WEP timer eats up combat timer

[the_emperor]

It seems that the use of WEP additionally eats up (at about double the rate) combat time as well. 
eg

P-51D 5min WEP leave you with  ~ 6-7min combat time (should be 15min). 
please give us the option to turn off this intransparent timer mechanic🙏

Edited August 1 by the_emperor

[LukeFF]

We need track files. 🙂

[the_emperor]

Of course, sorry:

https://limewire.com/d/nMt3f#fZEI5z2hKB

[LukeFF]

Per Gavrick, this is working as intended. 

[the_emperor]

But shouldn I have 15min of combat time after I used 5min of WEP instead of ~6?

[Kubert]

Both combat power and WEP are regimes when you are overloading the engine. Combat power is slight overload and WEP is heavy overload. To put it as simplistic as possible...after you use heavy overload, then you shouldn't for a certain period of time use even slight overload to keep the engine functional.

 

I personally almost never using WEP or emergency power. Only nominal or combat. For me is emergency/WEP only for running away from very terrible situations...and I try to never get to those. It's also easier to keep engine in check without them. For example in Ten Days of Autumn campaign I used emergency power once in 15 missions.

Edited July 23 by Kubert

[the_emperor]

This is about a game mechanic. 

That mechanic states I can run 5min WEP and 15min combat setting. 

Which I currently cant and should therefore be fixed. 

[Kubert]

Can you run combat mode for 15 minutes if you didn't use WEP shortly before?

 

Can you run WEP for 5 minutes?

 

If both answers are yes, then there is nothing to fix. Timers affecting each others is normal...because it is the same engine. It should be like that. 

[MDzmitry]

From what I understand, engine timers are practically equal to a stamina bar in most videogames. 

 

So, Military and WEP settings are just different multipliers for its "drainage", while Continuous is for "regeneration". And by this logic the engine's resource is shared (100%/15min/5min/2min) instead of having respective pools for each power output (100%/15min + 100%/5min + 100%/2min). 

 

But it's likely to be an oversimplified explanation, since by this logic alone I personally would've burnt my P-39's engine much more often.

[[CPT]Crunch]

Slices two ways, you can also set your prop to continuous at 86% and put the power at 89% in full combat and safely run 25 minutes of combat time.  You can go an awful long way at very fast speed, pretty much run a sortie out and back.  If you always have to run with hair on full fire your doing something very wrong tactics wise.

[the_emperor]

1 hour ago, MDzmitry said:

From what I understand, engine timers are practically equal to a stamina bar in most videogames.

That is also my understanding. 
but not knowing  how much I have already spent or recovered is very frustrating. 
in terms of the P-51 the fact that both regimes are run on the same rpm is the reason why both eat into each other und other planes like the Spitfire with the same engine dont have that issue but can trick the game to increase WEP/combat time by reducing rpm.
 

[the_emperor]

On 7/24/2025 at 8:07 AM, Kubert said:

Can you run combat mode for 15 minutes if you didn't use WEP shortly before?

 

Can you run WEP for 5 minutes?

 

If both answers are yes, then there is nothing to fix.

 

No, after ~15min Combat time, my WEP timer is reduced to ~3min and better yet, my engine kills itself without warning  via techno chat that my WEP time expired.

https://limewire.com/d/5i11x#8VxIZGP3X6

 

On 7/24/2025 at 8:07 AM, Kubert said:

Timers affecting each others is normal...because it is the same engine

Well, I would disagree.

the Timer mechanic is a game mechanic and therefore I should at least be able to use all settings the amount of time as described. otherwise we  need a visible stamina bar to know how much we have left.

 

On 7/24/2025 at 2:37 PM, [CPT]Crunch said:

Slices two ways, you can also set your prop to continuous at 86% and put the power at 89% in full combat and safely run 25 minutes of combat time

Yes, I know. but reducing RPM to increase time on high power settings is another problem with this timer mechanic.

[Kubert]

28 minutes ago, the_emperor said:

Well, I would disagree.

the Timer mechanic is a game mechanic and therefore I should at least be able to use all settings the amount of time as described. otherwise we  need a visible stamina bar to know how much we have left.

Yes, it is a game mechanic, but its purpose is to be as close as possible to realism. I doubt that in reality pilots could count with precise 5 or 15 minutes timers when pushing engine above its limit. We are lucky enough that wear and tear of the engine is not simulated and in every mission we get factory fresh machine. As [CPT]Crunch wrote. If you are blowing your engine often, you are doing something wrong...maybe loosing too much energy in turns or flying low and need to climb too much. I don't know. Check for example YouTube P-51 career of Wolfpack345. I watched it and he never blew his engine. Neither do I when flying any plane. 

 

And stamina bar? For real? It is simulator. I am playing without HUD, markers and icons at full realism for the best immersion. In my opinion this should be default mindset of regular IL-2 GB enjoyer. To seek autenticity and use HUD, technochat, markers and so just long enough to acclimatize before gradually turning them off.

Edited July 30 by Kubert

[the_emperor]

1 hour ago, Kubert said:

Yes, it is a game mechanic, but its purpose is to be as close as possible to realism

And in my mind, it fails in that regards.

 

1 hour ago, Kubert said:

And stamina bar? For real? It is simulator. I am playing without HUD, markers and icons at full realism for the best immersion. In my opinion this should be default mindset of regular IL-2 GB enjoyer

 

In that point I fully agree. But artificial timers are not the way to go but instead heat & consumption management are the way to go and take care of your engine and plane 

 

1 hour ago, Kubert said:

We are lucky enough that wear and tear of the engine is not simulated and in every mission we get factory fresh machine

then way should we have an engine that blows up after a certain amount of time, when all engine parameters are in the green an tell you can keep on going?

 

Again I am not asking for the termination of the timer mechanic, just the option to turn it off (like it was done with the La-5f) and manage the plane by heat and consumption,

since there are many things wrong with this mechanic:

 

[Kubert]

47 minutes ago, the_emperor said:

But artificial timers are not the way to go but instead heat & consumption management are the way to go and take care of your engine and plane

 

Removing them is not the way to go. With P-51 automatic radiators and insane fuel tanks it will be basically without any limitation. The longest missions we have in the game are around 250km away. And there are no droptanks for BFs and FWs to counter big fuel advantage of P-51. Imagine flying BF-109K4 around 150km from the base and encountering P-51. You both start boosting and don't stop because timer is gone and heat is similar for both planes with auto radiators. BF is done in around 15-20 minutes while P-51 has still a lot of fuel to spare. And P-51 pilot can abuse this tactics 100 times in row, because engines are not wearing over time. His aircraft will be scraped and he gets new one for the next mission.

 

I think what you are asking for is just trading one problem for another. It would make sense if engine wear and tear was a thing. So P-51 pilot would need to think to the future, knowing that if he'll be pushing engine all the time...his P-51 become a glider one day. 

 

You should ask for adding engine wearing over time first...then timers. In current game would be P-51 without any weakness left.  

 

Thats my thoughts if we focus only at gameplay and current options in the game.

[the_emperor]

So the P-51s fuel capacity would finally be an advantage ?😁  But I Agree that some times radiators seem to be too be effective.

 

So to summarize on the P-51 @LukeFF:

After Running my 5min WEP I only have ~6min Combat time left

and after running 15min combat I only have ~3min WEP left

works as intended (in regards that they use each other partially up when used) ?

 

[=MERCS=JenkemJunkie]

I've never seen an engine in BoX where combat eats the WEP timer. This sounds to me like your engine died due to the combat power timer being used up not WEP. If you used up all your 15 minutes of combat and then used 3 min of WEP, those 3 min of WEP would also be burning your already used up combat timer, putting you at something like ~20+ min of combat being used.

[the_emperor]

1 hour ago, =MERCS=JenkemJunkie said:

I've never seen an engine in BoX where combat eats the WEP timer.

 

I Have not tested all all engines in that regard, but I stumbled upon this by pure chance. So maybe this is pure P-51D "probleme" and maybe  is this linked to the timer mechanic and that both engine regimes are at the same rpm setting (my guess)...but maybe this is intentional and is wanted by the developers

Edited August 1 by the_emperor

[=MERCS=JenkemJunkie]

I was trying to say I dont think that there is a problem. Based on what you typed you should have had 2 mins left of WEP, but you blew up your combat timer while using WEP.

[the_emperor]

19 minutes ago, =MERCS=JenkemJunkie said:

I was trying to say I dont think that there is a problem. Based on what you typed you should have had 2 mins left of WEP, but you blew up your combat timer while using WEP.

 

Regarding Combat time using up WEP, I would like to withdraw my criticism, as I put the gauge at 61 inches, instead of the red line (where the throttle is gated for the B version), which gives you ~5 minutes WEP (after 15min combat).

 But my original criticism still is valid, that I am left with ~6min of combat time after I run my 5min WEP

[=MERCS=JenkemJunkie]

To know the timers, is to hate them. It makes sense that WEP would burn combat time, but it's implemented in a truly disgusting way if you look under the hood. Although it only makes sense if you're looking at the timers as though this is how engines actually work. Since in truth the timers are just a made up mechanic to stop people from running full WEP all the time, then separating the two timers so WEP is WEP, and combat is combat would I think be better in practice, instead of having the two timers interact with each other invisibly behind the scenes based on arbitrary ratios that vary plane by plane. Is anyone immersed when they're calculating how much combat time they used in WEP based on invisible fantasy math? 

[MDzmitry]

2 часа назад, =MERCS=JenkemJunkie сказал:

Since in truth the timers are just a made up mechanic to stop people from running full WEP all the time, then separating the two timers so WEP is WEP, and combat is combat would I think be better in practice, instead of having the two timers interact with each other invisibly

True, since timers won't go away at this point, they could at least use some tweaking to make the system more tolerable while still limiting in its nature.
For example, how it could be altered:

• Nominal - usually unlimited, allows to restore engine resource (timers) at a 1:1 rate for Combat and 1:2 for Emergency. (From what  I know the current rate is closer to 1:3). To support the 1:2 rate, similar practice is described in RLM documentation from the December of 1944 regarding the use of Notleistung being 5 minutes with a break of 10 minutes in between.
• Combat - check specific plane's timer, but let's take 30 minutes as an example. Drains its own timer, doesn't bother Emergency's. But when using Combat, Emergency's timer can not be restored.
• Emergency - (example) 5 minutes, drains its own timer. Doesn't bother Combat's timer. Doesn't allow restoration of Combat's timer.

Edited August 1 by MDzmitry

[=MERCS=JenkemJunkie]

Currently the recharge rates vary plane by plane, but they were standardized a year or two ago so that similar timers have similar recharge rates. If you want to stop WEP from recharging when combat is being used, I guess that's more of a balancing question, as planes like the la5 with only a WEP timer will be unaffected, while 109s and 190s will be nerfed as they can't recharge their WEP in combat anymore.

[the_emperor]

1 hour ago, MDzmitry said:

To support the 1:2 rate, similar practice is described in RLM documentation from the December of 1944 regarding the use of Notleistung being 5 minutes with a break of 10 minutes in between.

do you happen to have that document at hand?

as for the MW-50 usage its 10min WEP/Sondernotleistung and 5min pause at a lower setting (not specifying which).

[MDzmitry]

11 минут назад, the_emperor сказал:

do you happen to have that document at hand?

as for the MW-50 usage its 10min WEP/Sondernotleistung and 5min pause at a lower setting (not specifying which).

Скрытый текст

 

40 минут назад, =MERCS=JenkemJunkie сказал:

If you want to stop WEP from recharging when combat is being used, I guess that's more of a balancing question, as planes like the la5 with only a WEP timer will be unaffected, while 109s and 190s will be nerfed as they can't recharge their WEP in combat anymore.

I simply made up a draft of a possible alternative. Didn't plan this far as to consider balancing. Maybe using Combat could allow to restore WEP timer, that might be a bit more balanced.

Edited August 1 by MDzmitry

[=MERCS=JenkemJunkie]

I wouldn't say don't do it, it might work out better that way, (maybe even a reduced WEP regen, not 0), but there's unintended consequences to consider.