German Default Skins

[SCG_Neun]

Was wondering if we could ask for some better default skins for German armor.  I know it's not just me, because my buddies depicted here are radioing me that I am sticking out and need to find cover.  I radio back to them the same and took these screenshots.   This should be a fairly simple request not requiring much from the Devs.

Edited February 19, 2023 by SCG_Neun

[ACG_Bussard]

The StuG really stands out very prominently from wooded cover with its side skirts. In the low afternoon sun, it is a really very easy target for the Allied tanks and aircraft to spot. Is there any way to darken very shiny tan color or use a graphics filter here?

[SCG_Neun]

I do think a lot of this was the lighting in the game which happens late afternoon, early evening, but the color should be matted back and the yellow toned back, or give us another olive/brown option for cover as well.

[ShampooX]

Been asking for over two years now.  Crickets......

 

Edited:  sh*t I'd even pay for better skins in the Official File.  Hint hint Devs!!

Edited February 20, 2023 by ShampooActual

[moustache]

13 hours ago, SCG_Neun said:

Was wondering if we could ask for some better default skins for German armor.

 

you can always ask... you just have to expect a "NO"... it's an old and recurring request, many players, (some are even going to do surveys, but I don't don't even know if the devs looked at it...)... the last answer is that he didn't have the time and the skins made by the modders didn't have the quality enough to be integrated... sorry...

 

 

1 hour ago, ShampooActual said:

sh*t I'd even pay for better skins in the Official File.  Hint hint Devs!!

OLA!!! STOP!!!! give them no bad ideas, if they have really been taken over by Tencent, they will be hooked on your proposal, and in 3 months, we will have loot boxes and boosters...

[ShampooX]

@moustache Mous judging by the ages of most of us, I think we can all afford $5 for a skin or two

[MajorMagee]

How would pay-as-you-go skins work to solve the issue in multiplayer?

Edited February 20, 2023 by MajorMagee

[Guest deleted@188321]

2 hours ago, ShampooActual said:

@moustache Mous judging by the ages of most of us, I think we can all afford $5 for a skin or two

Because we can doesn't mean we will and doesn't mean we should.

[moustache]

4 hours ago, ShampooActual said:

Mous judging by the ages of most of us, I think we can all afford $5 for a skin or two

it's not wrong... but it wouldn't be very honest for those who wouldn't buy it, they would have a huge disadvantage (the photo posted by @SCG_Neun is really telling about the disadvantage of yellow camouflage on a green background.. .)

[MajorMagee]

I'm confused. Seems like if they didn't buy it they would still see the default skin on you since they don't have access to the new texture.

[moustache]

35 minutes ago, MajorMagee said:

I'm confused. Seems like if they didn't buy it they would still see the default skin on you since they don't have access to the new texture.

not sure, i imagine it will be like the rest of the game in multiplayer, you may not have this or that vehicle, but you can see it, a bit like the map system, where you can't play it solo , but can use it in multi.. nan?

[ShampooX]

@MajorMagee  not sure I copy that good buddy.  If players don't own the Stug they can still see it, right?  There is no issue with uploading a "paid skin" in the same official file for all to see.

[MajorMagee]

Okay, I'm not an on-line gamer so didn't understand how it worked.

[SCG_Neun]

Here is my friend Vonalba the other day...what a difference in our skins that we actually use.  We think we are camo in that brush...but wait....oh yeah, we revert back to default yellow skin and enemy on the Multiplayer...have easy time from the ground and air picking us out.     ?

[ShampooX]

1 hour ago, MajorMagee said:

Okay, I'm not an on-line gamer so didn't understand how it worked.

You'll find this is a really great community and I'm always happy to help!!   yeah buddy.

[ACG_Bussard]

The yellow used on the German vehicles seems far too bright and yellow.

 

In my research, I came across a German paint manufacturer that mixes and sells paints for historic military vehicles. The supplier states the following about the color RAL 7028 "Dunkelgelb" (dark yellow), which I translated into english:

 

"For the collector this means concretely that the RAL 7028 "Dunkelgelb" (dark yellow) edition 1944 offered here can be used for vehicles and military material which should represent the period of the Reichswehr / Wehrmacht until 1941 (in which the color was definitely used for testing purposes) and from October 1944 (minus a few months before since also here testing phase!) until the end of the war."

 

"The RAL 7028 "Dunkelgelb" (dark yellow) was supposed to be used on vehicles and objects manufactured between March 1943 and October 1944. 
Certainly various manufacturers still had stocks of this color after October 1944, so this color can still represent situations until the end of the war."

 

"In Army Communication 1943 No. 181 of February 1943, a "Buntfarbenanstrich" (new camouflage paint scheme) for Army motor vehicles and guns is decreed.

The basis of this camouflage paint is the dark beige color RAL 7028 "Dunkelgelb nach Muster". This Dunkelgelb (dark yellow) according to pattern is somewhat lighter than the dark yellow I. The patches to be painted on consisted of 2 color tones, RAL 8017 "Rotbraun" (red brown) No. 19", and RAL 6003 "olivgrün" (olive green), and were applied in appropriate amounts depending on the season, weather, and area of operation.

Thus, olive green patches were used more in the summer, with more reddish brown being used in the fall. Mostly the vehicles were painted in dark yellow ex works, to be painted with the appropriate camouflage patches on site. 

In the early days after the introduction of the "Buntfarbenanstrich" (new camouflage paint scheme), vehicles painted in RAL 7021, "Dunkelgrau" (dark gray) No. 46, were simply painted over with dark yellow spots, so that a desired camouflage effect was achieved here as well.

The first large-scale use of the "Buntfarbenanstrich"(new camouflage paint scheme) was at the operation "Zitadelle" on the tank types III / IV / V / VI."

 

The shown colors of the manfacturer are:

 

RAL 7028 Dunkelgelb + RAL 7028 Dunkelgelb Ausgabe 1944

 

Even if Tank Crew focuses only on the period of the Battle of Kursk, i.e. the period before the 44 ambush camouflage, the color chosen is simply inaccurate and would have to be corrected. It's not a feature, it's a bug and affects the gameplay to disadvantage of the German vehicles!

 

Source:
https://www.militaerlacke.de/fahrzeuglacke/2k-eimergebinde/wehrmacht/300/2k-ral-7028-dunkelgelb

Edited February 22, 2023 by 2./JG3_Bussard*

[MajorMagee]

Be careful with paint color chips in that surface texture, ambient, and direct lighting can have a significant effect on how they look. My experience with creating vehicle textures for Tank Crew vehicles is that the material properties built into 3d models, combined with the alpha layer, and variation of the in game lighting can result in significant shifts in appearance from the color I was painting with. Even the Mission Editor displays differently than what we see in game.

 

Also the wartime colors were provided as a paste that had to be thinned with either gasoline, or water. The gasoline solvent made for the most durable application, but was in short supply. In either case the color varied a lot based on how it was thinned and applied (spray or brush).

 

Then there is the layer of dirt and mud that caused even the Dark Grey vehicles used in Barbarossa to appear light brown after just a few miles of travel down a dusty track.

[ACG_Bussard]

@MajorMagee

 

Well, I am aware of the fact that color charts sometimes appear brighter or darker due to the lighting conditions in reality or simulation. However, the color scheme dark yellow (RAL 7028 Dunkelgelb) of the German vehicles in Tank Crew is still too bright and yellow. This dark yellow is in comparison even brighter than camouflage of the Afrika Korps vehicles in the sun (RAL 7027 Grau - grey + RAL 8020 Braun - brown).

 

Here is a  recording from the Tank Museum Munster/Germany from 2018 on a sunny afternoon day in autumn in a very good quality. In the first 14 Minutes you can see a Panzer III and Panzer IV in Afrika Korps painting as well as Panther in "Buntfarbenanstrich" (dark yellow with pattern). If you need more proofs feel free to PM me.

 

 

 

I hardly believe that the German army leadership was stupid enough to order a brighter camouflage for the Kursk operation in 1943 than for  the North Africa campaign in 1942. xD

 

Your reference with the brightening of the camo by dirt, fuel and water wasn´t meant seriously, right? Where can I notice this effect on the Allied vehicles in Tank Crew? 

 

Edited February 23, 2023 by 2./JG3_Bussard*
Correction of RAL-codes for Afrika Korps

[SCG_Neun]

Great video Bussard!  Thanks for sharing.

 

[MajorMagee]

The effect on allied vehicles in game is not as pronounced because they start off much darker, but they do get highlighted by the game lighting as well.

 

[ShampooX]

Awesome thread guys.  Reminds me of the days when I had hope.....

[ACG_Bussard]

It's just a shame for the beautiful German tank models that the current standard skins aren´t even follow the known guidelines from the primary sources (H.M. 1943, No. 181 Painting of Army Equipment) or secondary sources (e.g. Real Colors of WWII by AK Interactive). For copyright reasons I can't upload screenshots from the mentioned book here to show more.

 

I wouldn't care if there were several skins in different camouflage styles within the stock game - like for the aircraft. But in Multiplayer every other player or opponent sees the much too bright and yellow Skins and make the Axis tank players, even when they hiding in tree cover, to easy targets for the Allied Tankers and Pilots.