what's the best headset to buy in 2024

[Roach-]

Hey everyone I'm looking at purchasing a new vr headset and was wondering what other pilot's would recommend. I'm wondering if i should wait a bit because it doesn't seem like there's a lot of good options available for purchase on the market other than the index or Pimax 12k. I plan on getting a 5000 series card in the future so that's something to consider.

The Pimax sounds nice because of its large fov and i would imagine that would be so immersive. but have seemed to hear mixed reviews.

Anyways would love to hear everyone's thoughts and experience cheers.

 

my specs:

-Nvidia RTX 3090 ultra

-AMD Ryzen 7 5800x 8-core processor

-31.92 GB RAM

-Corsair H100i PRO XT 

-Rog Strix b550-f

 

[jollyjack]

seems now best to avoid a Reverb-G2 with windows 11 ...

[Maulkin]

This is why:
https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/27/windows_mixed_reality_is_dead

[Roach-]

Interesting good to know, the HP Reverb G2 and the Varjo Aero I was looking into but you cant even find them online, they are completely out of stock and the Varjo Aero has been discontinued. so that basically Leaves me with the Index or Pimax the index is expensive if you only plan on flying in VR 3/4 of the expense is the controllers and is a lower resolution then the HP Reverb G2

 

Anyone have experience with the Pimax Crystal 12K ?

 

[Aapje]

3 hours ago, Roach- said:

Anyone have experience with the Pimax Crystal 12K ?

Do you mean the Pimax Crystal or the Pimax 12K? These are different headsets.

 

The Pimax 12K doesn't exist yet. Pimax showed a bare bones prototype at CES a month ago, which means that they are far from having a fleshed out headset, which would then still need to be made production-ready. And knowing Pimax, at launch it would have serious QA issues, missing features and lots of jank.

 

You can find people's experiences with the Crystal in other threads. It seems to work very well if you don't end up with a defective headset and can deal with a headset that is twice as heavy as the Reverb G2.

 

BTW. Do you already have a headset or would this be your first? It's unclear and I would advice against the Pimax as a first headset.

[spreckair]

I have read some posts that the Meta Quest 3 is slightly better overall than the HP Reverb G2, so when my G2s become toast, this will be something that I will be looking at.  Mostly because of the price.  I wonder if there will be more choices in a year or two?  VR is still too niche to make projections.

[Aapje]

Yes, I would definitely suggest the Quest 3 for a VR beginner, someone with a little more modest budget or someone who is waiting for high-end headsets with fewer major drawbacks.

[Roach-]

I started of with a Oculus Rift S  it had occasional tracking issues narrow fOV and was a bit heavy. wasn't a huge fan, ended up selling it later on and jumped back in to Track IR.

That was also on my old rig, a Dell prebuilt with a 2070 super GPU.

[Aapje]

@Roach-

 

The Pimax is over twice as heavy as the Rift S, so if you already had an issue with the weight of the Rift S, I doubt that you will enjoy the Pimax.

 

I would suggest going for the Quest 3. It has way better visuals than the Rift S, is almost the same weight, has a better FoV and the software is less janky. The headset market is a bit in a weird place right now where the more expensive options have different strengths and weaknesses, so they aren't necessarily better buys, even if they cost a lot more.

 

Worst case with buying the Quest 3 and figuring out that you still don't think that VR is good enough or such, is that you are out a few hundred bucks after reselling the Quest 3. The Pimax could be a lot more costly. And I would guess that the chance that you are happy with the Quest is at least as good as with the Pimax.

 

Just keep in mind that they cut costs on the Quest 3 when it comes to comfort, which means that you need to budget some accessoires. A new headstrap is a huge comfort upgrade (BoboVR and Kiwi Design make great headstraps, but don't get the official Meta one). Keep in mind that weight is not the only factor, but the weight distribution and where the weight is hanging from makes an immense difference. Carrying weight on top of your head or on your forehead is way less bad than having things hang on your face. And for most people, having a counterweight seems to be more comfortable despite having more total weight.

 

If you wear glasses I would strongly suggest inserts.

Edited February 13, 2024 by Aapje

[Majpalmer]

I keep monitoring the advances in VR. I suspect at some point I'll give it a try. But one of the things that keeps me from buying is FOV. On my Ultrawide in Il-2 it's 138 degrees. The Quest 3 is something like 110? And the new Apple less than that? I have my TrackIr set to look back 180 degrees when i move my head about 70 degrees. I assume that with a VR headset you have to look back 180 to see back 180. Is that true? 

 

I also enjoy drinking, reading, deleting e-mails during the long fly outs on some missions. 

[Nos1s]

6 hours ago, Majpalmer said:

I keep monitoring the advances in VR. I suspect at some point I'll give it a try. But one of the things that keeps me from buying is FOV. On my Ultrawide in Il-2 it's 138 degrees. The Quest 3 is something like 110? And the new Apple less than that? I have my TrackIr set to look back 180 degrees when i move my head about 70 degrees. I assume that with a VR headset you have to look back 180 to see back 180. Is that true? 

 

I also enjoy drinking, reading, deleting e-mails during the long fly outs on some missions. 

Personally I think Quest 3 is the best option at the moment. From your comment I get the impression that you haven't tried VR much. Tell you that, both the movement, the size of things, and the sensation in 3D is 1 to 1. It is almost like being in the real airplane, you would lack the g forces hehe
The quality of the screens is very good, the pixels are not visible. So if you have a good PC you will see it with the same quality as any average monitor
The only downside is that if you don't want to use cables you will need a dedicated Wifi 6 router, you will also need a strap with battery and optional a facial to improve ergonomics
In addition, this VR headset opens up a whole world of possibilities, something that other headsets like Pimax or Varjo don't do.
All the best

[Aapje]

@Majpalmer

 

Comparing the FoV of a flat screen with VR is comparing apples to oranges. A monitor is essentially like watching the outside world through a window. The closer you get to the window, the more you would normally see from the outside and vice versa. Of course a monitor doesn't have actual depth behind it, so instead of having the FoV naturally occur, the game has to pick what FoV to render.

 

The size of your monitor and the size of the screen determine what a realistic FoV should be. Anytime you set the FoV to a different value, you will either get a fisheye lens-like distortion (although less extreme) or the opposite. You may not notice it, but it is there.

 

I strongly doubt that 138 degrees is close to a realistic FoV for your screen unless you have a huge curved ultrawide screen and sit very close to it.

 

Anyway, this is really a different kind of FoV from what people normally talk about for VR, which is the percentage of your vision where you see the pixels. If you'd determine the same for monitors, it would typically be quite low, unless you have a three monitor setup with steeply angled side monitors. And even that is just a good horizontal FoV, but you would still have way, way less vertical FoV.

 

This kind of FoV for both a flat-screen monitor and VR depends not just on the screen, but in large part on how far you are from the screen or the lenses. You will have a a much larger FoV for a flat screen if you almost touch the screen with your nose (although that obviously doesn't work well with flat screens). Similarly, the FoV for a headset can differ substantially depending on how you wear the headset.

 

Also, being in the headset is just very different from a flat screen and many people consider it way better. You shouldn't just think that an equal FoV is needed for the experience to be at least as good.

 

With VR you can use a TrackIR-like solution, or set a button to look fully behind you. So it is not necessary to turn 180 degrees, if you use the right software.

 

Drinking is typically still possible with a headset that doesn't block out all light (many people prefer to have light leakage around the nose, so they can see the real world by looking down). Reading and deleting mails won't be happening. However, I've seen quite a few people remark that they are no longer bored by regular flying in VR, without being in combat.

Edited February 13, 2024 by Aapje

[Voxman]

I could never go back to flying on a flat screen (I have a curved screen).   I been playing air simulation since the days of Apple IIe, with all the different steps going along the way, but always a monitor..whether CRT, or Flat.   

 

Flying VR is like a whole sensation that's been awakened.  I actually had tears  starting to stream when I first experienced it.  Well...I had to take off the headset as I was fogging them up...ha.

 

Anyway, when my G2 went south, I was quite depressed and distressed with the thought of going back to a monitor.  I held on, and after getting the refund on the G2 ( I suppose I gave Amazon an earful), and then getting the beautiful Varjo Aero, well I've been flying almost every day since mid -December.

Long missions are not boring anymore as one can fly in formation much, much more skillfully than with Track IR.  I used to do the same on long missions, just put it into autopilot and work on stuff.  This was offline of course.

 

Now the downside.  I haven't played online as spotting targets, as well as IDing is not easy. I'm starting to get used to the shapes, but if I play without icons, I don't stand a chance.  I will try online, but I'm sure I'll be handed my a$$.

Also another downside, yes, it can be difficult to have a drink...but it's not impossible.  The Varjo is pretty much sealed, so there's no way I can see out the bottom of the headset.  I've been able to adapt using muscle memory to choose the right keys on the keyboard.  The F and J key indentations are a nice starter.

Finally, it is a heavy piece of kit, and sometimes uncomfortable.  I will see how the summer fares as well.  Varjo does have a fan, which incidentally gets rid of the morning fog...literally, on the screen due to my office being very cold in the AM and slowly heating up as the morning progresses.

 

I'm very very happy with the Varjo, but seeing how support is going to be terminated next year...well, that's a pi$$r. 

Probably by then I'll need to buy a new vid card anyway...and hopefully the technology will be cheaper, and better..

So unfortunately, cost vs future proofing at this point is not good for VR. 

But I can't go back to a monitor.

[Majpalmer]

Good insights into VR. I suspect that at some point I'll give it a shot, that's why I keep reading posts in threads like this. The Meta 3 thing at $500 is pretty good for a try. $3500+ for the Apple? NFW!

 

I actually do have a huge Ultrawide. When I turn on FPS in Il-2 the numbers I get are 120 (FPS) and 138 (degrees). 

 

I'm also 72 and if I sit in the hot tub and read with my head at the wrong angle, I get neck pain. I wonder how I'll do with a headset on for two hours. 

 

All that said, at some point I know I'll give it a shot. It certainly looks fascinating. 

 

And thanks for the expansive remarks. 

 

Mike

 

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

Quest 3 is the way to go. Pico 4 also a good option if you can get one. My G2 is almost dead.

[Aapje]

7 hours ago, Majpalmer said:

The Meta 3 thing at $500 is pretty good for a try.

Yes, it is very good value for money. It does lack foveated rendering, due to the lack of eye tracking, which means that it is inefficient with CPU horsepower.

 

The human eye actually has a small region where you see things sharply. That's why the eye darts around and then our brain stitches that together seamlessly, so you think that you can see sharply all around you at the same time, even though that is not true. With eye tracking, software can only render the things that the eye is looking at with the highest sharpness, which is more efficient.

 

Of course, IL-2 doesn't support foveated rendering for now, so in this game it doesn't matter for now.

 

And the (near) future for the sharpest headsets is micro-OLED and micro-LED, while the Quest 3 has far cheaper LCD screens.

[slikslik]

Hi Roach.  If you want a VR HMD that gives a true wide FOV, your  best choice is a Pimax model.  Not the Crystal.  If you can find an 8kx that's all you'll need for a very real and immersive experience, until they release the 12K.  in my opinion that is.  I had the Rift S but like every other HMD it's FOV was too small.  I honestly feel that a minimum of 170 degrees FOV is needed for flight and race sims.  The 8kx allows that FOV up to 200 degrees. 

[Drano]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AoiMeAdmYA

 

VR Flight Sim Guy just put out this vid that pretty much covers what's out there now that's worthy in several price points. I have a G2 and think it's great but, I can't recommend buying one at this point as it's out of production for one thing and MS is gonna remove WMR that it needs to run from windows soon. It's days are numbered.

[Capt_Hook]

I use my G2 every day, though I'm also looking at new options in 2024.  I've had the G2 since the first release (mine has the original cable, and it still works [knock on wood]).  FWIW, I'd bet money that WMR HMDs will still be supported even on 24H2, but either through a Windows App Store stub or by MS paying Valve (or someone else) to develop a simple bridge.  They certainly won't be further developed or improved on anymore, though.  The reason for my conjecture is the anticipated regulatory heat MS would get in Europe - WMR HMDs were on sale even late last year.  If MS was killing tech that hadn't been sold for a decade nobody would care.  Regulators have also been pretty dismissive of the whole 'you can keep old version X if you want it to work'.  Consumer warranty laws alone will be a headache for MS that they can easily solve with a simple WMR stub to SteamVR.  

 

Regardless, though, WMR is dead in the long run even if we can flog these Reverbs till the plastic falls off, so something better will need to be had.  

 

The MeganeX looks interesting, and may wind up being a better light HMD than the BsB.  The Quest 3 seems mostly a side-grade for the Reverb, so I'll avoid that unless it's the only practical choice when the G2 craps out.  Index 2 is perpetual Hopium, but who knows... maybe 2024 will be the year.  

[kissTheSky]

1 hour ago, Capt_Hook said:

I use my G2 every day, though I'm also looking at new options in 2024.  I've had the G2 since the first release (mine has the original cable, and it still works [knock on wood]).  FWIW, I'd bet money that WMR HMDs will still be supported even on 24H2, but either through a Windows App Store stub or by MS paying Valve (or someone else) to develop a simple bridge.  They certainly won't be further developed or improved on anymore, though.  The reason for my conjecture is the anticipated regulatory heat MS would get in Europe - WMR HMDs were on sale even late last year.  If MS was killing tech that hadn't been sold for a decade nobody would care.  Regulators have also been pretty dismissive of the whole 'you can keep old version X if you want it to work'.  Consumer warranty laws alone will be a headache for MS that they can easily solve with a simple WMR stub to SteamVR.  

 

Regardless, though, WMR is dead in the long run even if we can flog these Reverbs till the plastic falls off, so something better will need to be had.  

 

The MeganeX looks interesting, and may wind up being a better light HMD than the BsB.  The Quest 3 seems mostly a side-grade for the Reverb, so I'll avoid that unless it's the only practical choice when the G2 craps out.  Index 2 is perpetual Hopium, but who knows... maybe 2024 will be the year.  

As @firdimigdi kindly linked in the other (G2 & W11) thread.

 

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/microsoft-is-discontinuing-windows-mixed-reality-wmr/622334/191

 

[nachinus]

I'm thinking about renting the Meta Quest 3 for 1 month and give this VR thing a go. I assume for sim gaming I would be needing the 512Gb ones? 

[Majpalmer]

Keep us posted!

[Aapje]

1 hour ago, nachinus said:

I assume for sim gaming I would be needing the 512Gb ones? 

No, the opposite. 512 Gb is only really useful if you use it standalone. When streaming PCVR games to it, you don't have to install things on the device (or at most Virtual Desktop, which is small).

[nachinus]

1 hour ago, Aapje said:

No, the opposite. 512 Gb is only really useful if you use it standalone. When streaming PCVR games to it, you don't have to install things on the device (or at most Virtual Desktop, which is small).

Oh, I see! thank you!  I don't have a clue about this stuff. ?

[nachinus]

Well, I just ordered my rental via Grover and I'll have the Meta Quest 3 next week. I'll get back to you and let you know if my mind was blown and you guys ruined normal screen sim-flying for me ? .

 

If anyone reading this is on the fence, this rental thing may be of help. I don't know if it works outside of Spain/EU, but I got a referral invite that grants 1st month rental for free in 3+ month rentals. If you use it I get discounts too, so be my guest.

https://www.grover.com/es-es/referred/R-179ZXPYTD

[Capt_Hook]

17 hours ago, kissTheSky said:

As @firdimigdi kindly linked in the other (G2 & W11) thread.

 

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/microsoft-is-discontinuing-windows-mixed-reality-wmr/622334/191

 

Yes, I know.  All I'm saying is it's not certain your WMR HMD won't work with Steam after 24H12, either through a Steam update, driver update or MS app store plugin.  There is a fair bit of incentive to produce such a thing.  It won't have the MS 'Home by the Sea' environment or any of it's goodies, but who uses that?  All I want to see is the SteamVR endless horizon when I put on the HMD.  

[kissTheSky]

3 hours ago, Capt_Hook said:

Yes, I know.  All I'm saying is it's not certain your WMR HMD won't work with Steam after 24H12, either through a Steam update, driver update or MS app store plugin.  There is a fair bit of incentive to produce such a thing.  It won't have the MS 'Home by the Sea' environment or any of it's goodies, but who uses that?  All I want to see is the SteamVR endless horizon when I put on the HMD.  

Gotcha. Let’s just say, I’m not as optimistic as you though.