Now what?

[itsmecamille]

I hope they don't yet bury the GB series for a single reason: I'd like to have FC vol III or whatever volume it takes to fly the N11 and E III in VR. It sucks for a be a fan of the early WW1 birds...

[Avimimus]

46 minutes ago, ptisinge said:

I hope they don't yet bury the GB series for a single reason: I'd like to have FC vol III or whatever volume it takes to fly the N11 and E III in VR. It sucks for a be a fan of the early WW1 birds...

 

Vol.III has theoretically been announced (although without pre-orders or an aircraft list).

 

Rise of Flight had in the end between 35 and 38 aircraft in it (depending upon how one counts). That is almost enough for four modules. They could release the remainder as collector aircraft, but I'm personally hoping for a Vol. IV with the Channel map and perhaps a couple of new early war two-seaters (Caudron IV, Voisin VIII, and the slower Albatros C.I or LVG C.II come to mind) as appropriate targets for the N.11, D.H.2 and E.III.

 

Of course the real dream is that a deal is worked out for the development of an FC.V with the Gulf of Venice and the Isonzo... something I think would sell adequately due to the visually striking and unique aircraft and landscapes - and which also has enough surviving reference material to be quite feasible. However, that is probably a bit too much to hope for. Still, very interesting to think about.

 

 

  

4 hours ago, Mysticpuma said:

Interestingly this was posted by Buzzsaw in the CloD forums. Development of the next module appears to be in limbo now so could there be the possibility of BoB and Africa coming into play if Fulqrum decide to pull out of the deal with TFS? 

 

"Now that Jason has made his announcement, I can talk about the fact that while it seemed we would be announcing TF 6.0 earlier this summer... that hasn't happened... and why.Jason was my immediate liason/link with 1C.  We had an established system whereby we would prepare for announcements, etc. In the spring of this year, Jason and I had planned to announce TF 6.0, and were preparing.  However, before that could happen, Jason made a decision to part company with 1C.  (which I can't comment on, see Jason's goodbye video)As soon as he made his decision, that put the announcement in limbo.  There are also other factors in play regarding Fulqrum, their ownership and the relation with TF.  (no I also can't go into detail on those)At the moment, pending some decisions by Fulqrum, everything is on hold except the release of the Visual Update.  Which will happen as soon as we are happy with the implementation. That is not to say TF will not be continuing our work on the CLIFFS engine... we will.  It is just a question of what the timing and parameters of that work are. Please don't ask for more details, I won't be able to provide them."

 

This does indeed make me nervous. It is a bit dangerous to have a parent company, and many good simulation companies disappeared when the parent company went under new management that didn't understand the genre (thinking of Digital Image Design, but also perhaps of the decision of Lucasarts to focus only on consoles, and also what happened to the Jane's Combat Simulations label and Dynamix). So far as I can tell - most of these died from the top down (and the top was far above the actual team developing the games).

[Gambit21]

1 hour ago, ptisinge said:

I hope they don't yet bury the GB series for a single reason: I'd like to have FC vol III or whatever volume it takes to fly the N11 and E III in VR. It sucks for a be a fan of the early WW1 birds...

 

I'm skeptical that FC is ever going to be really fleshed out for a few reasons...but we'll see.

[itsmecamille]

28 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

 

I'm skeptical that FC is ever going to be really fleshed out for a few reasons...but we'll see.

 

I already had plenty of concerns that FC would remain unfinished, and even more now. But indeed, not much that can be done, so we'll see...

[Jaegermeister]

Now what?

 

Now 1C Game Studios is under new management. They may go in a different direction, or maybe not. Western planes and modules are more profitable, but Eastern focus would be less risky in the current volatile social environment.

 

Now 1CGS will continue to produce the content that is already in process, because it's still a viable business, it's almost finished, and obviously (to me) profitable enough to make a living for a limited number of Devs, Employees and investors. Collector planes and FCII should stay close to schedule and Jason's exit probably won't change that much. There are a lot of moving parts, and they have not fallen apart AFAIK. FCIII maybe not so much.

 

Now the international player base will make their decisions whether to keep playing and participating or not based on personal life situations. I'm sure politics and changing priorities will factor into those decisions.

 

Now we will wait and see what the next module the Devs are planning will be, because they are the only ones that know and they will tell us when they see fit. I would expect at least one more full Great Battles module to be produced and only time will tell if and when it will be completed. We should hear what that will be soon.

 

I appreciate Jason's commitment to expanding single player content for the series with Scenario Missions and offline Campaigns, and I hope that will somehow remain a priority. I got nothing on that. 

 

 

 

 

 

[tattywelshie]

I wonder if Fulqrum will maybe try and amalgamate TF into 1c? I mean, the combination of Clod and BoX would make sense. Combine the clod engine, with the new graphic improvements, it seems the clod engine has a lot more potential, the BoX UI etc and combine into one sim would definitely make sense commercially I feel. 

[Gambit21]

It doesn’t work like that.

[Juri_JS]

I think some of you guys are much too pessimistic. The team has just recently hired a new community manager and opened new Discord and Telegram channels. I think they wouldn't do that without long term plans for the future.

[Guest deleted@83466]

I just got killed 52 times in HLL this evening, and got 2 in return, so I’m humbled to all ideas put forth now.

[tattywelshie]

1 hour ago, SeaSerpent said:

I just got killed 52 times in HLL this evening, and got 2 in return, so I’m humbled to all ideas put forth now.

That game is brutal!

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

1 hour ago, SeaSerpent said:

I just got killed 52 times in HLL this evening, and got 2 in return, so I’m humbled to all ideas put forth now.

Oh , I always have positive K/D ratio, this game is not that fast as original quake , as it's more tactical it even easier as you grow older and you can't relay on quick reflex only. What I can i say think what enemy would do and be smarter, practice. Good map knowledge and flow with responsive PC and mouse also helps.

Edited October 30, 2022 by 1PL-Husar-1Esk

[Guest deleted@83466]

I’m only at the point where I’m following Sarge around and blasting every window in sight with the BAR, and blowing myself up with grenades. Sorry, didn’t meant to divert thread.  Good stuff though.  People who find themselves bored or disappointed with flight sim for a period of time need to take a break for a while to do something else, and come back.  That was my only point.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

1 hour ago, SeaSerpent said:

I’m only at the point where I’m following Sarge around and blasting every window in sight with the BAR, and blowing myself up with grenades. Sorry, didn’t meant to divert thread.  Good stuff though.  People who find themselves bored or disappointed with flight sim for a period of time need to take a break for a while to do something else, and come back.  That was my only point.

Yes and it  is valid.

 

Edited October 30, 2022 by 1PL-Husar-1Esk

[=gRiJ=Roman-]

A lot at stake with the new module announcement ... I really hope they have chosen it wisely. I really want this sim to keep moving forwards.

I would glad just with the introduction of torpedo bombers.

Edited October 30, 2022 by =gRiJ=Roman-

[DD_Arthur]

5 hours ago, tattywelshie said:

I wonder if Fulqrum will maybe try and amalgamate TF into 1c? I mean, the combination of Clod and BoX would make sense. Combine the clod engine, with the new graphic improvements, it seems the clod engine has a lot more potential, the BoX UI etc and combine into one sim would definitely make sense commercially I feel. 

Eh? Fulcrum does not have anything to do with BoX. They do not own it in any way.

Amalgamating CLoD and BoX makes no sense whatsoever.

They are different code bases, different game engines and completely different teams.

 

Despite the relentless nonsense spouted here about how great CLoD is and it’s “untapped potential”, there is a reason why it only has an average of around thirty users just as there is a reason why 1C abandoned it’s development nearly ten years ago after spending years and millions trying to make it a commercial product.

Presumably, in the near future the CLoD part of these boards will disappear as CLoD is no longer a 1C product.

[BMA_FlyingShark]

Maybe the gameplay will not change much or at all but instead, the business model could change.

Imagine, like it happens more and more with software these days that you don't buy a permanent licence but you pay for a subscription and based game that you pay yearly or monthly or for a certain amount of playing time.

Just a thought and I hope I'm wrong here but I see it more and more (office 365, photoshop,...).

 

Have a nice day.

 

[dburne]

16 minutes ago, FlyingShark said:

Maybe the gameplay will not change much or at all but instead, the business model could change.

Imagine, like it happens more and more with software these days that you don't buy a permanent licence but you pay for a subscription and based game that you pay yearly or monthly or for a certain amount of playing time.

Just a thought and I hope I'm wrong here but I see it more and more (office 365, photoshop,...).

 

Have a nice day.

 

 

Well let us just hope they do not go back to " leveling up " for the single player experience. Or change it much at all, currently single player experience is quite good.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

Given word situations the potential buyers numbers  shrink and that could have negative impact for future of the series. We might like the game and the working passionate man behind it  but we all know who owns the stock and where revenue goes.

[DD_fruitbat]

7 hours ago, SeaSerpent said:

I just got killed 52 times in HLL this evening, and got 2 in return, so I’m humbled to all ideas put forth now.

 

Sounds like when I play it!

[sevenless]

12 hours ago, Avimimus said:

This does indeed make me nervous. It is a bit dangerous to have a parent company, and many good simulation companies disappeared when the parent company went under new management that didn't understand the genre (thinking of Digital Image Design, but also perhaps of the decision of Lucasarts to focus only on consoles, and also what happened to the Jane's Combat Simulations label and Dynamix). So far as I can tell - most of these died from the top down (and the top was far above the actual team developing the games).

 

The masterquestion is who owns the BoX engine, or in other words who owns 1C-777 Ltd. in Cyprus.

 

Interesting tidbit about the CLoD engine here:

 

Since the original agreement, 1C Entertainment, the company which owns the CLIFFS engine has been sold to Tencent, a Hong Kong based software and games company.  1C Entertainment was re-named to Fulqrum Publishing.

 

 

 

[Manstein16]

1 hour ago, sevenless said:

 

The masterquestion is who owns the BoX engine, or in other words who owns 1C-777 Ltd. in Cyprus.

This right here. If 1C-777 is a joint venture between 1C and 777, then Jason’s departure will have resulted in either (1) a dissolution of the JV and division of its assets, or (2) a buyout of Jason’s stake in the JV by 1C. I suspect it is the latter, but I haven’t seen any public information either way. What happens next will depend entirely on that outcome, however. Hopefully guidance will be forthcoming given its impact on this great franchise.

 

CLoD’s assets would appear to be entirely unconnected from the partnership following the acquisition of the 1C subsidiary “1C Entertainment” by Tencent; CLoD and BoX now partially share a name and nothing more.

Edited October 30, 2022 by Manstein16

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

1 hour ago, sevenless said:

The masterquestion is who owns the BoX engine, or in other words who owns 1C-777 Ltd. in Cyprus.

This is know fact.

[Eisenfaustus]

I have to admit this time it won’t be an instant preorder for me - whatever comes next. First of all I have to get a feeling for the direction the franchise is taking from now on.

 

Will the constant stream of core improvements parallel to the creation of new content continue? Will it decline or even improve?

 

Will SP further be a high priority or will it once again be ignored in favor of MP?

Will we keep the current payment model or will it be abandoned for something new?

 

Is the current lack of communication owed to the current situation or is it the beginning of a new communication model?

 

Was the change in leadership actually due to personal reasons or didn’t  the investors like a quality over quantity approach?

 

Whatever the answers to these questions might be - „business as usual“ has by now been interrupted such that the little autist in me has become very sceptical. 
 

And then they‘ll announce Spanish civil war or battle of France and I instant preorder to show appreciation of the bold choice of theatre

 

[dburne]

They would be doing themselves a favor by going ahead with the announcement of the next theater and plane set.

Edited October 30, 2022 by dburne

[javelina]

7 minutes ago, dburne said:

They would be doing themselves a favor by going ahead with the announcement of the next theater and plane set.

I would tend to agree.  This is a big change in the leadership, and thus would demonstrate a focus and continuity in a sense.  Regardless, I'll be in my P-39 later today in case I'm needed...  ?

[MasserME262]

On 10/26/2022 at 2:02 PM, ICDP said:

People need to realise that in order to make core improvements, you need to generate income.  This inevitably means there will be a steady stream of collectable planes/tanks and even new modules to entice people to spend their money.

 

A small sim dev team sitting around focusing on core improvements to FM, DM or engine managment etc, will very soon run out of money.  Bug fixes and improvements are nice, but they do not generate enough income to sustain a project like this.

 

I will miss Jason more than most here, I owe him a lot and have a lot of time for the guy.  Having said that there will be future developments to this sim.

 

 

probably the smartest comment in this thread.

[AEthelraedUnraed]

35 minutes ago, 1PL-Husar-1Esk said:

This is know fact.

I must have missed something. I haven't seen any recent announcements, and the company registry is behind a paywall. Honestly, I don't know who owns IL2 right now.

 

The fact that Jason left doesn't automatically mean he also sold his share in 1C-777. However, if he left because he was bought out, it might very well mean exactly that.

 

@Wardog5711 to what extent is your job "bidirectional"? In other words, are you able to discuss some of the things you pick up in the forums with the team, or are you just here to convey whatever the Devs have got to say to the English-speaking audience? I think that among the Western players, there's some anxiety about what exactly happened here and how this might potentially influence IL2 in the (not necessarily near) future, that might not be relevant or immediately apparent to a Russian audience. I understand there's some kind of big announcement coming in the near future; is the Dev team aware of some of these specifically Western uncertainties, and will these be addressed in this announcement besides the more universal concerns of where to go next etc.?

[Trooper117]

10 hours ago, SeaSerpent said:

I just got killed 52 times in HLL this evening, and got 2 in return.

 

Yes... I can relate to that. 

[Jaws2002]

1 hour ago, Trooper117 said:

 

Yes... I can relate to that. 

Yep. That game is very good to bring our ego down a couple of notches..?

 

I did get a few good sorties there, when, by pure luck, I ended up in a good position with the Mg34.

Edited October 30, 2022 by Jaws2002

[Wardog5711]

@AEthelraedUnraed

In answer to your question, the job is bi-directional. But only to a point at the moment. Considering that I have been with 1C for less than 5 weeks, I'm still very much a 'probbie'.  In both the literal and figurative sense. And I am not privy to all of the long term goals or even all of the short term ones at this point. But don't think all the angst is occurring in a vacuum. I do communicate concerns upwards.  

Also, a number of people look in on the forums/discord and are aware of the concerns. Most of which will hopefully be addressed by some of the upcoming communications from the management team. I'm not at liberty to elaborate at this time. 

Now, as far as the change in relationship between Jason and 1C goes. It all occurred well before my arrival and I have no information on the why, the how or the what. 

I have to assume that at least some folks on here have worked in the corporate sector before and understand that change is a constant in business.

Having personally been through a number of corporate mergers and divestitures over the last couple of decades, people at the top, middle and bottom come and go all the time. If I wasn't directly involved (as in laid off or reassigned), it was none of my business. Hell, I technically changed companies 4 times in a 7 year period and never left my desk.  Same building, new ID card, different sign on the roof. Nothing else changed.

 

As for things like weekly DD's and other info, that is also being looked at.  The 1C Caliber team doesn't do anything close to weekly updates and prefer to do a more informative one when there is actually something worthwhile to share.  They also do not have a forum and rely more on discord and streams. That doesn't mean we will follow suit. That's just how they roll on that team. 

Hang in there guys.

I'll share what I can, when I can and the rest will be coming from people higher on the totem pole than myself.

 

 

 

[oc2209]

21 minutes ago, Wardog5711 said:

Hang in there guys.

I'll share what I can, when I can and the rest will be coming from people higher on the totem pole than myself.

 

No problem. I'm sure your job's not very enjoyable yet, since most of what you've seen is the forum being whiny/mopey over Jason's departure.

 

Once the next module's announced, things should quickly go back to normal.

 

'Normal' being impassioned, ruthlessly savage debates/brawls/bloodbaths over mind-numbing WWII minutiae, and/or constant thread derailments into various theaters of the absurd.

[Wardog5711]

Quote

'Normal' being impassioned, ruthlessly savage debates/brawls/bloodbaths over mind-numbing WWII minutiae, and/or constant thread derailments into various theaters of the absurd."

Well, I love WWII and cold war history. Especially things that go bang, bang, bang.  That is my passion and my hobby. 

And I've been a smart-ass my whole life so absurd thread derailments that do not devolve into personal attacks is no big thing.

I also spent 8+ years as an admin and moderator on a regional Mil-Sim airsoft forum. Dealing with actual teenagers and adults that still act like teenagers being keyboard commandoes is nothing new. ?

 

 

 

[oc2209]

2 hours ago, Wardog5711 said:

Well, I love WWII and cold war history. Especially things that go bang, bang, bang.  That is my passion and my hobby. 

And I've been a smart-ass my whole life so absurd thread derailments that do not devolve into personal attacks is no big thing.

I also spent 8+ years as an admin and moderator on a regional Mil-Sim airsoft forum. Dealing with actual teenagers and adults that still act like teenagers being keyboard commandoes is nothing new. ?

 

It's good you'll be right at home, then.

 

Actually, now that I think of it, we probably won't be having too many knock-down drag-outs anymore. Ballistic and flight model performance seems to be in a fairly good place right now, so barring relatively minor issues, there's not a lot to complain about.

 

More threads along the lines of 'this feature could be improved' instead of 'fix this feature now or else!!1!1'

[Enceladus828]

11 hours ago, DD_Arthur said:

Despite the relentless nonsense spouted here about how great CLoD is and it’s “untapped potential”, there is a reason why it only has an average of around thirty users

Yeah, an average of thirty people who are retired or work part time — people with a lot of spare time in their life to play the game and go on MP.

Using this number of people as a means to determine how many play CloD on a regular basis is false because it doesn’t take into account those who work full time, or are in school — people with very little spare time to play the game. I’m one of those people.

 

11 hours ago, DD_Arthur said:

Presumably, in the near future the CLoD part of these boards will disappear as CLoD is no longer a 1C product.

[DD_Arthur]

24 minutes ago, Enceladus said:

Yeah, an average of thirty people who are retired or work part time — people with a lot of spare time in their life to play the game and go on MP.

Using this number of people as a means to determine how many play CloD on a regular basis is false because it doesn’t take into account those who work full time, or are in school — people with very little spare time to play the game. I’m one of those people.

 

Sorry, I got it wrong.  It's not thirty people. It's actually twenty-two and a half  people who play Cliffs. 

https://steamcharts.com/app/754530  

 

Enceladus, I don't know what your understanding of statistics is but the Steam charts tell the story of the entire player base. That's it.  Painful as they may be to you and embarrassing for all the other nonsense peddlars, Cliffs is a Steam only game.  These stats give you the entire story and if you link the release dates of Team Fusion updates  to these charts it quickly becomes apparent that Team Fusion's efforts have actually driven the player base away from CLoD.

 

Strange.....but true.

[Cloyd]

Do Steamcharts record people who play in Steam offline mode? Just a question, not suggesting that there are uncharted millions of people playing CLoD.

[Dagwoodyt]

33 minutes ago, Cloyd said:

Do Steamcharts record people who play in Steam offline mode? Just a question, not suggesting that there are uncharted millions of people playing CLoD.

I don't have an answer to your question nor whether offline hours are somehow captured in my Steam play time stats. Nevertheless, the online Steam Blitz/DW-T stats seem to tell of declining useage. Activity seems to peak during evenings London time. If I compare MP server totals they generally comprise about 1/3 of the total players during peak hours and fall precipitously on either side of that peak. I suspect the basic problem to be that many who buy Blitz cease to play once acquainted with its' quirks. Any recent upward useage spikes appear to correspond to pre-announced "special" online events.

[oc2209]

2 hours ago, Cloyd said:

Do Steamcharts record people who play in Steam offline mode? Just a question, not suggesting that there are uncharted millions of people playing CLoD.

 

I would guess not.

 

Steam charts do record even single-player only games, however. So it's not recording just people who go into multiplayer lobbies or whatever.

 

So 22-52 people (52 being the peak) is definitely bad by any estimation of the word. For the purposes of statistics, there's not much reason one game would have more hidden offline players than another.

 

BoS (which, because Steam considers Stalingrad the 'base game' for the entire series, is the requisite to play on Steam) registers 587 players for the previous 24 hour peak.

 

To give you some idea of how bad 22-50 people is, I just looked up Max Payne, a single player game from 2001, and it has 21 players right now. 50 at peak.

[Enceladus828]

@DD_Arthur I counted how many members said they're still here in this thread and save for Buzzsaw and someone there just to be a troll, it turned out to be 70, so more than triple the number of players listed on the Steam chart. 

Speaking of which, I looked at the Steam charts for DCS and they have on a 30-Day average, 1,236.3 players while BoS has 305.2 players. Also, Rise of Flight has on average 10.5 players.

The point I'm getting at is there are people who don't play the game all the time because they don't have time due to real-life. I very much would play this game all the time but can't due to things much more important. Therefore, in your eyes I would fall into the category of someone who doesn't play the game. But I do.

 

Somebody brought up the fact that reason the numbers are low is because there is not much advertisement for the game. Enigma's video about IL-2 1946 was pretty informative and how despite the game engine being 20 years it gives you heavy bombers and aircraft carriers which GBs doesn't. Therefore, some more life, not a whole lot, but a bit more could get pumped into it.

If Enigma or another person were to make a similar video about the IL-2 Dover series then perhaps more people would come.

 

Lastly, how about people who are skilled in 3D modeling Graphics with either Blender or 3dsMax or who is a knowledgeable programmer with C#, C++ and other common languages or can assist with making Campaigns or missions join Team Fusion. Very few of them can put in 30-40 hours a week on the game, so if you're able to but decide not to help because you'd rather see the game rot away, then you're not helping the situation.

 

Oh, and even if the player base drops to below 10, TFS won't be going anywhere, that's Fulqrum Publishing's decision, not the beliefs of cynic adults who act like preschoolers.

 

 

[Dagwoodyt]

29 minutes ago, Enceladus said:

@DD_Arthur I counted how many members said they're still here in this thread and save for Buzzsaw and someone there just to be a troll, it turned out to be 70, so more than triple the number of players listed on the Steam chart. 

Speaking of which, I looked at the Steam charts for DCS and they have on a 30-Day average, 1,236.3 players while BoS has 305.2 players. Also, Rise of Flight has on average 10.5 players.

The point I'm getting at is there are people who don't play the game all the time because they don't have time due to real-life. I very much would play this game all the time but can't due to things much more important. Therefore, in your eyes I would fall into the category of someone who doesn't play the game. But I do.

 

Somebody brought up the fact that reason the numbers are low is because there is not much advertisement for the game. Enigma's video about IL-2 1946 was pretty informative and how despite the game engine being 20 years it gives you heavy bombers and aircraft carriers which GBs doesn't. Therefore, some more life, not a whole lot, but a bit more could get pumped into it.

If Enigma or another person were to make a similar video about the IL-2 Dover series then perhaps more people would come.

 

Lastly, how about people who are skilled in 3D modeling Graphics with either Blender or 3dsMax or who is a knowledgeable programmer with C#, C++ and other common languages or can assist with making Campaigns or missions join Team Fusion. Very few of them can put in 30-40 hours a week on the game, so if you're able to but decide not to help because you'd rather see the game rot away, then you're not helping the situation.

 

Oh, and even if the player base drops to below 10, TFS won't be going anywhere, that's Fulqrum Publishing's decision, not the beliefs of cynic adults who act like preschoolers.

 

 

Activity on the Blitz subforum here and on the Steam forum seems in keeping with Steam player stats. I don't see how it is possible to know whether someone doesn't play the game because they are too busy or because the game doesn't meet their needs. What matters is that the player numbers and forum interest are both declining.