Jump to content
LukeFF

Seriously, some of these campaign missions are...

Recommended Posts

...crazy ridiculous. Who would ever send out 1 Bf 109 to intercept a group of Il-2s that had fighter escort? I know there needs to be a challenge for people in offline mode, but sending out just the player's plane against 8-10 enemy planes is simply absurd. 

  • Upvote 14

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lolz, you must have read my mind Luke. 

 

I fired up BoS last night, first time in ages, first mission on "The ring of death" has me doing a solo suicidal flight in a La5 sent out against 4 HE-111 and 4 109's.

 

I actually thought to myself, man this is ridiculous.

 

Well done Luke the Mage, OK then I've been playing too much Witcher 3, lol.

 

Mick. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There were a couple like that on the other side too...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought the Luftwaffe was outnumbered 10:1 on the Eastern front from what I've read. That's probably after Stalingrad though. If the game could make all the Soviet pilots total cannon fodder it would be more realistic. Ah something to hope for in a better campaign.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The problem with a totally randomised mission generator is that sometimes it will pump out very unsatisfactory scenarios, historically inaccurate and not 'fun' to play

 

Anything is possible with coding, but I wonder how much effort would be needed to include a small amount of logic in the randomiser to discount certain parameters to avoid generating  missions like this. That small change would avoid a lot of frustration

 

Cheers Dakpilot

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At least apply the simple logic, that LW flights never be smaller than a 'rotte' (2 aircraft) and VVS flights never fewer than 3.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am in the WinterStorm chapter and the missions are quite illogical :

The Gereman usually takes off from the pocket to attack the front line !

It would have been more interesting to have available airfiled in the west to provide cover to the offensive !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Last time I played the campaign I encountered sth the other way round. We as a 5 plane Stuka wing were send out to destroy 3 artillery pieces.

 

I for one dont mind the campaign anymore as the whole concept has been shaoed out wrong in my opinion but I understand for those how fly and enjoy it such issues are very annoying.

 

And no, LW aircraft were never send into combat as singles.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It works all the ways :

- Single LaGG 3 has to engage He-111s escorted by 109s - well, I just try to hit one of them head on and inflict damage enough to complete the mission and than get the hell out of there

- Couple of fighters have a task to intercept a single bomber without escort

 

And many other weird combinations. It is like there is no proper scaling, it should work simply - the more aircraft to engage the stronger should be the attacker. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have also a single Stuka bombing a bridge protected by at least 5 lagg-3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And why oh why, when given the task of intercepting Ju-52's are blasted things always coming from the direction of Moscow???

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It works all the ways :

- Single LaGG 3 has to engage He-111s escorted by 109s - well, I just try to hit one of them head on and inflict damage enough to complete the mission and than get the hell out of there

- Couple of fighters have a task to intercept a single bomber without escort

 

And many other weird combinations. It is like there is no proper scaling, it should work simply - the more aircraft to engage the stronger should be the attacker. 

 

I've been seeing weird things like that as well - my last Intercept mission in the Bf 109 F-4 had me and my wingman intercepting a lone Il-2. This wasn't an anomaly, either - I've had that same sort of mission template show up several times now. These sort of missions are just way too disconnected from reality to be enjoyable. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The .group files that are responsible are stored in the SCG.gtp.   If we had a mods-on mode we could fix this. 

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And now I'm seeing how futile ground attack missions are in the Bf 109. 9 times out of 10, there are enemy fighters over the ground target, which means either (a) being shot down by the enemy fighter cover or (b) dumping external ordnance and engaging the enemy fighters, which means failing the mission. And, of course, most times the player doesn't have friendly fighter cover to deal with the defending fighters. It all adds up to a bunch of frustration. It's pretty rare any more that I get frustrated to the point of getting mad while playing a game, but tonight was one of those nights. 

 

C'mon devs, there's gotta be a better way to generate campaign missions than this.

  • Upvote 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am amazed??? I never thought I would see the day when LukeFF would criticize either ROF or BOS.  Did anybody check, Did Hell Freeze over? Are the climate change fanatics right???? These are scary times!!! :rolleyes:

 

S!Blade<>< :lol:

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The .group files that are responsible are stored in the SCG.gtp.   If we had a mods-on mode we could fix this.

 

At this point I don't know why we ate worried about it, we should be modding it regardless of an approved mode or a lack thereof.

There are lots of mod sites, start making and posting them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am amazed??? I never thought I would see the day when LukeFF would criticize either ROF or BOS.  Did anybody check, Did Hell Freeze over? Are the climate change fanatics right???? These are scary times!!! :rolleyes:

 

S!Blade<>< :lol:

 

Just goes to show you hardly know me at all.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In chapter Unternehmen Wintergewitter, I had to bomb the Logovskiy train station 3 or 4 times... I didn't expected russian to be such fast builders :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am amazed??? I never thought I would see the day when LukeFF would criticize either ROF or BOS.  Did anybody check, Did Hell Freeze over? Are the climate change fanatics right???? These are scary times!!! :rolleyes:

 

S!Blade<>< :lol:

 

Then you obviously do not come here much. Luke like most of BoS's supporters are not blind and never have been.. nor are they stupid or mindless lemmings..

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Luke has done a lot to help RoF's career mode and I am sure he would do even more if he could. I find his comments interesting as they mirror some of my problems with the campaign.

 

Leaving the whole issue of historic content completely too one side, what is particularly frustrating is that many of these mission design problems are fixable by the community and could improve the SP experience even within it's current design philosophy, without 1CGS having to do much work, if only they would let us. (As Feathered_IV alludes).

Edited by unreasonable

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just like players could help expanding MP expiriemce by building huge missions for 100 players with different tasks and objectives....or like players could help people with performance issues by sharing their custom graphic settings optimised to their machines.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just goes to show you hardly know me at all.

You are correct I do hardly know you, I was just sharing an honest reaction to your OP with a little horsing around added on(i have never seen you post a complaint ever.). You are completely correct some of the mission sets in the Campaign Game are particularly ridicules in regards to actual WWII operations. The QMB for the Campaign Game definitely could use some work. Having to wait forever for a 4 plane flight to be ready to take off, or else the AI won't take off at all if you leave to early? Has that been fixed yet? Do the AI carry out the Attack Ground Target command or Follow our mission command and actually attack the mission targets? I haven't flown in about a month or more, so I am honestly asking?

 

Then you obviously do not come here much. Luke like most of BoS's supporters are not blind and never have been.. nor are they stupid or mindless lemmings..

I am not sure who pissed in your Wheaties, but I did not insinuate that anyone here is  what you described.  It is quite amazing that this post is coming from you, a Moderator. You are correct, I do not come here much and this(your post) is part of the reason I do not come here.  Your post, has no tie in to the OP, but was merely an attempt to insult to me, or you at least hoped it would be.  It was no insult though BC, it was just confirmation of your bias and nonprofessional performance as a  Moderator here.  You have a nice day, I hope things get better for you.

 

S!Blade<><

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am not sure who pissed in your Wheaties, but I did not insinuate that anyone here is  what you described. 

 

[Edited]

Edited by Bearcat

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's exactly what you're doing, actually.

Here let me fix BCs statement so that it reflects the actual situation:

"Then you obviously do not come here much. Luke like most of BoS's supporters are not blind and never have been.. nor are they stupid or mindless lemmings.." Except BSR whom exhibits all of these characteristics freely here on the BOS Forums while insulting and placing words in others mouths and not being held accountable to the BOS Forum rules for it.

[Edited]

 

S!Blade<><

Edited by Bearcat
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You are correct I do hardly know you, I was just sharing an honest reaction to your OP with a little horsing around added on(i have never seen you post a complaint ever.). You are completely correct some of the mission sets in the Campaign Game are particularly ridicules in regards to actual WWII operations. The QMB for the Campaign Game definitely could use some work. Having to wait forever for a 4 plane flight to be ready to take off, or else the AI won't take off at all if you leave to early? Has that been fixed yet? Do the AI carry out the Attack Ground Target command or Follow our mission command and actually attack the mission targets? I haven't flown in about a month or more, so I am honestly asking?

 

I am not sure who pissed in your Wheaties, but I did not insinuate that anyone here is  what you described.  It is quite amazing that this post is coming from you, a Moderator. You are correct, I do not come here much and this(your post) is part of the reason I do not come here.  Your post, has no tie in to the OP, but was merely an attempt to insult to me, or you at least hoped it would be.  It was no insult though BC, it was just confirmation of your bias and nonprofessional performance as a  Moderator here.  You have a nice day, I hope things get better for you.

 

S!Blade<><

 

It was not meant to tie into the OP .. it was meant to tie into this post...

 

I am amazed??? I never thought I would see the day when LukeFF would criticize either ROF or BOS.  Did anybody check, Did Hell Freeze over? Are the climate change fanatics right???? These are scary times!!! :rolleyes:

 

S!Blade<>< :lol:

 

Which was uncalled for and frankly serves no purpose other than to ridicule.. You say it was made in levity.. Fair enough.. but it was not funny. The subject did not find it funny neither did I..

 

Here let me fix BCs statement so that it reflects the actual situation:

 

Let's just carry on with the discussion shall we..  gents.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've also been noticing immersion-destroying things happening, like when flying a Stuka with 37mm guns, the waypoints are set at 4000m, and He-111s being sent to attack artillery, again from 4000m.

Edited by Cybermat47

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've also been noticing immersion-destroying things happening, like when flying a Stuka with 37mm guns, the waypoints are set at 4000m, and He-111s being sent to attack artillery, again from 4000m.

The Stuka altitude is too high. What altitude did the Germans bomb from with the He 111? I honestly don't know as I'm not a heavy (or in this case middleweight) guy. Not sure what altitudes the Western allies used their medium bombers at for level bombing. I'm vaguely aware B-17's bombed from around 25,000. So, 12,500 doesn't sound too bad to a neophyte like me. Might be time for some reading/research tonight.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People, you know that in this 'campaign" you can cancel any mission - and this dont have influence in the course of war/unlocks/rewards/level up, etc - just cost the time to load another.

 

If the briefing show a mission "impossible or senseless", just cancel and pick another.

You are not squadron pilot tied to superior orders, you a mercenary pilot fight for money (OK, XP), so select your task.  ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People, you know that in this 'campaign" you can cancel any mission - and this dont have influence in the course of war/unlocks/rewards/level up, etc - just cost the time to load another.

 

If the briefing show a mission "impossible or senseless", just cancel and pick another.

You are not squadron pilot tied to superior orders, you a mercenary pilot fight for money (OK, XP), so select your task.  ;)

We shouldn't have to cancel the missions though - they should all make sense.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are they (pre)scripted? I thought they randomly picked parameters from a set (friend/foe/objects/quantities) and kinda threw them together. That's why some can be a little screwy.

Edited by [TBC]HerrMurf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It was not meant to tie into the OP .. it was meant to tie into this post...

 

 

Which was uncalled for and frankly serves no purpose other than to ridicule.. You say it was made in levity.. Fair enough.. but it was not funny. The subject did not find it funny neither did I..

 

 

Let's just carry on with the discussion shall we..  gents.

It was a joke BC.  I didn't see where LukeFF said he felt insulted?  I did see where you, BC, tried to insult me by putting words into my mouth, but I am not stooping to your level. Neither you nor BSR can read my mind or decipher intent from what I write, So why don't both of you give it a rest ?   LukeFF, if  in any way  I offended or insulted you please let me know and I will make amends for it.

 

S!Blade<>< 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let's just get back to the original topic, please. :)


People, you know that in this 'campaign" you can cancel any mission - and this dont have influence in the course of war/unlocks/rewards/level up, etc - just cost the time to load another.

 

If the briefing show a mission "impossible or senseless", just cancel and pick another.

You are not squadron pilot tied to superior orders, you a mercenary pilot fight for money (OK, XP), so select your task.  ;)

 

The problem with that is the player often doesn't know until he's in the mission that he's been given a mission setup with crazy parameters, since the briefing doesn't give the player info like number of planes in the player's flight, escorting aircraft, etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We all point to these *problems* but will anything get done about it? Probably not and will be another case of "Moscow aint interested"

 

Mick. :(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And now I'm seeing how futile ground attack missions are in the Bf 109. 9 times out of 10, there are enemy fighters over the ground target, which means either (a) being shot down by the enemy fighter cover or (b) dumping external ordnance and engaging the enemy fighters, which means failing the mission. And, of course, most times the player doesn't have friendly fighter cover to deal with the defending fighters. It all adds up to a bunch of frustration. It's pretty rare any more that I get frustrated to the point of getting mad while playing a game, but tonight was one of those nights. 

 

C'mon devs, there's gotta be a better way to generate campaign missions than this.

If the frustration from the campaign results spoils the pleasure you had playing the mission, it means that the campaign system is very bad

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another case in point: a ground attack mission in La-5s, where the player has to take out all four artillery guns. I took out the first two guns with my bombs and, since my wingman is dawdling off somewhere else, I had to then engage the remaining two guns with my cannons. After taking out the third gun, a 109 found me and, predictably, shot me down. There are a couple of problems here:

  • Requiring the player to destroy an entire artillery battery is patently ridiculous. Knocking out two or three guns would be cause for celebration, not a "you failed" message from one's CO.
  • Requiring the player to take out so many targets means the player has to loiter over the target for a very long time, which of course increases the likelihood of being shot down by AAA or enemy fighters.
  • The AI takes way, way too long right now to finally decide it wants to attack a ground target with rockets or bombs.
  • The defending enemy fighters are always right over the target, which makes these sort of missions repetitive, predictable, and frustrating. 
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

LukeFF I agree with all of these points, they are exactly the sort of thing that people have been pointing out since the "campaign" was released. Many constructive suggestions have been made on how to improve the missions by people who recognize the strong points about BoS and wish to see it saved from obscurity.

 

Response there has been none except generic reassurances that "improvements will be made".

 

But the developers are also averse to allowing the user base to improve the mission making for them by opening up the relevant files.

 

Is it any wonder that so many SP players have been so scathing about this game?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...