Future of Tank crew

[Thad]

35 minutes ago, Fercyful said:

+ No infantry. Even some soldiers with anti tank weapons (panzerfaust and similar) can be nice to be hiding between houses and you can kill em using the tank machine guns. We already know that a Steel Fury quality infantry interaction level is a no go here (cpu cost, developing cost...) but still some anti tank teams can add quite a lot to immersion. But on this battlefield seems that most of the people were abducted by aliens, no trenches, nothing ? Maybe make the running AT gun soldiers/tank crews killable someday will be nice for make use of the MG or personal gun.  

 

Agree with you overall.

 

One must take note of the fact that Tank Crew is a addon to a 'WWII Combat Flight Simulator'. As such, infantry was never intended to be a specific target for aircraft. This is also why the terrain blocking is very lacking for ground action.

 

As primarily a flight simulator, Line Of Sight (LOS) restrictions due to terrain on the ground is basically missing from Tank Crew.

 

This is a critical tactical gaming flaw or limitation in any ground based game module. ? 

 

7 minutes ago, VacMaster1991 said:

I don't understand all the hate! Tank crew singleplayer works fine if you know how to use it properly. The Tanks are  very detailed and fun to drive. I have put over 200 hours in to tank crew and loved every minute of it. I would recommend it. 

 

No hate from me here. I just recognize the modules current glaring limitations as a tactical based tank simulation. 

Edited May 16, 2020 by Thad

[SCG_judgedeath3]

2 hours ago, VacMaster1991 said:

I don't understand all the hate! Tank crew singleplayer works fine if you know how to use it properly. The Tanks are  very detailed and fun to drive. I have put over 200 hours in to tank crew and loved every minute of it. I would recommend it. 

Encountered several places where anti tank guns fires on my tank when my tank is hidden or not in line of sight.... so have to play the missions as the developer wanted or else the broken AI guns will kill one...

Also try online multiplayer

[Fercyful]

22 hours ago, VacMaster1991 said:

I don't understand all the hate! Tank crew singleplayer works fine if you know how to use it properly. The Tanks are  very detailed and fun to drive. I have put over 200 hours in to tank crew and loved every minute of it. I would recommend it. 

 

believe me is NOT hate. Is pure sadness to see a quite expensive tank simulator with such nice tank models lacking of quite important stuff and more after playing some older games that have those features that make the overall experience much better. I know is based in a flight sim engine but hope that at least the AI shooting thru houses and trees will be fixed during the early access. 

[inexus]

I think it is great how many have contributed to this thread, which has been really valuable. 

 

What is missing is to see that Jason and/or the devs care about how people have provided so much feedback and will give us an update soon... 

[DetCord12B]

I should add to my initial post that I don't think TC is a bad game. It isn't. It just isn't a very good one either. Mediocre is a term I'd use. But as a tank simulation and as advertised, at least given the initial announcement, marketing and other facets its sorely lacking. It isn't a tank simulation, not by a long shot.

 

What's rather hilarious, at least from my opinion, is that most of us on the IL-2 Discord placed a bet that a community shill would pop-up and blame aspects of the product and its hardships on the people that purchased it while at the same time attempting to detract from what was initially advertised. My money was on @[Pb]Cybermat47 as he's been consistently a defender of  all IL-2 products, regardless of any and all issues associated with recent releases. I obviously lost. Bummer. The bet was $1300.

 

@Danziger has been associated with the developers given previous posts, actions, and commentary. Sorry mate, but your constant positive blurbs, complete lack of any differing opinions, fixes, motivations, assets, development commentary, paints a rather one-sided picture of yourself.

[Voidhunger]

Right now the game reminds me T34vsTiger.

There were same limitations like we have now. (AI, DMG model, enviroment, content, no infantry...)

It looks like modded T34vsTiger for better tanks 3d models, gameplay is the same.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Danziger]

4 hours ago, DetCord12B said:

I should add to my initial post that I don't think TC is a bad game. It isn't. It just isn't a very good one either. Mediocre is a term I'd use. But as a tank simulation and as advertised, at least given the initial announcement, marketing and other facets its sorely lacking. It isn't a tank simulation, not by a long shot.

 

What's rather hilarious, at least from my opinion, is that most of us on the IL-2 Discord placed a bet that a community shill would pop-up and blame aspects of the product and its hardships on the people that purchased it while at the same time attempting to detract from what was initially advertised. My money was on @[Pb]Cybermat47 as he's been consistently a defender of  all IL-2 products, regardless of any and all issues associated with recent releases. I obviously lost. Bummer. The bet was $1300.

 

@Danziger has been associated with the developers given previous posts, actions, and commentary. Sorry mate, but your constant positive blurbs, complete lack of any differing opinions, fixes, motivations, assets, development commentary, paints a rather one-sided picture of yourself.

From your spamming complaints into every thread you enter, it doesn't seem like you think any of the IL*2 stuff isn't a bad game. You do some really great work with textures. However, I have to agree with Jason when he told you to chill out with all the negativity. I don't think you actually understand what resources they have to work with as far as how small the team is and their allotted time to spend on each part of the game. You recently posted a thread demanding a download section. You said there is no excuse and no valid reason for not having one. What would you like them to stop working on in order to make that happen? Or maybe you or someone you know would like to make it happen on your/their own? I know that it is difficult to discern tone and emotion from black and white words on a page. However, most of the time you come across as a real Karen with all the negativity and demanding attitude. You have to remember that you aren't in the army anymore and people don't have to listen anymore when you try to order them around. Jason and the development team are not your soldiers. I have often wondered why you stick around this place if the shortcomings of these games cause you so much pain.

 

I am sorry mate, but your constant negative blurbs, complete lack of any empathy, understanding, humility, or respect for others' work, paints a rather one-sided picture of yourself.

 

I do not blame people that bought the product for the game lacking what they want. I do however, question the ability to comprehend what they read (if they did indeed read any of the TC announcements) of the people complaining that this isn't some cutting-edge tank simulator in its own ground-based engine. Tank Crew is not even released yet. So far, they have delivered everything they said they would. If there are any kind of delays or compromises to be made, they let people know. Most of the people that were into IL*2 had a good idea of what TC was going to be from the announcements and either weren't interested or bought it and are having fun while waiting for it to get fleshed out just like IL*2.

Edited May 18, 2020 by Danziger

[Cybermat47]

7 hours ago, DetCord12B said:

What's rather hilarious, at least from my opinion, is that most of us on the IL-2 Discord placed a bet that a community shill would pop-up and blame aspects of the product and its hardships on the people that purchased it while at the same time attempting to detract from what was initially advertised. My money was on @[Pb]Cybermat47 as he's been consistently a defender of  all IL-2 products, regardless of any and all issues associated with recent releases. I obviously lost. Bummer. The bet was $1300.

Uh... have I? I don’t recall defending GBS since sometime last year at the latest. I certainly never blamed any other players for the issues they had with the game, that wouldn’t make any sense.
 

Besides, it’s just rude to criticise your studio’s business partners in public (I’m with Team Fusion). I don’t think anyone really does that.

Edited May 18, 2020 by [Pb]Cybermat47

[Danziger]

7 hours ago, inexus said:

I think it is great how many have contributed to this thread, which has been really valuable. 

 

What is missing is to see that Jason and/or the devs care about how people have provided so much feedback and will give us an update soon... 

They have not commented in the Tank Crew section of the Russian forum either. I do not know why, but if I had to guess, I would say they are just monitoring the forums to see what the general consensus is. Possibly trying to figure out how to implement what the community wants and at what cost in terms of resources. Maybe they are debating whether it is even worth it to expand on TC in the future. There was a pretty big backlash when Stalingrad was first released as well and a long silent period after Moscow before the announcement of a change in direction. The only thing I can say is to keep posting ideas and wish lists. They do read these forums. However, people should remember that it is possible to make complaints and criticisms in a polite and respectful manner. The other thing is people forget that the development team play this game as well. 99% of the time, they want the same cool stuff we want. Like Jason is constantly saying, they have a very small finite amount of resources that are always being stretched to meet their planned schedules. This is why stuff like 4k textures for the old planes and cockpits are being done by community members. Sometimes community members have the time to sit and get every detail on a texture perfect while the developers have X amount of money to pay an artist for X amount of time that may or may not be enough to get every minute detail textured to perfection on schedule for release.

[Lofte]

On 5/17/2020 at 1:55 AM, Fercyful said:

Even some soldiers with anti tank weapons (panzerfaust and similar) can be nice to be hiding between houses and you can kill em using the tank machine guns. We already know that a Steel Fury quality infantry interaction level is a no go here (cpu cost, developing cost...) but still some anti tank teams can add quite a lot to immersion. But on this battlefield seems that most of the people were abducted by aliens, no trenches, nothing ? Maybe make the running AT gun soldiers/tank crews killable someday will be nice for make use of the MG or personal gun.  

My thoughts. Exactly. Don't even need moving infantry. Just lying on ground infantrymen - nothing more!

Edited May 18, 2020 by Lofte

[inexus]

13 hours ago, Danziger said:

They have not commented in the Tank Crew section of the Russian forum either. I do not know why, but if I had to guess, I would say they are just monitoring the forums to see what the general consensus is. Possibly trying to figure out how to implement what the community wants and at what cost in terms of resources. Maybe they are debating whether it is even worth it to expand on TC in the future. 

 

The worst a company with a long term community can do is to treat them with silence. I think people totally understand that company lacks resources and money. But to ignore people who have been with them for the last decade and paid for their modules is extremely poor. I don't see any excuse for this.

 

This is a community that has contributed many times with skins, tools, filled the void of missing documentation, etc. to support the company where they may had the inability to do it themselves. Look at the numerous missions and skins that have been created by community members for TC out of love for the module.

 

There is an expectation for a some mutual respect and at least come out with some response to the community for what is going on. 

Edited May 18, 2020 by inexus
new addition

[Thad]

Salutations,

 

I don't think an assertion about a lack of respect from the developers side is truly justified. Please note the excerpt below taken from the recent DD.

 

"According to Tank Crew players' feedback, we added a server option to disable tank AI gunners in multiplayer. Another option that has been requested for a while - now tech chat messages are a difficulty option so the players will be on equal terms in multiplayer".

 

That indicates attention to the TC players input. At least to some degree.

[Buggeredsteel823]

I'm  so far happy with the game and yes can see there some pain in the ass bits( like some rage with some bushes that damage my engine/gearbox)this kind of thing wouldn't put off playing it its one of those things that happened  just means you have to careful where you go and it still early times yet.

[inexus]

Is what I wrote so offensive? I think it is clear from previous messages on this forum that I thoroughly enjoy IL2. But I have not seen any feedback such as on the AI issue that was raised probably around six months ago now. There have been several threads in the TC section about this. 

[Thad]

No, I don't think what you posted was all that offensive. I share some of your observations and concerns.

 

We need to be patient with TC development while giving coherent and helpful feedback to the developers and to one another.  

[Enceladus828]

In no way trying to demean Tank Crew here, it is my feeling that at the least, almost everyone Tank Crew owner will have a Battle of... to go along with that, therefore a few amount of people will have only TC1, TC2, etc. Same as one only getting PTO battles, Eastern Front Battles, Western Front Battles, FC Volumes, etc.

 

Regardless of whether or not you have only TC Volumes, or have a TCx and a Battle of..., as long as you're both supporting and enjoying the product, then there's no reason for the product to be discontinued due to a lack of sales. If the devs reach the end of every Tank battle and every Battle of... that they can do, it was a good run and everyone should be proud of themselves.

 

For a Tank Crew 2 and hopefully future TC Volumes, it will probably be Tank battles and tanks known well to people, just like Tank Crew 1 was.

[Redwo1f]

My only concern is that the company ought to be very careful right now given the current and at least short term (likely longer) financial situation of the global economy. Not a great time for a relatively small company to be making gambles or pouring resources into anything where they may be taking a loss (if that is indeed the case regarding any of their products be it TC or FC or whatever - I am not privy to their books, nor is anyone here, so who knows how shaky some products are vs others (?)). Tread carefully... Wishing the developers success, but more importantly, wishing the developers continued survival.

 

...they likely have very much on their plate right now to think about regarding the future.

[DetCord12B]

21 hours ago, Danziger said:

From your spamming complaints into every thread you enter, it doesn't seem like you think any of the IL*2 stuff isn't a bad game.

 

References. Provide them. Granted, I've been critical of certain releases, but you make me out to be some sort of agitator that pisses on everything that comes the IL-2 way. This just isn't the case as my post-history provides and only furthers the evidence that individuals like yourself will utilize ad-homs and falsehoods in an attempt further your own points.

 

Quote

I don't think you actually understand what resources they have to work with as far as how small the team is and their allotted time to spend on each part of the game. You recently posted a thread demanding a download section. You said there is no excuse and no valid reason for not having one. What would you like them to stop working on in order to make that happen?

 

No, I posted a thread asking why a we don't have a DL section while niche products within the XP and P3D realms have theirs, products that are niche upon niche and garner sales well below anything within the IL-2 mainstay by-the-way. There is no excuse that a singular addon for an FS title like FSL that sells two products and yet has it's own community download center while while we do not. To attempt to argue against such an aspect is asinine.

 

Quote

However, most of the time you come across as a real Karen with all the negativity and demanding attitude. You have to remember that you aren't in the army anymore and people don't have to listen anymore when you try to order them around. Jason and the development team are not your soldiers. I have often wondered why you stick around this place if the shortcomings of these games cause you so much pain.

 

Good God, what an a** you are. Oh me oh my, I'm not in the military anymore. Geeze, thanks for clarifying that. I don''t think I'd have been able to face facts and or discern reality from fiction without your input. The fact that you can't clarify or address the rampant issues associated with Tank Crew and instead resort to "spreading" speaks volumes. 

 

You're really good at diversionary tactics, I'll give you that. Really good. 

 

22 hours ago, [Pb]Cybermat47 said:

Uh... have I? I don’t recall defending GBS since sometime last year at the latest. I certainly never blamed any other players for the issues they had with the game, that wouldn’t make any sense.
 

Besides, it’s just rude to criticise your studio’s business partners in public (I’m with Team Fusion). I don’t think anyone really does that.

 

Here for your edification.

 

You were quick to jump on the bandwagon in stating that TC is perfectly fine.

[Cybermat47]

5 minutes ago, DetCord12B said:

Here for your edification.

 

You were quick to jump on the bandwagon in stating that TC is perfectly fine.

 

That was a year ago to the day. And I never said that TC is perfectly fine, or that it has no problems, I was simply quoting a dev diary that said that some of the issues the game had at that time were being fixed.

If I thought TC was perfect, why would I acknowledge that there were serious flaws with the game at the time that the devs said they were going to fix? If I didn't think there was anything to be improved, why was I anticipating your Achtung Panzer mod so much?

Edited May 19, 2020 by [Pb]Cybermat47

[Danziger]

2 hours ago, DetCord12B said:

 

References. Provide them. Granted, I've been critical of certain releases, but you make me out to be some sort of agitator that pisses on everything that comes the IL-2 way. This just isn't the case as my post-history provides and only furthers the evidence that individuals like yourself will utilize ad-homs and falsehoods in an attempt further your own points.

 

 

No, I posted a thread asking why a we don't have a DL section while niche products within the XP and P3D realms have theirs, products that are niche upon niche and garner sales well below anything within the IL-2 mainstay by-the-way. There is no excuse that a singular addon for an FS title like FSL that sells two products and yet has it's own community download center while while we do not. To attempt to argue against such an aspect is asinine.

 

 

Good God, what an a** you are. Oh me oh my, I'm not in the military anymore. Geeze, thanks for clarifying that. I don''t think I'd have been able to face facts and or discern reality from fiction without your input. The fact that you can't clarify or address the rampant issues associated with Tank Crew and instead resort to "spreading" speaks volumes. 

 

You're really good at diversionary tactics, I'll give you that. Really good. 

 

 

Here for your edification.

 

You were quick to jump on the bandwagon in stating that TC is perfectly fine.

From your constant complaints and insults directed at the people working on this game, you do seem like some sort of agitator that pisses on everything they do. I am not pilfering through your post history. People can see it for themselves. You have called them lazy and incompetent regarding skins for tanks and 109s. Jason himself told you to knock it off in another thread. However, I don't know what has been purged and sanitized since then.

 

You posted a thread saying there is no excuse and no valid reason for not having a download section. Read it yourself. Sounds like someone demanding to speak to the manager to me. I don't know if you genuinely intend to come off that way or if years in the military made you used to talking that way to people without thinking about how your words come across. That is why I brought it up. 

 

Why would I clarify or address issues with anything these guys put out? I am not a tester or team member or in any way associated with this game apart from playing it and making a few skins.

 

Diversion from what?

 

Nobody is saying it is perfectly fine. What people are saying is that it isn't the unplayable steaming pile of dog poo that you want to make it out to be. People that knew what the deal was going in are generally having fun and happy to wait for things to be updated and fixed.

 

Again, the point is not that there is nothing wrong with the game. There will always be things that can be improved. The point is constructive vs destructive criticism. Being critical does not necessitate being rude.

 

Just scratch all of that. I am not trying to get into a pissing contest. The main point I wanted to get across for you is to just put yourself in the shoes of the people you are talking to before you write. Being rude makes you seem less professional and less likable while the work you do clearly says the opposite.

 

TC has its issues. Those issues were inherited from the engine in which it was built. It is also in a very early state. It would take a lot of time and work to make a proper tank sim out of it and not just a tank module in a flight sim. They surely already know all of this and will let everyone know when they have decided what course of action they want to take.

Edited May 19, 2020 by Danziger

[simfan2015]

FWIW my personal and honest opinion about Tank Crew is that I am amazed how the Devs pulled this off given the limitations of the BOS environment and game-engine.

As other posters have written here this is a development within a flightsim environment and as such it was not primarily meant as a detailed (on-the-)ground war simulation.

The same goes for helicopter warfare in a.o. the DCS World. I like helicopters too, in this I am always reminded in DCS of the fact that the DCS (IL-2  GB and CloD ...) environments were primarily intended for fighting way up there ... in the air.

If I look at e.g. another sim/game I love like Apache : Air Assault there it is obvious this was different (yet more scripted too), but the entire battlefield is *very* small compared to what we get in IL-2, CloD and DCS ! 

The fact that TC is intergrated so well in IL-2 GB is, IMHO, an incredible advantage too, but may indeed mean that we have to live with some limitations that other dedicated tank battle sims may offer.

OTOH how many other state-of-the-art/hardcore tank-sims are still in active development ? ... I know of very little !  

I really love TC ... for what it is and have no regrets whatsover buying it.

Edited May 19, 2020 by simfan2015

[Goosevich]

What people are saying is that it isn't the unplayable steaming pile of dog poo that you want to make it out to be.

 

Yeah, nah mate. He didn't imply anywhere that TC is a POS. But the glaring issues and the style the game is build in are really f*ckin' annoying at this point...and kinda unplayable (at least in mp )

People that knew what the deal was going in are generally having fun and happy to wait for things to be updated and fixed.

No, not really. For example i'm getting more and more pissed off whenever ppl mention magical TC2 as our tank sim savior - TC is the game is almost at the end of a developement cycle i presume  (tank-wise) and the only good change that came was a dmg model...that you cant really check out because of the non existant AI. Also im in awe that anyone wants make skins for our tanks - the system is so f*cked  that it's just sad.
 

[Danziger]

28 minutes ago, Goosevich said:

 

 

 

Yeah, nah mate. He didn't imply anywhere that TC is a POS. But the glaring issues and the style the game is build in are really f*ckin' annoying at this point...and kinda unplayable (at least in mp )
 

 

No, not really. For example i'm getting more and more pissed off whenever ppl mention magical TC2 as our tank sim savior - TC is the game is almost at the end of a developement cycle i presume  (tank-wise) and the only good change that came was a dmg model...that you cant really check out because of the non existant AI. Also im in awe that anyone wants make skins for our tanks - the system is so f*cked  that it's just sad.
 

 

By your single bar for owning TC, I am assuming that you do not own any of the other IL*2 stuff. Your very low post count tells you haven't been here very long (your profile says joined in January). So you do not really fit into the group I was talking about when I said that they knew what the deal was. People that were already in IL*2 seeing how things developed with the air battles and actually read the DDs had a lot better idea of what we were getting. As a result, they either did not purchase because they were not interested, or are understanding of what it is and what it is going to take to get it all fleshed out.

[Goosevich]

Yep x2. But that did not stop me from observing the forum for a long long time, and im still dissapointed.

[Patricks]

1 hour ago, Danziger said:

By your single bar for owning TC, I am assuming that you do not own any of the other IL*2 stuff. Your very low post count tells you haven't been here very long (your profile says joined in January). So you do not really fit into the group I was talking about when I said that they knew what the deal was. People that were already in IL*2 seeing how things developed with the air battles and actually read the DDs had a lot better idea of what we were getting. As a result, they either did not purchase because they were not interested, or are understanding of what it is and what it is going to take to get it all fleshed out.

 

I'm in the same boat, read in 2020 about TC being an "early access release" back in 2018 and jumped in thinking it must have made great strides in two years. Nope, but that's on me for reading the hype and diving into the shallow pool head-first. As for looking at the badges (as in Goosevich's case) to get an idea what he owns, it may or may not be accurate. I own the original IL2, CoD, CoD Blitz, Stalingrad, Kuban, Moscow, Bodenplatte, Tank Crew, several collector planes, and every campaign they sell. All you will see on my posts are what I bought direct from IL2. I'm fully supporting these people with my wallet, and when it comes to TC, i'm a bit let down. Unfortunately this directly works it's way into my decision not to purchase Normandy, even when it is released into "early access"... 

Edited May 19, 2020 by Icer