VKB 20cm curved extension with standard office desk chair

[Youtch]

Dear all,

 

I am considering buying a 20cm curved extension to my VKB flightstick to install it on the gorund between my legs.

 

I only have a standard office desk chair, which therefore has no hole in the middle compared to dedicated flight sim chair. 

It is a nice chair and I don t want to  mod it, and this would be vetoed by my wife.

 

I am struggling to figure out if not having this gap in the chair is going somehow to be a problem in terms of ergonomics/comfort with a much longer stick range of motion.

 

I was under the impression that not having any gap, might force me to bend forward more to each the stick, or seat further from the back of the chair, but maybe I am wrong.

 

Any experience with both type of installations to understand what does it change exactly?

 

Many thanks in advance,

 

y.

[-332FG-Gordon200]

@Youtch The VKB 20cm extension has a nice bend that makes altering your chair unnecessary. However, it isn't long enough to reach the ground.

I found attaching it to the bottom of my seat was a comfortable arrangement. I have limited reach of my right arm and this allows me to control the plane without leaning forward.

 

Here are a couple photos of my set up.

 

 

[Youtch]

I understand i will have to elevated the base a little.

 

Thanks for your answer and the pics.

 

I was not expecting the Gunfighter base to be so close to the bottom of the seat, in term of height and how close it is to the chair. This does not cause your arms to be too high? Can you still rest your forearm near your elbow on your legs?

 

Many thanks again,

y.

[Barn-Owl]

I had exactly the same problem you had.  I did not like the pain that my shoulder felt after using the "standard" chair without the cutout.  After a few months of playing like that, with my back leaning forward to accommodate full forward stick throw, I had had enough.  I ended up buying an Open Wheeler setup that perfectly allowed me to have exactly what I wanted: center stick with long extension, middle cutout of chair, throttle and keyboard mounts for the chair.  And it does not break the bank like the Monster Tech chair....

Edited August 20, 2022 by Friction

[dburne]

Don't have any issue using a VKB Gunfighter Pro with 200mm extension and a standard AK Racing gaming chair. It does not have a cut out in the seat.

I have the stick mounted to my desk with Monster Tech Extended desk mount. I have my chair sitting very close to the Gunfighter base practically touching the gimbal base. That is the standard Monster Tech Mount I have my Virpil CM3 throttle mounted on. Love their mounts, so quick to attach and detach from the desk.

 

Edited August 20, 2022 by dburne

[Youtch]

26 minutes ago, dburne said:

That is the standard Monster Tech Mount I have my Virpil CM3 throttle mounted on. Love their mounts, so quick to attach and detach from the desk

Are you mounting and unmounting each time you play? How long of an operations it is? How do you store the stick plus mount?

[dburne]

17 minutes ago, Youtch said:

Are you mounting and unmounting each time you play? How long of an operations it is? How do you store the stick plus mount?

 

Yes of course. Takes seconds. I store them on right side of my desk on floor, with covers on both stick and throttle. Stick and throttle stay attached to mounts, just unlock a lever to dismount it, or lock the lever in when mounting to desk. Literally seconds.

 

Also have a Virpil Collective I mount to a Monster Tech Chair Mount.

That one is a little more involved so takes me more like 1-2 minutes to mount or dismount lol.

Edited August 20, 2022 by dburne

[Youtch]

10 hours ago, dburne said:

I store them on right side of my desk on floor, with covers on both stick and throttle. Stick and throttle stay attached to mounts, just unlock a lever to dismount it, or lock the lever in when mounting to desk. Literally seconds.

Are this type of mount suitable for any type of table, would it work on standard IKEA table without marking or destroying table?

[Customizer171]

3 hours ago, Youtch said:

Are this type of mount suitable for any type of table, would it work on standard IKEA table without marking or destroying table?

You can use them to most tables, maybe even all, but I would think twice before putting them on a glass table. It's adjustable in terms of thickness of the table and they don't leave any marks.

Really great mounts!

Edited August 21, 2022 by Customizer171
Additional info

[dburne]

51 minutes ago, Customizer171 said:

You can use them to most tables, maybe even all, but I would think twice before putting them on a glass table. It's adjustable in terms of thickness of the table and they don't leave any marks.

Really great mounts!

 

Fully agree.

[Youtch]

Unfortunately i just realized that i will never have the necessary space between the desk and the chair to mount a monstertech setup.

 

I will have to proceed with floor mount instead.

[Youtch]

On 8/21/2022 at 12:03 AM, dburne said:

Don't have any issue using a VKB Gunfighter Pro with 200mm extension and a standard AK Racing gaming chair. It does not have a cut out in the seat.

I have the stick mounted to my desk with Monster Tech Extended desk mount. I have my chair sitting very close to the Gunfighter base practically touching the gimbal base.

Is your back fully supported by the chair, can you lay your elbows or forearms on your thighs?

[dburne]

21 minutes ago, Youtch said:

Is your back fully supported by the chair, can you lay your elbows or forearms on your thighs?

 

Yes the back is certainly tall enough with a small removeable pillow at the top, however I tend to lean forward a little myself.

I have my center mounted stick adjusted to where I can lay my forearms/elbows on the chair's arm rests. I would need to lean even further forward to lay them on my thighs and can't imagine that being comfortable. However I am tall as well.

Edited August 22, 2022 by dburne

[Youtch]

Many thanks for your answers. Very helpful. I had my doubt about the compatibility of 20cm extension with standard office chair.

 

Now i need to figure how to build a structure to mount the stick on the floor and be stable enough. Monstertech does not seem to offer floor mount. Maybe i will have to go DIY.

[dburne]

1 hour ago, Youtch said:

Many thanks for your answers. Very helpful. I had my doubt about the compatibility of 20cm extension with standard office chair.

 

Now i need to figure how to build a structure to mount the stick on the floor and be stable enough. Monstertech does not seem to offer floor mount. Maybe i will have to go DIY.

 

Not sure I understand exactly your need to do a floor mount?

I mean with extension you still have to have space between your chair and desk for the stick to have full throw forward.

[Youtch]

I have less than 10 cm between my desk and chair, this is why the stick needs to go below the desk (which is quite high, and my chair can go quite low), and stands on a mount build bottom up.

[Barn-Owl]

Pics below for the op... A center cutout is the way to go, by far.  No bad aches and pain and proper ergonomics.  I highly recommend the Open Wheeler seat.

pic2.jpeg 173915818_simseatpic.jpeg

[Drano]

This isn't going anywhere. 

[Youtch]

12 hours ago, Friction said:

Pics below for the op... A center cutout is the way to go, by far.  No bad aches and pain and proper ergonomics.  I highly recommend the Open Wheeler seat.

pic2.jpeg 2.06 MB · 7 downloads 173915818_simseatpic.jpeg 2.18 MB · 5 downloads

The pics do not seem to load correctly.

10 hours ago, Drano said:

This isn't going anywhere. 

This looks like heavy duty. You put some weight on the bottom. I am assuming it is stable enough while still be moved on the side. What you build in between the base and the gunfighter device is something to regulate height?

[Drano]

The base is a heavy pipe flange I rescued from a demo project at work. It probably weighs around 20 lbs, is fairly wide and all that weight is at the bottom. So yeah it's pretty stable! Moving it at all is a chore! I just used a combination of nipples to get the height I want. I cut a disc of, think it's 1/8" plate, to mount the gunfighter base to. 

[Youtch]

I just need to find a way to elevate the gunfighter base some 25cm above the ground, although I will need to assess carefully the ergonomics.

 

I remember somebody posting an excellent link about ergonomics, but I lost it somehow.

 

It is also very hard to find documentation about the travel range of the VKB gunfighter stick with 200mm extension.

I think the extension double the size of the stick and hence the range of motion on the top shall be some 14cm sideway, and 7cm sideway at the bottom of the stick. 

 

I am trying to figure out the minimum distance between legs to move comfortably with the stick when doing extreme roll.

 

I was thinking to build something out of thick wood, to be rigid enough.

 

 

Edited August 24, 2022 by Youtch

[BladeMeister]

He said 'nipples'

Huh Huh, Huh, Huh, Huh,

 

Yea,

'nipples' Huh Huh, Huh Huh!

 

S!Blade<><

Edited August 24, 2022 by BladeMeister

[Dagwoodyt]

Store-bought solutions are not always necessary. Started with Virpil. Now GF.

[Drano]

Without having it in front of me IIRC it's about that tall. I just made it whatever height was comfortable using whatever combination of--wait for it----nipples---worked. I'm sitting in a regular office chair at a pretty low height. I've modded it slightly with some 5/16" rod, nuts and washers so that the seat is tilted towards the back a few degrees. It always felt like I was sliding out of it especially after I put the jet pad on it. I don't have any issues with range of travel at the height I have it. I'd imagine if it was too low it hit both left/right and front/back. If too high I'd be reaching for it and I'd think that'd make for a fatigued arm. At the current height it JUST touches my legs on extreme rolls but doesn't hit backwards or forwards (unless I forget to push the keyboard shelf on my desk in).

[Youtch]

1 hour ago, Dagwoodyt said:

Is the shelve tied to the floor, glued or with some screws?

 

 

This is almost exactly what I am looking for.

[Dagwoodyt]

1 hour ago, Youtch said:

Is the shelve tied to the floor, glued or with some screws?

 

 

This is almost exactly what I am looking for.

The plywood base sits on a throw rug under desk. There is too much friction between base and rug for the base to move. Besides that, weight of TPR pedals would prevent base from moving. Foot rests in front of the pedals are located using wooden dowel pins so the foot rests can be positioned exactly every time and moved in and out for access to the pc case or even disassembled without screws or nails. As the footrests are located to the plywood base using dowel pins there is no way for the central box mount to move either. Filling the lower storage shelf adds more weight to the central box so nothing can move unless I want it to. Two dowel pins to locate bottom of central box on base is also easily done.

Edited August 24, 2022 by Dagwoodyt

[Barn-Owl]

Edited August 26, 2022 by Friction

[Barn-Owl]

image.jpeg

[Youtch]

For some reasons, the images you are attaching are not passing through.

[1Sascha]

I'd really love to go extension, but I kinda doubt I'd be able to pull it off on my desk with mounts and still be able to find a decent seating position. I have my Gladiator mounted to my desk and that already was a bit of a nightmare to get right. Plus I had to adjust its VKB mount to a pretty short configuration to even be able to make it work as a central mount without the chair (or my crotch) getting in the way. The Gladiator is quite a bit bulkier than the Gunfighter or the Virpil bases, but I don't see how I'd be able to go with an extension with a desk-mount here. I'd have to push my chair even further from my desk probably, which would mean I'd be further away from my monitor than I would like. It's on an extendable monitor-arm, but that thing is at  the limit of its reach already with my current setup.

 

Does anyone use a Gunfighter or T50/WarBRD with an extension and on one of those non Monstertech-style desk-mounts? I fear that if I adjusted my VKB mount to its longest setting to accommodate a GF and an extension, it'd stand off the desk so far that I'd have to sit like another half meter or so further away from my desk. 

 

S.

 

Edited August 26, 2022 by 1Sascha

[Barn-Owl]

I do not know why I am having difficulty posting these images.  I click on the "choose files" link and put in the jpeg picture from my hard drive.  It loads the file off my hard drive.  Anything else I need to do to get the pics to post?

Edited August 27, 2022 by Friction

[BladeMeister]

6 hours ago, 1Sascha said:

I'd really love to go extension, but I kinda doubt I'd be able to pull it off on my desk with mounts and still be able to find a decent seating position. I have my Gladiator mounted to my desk and that already was a bit of a nightmare to get right. Plus I had to adjust its VKB mount to a pretty short configuration to even be able to make it work as a central mount without the chair (or my crotch) getting in the way. The Gladiator is quite a bit bulkier than the Gunfighter or the Virpil bases, but I don't see how I'd be able to go with an extension with a desk-mount here. I'd have to push my chair even further from my desk probably, which would mean I'd be further away from my monitor than I would like. It's on an extendable monitor-arm, but that thing is at  the limit of its reach already with my current setup.

 

Does anyone use a Gunfighter or T50/WarBRD with an extension and on one of those non Monstertech-style desk-mounts? I fear that if I adjusted my VKB mount to its longest setting to accommodate a GF and an extension, it'd stand off the desk so far that I'd have to sit like another half meter or so further away from my desk. 

 

S.

 

Maybe you should look into a longer wall arm mount. I simply pulled my monitor closer to the front edge, and I love my MonsterTech center long drop mount for my GFIII. I pull my chair right up against the edge of my GFII base.

 

S!Blade<><

 

[1Sascha]

4 hours ago, BladeMeister said:

Maybe you should look into a longer wall arm mount.

To be fair, the one I have lets me pull the monitor almost to the front edge of the desk ... like 15 to 17 cm from it. It's not a wall mount but one that's fixed to the rear edge of the desk, but since the desk is 80cm deep and I couldn't put the mount in a completely central position, it's a bit hampered in its ability to extend forward.

 

^ Older work in progress pic. Ended up having to mount it further back onto the metal grating bit of the desk, and since I wanted to put it onto that strut the mouse sits on in this pic (for extra support), I couldn't put it in a completely central position.

 

 

 

^ This is pretty much as far as it'll go forward on an 80cm deep desktop.

 

Thing is that I have recently put lockable casters on my chair - the only ones I could find are 30mm taller than the stock ones, so that messed up my seating position a bit, but without lockable casters, my pedals would be unusable - especially now that I've put the dampener on them.

 

I *guess* the only way I'd be able to do this would be to raise my desktop height back up by a notch (20mm) - which will put it a bit too high for work. And since I can't adjust this desk on the fly (it's a more primitive system which requires quite a bit of effort to adjust without a second pair of hands around) *and* I'll have to clear off everything from the desk to do it, I'm kinda reluctant to go this route.

 

First world problems, ey? ?

 

@BladeMeister BTW: Can you post a side-view pic of your setup? I'd be interested to see where the leading edge of your chair's seat is in relation to your mount and stick-base. Although I'm not even sure if that will help me any since those Monstertech mounts don't protrude nearly as much from the desk as the VKB mount that I'm using - especially when I adjust it to its maximum length which will push its mounting plate further towards the chair.

 

S.

Edited August 27, 2022 by 1Sascha

[BladeMeister]

Hey 1Sascha, I hope this helps stir the creative side of your brain to achieve that 'perfect' sitting, monitor and Hotas position that all sim pilots desire. I either keep my chair about this close or I pull it right up against the GFIII base. Each of our situations are a bit different, but maybe these pics will help. I own MonsterTech mounts and they are Damn expensive, but I must say that it has been money well spent IMHO. They are quality made and they fill my needs for mounting my Hots very well, actually perfectly in my case. From my eyes to the monitor is 38" exactly if that helps. I think it all boils down to you having to choose, is this your virtual cockpit or your work desk. You can't have both combined once you have fallen this far into the Combat Flight Simming rabbit hole. Donning my dark armless oval sunglasses and speaking directly to you 1Sascha.

  "You take the Blue Pill, the story of your perfect Hotas setup quest ends,..... you wake up at your work / sim flying desk and live the rest of your life working and flying sims from the same desk while wondering what the perfect Combat Flight Simming hotas is!"

  "Or,... you take the Red Pill and experience how far the perfect Combat Flight Simming hotas hole goes! Simply know this 1Sascha,..... if you take the Red Pill,...there is no going back!"

 

S!Blade<><

 

 

 

Edited August 29, 2022 by BladeMeister

[Customizer171]

On 8/27/2022 at 3:58 PM, BladeMeister said:

Hey 1Sascha, I hope this helps stir the creative side of your brain to achieve that 'perfect' sitting, monitor and Hotas position that all sim pilots desire. I either keep my chair about this close or I pull it right up against the GFII base. Each of our situations are a bit different, but maybe these pics will help. I own MonsterTech mounts and they are Damn expensive, but I must say that it has been money well spent IMHO. They are quality made and they fill my needs for mounting my Hots very well, actually perfectly in my case. From my eyes to the monitor is 38" exactly if that helps. I think it all boils down to you having to choose, is this your virtual cockpit or your work desk. You can't have both combined once you have fallen this far into the Combat Flight Simming rabbit hole. Donning my dark armless oval sunglasses and speaking directly to you 1Sascha.

  "You take the Blue Pill, the story of your perfect Hotas setup quest ends,..... you wake up at your work / sim flying desk and live the rest of your life working and flying sims from the same desk while wondering what the perfect Combat Flight Simming hotas is!"

  "Or,... you take the Red Pill and experience how far the perfect Combat Flight Simming hotas hole goes! Simply know this 1Sascha,..... if you take the Red Pill,...there is no going back!"

 

S!Blade<><

 

 

 

Hello, I am curious to know why you have the stick twisted to one side, as seen in the pictures?

I have only my grip twisted some, to get a more relaxed position in my hand, but I guess you have another reason for it, or you would have done like me??

How do you like that Virpil button box for WWII aircrafts? 

[BladeMeister]

Here is my thinking Customizer171. Having the base angled simply facilitates the explanation below. It took a little while to get the muscle memory for the four directions on a diagonal, but now it is just second nature for me.

As far as the Virpil hardware, I think it is fabulous. I simply wish all Combat Flight Sims had 128 button support. It is nice to basically  map every command needed to my CM3 throttle and the KA50 panel. Now that 1C has released the new key mapping option for individual profiles I can have a profile for each plane if I so desire and I really like that option. Now if I just live long enough to make a profile for each.

 

 

S!Blade<><

 

Edited August 29, 2022 by BladeMeister

[Customizer171]

6 hours ago, BladeMeister said:

Here is my thinking Customizer171. Having the base angled simply facilitates the explanation below. It took a little while to get the muscle memory for the four directions on a diagonal, but now it is just second nature for me.

As far as the Virpil hardware, I think it is fabulous. I simply wish all Combat Flight Sims had 128 button support. It is nice to basically  map every command needed to my CM3 throttle and the KA50 panel. Now that 1C has released the new key mapping option for individual profiles I can have a profile for each plane if I so desire and I really like that option. Now if I just live long enough to make a profile for each.

 

 

S!Blade<><

 

Thanks, I kind of thought it was like that but I wasn't sure. 

I plan to get a button box or two, hahaha, but have not yet decided what to get.

I'm not a big fan of the throttles with a "million" buttons and hats on the grip, feels like you need to be a piano player to master it. I hope a button box would feel more natural for me to use.

Right now I have been considering The Black hog or Virpil KA50.

Really liking the GVL box you have but that's not possible to get right now, for obvious reasons.

[1Sascha]

21 hours ago, Customizer171 said:

Hello, I am curious to know why you have the stick twisted to one side, as seen in the pictures?

Mine's been twisted too since I went central mount. Can't twist the Gladiator's grip against the base, but the VKB mount allows to rotate the whole stick by maybe 5° to either side. One of the reasons why I wanted the VKB mount, since I wasn't sure it'd be possible to do this with Monstertechs. It feels so much more comfortable like this. In fact, when I use the stick untwisted as a central-mount, just holding the grip feels downright uncomfortable after a few minutes.

 

S.

[Drano]

I have my extension mounted straight on to the base and my grip canted a few degrees to the left. It's just an ergonomics thing. More confotable holding onto the grip if it's facing towards your hand than if it's straight. You get used to controlling the plane after a while when it's set that way.

[dburne]

5 hours ago, 1Sascha said:

Mine's been twisted too since I went central mount. Can't twist the Gladiator's grip against the base, but the VKB mount allows to rotate the whole stick by maybe 5° to either side. One of the reasons why I wanted the VKB mount, since I wasn't sure it'd be possible to do this with Monstertechs. It feels so much more comfortable like this. In fact, when I use the stick untwisted as a central-mount, just holding the grip feels downright uncomfortable after a few minutes.

 

S.

 

Yes the mount does not matter, the twist is in the stick/grip. Have mine angled to the left on my Monster Tech Mount no problem.