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Pict

[Request] Bomber intercept practice mission(s)

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Posted (edited)

I would happily make these myself if I had the same access to the mission editor most of us seem to have, however, I still don't, see here for details https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/16815-mission-editor-requestsuggestions-thread/?do=findComment&comment=514750

 

What I would like is a simple mission that puts you in an interceptor above and to the side of a bomber stream, so that you can practice high side attacks. No wing-men, no friendlies, no escorts, just you and the bombers.

 

Daytime, with no cloud, no radical wind, reasonably historically high altitude, Mig-3 or LAGG-3 vs He-111 or Ju-88's on the Moscow or Stalingrad map as a minimum, but any additional combinations would be more than welcome, doesn't need to be historic, or Red vs Blue, could be P-40 vs Pe-2's or Fw-190A3 vs Ju-88 or P-40 vs A-20B or on the Kuban map.

 

Makes no difference really, as I just want to practice a particular technique and this is virtually impossible with the Quick combat missions as the bombers fly like fighters and then go and land after a few minutes :)  So the bombers need to just cruise along as fast as they can in a straight line, relying on their speed and gunners for defense, and for a good distance, like at least half the map.

 

Thanks in advance to anyone willing to take the precious time to do this, it will be most appreciated and used many, many, many times.

Edited by Pict

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Here you go @Pict.

 

Intercept Bomber Practice.zip

 

 

This mission should be extracted into your:

 

...\1C Game Studios\IL-2 Sturmovik Battle of Moscow\data\Multiplayer\Dogfight\

 

folder.

 

This mission is designed to be played multiplayer server, but you can play all alone if you want (which is no fun!) or play with your friends. Additionally, this allows you to choose from many, many different planes instead of just a single plane. You had asked to be spawned to the side of a bomber, but I instead made the bomber flight spawn at a random location. Each time you, or your friends, kill the bomber flight a new set of four bombers will randomly spawn at a new location. Here's a video of how I set it up, and how bad a shot I am!

 

 

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The downside of making it MP is that we don't get to choose what bombers we are attacking and what level their gunners are. The only real advantage is that you get to respawn quicker but that is irrelevant if you have bombers with no gunners (unless you collide with them 😄)

 

I may be wrong but I thought the OP wanted to practice making attacks on bombers while avoiding the guns. 

 

On 3/15/2019 at 8:44 AM, Pict said:

bombers need to just cruise along as fast as they can in a straight line, relying on their speed and gunners for defense

 

 

If this is the case then :-

 

1) You need gunners to shoot back so you know if your attack plan is working.  If it was SP you could specify how good the gunners are and can make your aircraft invulnerable if you want to know you were hit but don't want to have to respawn.

2) You need to be able to choose what bombers you are attacking as you need to practice different attacks for different bombers.  Only SP allows that.

3) You want to choose what fighter you will be using and what modifications it has but you can do that in SP just as easily as in MP.

Of course it is always fun to practice killing bombers with friends and maybe you just want to practice finding where is the best place to hit a bomber when it cannot shoot back  in which case what you have done is best  but I got the impression that was not what he was asking for (and what I would find useful myself)

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Cool cool cool. Firstly, thank you a ton (and I really mean it) for the feedback. Let see if I can make another mission - a single player mission in this case - with all the feedback you provided. First, I have some questions for clarity sake, because I think you're thinking of QMB and not a single player mission.

 

Questions:

  • How do you choose different AI bombers in single player?
    • It sounds like you have a way of setting up AI bombers before the mission starts? How?
      • As a mission builder:
        • I can set up logic in the mission editor to spawn different types of bombers depending on what actions a player takes. As an example, the player could spawn He111s if they fire a green flare, and Pe2s if they fire a red flare. But this is limited to the three flare colors.
        • I can also setup different play areas. If you fly into "X" play area, then Ju87s spawn in. If you fly to "Y" play area, then IL-2s spawn in, and so on. 
  • In continuation of above, how do you set the skill level of said bombers in single player mission?
    • Again, it sounds like you know of a way to set the AI's skill level before starting the mission?
      • As a mission builder:
        • I can create the same logic as I stated above. Red flare for "Ace" difficulty, green flare for "noobs only", etc etc. However, it can't be a two flare system (it probably can be, but that's a lot of logic for a small request). It's either a flare for different bombers or a flare for different difficulty - you decide.
        • The same can be said true for play areas. X play area for harder difficulty, Y play area for easy mode, etc, etc
    • I was most certainly under the impression that you can not adjust the AI skill level of a single player mission without entering the mission editor. I also was under the impression that Pict does not want to tango with the mission editor, if he can help it. However, if he or anyone else wants to open the mission editor up, you're welcome to edit the skill level of the bombers in my mission. I only have four bomber entities in the map, so it should be fairly easy. See image:

image.thumb.png.65da274fdad038ca2b85e1e5d29f055c.png

 

  • How do you select a different playable planes in a single player mission?
    • Again, I'm pretty certain that single player missions must use a single plane and not the airfield respawner MCU. The official missions even have the name of the craft you'll fly in that mission, in the title of the mission because it can not be changed. Therefore, you can not select different playable planes without entering the mission editor. If this is the case, then I'll make it clear which plane is the player's plane in the mission editor, when I create the single player version of this mission, so that anyone can edit the plane as they see fit.

 

 

 

Edit: I should add that the bombers do in fact have gunners. They're just choosing not to shoot at the player because their priority is set to 'get to the next waypoint regardless of anything else'. So right now they're not shooting but that behavior is easily changeable in the mission editor.

Edited by [TWB]Sketch-

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4 hours ago, [TWB]Sketch- said:

Here you go

 

Thanks very much for taking the time to make this and the entertaining video too :) I saw this earlier, but held off on replying until I had at least tested it out a bit.

 

The multiplayer idea is certainly something I hadn't thought of and is good for having the full range of weapons at your disposal as you would in a single player Quick mission, with the added benefit of practicing with friends.

 

However, when I looked at the video and this was proven out when I tested the mission, the bombers only fly straight and level for a couple of minutes before making a turn, which by the time you get into position (above and to the side), means you only get one or two (at best) firing passes before they turn again. This means you spend most of the time flying into the intended starting position, which in the end is not so different to the single player quick mission. If I understand correctly, you limited the bombers to an area around the spawn point to save flying large distances to find them?...

 

Edit, I'm in the middle of writing this and got interrupted a few times, enough time for both of you to post, so I'm gonna post this, then read what's been said and up date my post :) 

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Posted (edited)

Huge apologies.  I *was* confusing SP with QMB.     🙄

 

In that case there is probably a limit to what you can do but it still might be better to make the gunners shoot back if you can as I believe that was a major part of what the OP was asking for (and I cannot work out out what needs changing to make that happen)     I am not very experienced with the Mission Editor. I know just enough to go in and tweak a few existing settings blindly eg I went in and changed the starting altitudes as most Russian fighters don't fly well at 4500m. My ignorance shows in the fact that I also tried altering each of the four groups to be a different bomber and just ended up with four mixed formations as it obviously does not work as I thought 🙄 Doh!    (still useful though)

If you made it as a SP mission with just four formations of four bombers then I would probably be capable of going in and customising what each bomber group was and what the fighter was so I have a few missions named 'SpitIX Bomber intercept' & 'Yak1b Bomber intercept' etc.    Though I like your idea of firing a flare to choose your opponents and if that would only work in MP that would still be OK as I could still make a version for each fighter I want to use. 

Thanks for going to the trouble though.  If you don't want to do any more could you give me a few pointers on how I make them shoot back and how I choose the gunner AI (or is that just part of setting the whole plane as 'Normal' level?)

Edited by 56RAF_Roblex
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Niiccee. We're on the same train now! CHOO CHOO! 😄

 

Okay, now that we're on the same page, let me propose some additions to my multiplayer mission setup.

I will add two more play areas...

  1. Each of these play areas will have a different bomber type. So "play area 1" will be He111s, "play area 2" will be Ju88s, and so on
  2. Each play area will have a spawn location (as I've done already for the first area).
  3. I'll add flare logic. If no flare, then the bombers will be easy mode and not shoot. If there's a flare though, then the bombers go into "high" skill set and will perform defensive maneuvers.
  4. If I have time (which I do currently) I'll add a super hard mode play area with He111s. They basically shoot you down if you stay on their six for less than 2-3 seconds.
  5. I'll make their flight paths much longer (more rectangular than square) for multiple passes at the bomber flight before they turn

 

These changes will allow you to select any plane you want, and fight the three most popular bombers and each bomber type will have customizable to difficulty. 

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2 minutes ago, [TWB]Sketch- said:

 

These changes will allow you to select any plane you want, and fight the three most popular bombers and each bomber type will have customizable to difficulty. 

 

That sounds perfect.   One thing I forgot to mention though.   I noticed that I did not have full engine control ie I was not able to adjust the RPM on my spitfire.   Is that something I can easily change somewhere?   I am sure other people are happy with it like that so I am only asking if I can tweak something for myself.

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Yes, this is a server setting. Before launching the server, check to see if you have the game set to 'normal'. If so, change it to 'expert' (or custom if you want) for complex engine management.

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57 minutes ago, [TWB]Sketch- said:

Here's the new mission

 

Ok, I gave it a spin, well 3 spins actually, but I never found the bombers once...I knew they were there somewhere, just where exactly was the problem. The "radar" on the map was intermittent and I spent all 3 flights just flying around over the cloud, which doesn't help with navigation.

 

I wanted to see how long they would fly before turning, but I gave up looking for them in the end. This is probably my fault coupled with a slow end computer that doesn't like multiplayer or clouds so much.

 

Your mission is well thought out and well made, and I'm sure it will go down well with most, but to be honest it's not really what I was looking for to begin with. I just want to practice a particular shooting technique, rather than an interception technique.

 

All I need is a simple single player mission 1x LaGG-3 on 6x He111 after that I can edit the aircraft type myself (even with a text editor if needs be), where I'm right next to and slightly above the bombers at the start and the bomber fly straight and level for the length of the map in a reasonably tight formation, AI set to random, no clouds, 4500m, no winter, no excessive wind.

 

Thanks again anyway :) 

 

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I got you fam.

 

If you load the mission in the mission editor, you can change the player plane and the bombers. Right now it's a LaGG3 against 6 He111s. See image:

 

image.thumb.png.f6491c906719c163f418bf442330b29f.png

 

 

This mission is single player, so extract into your:

 

...\1C Game Studios\IL-2 Sturmovik Battle of Moscow\data\Missions\

 

folder. As you can see, you're offset and behind the enemy as you requested. The mission also has the difficulty changer system via a flare thrown. You'll have 15 seconds to decide if you want the bombers to shoot at you or not. If you fire a flare within that 15 second window, the bombers shoot back; otherwise they'll not return fire. 

 

 

Attack Bomber Practice.zip

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Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, [TWB]Sketch- said:

I got you fam.

 

Almost...who's fam anyhow? :)

 

So, thanks once again for putting together another mission. I gave it a go and it's almost exactly what I was looking for. I say almost as I have no need for an easy option where the bombers don't shoot, it's just not going to be used and having to fire a flare every time is...a bit like turning my screen around to open the editor...I'd prefer not to need to do it :)  That said it doesn't work anyhow, no matter how many flares you fire, the counter goes down and you get bombers who don't shoot every time.

 

I was going to remove that feature in the mission builder myself, like a got rid of the unwanted ugly flickering clouds :) (might just be my graphics card) but it appears to be interwoven in the mission in a complex manner (complex from my level of understanding at any rate), and is probably why it's in a box called "don't mess with this"  :)

 

So, if you could chop out the fire the flare routine and just set the bombers to what bombers do and shoot back, random ai experience level is spot on,  I'd be over the moon. I can junk the clouds myself when I swap planes.

 

Sorry to bring bring back the broken toy once more, so to speak, it's very nearly spot on. The bomber formation, for instance, is great.

 

Other thing, I intend to record a track of this "high sided attack" that I'm practicing for you, so that you can get a clear picture of what it's all about. When watching the first video you made I noticed that you used 2 types of attack, the 1st, like many videos I've seen made for BOX was the suicide run up the bombers rear end and the in the second, you had a go at a head on attack.

 

The head on attack was designed to break up US bomber box formations to reduce the effectiveness of their combined gun defense and it's invention is attributed to Egon Mayer and Georg-Peter Eder of Jg.2, both impressive pilots who held record number of kills, Mayer was the first pilot to achieve over 100 kills solely on the western front & Eder was the leading ace against the USAAF. They were based near where I have been living for the past 20 years and I'd say it has some effect on why this interests me so much. Having flown light aircraft out of one of their old bases and taxied around where the old dispersal are still to this day, you can't help but imagine the intense pressure these young guys were under while attempting to stop the tidal wave of bombers that were passing through.

 

If you want a real challenge, try making a USAAF style bomber box formation, I'm sure I saw someone give it a go at some point, but I bet it would be frustrating to get right. If it could be done, head on passes would be interesting. My computer would probably die in the process :) 

 

Thanks once again for your efforts :good:

 

Edited by Pict

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40 minutes ago, Pict said:

Other thing, I intend to record a track of this "high sided attack" that I'm practicing for you, so that you can get a clear picture of what it's all about. When watching the first video you made I noticed that you used 2 types of attack, the 1st, like many videos I've seen made for BOX was the suicide run up the bombers rear end and the in the second, you had a go at a head on attack.

Ehhhh... I was only trying to get to the bombers quickly for video's sake. I always attack from the side or in front. /s

 

 

The next version will cost you one beer.

Attack Bomber Practice v2.zip

 

 

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No need for another version, this one has hit the mark spot on :good:

 

Here's the beer anyhow, you more than deserve it, thanks again :) 

 

Chimay-Bleue_-Blue_beer_900.thumb.jpg.10e9be1b04ad9710459c418074889116.jpg

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Posted (edited)

Chimay? Never had it. Is it good? Looks like a dark IPA, and I like dark beers. 

 

I'm glad the mission is working out for you. 

Edited by [TWB]Sketch-

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I spent a bit of time in Flanders last summer and tried Chimey beers for the first time then and I liked them all, but the blue I found something special, 9% alcohol so it's got a kick to it, but it's done well enough to carry that strength without it dominating the beer. Some people recommend that you cellar it for at least 6 moths to get the best out of it, I've yet to try that, but found it to be excellent right out of the store, so I need to remember to give that a go.

 

If you like dark beers, then I would highly recommend this one, and if you have a chance to buy get the glass that matches it, don't pass it up, as they are very slick. My mate in Flanders wouldn't let you pour it in anything else :) 

 

As far as I know it's available internationally and there are quite a few reviews of it on YouTube

 

American guy

Canadian guy

English guy (in a pub/club after a few Chimey Red's :)

 

The mission is just great, I've already duplicated it with different aircraft and am having a lot of pleasure from it. I used the mission editor in the original IL2 & DCS all the time, but have yet to get into the BOX one for reasons already outlined, which is a shame as it's the key to unlock all the potential. I have manged to figure out how to open, perform a simple edit, like change aircraft type, save and close it without needing to mess with my screen, so that another bonus from today :) 

 

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Please accept my thanks for your development and posting of all these missions.  They are all spectacular.  Also, my thanks for spurring me into actually playing in the multiplayer mode.  I have explored the this side of the sim, but never played.  I now regret that it took so long.  Again, a heart felt thank you.

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