Special pre-order features

[Talisman]

That would be a very interesting scenario.

There is possibilities then for a squad to fly training campaigns together against AI only to prepare and hone tactics.

The thing is I can't see how that is likely to be achievable, unless a member of the squad can host the mission and the results are able to be recorded and awards allocated for each player by 'the system'.  I am no expert though.

[gavagai]

Does no one like a challenge any more? 

 

Hi Jason,

 

Lack of challenge is precisely why people don't like the idea of having to fly singleplayer in order to unlock features.  Make a cooperative campaign that people can complete with (or against) their friends as an alternative and you might disarm a lot of critics.

 

Cheers!

[Feathered_IV]

After the rather pathetic offline experience provided by Cliffs of Dover, I'm very much looking forward to the new system offered with BoS.

[Bearcat]

 

 

This is actually a very good question .....

I am in your boat CS.. most of my offline flying is either in QMs or SMs.. I rarely do campaigns at all.. and I fly offline daily.. usually in the morning before I go to work.. Can this be clarified? Is it possible that the dve team could/would make the unlocks available for offline play period as opposed to just campaigns.. Make it so that it is based on time spent flying an aircraft offline period whether in a QM, SM or campaign?

 

 

 

Hi Jason,

 

Lack of challenge is precisely why people don't like the idea of having to fly singleplayer in order to unlock features.  Make a cooperative campaign that people can complete with (or against) their friends as an alternative and you might disarm a lot of critics.

 

Cheers!

 

 

I just am not a fan of offline campaigns.. When I fly offline I usually run a few QMs and head out the door to go to work.. In the evening between the honey dos, daddy dos, church stuff and whatever work I bring home and my squad activities I just don't have time to spend on a campaign to unlock content... I know that trying to set this thing up in a manner that will please most folks because let's face it .. you just cannot please everyone.. is a challenge and I will just dance to the song that is played when the time comes however I think the unlocks should be tied to time in a plane period.. if the unlock is in an IL2 them make it available to how muc time a pilot spends in the IL2 .. offline or online.. same with other aircraft.. 

 

That's my two cents for what it is worth..

[gavagai]

Fair enough, that is a good suggestion, too!

[leitmotiv]

I hope they will have 100% working Hard settings for Cologne gamescon showcase, so input from testers would be more interesting then easy settings tested in usa

[dburne]

I just am not a fan of offline campaigns.. When I fly offline I usually run a few QMs and head out the door to go to work.. In the evening between the honey dos, daddy dos, church stuff and whatever work I bring home and my squad activities I just don't have time to spend on a campaign to unlock content... I know that trying to set this thing up in a manner that will please most folks because let's face it .. you just cannot please everyone.. is a challenge and I will just dance to the song that is played when the time comes however I think the unlocks should be tied to time in a plane period.. if the unlock is in an IL2 them make it available to how muc time a pilot spends in the IL2 .. offline or online.. same with other aircraft.. 

 

That's my two cents for what it is worth..

 

I am somewhat surprised, your being a big fan of the IL2 Series. Without a doubt the best campaigns I have ever flown in any combat sim to date, were some of the fantastic user made campaigns for IL2.

I so hope, that BOS is such that users have that same ability, and the motivation from it being a great sim,  that they will do the same for it.

 

But then in all fairness, I was never one much for multiplayer. I hooked up with a couple of guys on the old IL2 forums and flew some missions together here and there,  I however seemed to get the most satisfaction in single player with those user made campaigns.

When I fly and it will be offline for the most part, or I guess I should say single-player, I much prefer flying a good campaign that I keep progressing through, than some instant action type scenarios.

 

As far as unlocks, can't say that I have ever played a flight sim that had them ( although someone mentioned ROF does though I am not sure what they would be). I do enjoy flying career mode in ROF. I do not particular care one way, or the other, whether those unlocks are available to us in any form or not.

Edited August 6, 2013 by dburnette

[CrazySchmidt]

I'm sure that campaigns can be very satisfying for those who have the time and/or are prepared to put the time into them, however for someone like myself (and I do consider myself a great and long time fan of IL-2) due to real life time constraints, I'd be lucky if I got 15-20mins at a time to fly these days and that would only be 2 - 3 times a week at best.

 

I simply have no time to play campaigns, but would very much like to be able to get the most out of this pending release as far as available aircraft is concerned.

 

I think BC has hit the nail on the head with this, total time spent on individual aircraft regardless of game play style is as fair as it can possibly get, that way everyone gets a chance.

 

Cheers, CS.

[71st_AH_Hooves]

I hope they will have 100% working Hard settings for Cologne gamescon showcase, so input from testers would be more interesting then easy settings tested in usa

I think its going to be similar to the event I and others got to attend, mostly for the press, although those lucky are ducks are going to be able to use oculus with native support..... 

 

Im sure there is a quality group of Closed testers that will have ample time and experience to help 1CGS to iron out the bugs before release.

[Feathered_IV]

Just to clarify, is BoS to be aimed towards people who don't have the time or inclination to play it, or to the dedicated fan who intends to do their utmost to take advantage of all its features???

[Bearcat]

I am somewhat surprised, your being a big fan of the IL2 Series. Without a doubt the best campaigns I have ever flown in any combat sim to date, were some of the fantastic user made campaigns for IL2.

I so hope, that BOS is such that users have that same ability, and the motivation from it being a great sim,  that they will do the same for it.

 

But then in all fairness, I was never one much for multiplayer. I hooked up with a couple of guys on the old IL2 forums and flew some missions together here and there,  I however seemed to get the most satisfaction in single player with those user made campaigns.

When I fly and it will be offline for the most part, or I guess I should say single-player, I much prefer flying a good campaign that I keep progressing through, than some instant action type scenarios.

 

As far as unlocks, can't say that I have ever played a flight sim that had them ( although someone mentioned ROF does though I am not sure what they would be). I do enjoy flying career mode in ROF. I do not particular care one way, or the other, whether those unlocks are available to us in any form or not.

 

Well see I find it just as odd and surprising when I consider those who say they do not fly online.. for me online coops are where it's at..

 

Just to clarify, is BoS to be aimed towards people who don't have the time or inclination to play it, or to the dedicated fan who intends to do their utmost to take advantage of all its features???

 

It should be aimed at anyone who wants an immersive, fun and challenging depiction of WWII air combat ...  Just like IL2 did.. I am just as dedicated as anyone else who has been flying this sim daily for over a decade.. Just because I am not big on campaigns doesn't mean that I am not doing my utmost to take advantage of what the sim has to offer.. I have spent thousands of hours and hundreds of dollars.. on the sim.. not counting the hardware to run it to my satisfaction.. I am just talking about on copies of the sim.. and that not just for myself.. and I am willing to do the same for BoS providing it gives me what I want.. which I have no doubt it will do.

[CrazySchmidt]

Just to clarify, is BoS to be aimed towards people who don't have the time or inclination to play it, or to the dedicated fan who intends to do their utmost to take advantage of all its features???

 

I think it's fair to say the developers will be aiming at any customer who is willing to pay for their product, regardless of how each individual chooses to enjoy it.

 

CS.

[Panzerlang]

If the MP is going to be predominantly the same air-quake crap as in RoF I, for one, certainly hope the BoS SP will be very strong. At least as strong as Pat Wilson's Campaign for RoF.

[71st_AH_Hooves]

It all depends on teh mission makers, The missions on New Wings are Def not jsut Air Quake.  many ground objectives exist for those looking to move a littel concrete and mud.  And of course fighters trying to stop them.  That being said Pat Wilson's Campaign is VERY good.

[Panzerlang]

It all depends on teh mission makers, The missions on New Wings are Def not jsut Air Quake.  many ground objectives exist for those looking to move a littel concrete and mud.  And of course fighters trying to stop them.  That being said Pat Wilson's Campaign is VERY good.

 

I'm thinking in terms of mission distances, objectives, fuel-loads and suchlike. The only time we got anything remotely realistic in RoF was when one of the extremely infrequent and short-lived online wars was running. BoS's MP needs to come with something that facilitates that level of authenticity as a default.

 

It won't of course and MP will devolve into the usual headless chicken tosh. So please (please) give us a quality SP campaign. Please.

Edited August 6, 2013 by JG3-Siggi

[Blitzen]

I hope these Soviet gunners are human ( maybe they'l get airsick?)as they get thrown all over the rear cockpits of their aircraft...in the original Il-2 they never missed!

[I/JG27_Rollo]

It has gotten better with the recent patches though.

 

The AI gunners nowadays don't really hit you as long as you don't park yourself on the direct 6 of an IL-2

[71st_AH_Hooves]

I'm thinking in terms of mission distances, objectives, fuel-loads and suchlike. The only time we got anything remotely realistic in RoF was when one of the extremely infrequent and short-lived online wars was running. BoS's MP needs to come with something that facilitates that level of authenticity as a default.

 

It won't of course and MP will devolve into the usual headless chicken tosh. So please (please) give us a quality SP campaign. Please.

Im not following, The missions Im speaking of had objectives you had to fly to, take out targets, and fly home.  They were at some distance and it took a bunch of fuel to get there.

 

I would ay that on Online War would be MORE feasible in a WWII setting.  And with a mich more popular genre Im sure we will be getting enough players to make these MP sessions awesome.  

 

But I do agree that a SP campaign that offers those one off missions (instead of a perpetual fight in MP)  would be cool, PAT Wilson to the rescue perhaps?

[Frequent_Flyer]

After the rather pathetic offline experience provided by Cliffs of Dover, I'm very much looking forward to the new system offered with BoS.

 

Just to clarify, is BoS to be aimed towards people who don't have the time or inclination to play it, or to the dedicated fan who intends to do their utmost to take advantage of all its features???

Feathered,

 

Pacific Fighters, by a wide margin sold the most " units "   of all the various IL-2 incarnations . The vast majority of the folks who purchased any of the IL-2 offerings were  customers who predominately  played " off line ". I tend to think market research was not at the fore front  of ( 1C/ 777)  the decision making process . The orientation of the project seems to be, enhancing the ROF ( albeit in WW II ) experience with a Russian  customer base in mind.

[DD_Arthur]

Feathered,

 

Pacific Fighters, by a wide margin sold the most " units "   of all the various IL-2 incarnations . The vast majority of the folks who purchased any of the IL-2 offerings were  customers who predominately  played " off line ". I tend to think market research was not at the fore front  of ( 1C/ 777)  the decision making process . The orientation of the project seems to be, enhancing the ROF ( albeit in WW II ) experience with a Russian  customer base in mind.

 

How do you know Pacific fighters "by a wide margin sold the most units"?  UbiSoft sold just over nine hundred thousand copies of  IL2 on disc, in all it's iterations. The biggest seller was Forgotten Battles.  Never seen any figures for 1C's sales but I would imagine they were significantly smaller as they had the smaller market.

 

I don't quite understand this perceived 'bias' to a Russian market.  Does RoF have a Russian orientation?  These sims are developed by Russian teams who seem to have cornered the expertise as well as the market.  Why shouldn't they start on the Eastern front?  They have a history to be proud of too. Nazi Germany was defeated in the main part by the blood and sacrifice of the Russian people. 

 

Original IL2 ( the clues in the name) developed in time to cover all theatres.  If BoS is a success I see no reason why the series will not be expanded into western theatres too.

[Bearcat]

Also you

 

Pacific Fighters, by a wide margin sold the most " units "   of all the various IL-2 incarnations . The vast majority of the folks who purchased any of the IL-2 offerings were  customers who predominately  played " off line ". I tend to think market research was not at the fore front  of ( 1C/ 777)  the decision making process . The orientation of the project seems to be, enhancing the ROF ( albeit in WW II ) experience with a Russian  customer base in mind.

 

That s understandable since PF was not only bought by new simmers who wanted to try the stand alone but also by anyone who wanted to expand the copy of FB that they already owned.. which was probably most f not all FB owners..

[DD_Arthur]

BC; the sales figures for UbiSoft I quoted were obtained by Blairgowrie - he asked MissKleaneasy and she came back with some fairly detailed stuff.  I can't remember the figures but they were surprisingly exact. Europe followed by the US were UbiSoft's biggest market with everywhere else a distant third.  Over a third of sales were for Forgotten Battles but this was four or five years ago and IL2 1946 was still selling in units.  Interestingly, it can no longer be obtained from the Ubishop.

 

It is surprising that PF is not the biggest selling for the reasons you state but perhaps this has more to do with the the point made that the vast majority of purchasers will have never gone online or indeed even been aware there were forums to join! These would be one-off, spur of the moment purchases.

 

I should imagine the vast majority of discs sold are now in land fill sites or lying forgotten in basements and boxes.

Edited August 11, 2013 by arthursmedley

[Frequent_Flyer]

How do you know Pacific fighters "by a wide margin sold the most units"?  UbiSoft sold just over nine hundred thousand copies of  IL2 on disc, in all it's iterations. The biggest seller was Forgotten Battles.  Never seen any figures for 1C's sales but I would imagine they were significantly smaller as they had the smaller market.

 

I don't quite understand this perceived 'bias' to a Russian market.  Does RoF have a Russian orientation?  These sims are developed by Russian teams who seem to have cornered the expertise as well as the market.  Why shouldn't they start on the Eastern front?  They have a history to be proud of too. Nazi Germany was defeated in the main part by the blood and sacrifice of the Russian people. 

 

Original IL2 ( the clues in the name) developed in time to cover all theatres.  If BoS is a success I see no reason why the series will not be expanded into western theatres too.

Factually speaking the Luftwaffe suffered numerically greater losses to the West vs. East. However, if you are referring to casualty totals, the Soviet Union leads this statistic. Is this is what you are intimating by " defeated in main "? If so, interesting way of scoring a victory. I have not read a single military historian who ascribes a greater percentage of victory to the to the combatant who achieves a  greater number of casualties. 1C /777 are the " owners" of BOS, they can start with whatever theater they choose.

   

I would assume the initial offering is the most critical for the health and longevity of the franchise.Mass appeal would capture a greater market of paying customers.   The MTO would have a greater appeal to  Italian, British,  US, New Zealand, Australian and South African customers. In addition offer greater diversity in scenery, game play and aircraft.

[TheBlackPenguin]

Hi Jason,

 

Lack of challenge is precisely why people don't like the idea of having to fly singleplayer in order to unlock features.  Make a cooperative campaign that people can complete with (or against) their friends as an alternative and you might disarm a lot of critics.

 

Cheers!

 

I like this idea, just not sure if they could fit into their tight schedule before release, but if this is something doable and popular then hopefully it can integrated further down the line. As someone who flies mainly off-line campaigns this is actually attractive and I would certainly give it a shot. +1

[Trooper_Thorn]

I am going to purchase the premium edition pre-order September 3rd. I am on a fixed income and this is when I get my disability check. Unfortunately the deadline for the rear gunner's mod is before the payment. Never-the-less I am counting down when I can purchase the sim. I have had Rise of flight for a couple of years and still take my DR-1 up for flights when I am not busy with Star Trek online, World of tanks and Open Beta Warthunder and Mechwarrior online. I just hope y'all can do a European add-on along with the Pacific theater. I have been flying sims since Microprose's DOS flight sims, the first Red Baron and the early text games on DOS. (Mid 80's)Yes, that officially makes me an old fart. There are so many wonderful aircraft to choose from that flew in the different theaters of WW2. The Korean War Is the next logical step however, there is so much that is currently untouched. I say this because I am familiar with 777's work on Rise of flight and the beautiful environmentals and Aircraft in the ROF sim. I am looking forward with great anticipation to getting my copy.

Edited August 11, 2013 by Trooper_Thorn

[FlatSpinMan]

Hey there Trooper_Thorn

See you up there above Stalingrad in a few months. Its going to be fun.

[DD_Arthur]

Factually speaking the Luftwaffe suffered numerically greater losses to the West vs. East. However, if you are referring to casualty totals, the Soviet Union leads this statistic. Is this is what you are intimating by " defeated in main "? If so, interesting way of scoring a victory. I have not read a single military historian who ascribes a greater percentage of victory to the to the combatant who achieves a  greater number of casualties. 1C /777 are the " owners" of BOS, they can start with whatever theater they choose.

   

I would assume the initial offering is the most critical for the health and longevity of the franchise.Mass appeal would capture a greater market of paying customers.   The MTO would have a greater appeal to  Italian, British,  US, New Zealand, Australian and South African customers. In addition offer greater diversity in scenery, game play and aircraft.

 

I wasn't specifically referring to the Luftwaffe nor was I considering casualty figures.  I was thinking of the titanic struggle between two huge opposing armies in the east which went on for nearly four years and culminated in the Soviet Union destroying the fighting power of the Wehrmacht, over-running Berlin and most of central and eastern Europe - an area they then managed to retain hegemony over for the best part of half a century.

 

This would seem a victory of sorts. Btw, do military historians ascribe "percentages of victory"?  I would have thought that a philosophical rather than a historical question.  The first world war was won by the Entente.  By late 1918 the Central Powers were forced to offer an armistice and the following year they had a peace treaty imposed on them. This victory cost the Entente some six million military dead as opposed to the Central Powers four million.  From a philosophical point and in view of what happened barely twenty years later it would indeed seem a rather hollow victory.  Once the shooting starts everyone looses.

 

The Russian peoples have a long history and a big history but it's still largely unknown and unrecognized in the west. 

 

I completely agree that the initial offering that this team produce will be critical to the health and longevity of the sim but I think it's success will lie in the technical quality that they offer rather than the theatre they cover.  

[Frequent_Flyer]

I wasn't specifically referring to the Luftwaffe nor was I considering casualty figures.  I was thinking of the titanic struggle between two huge opposing armies in the east which went on for nearly four years and culminated in the Soviet Union destroying the fighting power of the Wehrmacht, over-running Berlin and most of central and eastern Europe - an area they then managed to retain hegemony over for the best part of half a century.

 

This would seem a victory of sorts. Btw, do military historians ascribe "percentages of victory"?  I would have thought that a philosophical rather than a historical question.  The first world war was won by the Entente.  By late 1918 the Central Powers were forced to offer an armistice and the following year they had a peace treaty imposed on them. This victory cost the Entente some six million military dead as opposed to the Central Powers four million.  From a philosophical point and in view of what happened barely twenty years later it would indeed seem a rather hollow victory.  Once the shooting starts everyone looses.

 

The Russian peoples have a long history and a big history but it's still largely unknown and unrecognized in the west. 

 

I completely agree that the initial offering that this team produce will be critical to the health and longevity of the sim but I think it's success will lie in the technical quality that they offer rather than the theatre they cover.  

The history of mankind is one " war " followed by another. WW I did very little to fix Europe's inability and willingness to stop another conflict . Meanwhile before Hitler and Stalin started WWII, Japan was aggressively staking claims in China and Korea and so on...

 

I will respectfully disagree , Success will be measured in  units sold and its impact on  net income, rather then  "technical quality ".

If accept the premise, it will be at least as good technically speaking as ROF, it still needs sell enough units to fund further development.

[Bearcat]

I completely agree that the initial offering that this team produce will be critical to the health and longevity of the sim but I think it's success will lie in the technical quality that they offer rather than the theatre they cover.  

 

I agree.. because if it is technically sound and is a good sim.. the other theaters will come.. In 2002 IL2 1946 was just a fantasy in the minds of some but here we are over a decade later and IL2 has evolved into what it is today.. I am hoping that in 2022 (which is only 9 years away.. )  BoS will still be around and have an active community.

[Uufflakke]

BC; the sales figures for UbiSoft I quoted were obtained by Blairgowrie - he asked MissKleaneasy and she came back with some fairly detailed stuff.  I can't remember the figures but they were surprisingly exact.

 

The only other info related to Blairgowrie (RIP) and MissKleaneasy and IL-2 sales I found here (for what it is worth):

 

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:GFQmMjbxwfMJ:www.gavca.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D2%26t%3D21972+&cd=4&hl=nl&ct=clnk&gl=nl

[JG_52Erich_Hartmann]

While this is great and all, I sincerely hope it's a feature everyone will be able to unlock with some work, and not a complete Pre-Order only feature.

[dburne]

I must say the more time I spend on this forum, the more I am motivated to launch my good ole IL2 1946 again.

It is still installed, just would have to configure my Warthog HOTAS for it, and get it updated to the latest mod/version. But if I can just put it off a little longer, my Premium Edition of BOS will be here .

 

In regards to the special " features", while they are somewhat rewarding the pre-order buyers with some, I can not imagine them developing and putting into the game, without making the accessible in some form or fashion to everyone that owns it - at some point.

[TheBlackPenguin]

In regards to the special " features", while they are somewhat rewarding the pre-order buyers with some, I can not imagine them developing and putting into the game, without making the accessible in some form or fashion to everyone that owns it - at some point.

 

If you're referring to the gunner n the Il-2, then yes I think they mentioned it being an unlock in the campaign. If its the extra planes, they'll be available in the store, although not sure if that means available day 1, or later.

[=69.GIAP=YSTREB]

preordered premium now what? any news

[=BKHZ=Furbs]

preordered premium now what? any news

 

 

Hurry up and wait.

[VeryOldMan]

Just to clarify, is BoS to be aimed towards people who don't have the time or inclination to play it, or to the dedicated fan who intends to do their utmost to take advantage of all its features???

 

 

You could rephrase that as..  is this  market product aimed  at a population that   is large enoguh to sustain the product? Or aimed at the  other 500 people in the world that cannot hope to pay even for  1 of the developers work?

 

Most people that have money to spare on a game do not have  much time to  play it.. that is one of the cornerstones of game development nowadays. That doe snto mean it needs to be  console like   simplified games. But you  cannot make the player feel like he is wastign his time at any second!

[Skoshi_Tiger]

Im sure there is a quality group of Closed testers that will have ample time and experience to help 1CGS to iron out the bugs before release.

 

Yes exactly, but to find all those obscure bugs that  only an idiot could find, they need the rest of us to help out!

[dburne]

 

Most people that have money to spare on a game do not have  much time to  play it.. that is one of the cornerstones of game development nowadays. That doe snto mean it needs to be  console like   simplified games. But you  cannot make the player feel like he is wastign his time at any second!

 

Now that is very true, I can certainly relate!!

[yumyumlike]

pre  order  i  made  that  goof  once  not  again  and  anyway  this  is not  going  to  be  skill, its  going  how  much $$$  cash  you   got :wacko:

[dburne]

pre  order  i  made  that  goof  once  not  again  and  anyway  this  is not  going  to  be  skill, its  going  how  much $$$  cash  you   got :wacko:

 

Really?

So does that mean since I went all out and ordered the Premium Edition, I will automatically be an Ace?

Sweet!!