Developer Diary, Part 65

[Dakpilot]

Also never had the inverted axis problem, using MSFFBII and Saitek throttle quadrant, do not use any joystick/input software, as was said above not everyone is experiencing this so when commenting about this problem it will help if you put what hardware and software you use in the proper bug report section,

 

If it is a problem for you a proper report in the right section will get it fixed quicker  ? 

 

Cheers Dakpilot

Edited May 24, 2014 by Dakpilot

[Zak]

Also never had the inverted axis problem, using MSFFBII and Saitek throttle quadrant, do not use any joystick/input software, as was said above not everyone is experiencing this so when commenting about this problem it will help if you put what hardware and software you use in the proper bug report section, If it is a problem for you a proper report in the right section will get it fixed quicker  ?

Thanks, Dakpilot

[CreepiJim]

There is a whole thread about that issue and as far as I am aware there are bug reports.

 

Before I post a bug, I need to make sure it is not a common problem on my end. Been a beta tester (real beta mind you) for ages and don't post things that are not software related. This is a discussion thread so I am discussing. Because some people don't have the issue does not entitle anyone to repeat the usual support questions.

[dburne]

Hi , Both BoS & RoF  do not recognise dual key commands from Saitek X52 or Logitech software whether wrote  as dual key presses ,macro or special macro when programmed in the specific device software . Commands such as  LEFTSHIFT+A only show the single key A but the game recognises direct key input in combinations from the keyboard . There have been a number of posts on this issue and those players devices that allow scripting in their software have found workarounds .

 

Agreed, this is indeed a problem for many, and it has been reported on for quite some time now.

I was fortunate in that I was able to learn the scripting editor in TARGET for my Warthog and able to program my commands around it, by introducing a slight delay between the combo key presses. Matter of fact this very issue is why I took the time to learn the scripting editor for TARGET.

It would seem that it should be fixable in the controller configuration, but I am no programmer by any means.

 

Undoubtedly there are many users that would very much appreciate it, if this issue could be addressed... I am sure it probably is not high up on the priority list but hopefully they can look at doing something for the final release.

Edited May 24, 2014 by dburnette

[BlackDevil]

Also never had the inverted axis problem, using MSFFBII and Saitek throttle quadrant, do not use any joystick/input software, as was said above not everyone is experiencing this so when commenting about this problem it will help if you put what hardware and software you use in the proper bug report section,

 

If it is a problem for you a proper report in the right section will get it fixed quicker  ? 

 

Cheers Dakpilot

I have MSFFB2 and saitek throttle Quadrant with no input Software. You see, chances are good, it. is a bug.

[Dakpilot]

obviously it is a bug that is affecting many people.

 

My point was that a proper report with software/hardware info will help them to fix it quicker, see we can help ourselves with the proper actions

 

The more useful info they get, the easier it is to track down a bug

 

Cheers Dakpilot

[Talisman]

I used to think it was OK because I was not effected by this bug.  Then, guess what, I now recently have this bug and have to reset the joystick every time I launch the game, by using a trick to reverse the dead zone settings.  It may not happen to you yet, but it might next week or the week after that and then you will think different.

 

So take note that this is a problem, it is plastered all over the forum and the developers surely will not want this to continue to final release.  To have this happen to people on final release will not be funny.

[LukeFF]

I think yak should have rudder trim. But it seems not to work - at least for me. IIRC on La5 it works. But I seem not to be able to yaw trim the yak.

 

The Yak-1 did not have rudder trim.

Exactly.

Serial production FW190 never got the old version MG-FF. Only the upgraded versions (capable of shooting Mine shells).

 

Fair enough, I was mistaken. 

[[DBS]El_Marta]

I am on the same boat as 6BLBird Dog and dburnette here. I am using Pinnacle Game Profiler with my MSFFB2 stick and the Saitek Software on my Throttle Quadrant.

Apart from this it would be nice to have assignable "Modifiers" like it is done in DCS.

[sturmkraehe]

The Yak-1 did not have rudder trim.

 

Fair enough, I was mistaken. 

 

 

Well, the model we have in game has this:

 

 

So either the model is wrong, the missing rudder trim is wrong, or this little movable surface on the rudder that I take for a rudder trim tab is something else. If the latter please help me to understand the function of this movable surface.

[Jade_Monkey]

Also never had the inverted axis problem, using MSFFBII and Saitek throttle quadrant, do not use any joystick/input software, as was said above not everyone is experiencing this so when commenting about this problem it will help if you put what hardware and software you use in the proper bug report section,

 

If it is a problem for you a proper report in the right section will get it fixed quicker  ? 

 

Cheers Dakpilot

 

Currently I dont have the throttle issue either with my Logitech Extreme 3D Pro. However I noticed a lot of people with Saitek software are reporting it. I'm getting my X-55 next week and I really hope i dont get the same issue 

[sturmkraehe]

I have a Saitek X52 (a couple of years old) and I use the current programming software to map a few single keys and I have no issue. However, I use the MS FFB2 for steering the plane, the Saitek throttle for throttle and some extra functions. The stick is used only for some additional buttons.

[LukeFF]

Well, the model we have in game has this:

 

 

So either the model is wrong, the missing rudder trim is wrong, or this little movable surface on the rudder that I take for a rudder trim tab is something else. If the latter please help me to understand the function of this movable surface.

 

That tab was adjusted on the ground.

[Nankeen]

I use a cheap T16000M Thrustmaster with the hall effect accurate technoligy. From what I can recall (with the throttle axis), it was inverted to begin with, (long ago now) and all I did was move the throttle in the opposite direction first before binding it. No problems since. Drivers and Target software for the joystick are installed, but have not needed to use the Target Software yet. This may, or may not help you, but you will never know unless you give it a go

 

 

[Nankeen]

Another suggestion would be: Make sure you are running the latest input peripheral drivers (from the products home page). It's often drivers are updated for a reason.

This could aid with the problem solving.

[sturmkraehe]

That tab was adjusted on the ground.

 

Mh. That is a hell of complicated mechanic device for a trim tab adjustable only on ground. I'd expect to have then rather something like this (similar to what the 109 had: only a bendable metal piece):

 

 

Why have it changed to this then:

 

[6BLBird-Dog]

Hi , Both BoS & RoF  do not recognise dual key commands from Saitek X52 or Logitech software whether wrote  as dual key presses ,macro or special macro when programmed in the specific device software . Commands such as  LEFTSHIFT+A only show the single key A but the game recognises direct key input in combinations from the keyboard . There have been a number of posts on this issue and those players devices that allow scripting in their software have found workarounds . The effect of this for some of the players I know is the necessity of adding an extra device(S) and using direct input so the game recognises the device and button number . Those who cannot afford a second or even third device find their device game control  inputs limited to the number of single key commands available often deleting default assigned commands that are less relevant to game play in order to achieve this . Can this be looked into please as although posted in many areas it has still not been addressed & as the series expands in the future more  inputs may be needed.Many thanks .

Hi Zak ,The reason I posted in the wrong section is because in the correct section this issue has repeatedly been posted on as early as last winter with no response of  if matter is being looked into .It was on my part deliberate as six months with no reports from the team is indicative of either no-one is taking notice of the appropriate section , not issuing any information as to what is being done or the issue is one for some reason the team is avoiding addressing . I hoped my post here at least it would bring the matter to the fore in a diplomatic manner and inform all who have repeatedly made posts on this where it is pertinent some kind of feedback . At least you are now aware of the matter so could you kindly refer it to the person in the team who can fix this bug & inform us of any problems or progress.Many thanks again.

Edited May 24, 2014 by 6BLBirdDog

[Jokker]

Thanks update + information.

[Hopper64]

I didn't have the throttle axis issue until about 2 weeks ago, and it has been persistent since that time. No matter if I try to invert the axis, it does not change. I had no issues for months until now. No change in hardware as in my signature.

[I./ZG1_HeTzeR]

That tab was adjusted on the ground.

Haha no it wasnt. What you mean are the little red metal plates as seen on the 109s. Those were adjusted by the factory! 

 

This here is a "Flettner Ruder" or in english "Servo Tab" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Servo_tab

Edited May 24, 2014 by I./JG21-HeTzeR

[SR-F_Winger]

When will we get so see killcounts and killmesssages in MP again=

[Bando]

Haha no it wasnt. What you mean are the little red metal plates as seen on the 109s. Those were adjusted by the factory! 

 

This here is a "Flettner Ruder" or in english "Servo Tab" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Servo_tab

So this was to relief the load on the rudder? If so, quite a genius solution.

 

About the reverse axis: I have a MSFF joystick and from 2 weeks ago had this bug as well. Yesterday I defaulted everything and started from scratch. Each time an axis was wrong, I defaulted it again and tried to go through the allocation process again. Now every time I fire up the sim, all axis are right. It can be done, cost a bit of time.

Edited May 24, 2014 by Bando

[SOLIDKREATE]

The reversed throttle bug is still there. I cannot ever make it to where I push the throttle forward for power. I always have to pull back. This is counter intuitive! None of the mission editor missions will load at all. I sat here for 10 minutes and nothing. I like this sim but now it's more of a frustration than a joy. What happened to the controls since update 60?

[Sokol1]

Here I solve this issue in this way:

 

First try: set throttle axis accord joystick normal  movement, 0% (1) to 100% (2).

So move joy throttle axis 1>>>2

 

Result inverted.

 

Second try: leave the joy lever in 2 and move 1<<<<2 (inverse from normal throttle movement).

 

If not registered of first move, move (back and forth) more times.

 

1<<<<2

2>>>>1

1<<<<2

2>>>>1

 

Will register the inverse of the first try. Appear a signal (-) in axis name.

 

Sokol1

[LukeFF]

Haha no it wasnt.

 

 

I'm going off what we were told in closed testing: it was only adjustable on the ground or not adjustable at all.

Edited May 25, 2014 by LukeFF

[BlackDevil]

@sokol1, Boomerang : i see, you dont have this bug - gratulation !

 

If the axis inverts, everytime you launch the game, You will recognize what our problem is

Edited May 25, 2014 by BlackDevil

[JtD]

Yak-1 rudder trim was adjustable on the ground only. From the manual:

 

"Trim ... is adjusted on the ground by the means of the eye bolt (21)."

[LukeFF]

Yak-1 rudder trim was adjustable on the ground only. From the manual:

 

"Trim ... is adjusted on the ground by the means of the eye bolt (21)."

 

Excellent, thanks for posting that diagram!

[StG2_Manfred]

@Sturmkraehe: Expecting, assuming, thinking (guessing) is the worst research one can do!

 

Sorry if I'm too frank, but I read that that often from you, so I had to say this.

[Brano]

From drawings I have at my disposal this ground adjustable trimmer for rudder has been completly removed from series 111 onwards.Which were in fact Yak1b.There was only this small fin left,which seems to be kind of counterweight.

Good post JtD

[GRehalkov]

Hi all, I just noticed, if (after finishing the misson in QMB) you normally land on your airfield and after you, the next AI plane crash the land during landind maneuver and will remain on the runway, the next one AI plane can´t land at all.  I now it´s just a little thing, but it´s bad for immersion.

 

Despite of this, BOS is for me the best one plane sim on the market now, thanks...

[sturmkraehe]

Yak-1 rudder trim was adjustable on the ground only. From the manual:

 

"Trim ... is adjusted on the ground by the means of the eye bolt (21)."

 

Thanks, JtD. I was looking for some information but obviously there is none in English on this (at least I didn't find any). Thanks for having made this available. Can you translate the whole phrase as you seem to be fluent in Russian?

 

Now I'll check if I can set trim on the ground. Should be possible I'd say. Pressing keys on ground would equate to the pilot telling the mechanic how to set the trim...

[Zak]

Thanks, JtD. I was looking for some information but obviously there is none in English on this (at least I didn't find any). Thanks for having made this available. Can you translate the whole phrase as you seem to be fluent in Russian?

The trimmer has identical deviations in both directions and it's set up on the ground with an eye-bolt.

[Tab]

@sokol1, Boomerang : i see, you dont have this bug - gratulation !

 

If the axis inverts, everytime you launch the game, You will recognize what our problem is

if reinstalling does not help it's because the input-settings are left intact after the game is uninstalled and not properly patched by the launcher. I would try uninstall the game, manually delete the whole game folder, and install it again.

Or maybe just try my input-files after backuping yours. I don't have the problem (using saitek x52 pro with mapping software)

input.zip

[CreepiJim]

My findings regarding the axis issue:

 

Did a complete reinstall removing every folder/file related to BoS. Axis is detected, but has to be inverted. Using my old input files the issue with axis inversion not being saved happened again. Copied the original input files over the changed ones, no issue. You can however use your mapped keys after a fresh install by just copying the .actions and .map files (two each).

 

The inverted axis is saved and I don't have to remap the whole config.

 

Conclusion: The bug has to be in the input files. I could test more to find the possible bug-file, but I am lazy :D

[SYN_Mike77]

Has anyone looked to see if the inverted axis problem is hardware related?  I for example have a T16000 joy stick and saitek throttle quadrant and don't have the problem.  Maybe the problems is a bug only affecting certain control devices?

[dburne]

Has anyone looked to see if the inverted axis problem is hardware related?  I for example have a T16000 joy stick and saitek throttle quadrant and don't have the problem.  Maybe the problems is a bug only affecting certain control devices?

 

I use a Warthog along with CH Throttle Quadrant as well, and have not had that issue - I know I have seen some other Warthog users here that do have that issue.

[SYN_Mike77]

ok, good start.  Other input configurations?  Does anyone using a T16000 have the inverted axis bug?

[Volkoff]

Has  anyone looked to see if the inverted axis problem is hardware related?  I for example have a T16000 joy stick and saitek throttle quadrant and don't have the problem.  Maybe the problems is a bug only affecting certain control devices?

Cool Mike, I have the same exact set up for my throttle and joystick. I do not have the axis inversion problem, either. I am sorry to read that some persons are having problems. I think that they can reverse an axis in control settings.  MJ

[dburne]

 I think that they can reverse an axis in control settings.  MJ

 

Yes they can, however for many they have to go in and do it each time they launch the sim, it starts reversed for them every time.