Hispano 20mm Cannon Sound

[Jiver67]

Compared to the other aircraft cannons in the simulation, the Hispano 20mm sounds very weak (both inside and outside of the cockpit). Are there any plans to improve the sound for this cannon in a future update? 

Edited January 6, 2024 by Jiver67

[Jade_Monkey]

Most sounds (especially engines) are just not up to par. I hope that the sound engineer takes a hard look once they upgrade the FMOD in the next project.

[Jiver67]

Overall, I'm actually pretty happy with the engine sounds and the other weapon sounds. I just jumped in both the Typhoon and Tempest and fired all four 20mm cannons...they sound like rifle caliber machineguns at best. It should sound like all hell breaking loose when those four cannons fire at the same time!  

[Trooper117]

Try firing twin Vickers in WWI aeroplanes, they are right in front of you, but sound like a couple of wet farts going off... rubbish!

[Jiver67]

I would love to make a sound mod for the Hispano cannon, but I don't believe the game allows this. I made a comprehensive sound mod for IL-2 1946 many years ago. Some of you guys may be familiar with it. It had a pretty strong following back in the day. 

[Avimimus]

I feel the same way. But apparently, it isn't that unrealistic... 

 

Apparently it is that way.

 

...even if it sounds awfully tinny to me:

 

 

[Jiver67]

 

[RedeyeStorm]

@Jiver67, it is possible to mod the sound I believe. The only problem is that most mods are only allowed offline because server settings do not allow mods. I only fly SP so no issue on my end so you’ve got my vote

[BlitzPig_EL]

Anyone here ever heard a real Hispano cannon fired?  I know I never have.  What is it supposed to sound like? How would we know what is correct, and what is just overly dramatic Hollywood SFX?

[R33GZ]

2 hours ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Anyone here ever heard a real Hispano cannon fired?  I know I never have.  What is it supposed to sound like? How would we know what is correct, and what is just overly dramatic Hollywood SFX?

I've often pondered this too. How would anyone know what a weapon firing sounds like 10m outside a cockpit? Assuming the aircraft is flying, there would be 200 - 300mph wind to contend with as well. Have you ever stuck your head out the window of a car doing 60mph? You can't hear the engine over the rush of the air

[Jiver67]

4 hours ago, RedeyeStorm said:

@Jiver67, it is possible to mod the sound I believe. The only problem is that most mods are only allowed offline because server settings do not allow mods. I only fly SP so no issue on my end so you’ve got my vote

 

Thanks Redeye! Would you happen to know how to go about modifying the gun sound files? I know in IL-2 1946 you had to drop the replacement sound files into a mods folder so that the game would use them.

 

4 hours ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Anyone here ever heard a real Hispano cannon fired?  I know I never have.  What is it supposed to sound like? How would we know what is correct, and what is just overly dramatic Hollywood SFX?

 

Blitz, they are pretty damn loud! Here is an example of the Hispano 20mm firing:

 

 

Edited January 6, 2024 by Jiver67

[Jiver67]

2 hours ago, R33GZ said:

I've often pondered this too. How would anyone know what a weapon firing sounds like 10m outside a cockpit? Assuming the aircraft is flying, there would be 200 - 300mph wind to contend with as well. Have you ever stuck your head out the window of a car doing 60mph? You can't hear the engine over the rush of the air

 

R33GZ, you make a good point. When flying the aircraft, the sound of the cannon(s) would be reduced (especially heard from inside the cockpit). However, heard from outside the cockpit the sound would be very loud I would think. In the game, the Hispano cannon sound is the same whether heard from inside or outside of the cockpit. Even with four cannons firing (i.e. the Typhoon) the sound is very weak.

 

Another example:

 

 

Edited January 6, 2024 by Jiver67

[Jiver67]

Here is the 20mm Oerlikon cannon (used in early war German aircraft and on many navy ships):

 

 

 

[R33GZ]

56 minutes ago, Jiver67 said:

Here is the 20mm Oerlikon cannon (used in early war German aircraft and on many navy ships):

 

 

 

That is insane! What the hell else was being fired on that range lol. He looked well chuffed with himself after that ?.

 

That's kinda my point though, that gun is static, not moving through the air at 300mph. Sound is relative to the observer, so how would it ever be possible to REALLY know what that oerlikon sounds like from outside a moving aircraft... superman might be able to figure that one out I suppose. An example would be how the tone of a car horn changes as it drives past you compared to it being statica

 

Sound design and foley is a dark art for sure... part voodoo ?

[RedeyeStorm]

@Jiver67, sorry I have no idea. I am  no modder myself but a couple years ago there was a discussion between Jason and a guy that wanted to modify the sounds. Jason said that modding the sound was possible. You could ask @Stonehouse who has been doing some great stuff with AI shooting and AAA. Or @migmadmarine who has been making historical modskinpacks for the series.

[Jiver67]

9 hours ago, RedeyeStorm said:

@Jiver67, sorry I have no idea. I am  no modder myself but a couple years ago there was a discussion between Jason and a guy that wanted to modify the sounds. Jason said that modding the sound was possible. You could ask @Stonehouse who has been doing some great stuff with AI shooting and AAA. Or @migmadmarine who has been making historical modskinpacks for the series.

 

Thanks Redeye, I may contact one or both of them.

[Stonehouse]

Never tried to do it but guessing you would start here if you had any chance to alter the sound.

 

[Gunfreak]

13 hours ago, Jiver67 said:

Here is the 20mm Oerlikon cannon (used in early war German aircraft and on many navy ships):

 

 

 

Unless they are using extremely good microphones set at various ranges, then a video clip isn't really gonna pic up what it would sound like. 

For a human ear. Then you got the whole sitting in cockpit,,flying at 400kmh vs stationary outside on a field thing. Short of actually flying and live firing while also having tens of thousands in audo equipment (placed in the cockpit, placed outside the plane and ideally also placed on several planes flying close by) we're never gonna get the correct sound 

[Trooper117]

Historically correct sounds or not... people like to hear a meaty thump when they press that gun button.

[Avimimus]

It does seem from the videos that these weapons did sound rather tinny ? So, everyone's kind-of convinced me that it is pretty close to correct... even if I'd like more of a thump to it.

 

One thing it could do with perhaps, though, is a bit more definition - a slightly more distinguishable space between each round.

[Yogiflight]

It is not only the wind noise reducing the sound of your wing mounted guns, but also a 2,000 hp engine with very short exhaust pipes without any kind of muffler in front of the cockpit. It surely would be louder to have two 20mm guns under the cockpit floor, with the muzzles below the pilot seat, like in the Bf 110, or the weapon casing of a 20mm (or 30mm) gun between the feet, like in the 109s.

[Jiver67]

11 hours ago, Stonehouse said:

Never tried to do it but guessing you would start here if you had any chance to alter the sound.

 

 

Thank you very much Stonehouse! I will play around with this tool and see what I can come up with!

 

11 hours ago, Gunfreak said:

Unless they are using extremely good microphones set at various ranges, then a video clip isn't really gonna pic up what it would sound like. 

For a human ear. Then you got the whole sitting in cockpit,,flying at 400kmh vs stationary outside on a field thing. Short of actually flying and live firing while also having tens of thousands in audo equipment (placed in the cockpit, placed outside the plane and ideally also placed on several planes flying close by) we're never gonna get the correct sound 

 

Very true Gunfreak. Also, altitude, atmospheric pressure, and humidity alter sound waves. My goal is to simply make the cannon sound have more "punch" so that it is louder than the rifle caliber machineguns.

Edited January 7, 2024 by Jiver67

[Jiver67]

11 hours ago, Trooper117 said:

Historically correct sounds or not... people like to hear a meaty thump when they press that gun button.

 

Yes, it is that satisfying feeling of hearing all four 20mm cannons shake the cockpit when you are doing a strafing run in the Typhoon! 

[Jiver67]

6 hours ago, Yogiflight said:

It is not only the wind noise reducing the sound of your wing mounted guns, but also a 2,000 hp engine with very short exhaust pipes without any kind of muffler in front of the cockpit. It surely would be louder to have two 20mm guns under the cockpit floor, with the muzzles below the pilot seat, like in the Bf 110, or the weapon casing of a 20mm (or 30mm) gun between the feet, like in the 109s.

 

All true, not to mention a closed cockpit and wearing a leather flight cap which covers your ears. Nonetheless, for me, hearing that meaty canon sound is almost a necessity (even if it may not be 100% realistic). What bothers me the most is that the machinegun and cannon sounds are not very consistent. The Browning .50 MG (which sounds amazing!) is louder than the 20mm Hispano. This doesn't make sense to me.

[Youtch]

The sound of Hispano is what is keeping me away from fuly enjoying playing british fighters in IL2.

It is soooo satisfying to go back to german fighters just for the sound of the german cannons.

 

Hispanos in IL2 are the worst sounding cannons. They sound like they would be some type blowgun or gun on silencer.

 

To me, it reminds me more of some "digestive problem" than real cannon. ?

 

In DCS the Hispanos have been modelled with much more punch, and are decently satisfying.

[Avimimus]

On 1/7/2024 at 1:48 PM, Jiver67 said:

Yes, it is that satisfying feeling of hearing all four 20mm cannons shake the cockpit when you are doing a strafing run in the Typhoon! 

 

The lower rate of fire of the Hispano Mk.II (compared to the Mk.V) also gives the Typhoon more definition and 'impact' than the Tempest.