at 12H?

at this point it would not make more sense to be able to select the exact target to be monitored by the gunner? 

with binoculars or a button in the menu? because otherwise it would be nonsense..

in any case right now the gunner is not monitoring anything , he points the gun in a vacuum in directions where there are not even enemies , it just creates problems

 

and in any case I will add one thing, it is not at all realistic for a gunner who spends his time adjusting the rotation of the turret while the tank is moving, the tank will zigzag from right to left, move in all directions because the terrain is distorted and you seriously think the gunner can see anything with all that movement and shaking? no it's not even logical.....

 

why not a gunner who starts turning the turret once the tank has finished rolling and moving in all directions... that would make sense.

but again at condition that we give him the order to do so, otherwise it's boring a turret which moves by itself during the game.

 

it's like the story of the cannon which locks.. I'm a commander tank, did I order the barrel lock? we are in the middle of a fight.... why is the tank locking its gun on its own?

you see that's what's wrong, there are "realistic" functions that are added to the game, but the programming is half done, the work is shoddy because in the end the function handicaps the game more than anything else ..

 

we might as well keep it simple, remove the locking of the barrel and remove the untimely rotation of the turret, the game would be more pleasant and in the end it is more realistic.

anyway if we start from the principle of realism, then we should not be able to access the position of the driver or the gunner, only to be a tank commander...

we have to be reasonable, it's only a video game, so much keep things simple and done right

 

 

Edited June 3, 2022 by TIGRE88

[Munster_]

Was 4.705b hotfix already released on Steam? Still getting the black screen and the error

 

Failed to open texture 'GRAPHICS\TEXTURES\DEFWHITE.BMP'

[Sneaksie]

4.705c just released:

1) Skip button works in scenario campaigns;
2) Sounds in detailed tanks work correctly;
3) Stationary AT and AA guns and machineguns are correctly animated in multiplayer;
4) Observation balloons will be lowered when there are enemy fighters nearby in QMB;
5) Duplicate observation balloon tether has been removed.

[LF_Mark_Krieger]

On 6/1/2022 at 9:46 AM, IckyATLAS said:

A beatiful bird and fast. I am always looking to some details, and noticed that if you have the additional 58 mm cannon, then the cannon pretty large cartridge is ejected from a special opening under the fuselage. But in that case the 4 standard machine guns have no more visible ejected spent cartridges. But if we fly without the large 58mm cannon then the spent cartridges of the 4 machine guns are ejected and visually can be seen. My question here is about the real thing, whenthe 58mm cannon was mounted was also a retainer box installed for the other guns cartridges. The ejection circuit was probably different but I am no expert here.

 

I also did not find how to open the cockpit windows. The normal command RAlt C does open or close the cockpit door. But what about the windows?

There is the LWin C command that should do that but it does not seem to work.

I think that the open windows command doesn't work since a lot of patches ago. It's a pity, but I suppose devs had some problems with it and I hope they will reestablish it someday.

[ShampooX]

Boom!  Thanks Sneaksie!

[Dusty_Steppes]

Thanks for the sound fix. Now if you could bring back the HUD gear indication that was available when seated in the tank driver's position, I would be a happy camper. Whenever I drive a vehicle with a manual transmission in real life, I shift by feel, not by looking at the gear shift lever. Since there is no sense of feel it would be great to have it back in the HUD when in the driver's position.

[Regingrave-]

19 минут назад, LF_Mark_Krieger сказал:

I think that the open windows command doesn't work since a lot of patches ago. It's a pity, but I suppose devs had some problems with it and I hope they will reestablish it someday.

You mean the command to open hatches on tanks? Seems working for me. What particular tanks?

[simfan2015]

Art-j knows far more about the mossie FM than I do. Thanks, didn't know a lot of these things. My personal enjoyment of both il-2 GB and DCS is more about awe of these products than my in-depth knowledge about these planes. I learn about these planes by... trying to fly them. But I love reading the opinion of experts on these matters. I won't be negative about either il-2 or dcs planes because I simply know too little about it and therefore I can't. 

Thank you all for the valuable information I get here each and every day. Because of it I appreciate flying even more. My original post should have read... I like the mosquito version of il-2 more because it is, for me, easier to setup, fly and handle than the DCS version. 

[Yogiflight]

2 hours ago, Regingrave said:

You mean the command to open hatches on tanks? Seems working for me. What particular tanks?

He refers to the post of IckyATLAS, who was talking about the cockpit windows of the Mossie.

[Hotaru_Ito]

I'm having fun with the Mosquito so far. Having to lean to the right to use the sight is a little disconcerting, but I'm getting used to it, and having it out of the way the other 99 percent of the time is actually kind of nice. And quad Hispanos + excellent visibility over the nose + easy-mode gunnery because all the guns are in the nose is fantastic, as is being able to carry 8 rockets, 2 bombs, and plenty of cannon rounds. The adjustable sight is nice too, I'm finding 2 degrees for rockets and 4 for bombs works out pretty well.

 

Only problem so far is career. All you get are "traffic interdictions", which involve flying way behind enemy lines in daylight with no escort and getting intercepted every time. First try, easy difficulty/scattered density, my two-ship flight was intercepted by 4 109s. They got the other Mosquito, but I shot down all 4, because apparently the Mosquito can do that, and continued by myself. Found a convoy, shot up one truck, got hit by AAA, headed back. Intercepted by 4 more 109s, one of which crashed trying to hit me. They followed me all the way past Eindhoven before they finally managed to shoot me down. Admittedly, getting "ace in a day," counting the maneuver kill, in a Mosquito against 109s was entertaining, but mostly I just want to fly fighter-bomber missions in peace, with AAA being the main threat. Apparently these interdictions are supposed to be night missions, which would solve the problem, but until then, could we maybe have normal, escorted "attack vehicle column" missions instead?

Edited June 3, 2022 by Hotaru_Ito

[LukeFF]

12 minutes ago, Hotaru_Ito said:

Only problem so far is career. All you get are "traffic interdictions", which involve flying way behind enemy lines in daylight with no escort and getting intercepted every time. First try, easy difficulty/scattered density, my two-ship flight was intercepted by 4 109s. They got the other Mosquito, but I shot down all 4, because apparently the Mosquito can do that, and continued by myself. Found a convoy, shot up one truck, got hit by AAA, headed back. Intercepted by 4 more 109s, one of which crashed trying to hit me. They followed me all the way past Eindhoven before they finally managed to shoot me down. Admittedly, getting "ace in a day," counting the maneuver kill, in a Mosquito against 109s was entertaining, but mostly I just want to fly fighter-bomber missions in peace, with AAA being the main threat. Apparently these interdictions are supposed to be night missions, which would solve the problem, but until then, could we maybe have normal, escorted "attack vehicle column" missions instead?

 

This is a temporary measure; nighttime traffic interdiction missions weren't ready for this release. 

Edited June 3, 2022 by LukeFF

[69th_Mobile_BBQ]

4 hours ago, LF_Mark_Krieger said:

I think that the open windows command doesn't work since a lot of patches ago. It's a pity, but I suppose devs had some problems with it and I hope they will reestablish it someday.

 

I agree.  It would be a nice 'detail' for planes with openable side windows (that are not currently functional - on never were) to be made functional.  

I also advocate for planes with canopies that can be opened in increments, such as the Yak models, to have functionality added as well.  

The models already appear to be ready (mostly) for this to happen.  

[Hotaru_Ito]

23 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

 

This is a temporary measure; nighttime traffic interdiction missions weren't ready for this release. 

I know, I saw your post about it in the Career forum. I meant to suggest a different temporary measure. Currently those missions basically aren't playable, since you just get intercepted every time and have to either dogfight single-engine fighters or run away. I think using the regular, escorted "attack vehicle column" missions until night interdictions are ready would be a better stopgap than unescorted daytime interdictions. Still basically the same mission type (attack road traffic), and since the escorts usually deal with the interceptors for you, they're actually possible to complete on a regular basis.

[Freycinet]

Just a short post here to say that I am amazed by, and highly appreciate, the fantastic interaction of the developers with the user base. Unheard of in other games and sims. 

[SvAF/F16_Goblin]

I might miss something here but, I can't get tail rudder trim to work in the mossie. In other planes the setting works but not here.

Have I missed a new binding somewhere cause I can't seem to find the culprit.

 

Solved:
For some reason I had to rebind the same controller inputs again to get the game to recognize them and the problem is solved

Edited June 4, 2022 by SvAF/F16_Goblin

[jeanba]

Tested the Mosquito yestearday and I lové it

[Zeev]

Is the new plane built from paper? I flew quick mission, strafed some convoy, AA hit me once and my plane was cut into two pieces, instant death.

Any other, smaller plane would take the hit and continue flying. 

[jeanba]

I did not notice this.

What I found (andis also true with the Ju88C) is that it is larger, less maneuvrable than single engine and as such more vulnerable to large caliber  weapon.

 

[Noisemaker]

39 minutes ago, Zeev said:

Is the new plane built from paper?

Who wants to tell him?

[THERION]

1 hour ago, Zeev said:

Is the new plane built from paper? I flew quick mission, strafed some convoy, AA hit me once and my plane was cut into two pieces, instant death.

Any other, smaller plane would take the hit and continue flying. 

 

Hm, theoretically you are not far away from the truth. The major parts from the new plane are made from wood - that's why it is also called the wooden
wonder. And as we all know, paper is made of wood. So finally you are not that wrong with your guessing, except that of course, they used the wooden
fibre in a early stage, before it get literally to paper...

For the nit pickers: yes, I know, paper is not only made of wood, there are also other fibres used to produce paper - but finally paper is always made of

organic fibres...

 

1 hour ago, Noisemaker said:

Who wants to tell him?

 

I tried...

[Yogiflight]

10 hours ago, Hotaru_Ito said:

I meant to suggest a different temporary measure. Currently those missions basically aren't playable, since you just get intercepted every time and have to either dogfight single-engine fighters or run away.

This counts for all 'Traffic Interdiction' missions, no matter, which aircraft. Simply a wrong mission design. I wrote a bug report for the Bf 110. You might want to do the same for the Mossie. Another detail, I found is flying large detours through friendly and enemy territory on the way to the target zone, which doesn't make sense as well.