The "Who's still here?" question.

[No.54_Reddog]

1 hour ago, Dagwoodyt said:

It seems unrealistic to single out the VR component of the Update "package". If any component doesn't function properly that's a "fail". Any angst over corporate juggling would be lessened if there were more signs of progress toward package' completion. A successful launch would help game stats, of which MP is a component.

 

I think a lot is pinned on VR specifically and singled out for mention by people individually because we all know someone who has said "can't go back to flat screen". If the trees aren't an improvement or can't be implemented, frankly I don't care, the originals weren't that bad and I didn't think they were a priority. If the clouds look no worse than we have seen this far, I'll be happy as long as they're easy to implement in our existing mission building code. Etc etc. VR is kinda make or break for people. As a flat screener I could not care less for myself, but I recognise it's import for the wider community and the games longevity. I did actually get an opportunity to experience VR in DCS yesterday and can see the appeal and can well believe that is the direction we will all end up going at some point.

[Varibraun]

Present✋

[Buzzsaw]

3 hours ago, No.54_Reddog said:

 

I think a lot is pinned on VR specifically and singled out for mention by people individually because we all know someone who has said "can't go back to flat screen". If the trees aren't an improvement or can't be implemented, frankly I don't care, the originals weren't that bad and I didn't think they were a priority. If the clouds look no worse than we have seen this far, I'll be happy as long as they're easy to implement in our existing mission building code. Etc etc. VR is kinda make or break for people. As a flat screener I could not care less for myself, but I recognise it's import for the wider community and the games longevity. I did actually get an opportunity to experience VR in DCS yesterday and can see the appeal and can well believe that is the direction we will all end up going at some point.

We will be implementing Speedtree 8.0/9.0 tree models for the Visual Update.  This is a work in progress, but you can see samples of their game tree library models on the Speedtree site.  With our license, we have access to their entire library.

 

https://store.speedtree.com/speedtree-store/filters/product_cat/games-v8/

 

We are also again testing trueSKY in the VR Beta... added the in progress trueSKY version to the current Beta.  We have recently upgraded our Simul trueSKY license to give us more support... our previous license meant next to no advice from Simul on how to fix bugs, etc.  So we are hoping to make better progress on the implementation.

 

Also added our new upgraded Spitfire/109 3d cockpits.

 

We continue to grant players access to the Beta, anyone who has both games and proof of ownership of a VR headset can join.

12 hours ago, No.54_Reddog said:

Would be lovely to get something other than a post about a 50% off sale on steam, and a closure of a thread which was being conducted in perfectly polite and good terms by all concerned. But then that's I think why a lot of us keep coming back, we like the abuse...

Thread contained a lot of misleading and incorrect information and speculation.

[BOO]

We'd have made bloody good resistance fighters given our inate ability to derail anything we touch....though I suspect the Germans would have found us pretty quickly with all the bickering we do. 

 

 

Edited October 24, 2022 by BOO

[Dagwoodyt]

It's beginning to look like a 2023 Update release, but pleased to get a progress report nevertheless ?

Edited October 25, 2022 by Dagwoodyt

[Avimimus]

I'm here.

[Mysticpuma]

Created a new thread

Edited October 25, 2022 by Mysticpuma

[rocho]

12 hours ago, Buzzsaw said:

We continue to grant players access to the Beta, anyone who has both games and proof of ownership of a VR headset can join.

 

Don't forget about me. ? Check your mailbox, please.

[DBS]

Anyone not hyped for CLoD VR should note the one reason it will be better than BoX: Clickable cockpits!

 

The level of immersion this will provide will be huge. 

[Lord_Pyro]

Don't forget to mention that CloD can handle larger AI formations than BoX, making SP content way more interesting.

[YR-DAN55]

Still here .

[Rei-sen]

I'm checking the forums occasionally, waiting for the AI to be fixed, 'cause at this moment it's unplayable.

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

Checking in on forums for information etc. RL keeps busy and away from flying at the moment though

[R33GZ]

Still here. Not currently playing. Will most likely fire it up after the visual update next year and probably purchase tobruk I think

Edited October 28, 2022 by R33GZ

[BlindAsABat]

Still here. Check in from time to time to see if anything has changed. I don't care about VR but I do care about the available servers & there are none, currently, on which I wish to play. The demise of Storm of War was a disaster for CloD from which it has not & probably never will recover. Instead of poncing about developing North Africa, which very few people cared about, they could have spent their time and precious dollars supporting & developing the best flight sim campaign ever yet devised.

[Jack_Daniels1983]

Still here, waiting for TrueSky and 4K Terain Update. VR is nice but not necessary for me.

[KeyCat]

Lurking in the shadows

[jcole]

Still here…….about every other day or so……not real interested in VR. Update/upgrade for loadout and convergence and panning would be welcomed……

Edited October 31, 2022 by jcole

[eddyflight]

I've had Cliffs for several years and been impressed by how well it runs and a lot of its effects. 

Looking forward to the graphical updates.

[BladeMeister]

12 hours ago, BlindAsABat said:

Instead of poncing about developing North Africa, which very few people cared about,

I would say that that is your opinion and not necessarily the view of many that purchased DWT. I think it is a great theater with a lot more potential, especially for large numbers in MP maps/missions.

 

S!Blade<><

[Buzzsaw]

On 10/31/2022 at 4:31 AM, BlindAsABat said:

Still here. Check in from time to time to see if anything has changed. I don't care about VR but I do care about the available servers & there are none, currently, on which I wish to play. The demise of Storm of War was a disaster for CloD from which it has not & probably never will recover. Instead of poncing about developing North Africa, which very few people cared about, they could have spent their time and precious dollars supporting & developing the best flight sim campaign ever yet devised.

Do you own BLITZ?  Do you own TOBRUK?  Were you really paying attention to what was happening with SoW?

 

If you did, perhaps you wouldn't make such a statement.

 

In the first place, the STORM OF WAR campaigns were able to be successful because Team Fusion had taken the original game and modified it so that Flight and Damage models were more accurate and graphics were improved.  Sure it was a excellent campaign, but it needed a good game and a good Mission Builder... which the TF modded CLIFFS had.

 

2nd, TF's first professional release, BLITZ, the updated version of the original game, was put out to allow campaigns like SoW to develop further.  It added additional aircraft and again improved graphics, including the Beaufighter, Bf-110C-6, Blenheim Mk IV-Late and Mk IVF-Late and several new Tiger Moths.

 

3rd, TOBRUK was not just a Desert War Campaign.  We could have only provided the tropical variants of aircraft, but in fact the module added a large number of new aircraft and variants which only saw service on the Channel map.  These aircraft have carefully crafted subtle differences from the tropical variants.  The new aircraft allow a Campaign maker to take the Channel conflict into mid 1941.  Below is a list of aircraft which were created specifically for a Channel map campaign:

 

Bf-109E-7

Bf-109E-7N

Bf-109E-7Z

Bf-109F-1

Bf-109F-2

Bf-109F-4-Derated

Bf-109F-4

Bf-109F-4Z

Ju-88A-5

Ju-88A-5-Late

Ju-88C-1

Ju-88C-2

Ju-88C-4

Ju-88C-4-Late

He-111H-6

Bf-108 Taifun

Fiat CR-42

Spitfire Mk IIB

Spitfire Mk VA

Spitfire Mk VB

Spitfire Mk VB-LF

Spitfire Mk VB-Late

Spitfire Mk VB-LF-Late

Hurricane Mk IIA

Hurricane Mk IIB

Hurricane Mk IIB-Late

Hurricane Mk IIC

Hurricane Mk IIC-Late

Hurricane Mk IID

Tomahawk Mk IIB

Tomahawk Mk IIB-Late

Kittyhawk Mk IA

Martlet III

Beaufighter Mk IF-Late

Beaufighter Mk IC

Wellington Mk IA

Wellington Mk IC

Wellington Mk IC-Late

Wellington Mk IC-Torp

Dewoitine D.520

 

These aircraft allow a detailed campaign to be created.

 

And as for your comment that TF's work to create a Desert Campaign was "...poncing about..." ... well tell that to the thousands of RAF, Luftwaffe and Regia Aeronautica pilots who fought there.  It was the most strategically significant theater of operations for the Axis versus Britain in war between late '40 to mid '42.  It deserved to be presented to the Flight Sim community, there has never been a simulation which examined the campaign in detail, and TF is proud to have created one and will not apologize.  If you are not interested, fine, there are many others who enjoy exploring the less well trodden corners of WWII and who appreciate what TF did.

[No.54_Reddog]

59 minutes ago, Buzzsaw said:

Do you own BLITZ?  Do you own TOBRUK?  Were you really paying attention to what was happening with SoW?

 

If you did, perhaps you wouldn't make such a statement.

 

In the first place, the STORM OF WAR campaigns were able to be successful because Team Fusion had taken the original game and modified it so that Flight and Damage models were more accurate and graphics were improved.  Sure it was a excellent campaign, but it needed a good game and a good Mission Builder... which the TF modded CLIFFS had.

 

Did you really just try to take credit for SoW there? Kinda feels like you did. Well done you then. Kudos. Ofc I don't know how you'd know it was "an excellent campaign", you never joined the server, or the campaign so never saw anything of it.

 

1 hour ago, Buzzsaw said:

 

2nd, TF's first professional release, BLITZ, the updated version of the original game, was put out to allow campaigns like SoW to develop further.  It added additional aircraft and again improved graphics, including the Beaufighter, Bf-110C-6, Blenheim Mk IV-Late and Mk IVF-Late and several new Tiger Moths.

 

 

How did that work out? Was there a sudden upwelling of campaigns like SoW developed? Or could it be that the failure to address any of the bugs painstakingly reported on your own bug tracker by the communities supporting your game and which were affecting the campaigns and map builders demoralised them from anything? I know it certainly played a large part in my own lack of willingness to relaunch SoW.

 

1 hour ago, Buzzsaw said:

If you are not interested, fine, there are many others who enjoy exploring the less well trodden corners of WWII and who appreciate what TF did.

I'll just leave this here

[MiGCap]

Here! 

 

Only waiting for VR to play again.

[343KKT_Kintaro]

Reddog, with respect, Buzzsaw gave me the impression that by means of "Sure it was a excellent campaign", he was simply meaning that he's ready to acknowlede some part of what BlindAsABat stated but that he doesn't acnowledge some other part. That's all. So, what I get from last Buzzsaw's post is that, ok, the campaign was popular and successul, but such a success couldn't have been reached without TF's mods and fixes. Which is, let's be honest, true.

 

And Reddog, seriously, I'M SURE BUZZSAW IS NOT forgetting how important you were in the implementation of this campaign. I was absent from the game for a few years and I never participated in it (sorry), but I recently learned about your important role. The French-speaking OBT guys, with whom I have been on coms many times in the last three years, always told me how fantastic Storm of War was... so... what about going back to it? What's wrong with reconciling and launching the campaign again?

 

 

[Buzzsaw]

3 hours ago, No.54_Reddog said:

 

Did you really just try to take credit for SoW there? Kinda feels like you did. Well done you then. Kudos. Ofc I don't know how you'd know it was "an excellent campaign", you never joined the server, or the campaign so never saw anything of it.

Of course I am not trying to take credit for your campaign.  I was just stating the fact your Campaign did use the CLIFFS OF DOVER game with the TF Mod... and it did achieve a lot of success with the game TF had resurrected.

 

And I knew SoW was an excellent campaign because I discussed it a number of times with those who were flying it regularly.  And watched videos, etc.

 

I didn't have a chance to join the Campaign full time as I was already overloaded with TF work... but I did fly a couple missions, (although I didn't register... asked the Red side commander if it was ok to join, they said yes)  And I posted on the ATAG forums after flying the missions, and encouraged people to join the campaign.

3 hours ago, No.54_Reddog said:

 

How did that work out? Was there a sudden upwelling of campaigns like SoW developed? Or could it be that the failure to address any of the bugs painstakingly reported on your own bug tracker by the communities supporting your game and which were affecting the campaigns and map builders demoralised them from anything? I know it certainly played a large part in my own lack of willingness to relaunch SoW.

 

Not sure I understand your hostility.  I have already explained we are a small team, working part-time to find ways to improve the game.  Since our releases, we have had a new Campaign start up... TWC deserves a lot of credit for the excellent work they've done... just like you deserve credit for your work on SoW.

 

Regarding the '...failure to address any of the bugs...'  ...we have fixed hundreds of the bugs in the game.  And yes, there are still issues and still more improvements to be made.  Which is what we continue to do.

 

The fact the game has declined in popularity... that is a function of our progress being slower than we hoped... and being up against a very good alternative... in GREAT BATTLES.  Still we think there is an opportunity to bring the game back to more of a center stage position with some of the improvements we have in the pipeline.

 

We hope the community will have a look and judge our work objectively.

[BOO]

On 10/31/2022 at 11:31 AM, BlindAsABat said:

Still here. Check in from time to time to see if anything has changed. I don't care about VR but I do care about the available servers & there are none, currently, on which I wish to play. The demise of Storm of War was a disaster for CloD from which it has not & probably never will recover. Instead of poncing about developing North Africa, which very few people cared about, they could have spent their time and precious dollars supporting & developing the best flight sim campaign ever yet devised.

Nice to see you are still about llama

6 hours ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

Reddog, with respect, Buzzsaw gave me the impression that by means of "Sure it was a excellent campaign", he was simply meaning that he's ready to acknowlede some part of what BlindAsABat stated but that he doesn't acnowledge some other part. That's all. So, what I get from last Buzzsaw's post is that, ok, the campaign was popular and successul, but such a success couldn't have been reached without TF's mods and fixes. Which is, let's be honest, true.

 

And Reddog, seriously, I'M SURE BUZZSAW IS NOT forgetting how important you were in the implementation of this campaign. I was absent from the game for a few years and I never participated in it (sorry), but I recently learned about your important role. The French-speaking OBT guys, with whom I have been on coms many times in the last three years, always told me how fantastic Storm of War was... so... what about going back to it? What's wrong with reconciling and launching the campaign again?

 

 

Work that many imvolved in SOW in the main and in part  helped with in the early days of TF before not being with TF for whatever reason  - lets not forget that

 

Its not a matter of reconciling. SOW is independent of the politics largely down to the love for the game that those responsible for it feel (y'know - the haters who dont do anything according to some who really dont and never have done anything but shout from the sidelines). It a matter of commitiing to hundred of ours of time, hundreds of pounds in costs and being prepared for endless questoning, whining and abuse, the like of which makes anything on here look like childsplay. Its assessing what is now left of the online community 5 years after it faded away. Its working out  if the toll all the admin and frustration takes on private lives is worth it. Finally its taking a position on if the upcoming improvements will be both enough to bring players back in the numbers needed and, if so, if the bugz that are still present in the backroom will interfere with how the SOW team wish to develop thier campaign.

 

Sorry OT  again and Im sorry for messing up the thread futher @Mysticpuma

[343KKT_Kintaro]

Ok BOO, I note what you say. I know nothing about server management, nor about mission building, but for me the game, as it is now, is much more than playable, it's  exciting. I'm back to Cliffs of Dover since 2019, the year when I realised that the Blitz edition is a second chance for guys like me (indeed I was far disappointed in 2011). I won't be one of those who will manage servers and prepare missions, but I'll fill the rosters, with anyone here if anyone here has the good will of making this game continues.

 

[Mysticpuma]

Maybe a mod could move the none "I'm here" replies to the Team Fusion thread? 

[9./JG52_J-HAT]

24 minutes ago, Mysticpuma said:

Maybe a mod could move the none "I'm here" replies to the Team Fusion thread? 

Well, at least we have three pages this way.

[BladeMeister]

4 hours ago, BOO said:

 

 

 

Its not a matter of reconciling. SOW is independent of the politics largely down to the love for the game that those responsible for it feel (y'know - the haters who dont do anything according to some who really dont and never have done anything but shout from the sidelines).

So if you and the few others who want to post here of your love and concern for CLOD/DWT's well being and future potential are actually of good intent, then why at the same time criticize and insult the very Team, TFS, which is the only Development Team working on the sim you each self profess to love? How does what each of you few in anyway help or encourage the future of CLOD/DWT?  Do each of you want to take over the development? Do you want TFS to be fired and stop all development of CLOD/DWT? Do you want 1C to take over development? Is it because you each are people that are currently sitting on the sidelines, you know the actual ones that self proclaim that they are doing something when they are not doing anything except complaining about the past, when they actually did something, speculating about a future which not one person can actually predict and undermining and insulting the actual people which are providing the hours of self sacrifice while developing CLOD/DWT further? Is it because you are butt hurt from past dealings with TFS and you can't get past that like an adult?  Maybe you just like seeing the reaction of people that do like what TFS is doing, for good, bad or indifference because we appreciate that TFS is, at the very least,(it is much more in my eyes) bringing future upgrades to CLOD/DWT for free, when the alternative would be no development for CLOD/DWT at all? Are you looking for appreciation for what you did years ago? Do you expect to directly tell TFS what to do and not do and control where CLOD/DWT is going? What is it?

      What is the end goal of the few that want to attempt to call the TFS Team out for not making your self imposed update release deadlines, which have always been prefaced, "subject to change"? For not fixing the bugs which you deem important while fixing 100s of other bugs which TFS deemed more important? For not giving the PR content in a timely well regimented schedule? What are each of you doing to encourage or move the development of CLOD/DWT forward today? Let me answer that for you you, NOTHING. Just like you accuse others here of doing, maybe you are accusing only me who knows. Each of you, Reddog, Boo and Dagwoodyt are doing nothing except running your mouths about what happened in the past, what you are not given right this minute or what is possibly going to happen in the future. You're self righteousness is self imposed, thinly veiled in conceitedness and smells to high Heaven as the old saying goes. Save your subtle insults for those that can't see through the backwardness of what you write. Nothing you write is helping move CLOD/DWT forward in any way shape or form. It is useless.

 

4 hours ago, BOO said:

 It is a matter of committing to hundred of hours of time, hundreds of pounds in costs and being prepared for endless questioning, whining and abuse, the like of which makes anything on here look like child's play. Its assessing what is now left of the online community 5 years after it faded away. Its working out  if the toll all the admin and frustration takes on private lives is worth it. Finally its taking a position on if the upcoming improvements will be both enough to bring players back in the numbers needed and,

So let me get this straight, what you are saying here is that while you Boo, Reddog(SOW Campaigns) and Dagwoodyt, are doing nothing presently to help CLOD/DWT be more popular and haven't for years now, yet still are complaining about what you don't like about what hasn't been released yet, TFS is pushing ahead through everything you listed above and making the commitment, investing the money, the countless hours and doing the actual work of developing CLOD/DWT while basically betting their lives that the future outcome will be bright even though people like each of you continue to attempt to belittle and criticize them and the work they are doing and how they publicize or do not publicize it? Is that what you are really saying? It seems like it to me The really amazing thing is that the members of TFS, in spite of people like you three, continue on with development. The Team at TFS is thick skinned obviously and above this level of insolence, but I am impressed to see Buzzsaw address these episodes of insolence head on and with a respectful response even though those that are making the posts don't deserve that respect IMHO.

Go TFS! Can't wait for the free upgrade!

 

S!Blade<><

[Bloyamind]

Present! And new, 58 hours in. Cliffs of Dover Blitz + Tobruk is my first sim experience and i'm absolutely loving it, coming from Elite Dangerous. Having the most trouble with AI not staying engaged and heading off which leads to sometimes up to 15 minutes of chasing, shooting once and them just continuing on, not engaging. Any techniques other than gaining altitude and diving a bit to gain on them? I guess this is the main reason I want to try online. Any tips on finding a noob friendly online experience? (is there a specific server/time where people are online?). So far focussing on the Spitfire after some time in a bf109. 

Edited November 2, 2022 by Bloyamind

[Blitzen]

I'm raising my hand!

Edited November 2, 2022 by Blitzen
Screenshots

[352ndOscar]

“About 9hrs in Spits Sir….”  A rookie but here on and off.

[jollyjack]

On 10/18/2022 at 6:29 PM, DD_FT- said:

still here

 

My wife says i might not ...

 

[9./JG52_J-HAT]

On 11/2/2022 at 4:00 PM, Bloyamind said:

Present! And new, 58 hours in. Cliffs of Dover Blitz + Tobruk is my first sim experience and i'm absolutely loving it, coming from Elite Dangerous. Having the most trouble with AI not staying engaged and heading off which leads to sometimes up to 15 minutes of chasing, shooting once and them just continuing on, not engaging. Any techniques other than gaining altitude and diving a bit to gain on them? I guess this is the main reason I want to try online. Any tips on finding a noob friendly online experience? (is there a specific server/time where people are online?). So far focussing on the Spitfire after some time in a bf109. 

Don‘t think there‘s a solution other than changing the AI and waypoints in the mission afaik. It‘s been an ongoing point of concern for many people. 
 

Online you can join TWC. It is noob friendly enough. Players will patrol and engage what they spot. So keep a lookout and try not to get bounced. If you see a contact try to steer away from it if you don‘t feel like engaging. The maps is big enough and there are AI flights (patrols, bombers; on both sides) so you can pick you fights and stay away from trouble, do yout own raids etc. 
 

There is this other server which is a dogfight server iirc. VCAF I think it is. There are usually people there but I have never been. 
 

Most players are on on EU nights. 

Edited November 5, 2022 by 9./JG52_J-HAT

[Bloyamind]

Thanks! Definitely what I was looking for, will check! And as I'm in the Netherlands, EU nights is where it's at

[9./JG52_J-HAT]

28 minutes ago, Bloyamind said:

Thanks! Definitely what I was looking for, will check! And as I'm in the Netherlands, EU nights is where it's at

Nice. Forgot to add, players tend to use ATAG‘s Teamspeak when flying there. So you can hook up with other players flying on your side. Visit the ATAG forums for the link and password. 

Edited November 5, 2022 by 9./JG52_J-HAT

[Bloyamind]

3 hours ago, 9./JG52_J-HAT said:

Nice. Forgot to add, players tend to use ATAG‘s Teamspeak when flying there. So you can hook up with other players flying on your side. Visit the ATAG forums for the link and password. 

Sorry to bother you, and I know this is not the place, so mods, feel free to remove this post if necessary, but it's driving me nuts after a few hours of fiddling around. TWC has players online. I see they are online in the TWC discord which I managed to join, but non of the voice channels has anybody. Where to find them? That's question nr. 1. 2: I joined the server to try figure it out but it starts me off with a message that i'm low on fuel and something about HQ. That scared me right back out of the server, because it's the first time i've seen something like this in the game. What does this mean and is it something I can practice offline? If HQ is on the ground at the airfield I chose... Also the briefing is really daunting, but the briefing for the allies, who I want to join is different only shows updates of what has happened. 

Can someone help me out or send me to the right topic to discuss this? Thanks.

 

edit: a user pointed me to the ATAG TS, as you did. But same goes for over there. 

Edited November 5, 2022 by Bloyamind

[OBT-Eazy]

35 minutes ago, Bloyamind said:

2: I joined the server to try figure it out but it starts me off with a message that i'm low on fuel and something about HQ. That scared me right back out of the server, because it's the first time i've seen something like this in the game. What does this mean and is it something I can practice offline? If HQ is on the ground at the airfield I chose... Also the briefing is really daunting, but the briefing for the allies, who I want to join is different only shows updates of what has happened. 

Don't worry about fuel.  Noofy loves bombing our fuel facilities.  Later, you'll learn own repair them. ?

TWC campaign offers a lot of features (radar, AI escort, repair and restock missions, ...).  Give a chance and enjoy.
Just spawn, start your engine and take-off and fly like J-HAT said, and check your six!

For more infos about the features and additional commands available, you can take a look here : 

https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35466

https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36286
https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35156

https://forums.twcpilots.com/showthread.php?tid=116 (need to be registered)

[Bloyamind]

Thanks for all that. I will! Maybe not now. I'm at that point after hours of twidling where I can't get TSnotifier to work that i'm about to yell at my screen. Which was after all the hidden things I needed to do in the TWC discord server to be able to connect to voice channels that appear to be empty. Etc. etc. So the flight is out of me for now. This feels like needing to hack straight into 1998. ghehe. edit: couldn't let it go, so got TSN to show my name when I talk. That's step one!

Edited November 5, 2022 by Bloyamind