Has TC peaked?

[Leon_Portier]

On 10/31/2022 at 12:08 PM, Wardog5711 said:

My home game room table is 4' x 8'. We can add a 2'x4' extension if needed, but it gets really cramped moving around the ends.

Back when I still did public  games, we would often reserve three tables at the local game store and push them together for a 12' x 6' game surface.

These pics are from a 2002 game. At some game events, we ran three separate table with different terrain on each. City, desert and rolling hills/forest.

I haven't done anything public since the coof started back in 2019, so we just play at my house on the shop table whenever the boys come down to play.

 

And..thats enough of a thread derail in the TC forum.  To say I love tanks and big metal death machines is an understatement.

And I would like to see TC grow myself since I'm a much better tanker than I am a pilot. ☹️

 

 

I spy Battletech, stompy ?

[Guest deleted@83466]

 

6 minutes ago, Voidhunger said:

@Wardog5711 you have the EXIT sign also at home? Is that standard for the US? Fire, tornado?

No, people in the US don’t have “exit” signs in their own home, lol!  We aren’t that stupid, at least not yet?

[Guest deleted@188321]

@Wardog5711 Please don't take the thread completely off topic.

Thanks

[Spinnetti]

So back on topic, after watching the dev's video (which I was glad to see the faces behind the game), its clear that TC It hasn't peaked or not peaked, it just is. Its mostly a 3rd party development and as such, my read of the situation is that there is no profit motive to improve or address anything and I'm sure the contractual bug fix period is long past. Unless there is future revenue associated with it, I wouldn't expect anything out of TC other than any incidental benefit from base game improvements. It will take a pretty good push to get any core TC improvements whatsoever, however new tanks and theaters may happen if the 3rd party can do it, and there is enough business case to do so. Sucks given the price premium it costs, but its not really part of the core game. 

Edited November 13, 2022 by Spinnetti

[moustache]

15 hours ago, Spinnetti said:

So back on topic, after watching the dev's video (which I was glad to see the faces behind the game), its clear that TC It hasn't peaked or not peaked, it just is. Its mostly a 3rd party development and as such, my read of the situation is that there is no profit motive to improve or address anything and I'm sure the contractual bug fix period is long past. Unless there is future revenue associated with it, I wouldn't expect anything out of TC other than any incidental benefit from base game improvements. It will take a pretty good push to get any core TC improvements whatsoever, however new tanks and theaters may happen if the 3rd party can do it, and there is enough business case to do so. Sucks given the price premium it costs, but its not really part of the core game. 

I mainly read the summary of the "interview", so I may not have all the info, plus the discussion topic, but did they talk about TC? sales are satisfactory? there are projects for TC? from what i understand, the porchain DLC is the last? they just honor their promise made before and bye?

Edited November 14, 2022 by moustache

[moustache]

14 hours ago, Eeafanas said:

They talked about going to St Petersburg next week for talks with DigitalForms about continued cooperation and further development of the guided ground vehicles.

The future of the TC series will depend on their agreement.

If they refuse, the developers will look for other partners.

you seem well informed... I don't really know what DigitalForms actually does: does it only deal with the 3D model? who takes care of the damage model? is the map from this company or from 1C/777studio? the gameplay/animation mechanics are the fruit of which studio? what does this studio actually do?

[super-truite]

30 minutes ago, moustache said:

you seem well informed... I don't really know what DigitalForms actually does: does it only deal with the 3D model? who takes care of the damage model? is the map from this company or from 1C/777studio? the gameplay/animation mechanics are the fruit of which studio? what does this studio actually do?

from the interview, they said that the partners are mainly dealing with 3d models and that they handle the engine integration i.e. ballistic, physics etc.

[Spinnetti]

Moustache - its all in the interview. Worth a watch, but since its mostly 3rd party, it all depends on what money they make from it to decide if its worth doing more.

 

[moustache]

On 11/16/2022 at 8:46 PM, Spinnetti said:

Moustache - its all in the interview. Worth a watch, but since its mostly 3rd party, it all depends on what money they make from it to decide if its worth doing more.

it's my level of English that prevented me from watching (I didn't want to take the risk, as some people do, of misunderstanding something and going into flat earth theories...)... I would have to take a look if youtube auto translator is working now..

[Alexmarine]

My face when debatable choice of uniforms for the StuG crew:

[moustache]

maybe a modder will want to perfect this?

[Wardog5711]

Ok, I have these questions captured and saved for the DEV team concerning the StuG:

 

1) will it come with its own skin model (the churchill still doesn't have one...)?
2) speaking of skin, the churchill had the chance to get an official "non-kursk period" skin, will the Stug have it too?
3) smoke for more people, that's cool, does that mean the AI will now react to this one?

4) and above all, no Scherenfernrohr S.F.14 Z.Gi for the commander of Stug?

[No_Face]

34 minutes ago, moustache said:

maybe a modder will want to perfect this?

If it's just a color problem, the developers can fix it themselves easily in my opinion.

 

If the crew has these colors now it is, again in my opinion, for two reasons:
-Either the developers were not aware that this color was incorrect.
-Or they made it as simple as possible by reusing an already existing model to save time.

 

So I am not worried, if as the experts claim, there is a mistake, it will be corrected (maybe not as soon as the Stug is released)

[Wardog5711]

Just so I'm clear, you are wanting the feldgrau, with pink piping and totenkopfs on the collar badges.

[THERION]

5 minutes ago, Wardog5711 said:

Just so I'm clear, you are wanting the feldgrau, with pink piping and totenkopfs on the collar badges.

 

This would be historically wrong. Stug crew used the Feldgrau tanker uniforms, BUT with RED pipping (Troupe's colour for artillery).

[Bonnot]

I'ld accept gracefully all colors of the rainbow for pipping, cuffs and collars in exchange of a "West Front"   allied tank and crew (even in rags) ....!

this reminds me my Napoleonic wargames unreconciliable disputs over the exact hue of scarlet in 1812  ?

[Alexmarine]

13 hours ago, Wardog5711 said:

 you are wanting the feldgrau, 

 

Correct for both StuG and Ferdinand

 

13 hours ago, Wardog5711 said:

with pink piping 

 

Correct for Ferdinand, Red for StuG

[ShampooX]

I just want to THANK everyone in this thread.  Now we are the most replied thread on the forum and only 1K short of being the most viewed!  I have to think it is because, as loyal players of this game, we all see it's tremendous potential (especially in PvP online play) for this TC "experiment" to be the best historical tank game/sim in the history of the world.  Anyway, we criticize, we kid, we argue...because we love.    As somebody said above, this is the best kept secret in gmaing and I am more than happy to have it that way - although a couple hundred new players would be nice.

[moustache]

On 11/19/2022 at 1:22 PM, Wardog5711 said:

Ok, I have these questions captured and saved for the DEV team concerning the StuG:

 

1) will it come with its own skin model (the churchill still doesn't have one...)?
2) speaking of skin, the churchill had the chance to get an official "non-kursk period" skin, will the Stug have it too?
3) smoke for more people, that's cool, does that mean the AI will now react to this one?

4) and above all, no Scherenfernrohr S.F.14 Z.Gi for the commander of Stug?

some answer?

[Wardog5711]

Nothing yet. I dropped it off first thing this morning and probably won't hear anything back for a day or two.

[Bonnot]

We know your task is not easy between our Wants, Wishes, Do, Give , et....and the far HQ but  I once again made a suggestion :

The Sherman and Churchill , with proper skins (and crew?)  + all the AI AFV provided for DDay,  could be the base for a Second Front, even limited, on a bit of map from BOBP ( Ardennes ) or BoN  ( Bocage, Caen, Falaise gap...) this at little cost in work and resources ....

This could satisfy many players and help to wait for better days and increase the audience - so, I hope ?

 

[Wardog5711]

Quote

Please ask about uniform changes for Ferdinand and StuG crews?

This was answered in a test thread.

unfortunately we have only one character for all German crews, so it can't be reskinned.

 

I will try to get some clarification on whether that means forever, or just for the near future.

[LukeFF]

6 hours ago, Bonnot said:

We know your task is not easy between our Wants, Wishes, Do, Give , et....and the far HQ but  I once again made a suggestion :

The Sherman and Churchill , with proper skins (and crew?)  + all the AI AFV provided for DDay,  could be the base for a Second Front, even limited, on a bit of map from BOBP ( Ardennes ) or BoN  ( Bocage, Caen, Falaise gap...) this at little cost in work and resources ....

This could satisfy many players and help to wait for better days and increase the audience - so, I hope ?

 

The Sherman we have is a Lend-Lease model and wouldn't be appropriate for a Western Front map, to say nothing of the work needed to properly render British and US tank crews (the research itself, plus building the models, making the textures, recording audio files, etc.). And, then there's making a Western Front map that is optimized for tank combat. If it was that simple of a thing to do it would have been done long ago. ?

 

Beyond all that, it still amazes me that people think the developers are entirely oblivious to what went on in the war, be it in the air or on the ground. You have to have strong focus when carrying out a project like this, and for the time being that focus is the Eastern Front in July 1943.

[MajorMagee]

I don't believe that people think that the developers are entirely oblivious to what went on in the war. Unfortunately, it's much more likely that people think that they're oblivious to any attempt at satisfying what their paying customers want.

[CIPPOZ]

On 12/3/2022 at 09:09, RedeyeStorm said:

@LachenKrieg Sento che le tue osservazioni sull'equilibrio si basano principalmente su MP e Mi piace@Avimimoaccennato a c'è solo una mappa TC. Il fatto che tu possa guidare i carri armati su altre mappe è semplicemente un vantaggio. Come Avimus per il mix di carri armati basati sulla storia è un punto di forza.

Per me la più grande delusione di TC è l'assoluta mancanza di intelligenza artificiale. Non ci sono manovre, nessuna ricerca di riparo o posizioni a scafo abbassato. Basta seguire il percorso, individuare un nemico, fermarsi e iniziare a sparare finché il bersaglio non viene distrutto. Risciacquare e ripetere fino alla fine del percorso o distrutto. Elimina ogni sensazione di "simulazione" del gioco.

 

Oh, e irrita le comunicazioni goffe.

⁸Hello, yes! I fully agree with you, artificial intelligence is important and it's the one that creates various situations in matches, I have if not; as you say they repeat the same gestures and it's a shame ,....It's important!!

[Alexmarine]

On 11/22/2022 at 5:46 PM, LukeFF said:

 Eastern Front in July 1943.

 

I mean, we actually can cover even a little more than that with what we have available, or at least up to maybe November/December 1943.

 

Bummed by the news on the SPG crew uniforms though...

[Bonnot]

On 11/22/2022 at 5:46 PM, LukeFF said:

The Sherman we have is a Lend-Lease model and wouldn't be appropriate for a Western Front map, to say nothing of the work needed to properly render British and US tank crews (the research itself,

I respect  your position and technical competence but, it is difficult for me to receive your arguments about the Sherman ( I mean external diff where so many variants of cammo, external armor added on the field, loads of personnal items , etc.... ) or the difficult research of docs on US/UK tank crews at DDay time with the thousands of films, photos, drawings etc...available everywhere.

 

One argument is final and says all :  "for the time being that focus is the Eastern Front in July 1943. "

this  is the " Ultima  Ratio Regis " and probably ends all discuss !

[Voidhunger]

It would be nice instead of TC2 to have finally more scripted campaigns and advanced qmb for tanks.

If you are not playing MP there is nothing to do. Its ridicolous after those years.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

AQMB would be nice to have, personal i bought TC and spend just few hours playing it. Can't stand all seeing and shooting throw obstacles AI. Same with environment graphics and special effects. When I hit the tree and destroyed my tank, I quit in rage ?

[Koenigstiger]

Hello,

 

I've been playing all kinds of PC tank games for more than 30 years now - but only as a single player due to the poor internet connection here in the country. TC has uncanny potential in terms of realism and tank depiction, so in my opinion it has by no means exceeded its peak. It is of course up to those responsible to finally separate the game from the actual flight simulator and to develop it further independently as a good or best simulator for the time of WW II. Various career modes would also be desirable here to show the development of technology over the course of the war. In addition, of course, there are always new tank models, because every player has his favorites for certain phases of the war.

For me as an old tank soldier, realism is particularly important - this means that the use of terrain is rewarded and the partner tank or tanks also behaves in a combat manner and, for example, does not turn when dodging and drives forward!

 

Unfortunately I am not allowed to name the games, which I also think are very good. Above all, a new game in its early access phase stands out here, which deals with the transition from the "Cold War" to the hot war in the so-called "Fulda Gap" with excellent graphics and a concentration on the essentials.

 

In all games, a good AI should not be forgotten - it should always present the player with new challenges and react, even if the game is the same.

 

Good luck

 

Guenther

[WitchyWoman]

Without a career mode or ai controlled infantry, I pass. Im too spoiled with older tank sims that model a complete ground war. If both these features are ever added, I'd buy it right away.

Edited December 1, 2022 by WitchyWoman

[Frinik22]

Why afraid of naming the good games Guenther? I am not afraid .You are talking about Gunner Heat the recently relased armour sim made a small team and featuring tanks from the Cold War. Very good game. What else? Oh STeel Beastss a cl;assic and probably the most realistic . Steel Armour Blaze of War by Graviteam half tactical half sim. ? Stee Fury also by Graviteam WW2? Panzer Elite old and venerable n but sitll entertaining. Armored Fist an oldy. T72 Balkans on Fire little known tank sim game made by Graviteam's predecessor which features Soviet tanks used during the Balkan wars of the 1990s.

Edited December 1, 2022 by Frinik22

[Wardog5711]

Quote

Why afraid of naming the good games Guenther? I am not afraid .

Most folks avoid naming the competitors games to not run afoul of a rule 19 violation. Better safe than sorry. 

All of those games mentioned were designed from the outset to be an armor on armor game at it's core, whereas TC was meant to fit solely into the battle of Kursk timeline and map. It's intended purpose was to SIM that narrow historical timeframe. 

A lot of users (me included) would like to see TC expanded. But to compare it to larger tank on tank games that are not restricted to a specific time and place or set of vehicles is not a good comparison.  Is TC perfect, no. Can it be improved, yes.   But there are a lot a business related factors to be considered before any expansion can take place. 

 

[DD_Crash]

1 hour ago, Wardog5711 said:

 It's intended purpose was to SIM that narrow historical timeframe.

This is what needs to change

[Wardog5711]

 

 

Quote

This is what needs to change

 

As a player, I don't disagree with you.

But as a company guy, that would be a strategic/financial level decision. And well above my paygrade.

I have 10 years invested in WOT. 180 tanks in my garage last time I bothered to look. Most of which I don't use anymore.

But I don't want TC to degenerate to that level of arcade silliness with paper panzers and warp drive equipped wheeled vehicles.

A slightly less hardcore SIM, more FPS based armor vs. armor game would be my choice if I was king of the world. But I'm not.?

 

 

Edited December 2, 2022 by Wardog5711
Update the number of tanks in my garage. It's shocking.

[Voidhunger]

Lets hope they start a new engine with the support of ground battle.

I dont care now if its in the west or east but we need better enviroment, AI, effects, career mode etc.

TC can be improved in 10 years like the BOX but it will always has limitations because this engine was made for planes.

[SCG_judgedeath3]

Would argue its being hardcore sim(although I wish it was way more realistic as some stuff in the tanks is still bare bone and simplified…) is shat makes tank crew good and different than its competetion on the current market, Its a simulator game in a simulator game series afterall and that should be the focus, and its interesting to try snd recreate tank battles in history with each side having pro and cons with the weapons that existed during said battle. If tank crew goes and becomes less simulator and arcade style game with little focus on simulating, then yeah it might sell more and players who want easier times might enjoy it, but myself and others who finds the hardcore simulator as its best advantage and reason to leave games like warthunder and play tank crew for would go away and play older tank simulators. 

[No_Face]

I agree, there are enough non-simulation tank games to satisfy the more arcade oriented players but few offers for simulation tank games so you should not (at least I don't want to) lose this aspect.

[Bonnot]

 

I agree, provided the game goes beyond the OstFront 1943 and extends realism to the surroundings of the Tanks : men, APC/AT,  obstacles, various terrains etc...

[WitchyWoman]

On 12/1/2022 at 4:05 AM, Frinik22 said:

Why afraid of naming the good games Guenther? I am not afraid .You are talking about Gunner Heat the recently relased armour sim made a small team and featuring tanks from the Cold War. Very good game. What else? Oh STeel Beastss a cl;assic and probably the most realistic . Steel Armour Blaze of War by Graviteam half tactical half sim. ? Stee Fury also by Graviteam WW2? Panzer Elite old and venerable n but sitll entertaining. Armored Fist an oldy. T72 Balkans on Fire little known tank sim game made by Graviteam's predecessor which features Soviet tanks used during the Balkan wars of the 1990s.

You forgot the good game, although the graphics are left wanting now...Panzer Elite, especially with mods, people still play and mod  it, again infantry are there. M1 tank platoon 1 and 2, iPanzer 44 was not bad either and had infantry and careers.

 

Don't take me wrong here, I am not asking to play infantry which would turn this game into something else, but they should be in IL-2 and controlled by the AI. Without that mechanic in the tank sim, it turns the sim into more of  game like world of tanks or War Thunder which is junk in my opinion. Tanks alone slugging it out with other tanks and vehicles is not realistic at all without supporting elements and other important dangers on the battlefield. Some people make up excuses about it not being possible but I disagree with that. I have some experience here working for a company that makes WW2 strategy games( not sims). Oh how I miss SSI, JANES, Digital integration, and some other simulation software companies.

 

I often find myself playing older games more often then newer ones because the new ones just have not captured the long term interest and fun for me and I know a lot of other people do too for the same reasons.

 

Edited December 2, 2022 by WitchyWoman