AI non playable tanks : broken armor ?

[super-truite]

The non playable AI tanks (those that you cannot play, like the jagpanther, the marder etc.) are supposed to use less resources. I would thus like to remove the AI (playable) tanks on my server and replace them by those. But from my past experience, I feel that the behavior of the armor of those tanks is a bit off.
Do you feel the same ? Is this something that got improved lately?
For instance, the AI non playable KV1 was  almost impossible to penetrate. I think it was the same problem with the t34 as well.

If it's not clear: some tank names in the mission editor start with "_" . Those are the playable tanks, but they can also be controlled by  AI and are supposed to react better.
The other ones (with no _ in their names) are controllable only by AI.

[ww2fighter20]

1 hour ago, super-truite said:

For instance, the AI non playable KV1 was  almost impossible to penetrate.

Maybe you faced an different KV1 version?

There are 4 KV1's, KV1-1941, KV1-1942, KV-1S AI and KV-1S playable.

KV-1S (AI + playable) have the weakest armor (75mm front - 60mm side, both hull).

KV1-1941 and 1942 have the strongest armor (100mm front and side hull).

[super-truite]

might be, but my issues were mostly at point blank or max 300meters or so with a Tiger (with APHE). I will try to make a little experiment with all the tanks

[super-truite]

After some tests, it looks way better than what I experienced before. Not sure if it's because there was an update that fixed it or because when it happened I was on a crowed server. Maybe he lag can cause a seemingly bad penetration behavior ?

Edited March 24, 2021 by super-truite

[LachenKrieg]

33 minutes ago, super-truite said:

After some tests, it looks way better than what I experienced before. Not sure if it's because there was an update that fixed it or because when it happened I was on a crowed server. Maybe he lag can cause a seemingly bad penetration behavior ?

I would be interested to hear what you found in terms of which guns vs which armor. I would also be interested to know where @ww2fighter20 got the information from. Is that info available in the mission editor somewhere? 

[Leon_Portier]

Dunno about exact damage model, but maybe try to lob HE shells against AI only tanks. I found them extremly destructive. Dunno if its supposed that way but my KV-1s blows up medium AI only tanks with a single HE into their side.

Edited March 25, 2021 by [N.O.G.F]Leon_Portier

[Cybermat47]

The Jagdpanther? I don’t think that’s in this game. 
 

I do think I’ve seen the Jagdpanzer IV/70, though:

 

[super-truite]

yes I meant Jagdpanzer IV.  I have Tank dislexia . 
@LachenKrieg I tried  frontal long distance shots (> 2km ) with Tiger and ferdinand. Close range with Tiger and M4A2 so far. I tried shooting on all the available tanks. I will make some more test.
The only issues I found so far were not related to armor. I will try to test it in a bad network environment also to see if lag can cause armor penetration issues (because it's online that I noticed problems before).

The marder and the jagdpanzer AI seemed a bit broken:
-Marder missing completely  and shooting at ground when above  900m or so of the target
-jagdpanzer sometimes ignoring me (the waypoint was at low priority and the AI level was set to high, so it should have been really agressive), sometimes not.

Edited March 25, 2021 by super-truite

[BlitzPig_EL]

Please remember that the AI only tanks in the mission editor were designed initially for the flight sim side of things and were meant to be targets for aircraft or merely just eye candy for the flight sim side of things.  They were never originally designed to be engaged by humans in tanks, because there were no such things at that time.

[super-truite]

I know, but it turns out that even with a good server, you hit the limit in terms of performances rather quickly. It is likely I will be forced to use a mix of AI only tanks and AI playable tanks unfortunately. 
I need a total of 10 moving tanks or so  + some static ones + 4 AI planes.

[BlitzPig_EL]

True, the maximum amount of AI of any kind is a big limiting factor for all of us, in tanks or aircraft.

 

Imagine a US Navy Cleveland class light cruiser with it's full, late war compliment of anti aircraft guns.  It alone would grind most servers to a slideshow when they opened up on some happless enemy plane.

[super-truite]

yeah, I wish the devs could do a system like in Arma where you can launch other servers dedicated for AI  

[ww2fighter20]

On 3/25/2021 at 12:00 AM, LachenKrieg said:

I would also be interested to know where @ww2fighter20 got the information from. Is that info available in the mission editor somewhere? 

This is the armor data from the actual tanks and they should be similar in the game, can't say if this is the case in the game but I can remember it was mentioned either in an update/devblog or one of the devs back when Tank Crew was in development the damage system was completly overhauled for all ai vehicles which also included more accurate armor values.

[super-truite]

good to know that must be it then

[FeuerFliegen]

I have personally noticed that the Jagdpanzer is incredibly easy to destroy with just .50 cals from something like a P-47... while I do not know exactly how armored these are, I'd suspect that they wouldn't be easier to destroy than the other German tanks.

 

Either way, I would appreciate having something like the Jagdpanzer as an AI tank in your server, just to give us some more variety.

[MajorMagee]

One of the techniques reportedly used during the war by the P-47 pilots was to intentionally have their rounds strike the ground and ricochet back up into the bottom of the tank. The radiator openings in the rear deck were also vulnerable until they started being protected by a stand-off armored cover in late 44. As this video memory mentions they would also go after the accompanying soft vehicles first to leave the tanks stranded without logistical support.