NOW CLOSED - Invitation to Closed STEAM BETA - Only for VR users

[Buzzsaw]

Hello All

 

We will be creating a private, passworded STEAM BETA for VR users to test our Beta VR Implementation in the next few weeks.

 

There will not be any restrictions on the number of users who may participate.  However, there will be a cutoff date for applications... after the cutoff date, we will not take any more applicants.

 

This thread is an invitation to all those who qualify.  Below are the requirements for community members to apply:

 

-  Must own both BLITZ and TOBRUK  (Beta will incorporate both games... anyone who doesn't have TOBRUK will not be able to use the Beta)

 

-  Must own an up to date/fully supported VR headset

 

-  A .jpg or other visual record of the player's VR headset, serial number, manufacturer and model will be required to be submitted with an application.  We need this to determine if there are any issues with particular types of VR hardware.

 

-  Application received by February 15th 2022 latest

 

There is no use in those who do not have VR testing this Beta... there will be an opportunity to test the full Visual Update in a public Beta later.  In the meantime we ask those community members who do not have VR systems to have a bit more patience.

 

IMPORTANT:

 

Do not reply here.

 

Instead, please send me a private message on these forums along with a link to your email.

 

If you are a member of a group, I would appreciate it if instead of replying individually, the group representative sends me a single message, along with the names and emails of all those from the group who wish to participate.

 

----

 

We will be setting up a special private Beta Forum for participants to post their feedback and comments.

[Buzzsaw]

Please note, I will not reply to your Messages immediately... I don't want to send out 75 different emails.

 

I will reply when we get a good number of applicants and as a group.

 

Thanks for everyone's patience!  ?

[scram77]

Oops - Didn't mean to reply on here.

 

 

Edited February 4, 2022 by scram77

[Whitetipshark]

Excuse the ignorance.

But how do i reply to you if I'm not allowed to reply to you?

[kissTheSky]

I hope I’m not going out of turn here. I understand the verification of VR headset to be a part of the beta, but why serial number as well?

[Buzzsaw]

11 hours ago, Whitetipshark said:

Excuse the ignorance.

But how do i reply to you if I'm not allowed to reply to you?

You reply by a private message not on this thread... see your controls.

 

I am doing that for privacy reasons.... I am sure people don't want their emails made available for anyone to spam.

[HokieRob]

5 hours ago, kissTheSky said:

I hope I’m not going out of turn here. I understand the verification of VR headset to be a part of the beta, but why serial number as well?

Becuase some brands of VR headsets have had small but important changes between batches. Example would be the HP Reverb G2. There are now 2 versions, the orginal and an improved verions, but both are simply labeled at "G2". By tracking S/Ns, the developers can see if issues that pop up in testing can be isolated to specific batches/versions of headsets.

[Buzzsaw]

9 hours ago, kissTheSky said:

I hope I’m not going out of turn here. I understand the verification of VR headset to be a part of the beta, but why serial number as well?

For the same reason as mentioned by HokieRob.

 

And also, we are looking for feedback from the testers.... so when you post your feedback, we will expect you to post the Type/Model/Serial# there too.

 

Finally we do not want non-VR users in this test... giving us irrelevant information or asking for changes in areas which don't relate to VR.

 

We want players who are experienced with VR... people who like VR and are motivated to test the game's implementation and confirm where there are issues.

[Angry_Russian]

1 hour ago, Buzzsaw said:

For the same reason as mentioned by HokieRob.

 

And also, we are looking for feedback from the testers.... so when you post your feedback, we will expect you to post the Type/Model/Serial# there too.

 

Finally we do not want non-VR users in this test... giving us irrelevant information or asking for changes in areas which don't relate to VR.

 

We want players who are experienced with VR... people who like VR and are motivated to test the game's implementation and confirm where there are issues.

You say you don't want non-VR users in this test, but as a mandatory condition you set owning Blitz and Tobruk, which are only relevant to non-VR users right now. I think if you want many people to participate in this test you need to provide possibility of refund to those who participated but didn't like VR implementation at the release date. E.g. for this reason I own DCS and IL-2 GB and flying them for hours every day - I could see how well they work in VR before buying them, but this game is still a black box in VR. I'm not interested in 2D and would've bought your game and provided you with testing, but as warranty it seems fair if you provide a refund possibility in case VR implementation ends up on MSFS level..

 

Please think about this, it may grow your testing base significantly.

[Buzzsaw]

33 minutes ago, Angry_Russian said:

You say you don't want non-VR users in this test, but as a mandatory condition you set owning Blitz and Tobruk, which are only relevant to non-VR users right now. I think if you want many people to participate in this test you need to provide possibility of refund to those who participated but didn't like VR implementation at the release date. E.g. for this reason I own DCS and IL-2 GB and flying them for hours every day - I could see how well they work in VR before buying them, but this game is still a black box in VR. I'm not interested in 2D and would've bought your game and provided you with testing, but as warranty it seems fair if you provide a refund possibility in case VR implementation ends up on MSFS level..

 

Please think about this, it may grow your testing base significantly.

There is no text or indication anywhere on the BLITZ and TOBRUK Steam Sale site where it says the game is VR enabled.

 

And we have made it clear many times on the Steam Discussion boards,  before the release of TOBRUK and after as well as on these IL-2 boards and others that VR is not enabled.

 

If you don't want to purchase TOBRUK, then you will need to wait till the Visual Update patch is officially released to play with VR on BLITZ.

 

It makes no sense to run two Betas... one for BLITZ only users and one for BLITZ and TOBRUK users... that would require two sets of software and additional coding.

[Angry_Russian]

1 hour ago, Buzzsaw said:

There is no text or indication anywhere on the BLITZ and TOBRUK Steam Sale site where it says the game is VR enabled.

 

And we have made it clear many times on the Steam Discussion boards,  before the release of TOBRUK and after as well as on these IL-2 boards and others that VR is not enabled.

 

If you don't want to purchase TOBRUK, then you will need to wait till the Visual Update patch is officially released to play with VR on BLITZ.

 

It makes no sense to run two Betas... one for BLITZ only users and one for BLITZ and TOBRUK users... that would require two sets of software and additional coding.

I don't think you got my point. From IL-2 franchise I own only Great Battles and Flying Circus (had a disk of 1946 but that's officially lost ?), don't have anything related to Cliffs of Dover, because indeed it doesn't have VR. There is just a faulty logic IMO in the whole beta test approach right now:

1) Game is obviously not VR-ready, but you want to make it so and lacking a bit in resources => you want VR beta testers.

2) At the same time many people who own VR and fly only in VR don't have your game because for them for now there is no point in owning it - it doesn't have a VR support => so they don't have it to test and you won't have them as beta testers. Most experienced VR fliers are among these people.

 

As result the only people who will test your VR implementation are those who are OK to fly also in 2D (that's why they own your game), which is a minority of those who own VR. Or those who just want to risk it and just get into it hoping for the best outcome.

 

My point is that at the end we both need the same thing - nicely working VR for which we are ready to give you our free time for testing it, but for that we at least need warranties that we won't end up with a paid game which doesn't work for us. Basically you are saying to us now "please buy Blitz and Tobruk and we will give you ability to test VR implementation in the beta branch, and trust us, it will end up good". I'm saying trust works both ways and in case we do go this way we should have a possibility to refund the game if you fail to deliver. Otherwise we end up with a 2D game in our steam library which is not interesting for a VR user, or not really functional VR implementation in it (hence MSFS example, which claims VR support BTW). Same way you should have a possibility to recall access to VR beta from any user you've given it to. That's only fair here.

 

I think we can both agree that flight sim community is small, VR part of it is even smaller, and part of this part who owns your game is even more smaller. If you had enough resources to test everything without us we wouldn't see this beta with a "serial number headset thing" here - you would've bought them or rented them yourself to test and opened a beta only for small bugs catching and content polishing. Personally I'd really like to help you out with this, but I need basic warranties that at least I won't end up paying for the game I won't use. It's not like your game is expensive but the whole idea of gambling just feels wrong..

Edited February 6, 2022 by Angry_Russian

[5DG-Taslehoff]

No thanks . There is no reason for you to have my headset  Ser No. that's  intrusive data collection.

[9./JG52_J-HAT]

Wait for VR to come out, read and watch reviews and decide to buy it. 

 

If you decide to buy it anyways (regardless of for the Beta or not) Steam refund policies still apply. Less than two hours played and within 2 weeks of purchase. Just return it if you don‘t like it.
 

But then if you buy it for the Beta and return it in the return window, your testing will only satisfy your own curiosity and lack of patience. A waste of time for TFS. You‘ve waited how long for it now and wants to participate in the Beta so you can test it out to see if you like it or not?
 

Also, don‘t assume everyone that flys CloD in 2D doesn‘t have VR experience or doesn‘t fly anything else. Not all are in the „VR or nothing“ category.

 

7 minutes ago, 5DG-Taslehoff said:

No thanks . There is no reason for you to have my headset  Ser No. that's  intrusive data collection.

You realize he‘s not offering you anything, don‘t you? It‘s not early access in exchange for your „personal data“. As of the reason hasn‘t been explained above anyways.

Don‘t agree? Move along. Simple. 

 

Edited February 6, 2022 by 9./JG52_J-HAT

[messsucher]

50 minutes ago, Angry_Russian said:

Basically you are saying to us now "please buy Blitz and Tobruk and we will give you ability to test VR implementation in the beta branch, and trust us, it will end up good".

 

If they say that, it is like asking you to be an investor, which is by definition a risky business.

[Angry_Russian]

1 hour ago, 9./JG52_J-HAT said:

Wait for VR to come out, read and watch reviews and decide to buy it. 

 

If you decide to buy it anyways (regardless of for the Beta or not) Steam refund policies still apply. Less than two hours played and within 2 weeks of purchase. Just return it if you don‘t like it.
 

But then if you buy it for the Beta and return it in the return window, your testing will only satisfy your own curiosity and lack of patience. A waste of time for TFS. You‘ve waited how long for it now and wants to participate in the Beta so you can test it out to see if you like it or not?

I perfectly know how returns work on Steam, that not about it at all. I'm actually offering a way to expand the testing base here, which actually benefits everyone. It costs $0 to the devs to give access to a flight sim for a short term (it's not a lost sale, if the product is good it will be bought at the end as everyone here is for gameplay and not some kind of story which can be accessed in beta) but paradoxically it costs beta testers to join it. With current terms I'll move along for sure. But I'm afraid that's not what the devs would want at the end, right?

 

Honestly I would've paid $100 for a good implementation of VR in this game, and I think a lot of people would've pay at least $50 given the advantages it has over other sims. But what we have now is promises of a small team to deliver it for free with our help and a limiting beta, which sounds more risky than it could. It indeed starts to sound as some kind of Early Access investment thing as @messsucher is mentioning above - such approach works with over-hyped titles, where people just want to jump into something for whatever cost, but not sure it works in such a small community like this..

 

1 hour ago, 9./JG52_J-HAT said:

Also, don‘t assume everyone that flys CloD in 2D doesn‘t have VR experience or doesn‘t fly anything else. Not all are in the „VR or nothing“ category.

I'm not assuming everyone, but I could bet money that majority is exactly like this. After flying in VR going back to 2D works for very few and for specific reasons, most commonly physiological. My point here again is to expand the test base instead of cutting it short. What you achieve by assuming that it's OK to have as main testers people who do both 2D and VR for flights sims is a viewpoint of minority, which should not be the case for beta test of VR support.

Edited February 6, 2022 by Angry_Russian

[RAAF492SQNOz_Steve]

12 minutes ago, Angry_Russian said:

I perfectly know how returns work on Steam, that not about it at all. I'm actually offering a way to expand the testing base here, which actually benefits everyone. It costs $0 to the devs to give access to a flight sim for a short term (it's not a lost sale, if the product is good it will be bought at the end as everyone here is for gameplay and not some kind of story which can be accessed in beta) but paradoxically it costs beta testers to join it. With current terms I'll move along for sure. But I'm afraid that's not what the devs would want at the end, right?

 

Honestly I would've paid $100 for a good implementation of VR in this game, and I think a lot of people would've pay at least $50 given the advantages it has over other sims. But what we have now is promises of a small team to deliver it for free with our help and a limiting beta, which sounds more risky than it could. It indeed starts to sound as some kind of Early Access investment thing as @messsucher is mentioning above - such approach works with over-hyped titles, where people just want to jump into something for whatever cost, but not sure it works in such a small community like this..

 

I'm not assuming everyone, but I could bet money that majority is exactly like this. After flying in VR going back to 2D works for very few and for specific reasons, most commonly physiological. My point here again is to expand the test base instead of cutting it short.

Hi Angry_Russian,

In my opinion and experience with developing other software applications.........................

 

The team supporting CLOD is small and getting VR feedback from inexperienced users would not be an efficient way to conduct the Beta test.

They would really benefit from experienced users that can test lots of different aircraft and mission scenario's.

 

To take inexperienced testers would mean a lot of "hand holding" when the new users encountered config and CLOD startup issues.

 

I actually own CLOD and Tobruk but consider my self too inexperienced to add much value to the beta test program.

 

I am really only interested in CLOD, when a fully tested released version of VR is available.  Wish the small and dedicated team every success with testing program and successful release of the VR version.

Edited February 6, 2022 by RAAF492SQNOz_Steve

[Angry_Russian]

20 minutes ago, RAAF492SQNOz_Steve said:

Hi Angry_Russian,

In my opinion and experience with developing other software applications.........................

 

The team supporting CLOD is small and getting VR feedback from inexperienced users would not be an efficient way to conduct the Beta test.

They would really benefit from experienced users that can test lots of different aircraft and mission scenario's.

 

To take inexperienced testers would mean a lot of "hand holding" when the new users encountered config and CLOD startup issues.

 

I actually own CLOD and Tobruk but consider my self to inexperienced to add much value to the beta test program.

 

I am rally only interested in CLOD, when a fully tested released version of VR is available.  Wish the small and dedicated team every success with testing program and successful release of the VR version.

Completely agree with you, relevant VR experience is important and picking the testers is the key. Maybe being a part of IL-2 franchise TFS could give access to IL-2 GB VR users? This way they'll get people who actually flies in VR on WW2 planes and have an idea of how should things be in VR to have enjoyable experience.

 

If I knew that a lot of people are behind this and success is guaranteed I wouldn't even post here and indeed waited for it to be released and bought it for whatever money asked. I just had a feeling that this is not the case and was thinking how can I help, hence my posting here. If that is not what is supported by community or considered reasonable by the devs that's totally fine, I'll just wait and see what they manage to pull out of it. Heck I'm waiting ED to fix VR clouds for almost a year already, still flying in 2.5.6 ?

Edited February 6, 2022 by Angry_Russian

[OrLoK]

ive *just* bought Tobruk to be able to enter the test.

 

I may well not get in.

 

But regardless of that, if they can add VR or even give it a good run as an attempt, then it will be worth the purchace.

 

If they fail for whatever reason, Im still happy to have supported them.

 

Even as a 2D player the original game never ran well for me, so this is a chance to have another go.

 

I wish them the best of luck and if they need my personal details or a few serial numbers, then im happy to supply them, theyre not a completely unknown quantity.

[Angry_Russian]

1 hour ago, OrLoK said:

ive *just* bought Tobruk to be able to enter the test.

 

I may well not get in.

 

But regardless of that, if they can add VR or even give it a good run as an attempt, then it will be worth the purchace.

 

If they fail for whatever reason, Im still happy to have supported them.

 

Even as a 2D player the original game never ran well for me, so this is a chance to have another go.

 

I wish them the best of luck and if they need my personal details or a few serial numbers, then im happy to supply them, theyre not a completely unknown quantity.

Yeah, I get you, I was thinking like that about DCS a year ago, was feeding on promises of new engine and VR improvement, but here we are. Since then I've bought many new modules for DCS supporting the devs but at the end I'm playing 2.5.6 because it's twice better in VR performance than a current version, and that is with a much bigger team than TFS. So I've promised myself that I'll stop paying untill I actually get something which works for me, and not only for the developer.

 

Actually the only game that really delivers in VR flight sims is IL-2 GB+FC, and I just really want this one to be another one. Here we have a developer who in contrary to ED acts like they really care about VR and trying to get people into making it better, so I hope they'll have more people like you to join the beta.

[OrLoK]

without going to offtopic, I dont thinkg that the DCS devs are doing to badly either.

 

I too have *lots* (20?) of paid modules but rarely play due to poor VR performance but I dont think they dont care, rather that VR isnt as easy to "optimise" as we wish it were!

 

We are spoiled by IL2 BoX's great VR performance, which *did* take a long time to get right tbh. Im sure in time we will see improvements in DCS and (fingers crossed) Blitz's.

 

I think we forum visitors are often far too harsh on the devs (im sure ive done it myself), we have to remember that the guys n gals, etc  who are part of the team are likely even more passionate than us because they have *far* more invested in the game than us!

 

If one cant/wont support a dev experiment, then thats fine but for me the risk is worth the cost, ymmv!

 

Devs are people too

[parisean]

I tried to send you a message but it said I had the right to only send "0" messages per day - any idea why? I have a Rift 2 and want to join in the fun

[Buzzsaw]

1 hour ago, parisean said:

I tried to send you a message but it said I had the right to only send "0" messages per day - any idea why? I have a Rift 2 and want to join in the fun

Please try again parisean.

 

Thanks for your interest.  ?

 

---

 

Thanks to everyone who has applied... huge response so far.  ?

 

Will be replying early this upcoming week.  ?

 

 

[Fast_toche]

Pour le numéro de série, je vois pas l'intérêt?

Qu'on m'explique...

Sinon je suis partant !

[Buzzsaw]

35 minutes ago, Fast_toche said:

Pour le numéro de série, je vois pas l'intérêt?

Qu'on m'explique...

Sinon je suis partant !

Parce que certaines marques de casques VR ont subi des changements mineurs mais importants entre les lots. Exemple serait le HP Reverb G2. Il existe maintenant 2 versions, la version originale et une version améliorée, mais les deux sont simplement étiquetées "G2". En suivant les S/N, les développeurs peuvent voir si les problèmes qui apparaissent lors des tests peuvent être isolés à des lots/versions spécifiques de casques.

 

Et aussi, nous recherchons les commentaires des testeurs.... donc lorsque vous postez vos commentaires, nous nous attendons à ce que vous y postiez également le type/modèle/numéro de série.

 

Enfin, nous ne voulons pas d'utilisateurs non-VR dans ce test... nous donnant des informations non pertinentes ou demandant des changements dans des domaines qui ne concernent pas la VR.

 

Nous voulons des joueurs qui ont de l'expérience avec la VR... des gens qui aiment la VR et qui sont motivés pour tester l'implémentation du jeu et confirmer où il y a des problèmes.

[BatSpoggy]

14 hours ago, 9./JG52_J-HAT said:

You realize he‘s not offering you anything, don‘t you? It‘s not early access in exchange for your „personal data“. As of the reason hasn‘t been explained above anyways.

Don‘t agree? Move along. Simple. 
 

That's what he said. He doesn't agree and he's moving along.

 

I don't like it either. Testing is me doing work that they would otherwise have to hire people to do. I don't mind doing that for free to help improve a product that I'm going to be using, but look at it like this hypothetical conversation:

 

Developer: "Hey do you mind testing my product? You won't be paid but your feedback will improve the product and as you're already using it that'll be to your benefit."

Me: "Sure, that sounds like a decent deal."

Developer: "Great, so I'm going to need you to supply a load of personal information first. Also, during the process I'm going to act like I'm doing you a favour and behave dismissively towards you while you're saving me a load of money in hiring testers."

Me: "Oh no, it just turns out that I have to wash my hair that day, toodles."

 

I can't see any reason whatsoever to need the serial numbers at the beginning. I can see why they might ask for it if a specific problem cropped up that looked to be related to different revisions of the headsets, but that can be dealt with at the time the problem is found, if one is ever found.

It's bad form to start making demands of people that you're asking to do work for you for free and who have no obligation to do so.

 

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

Guys, a serial number on a consumer product is not a fingerprint, social security number, or driver's license number. I care about freedom and privacy more than most people, but what's the big deal here?

 

I don't necessarily disagree or object however, that testers should be given a free copy of Tobruk if they don't already own it though.

Edited February 6, 2022 by -332FG-drewm3i-VR

[=420=Syphen]

4 minutes ago, BatSpoggy said:

work for you for free and who have no obligation to do so.

 

Hmm.. kind of eloquently summed up what Team Fusion started as. Volunteers working for free with a passion for the sim in those words.   

 

Buzzsaw did say above that they are having very large interest in the beta so the losing the few people convinced that TF is requesting serial numbers for nefarious reasons likely won't be a problem.

[BatSpoggy]

1 hour ago, =420=Syphen said:

 

Hmm.. kind of eloquently summed up what Team Fusion started as. Volunteers working for free with a passion for the sim in those words.   

 

Buzzsaw did say above that they are having very large interest in the beta so the losing the few people convinced that TF is requesting serial numbers for nefarious reasons likely won't be a problem.

I don't understand the relevance of what they started as. They're not working for free now, they're asking the community to work for free. That's fine with me unless I'm expected to jump through hoops.

 

[=420=Syphen]

5 minutes ago, BatSpoggy said:

I don't understand the relevance of what they started as. They're not working for free now, they're asking the community to work for free. That's fine with me unless I'm expected to jump through hoops.

 

 

Simply a musing.

 

No they aren't working for free, but this is still a side project and not a main career for the team. If you consider providing them with a serial number to be "jump(ing) through hoops", you likely aren't the person they are looking for to test out the VR functionality of CLoD/Tobruk.  

 

It's pretty amusing to me that people think a VR headset serial number is somehow an invasion of privacy or too much of an effort. Ah well. Horses for courses, eh? 

[paul_leonard]

Actually providing the serial number is really really hard.   The label is so small on my G2 that I haven't yet been able to take a proper picture of it yet, even with the camera on my iPhone 13!  I can barely make it out with the magnifier.  This beta testing work is proving tougher than I thought.  Phew.

[firdimigdi]

8 hours ago, -332FG-drewm3i-VR said:

I don't necessarily disagree or object however, that testers should be given a free copy of Tobruk if they don't already own it though.

 

If the devs are up to it, have time to manage this and if it allows for the fine-grained control required, they could set a steam playtest up:

 

https://steamcommunity.com/groups/steamworks/announcements/detail/2954884882167446258

 

That way people can test it for the duration the devs want and then they lose access and have to buy the game when testing is done; perhaps with a discount for testers to sweeten the deal or whatever.

[Voyager]

Out of curiosity, was there an idea when the first wave of confirmations goes out? 

[ITAF_Airone1989]

4 minutes ago, Voyager said:

Out of curiosity, was there an idea when the first wave of confirmations goes out? 

Every 75 applications

[OrLoK]

2 hours ago, ITAF_Airone1989 said:

Every 75 applications

I bet there's multiple waves too!

 

*snoopydance*

[J2_Steve]

Interesting reading this thread.

 

Seems to me they are "asking" for people to help test their VR implementation. Not telling people. Nobody is being forced. They have a criteria for testing and if you cant meet it then you are not suitable as testers.

If you don't want to give out your serial numbers or don't have the game , then the beta is not meant for you and you simply move on and wait for the update to be delivered. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Voyager]

6 hours ago, ITAF_Airone1989 said:

Every 75 applications

Thank you. 

 

Has the first wave already gone out? Trying to make sure I got my application in correctly. 

[9./JG52_J-HAT]

7 minutes ago, Voyager said:

Thank you. 

 

Has the first wave already gone out? Trying to make sure I got my application in correctly. 

I submitted mine a few minutes after this thread came up and haven‘t gotten any response yet. So I am guessing (if Buzzsaw is replying chronologically) no messages have gone out yet.

 

 

[Fast_toche]

17 hours ago, Buzzsaw said:

Parce que certaines marques de casques VR ont subi des changements mineurs mais importants entre les lots. Exemple serait le HP Reverb G2. Il existe maintenant 2 versions, la version originale et une version améliorée, mais les deux sont simplement étiquetées "G2". En suivant le S/N, les développeurs peuvent voir si les problèmes qui apparaissent lors des tests peuvent être isolés à des lots/versions spécifiques de casques.

 

Et aussi, nous recherchons les commentaires des testeurs.... donc lorsque vous postez vos commentaires, nous attendons à ce que vous y postiez également le type/modèle/numéro de série.

 

Enfin, nous ne voulons pas d'utilisateurs non-VR dans ce test... nous donnons des informations non pertinentes ou demandant des changements dans des domaines qui ne concernent pas la VR.

 

Nous voulons des joueurs qui ont de l'expérience avec la VR... des gens qui aiment la VR et qui sont motivés pour tester l'implémentation du jeu et confirmer où il y a des problèmes.

Merci pour les explications, je vous ai envoyé tout ça.

[furnac]

Trying to send you a direct message but I'm limited to 0 messages per day

[Goffik]

2 hours ago, J2_SteveF said:

Interesting reading this thread.

 

Seems to me they are "asking" for people to help test their VR implementation. Not telling people. Nobody is being forced. They have a criteria for testing and if you cant meet it then you are not suitable as testers.

If you don't want to give out your serial numbers or don't have the game , then the beta is not meant for you and you simply move on and wait for the update to be delivered. 

 

Indeed, the attitudes of some are a bit strange to say the least. "Intrusive data collection" was the phrase that made me laugh. ? Intrusive how? It's a request for those volunteering, not a demand on us all. And what exactly do people think can be done with a product serial number anyway? Someone might submit your warranty verification for you... oh no!! ?

 

Getting public volunteers to test your product is hardly a new concept either... Steam's Early Access programme, anyone? The point of both EA and this beta test is that they are entirely optional... you can join in, or not. Nobody is putting a gun to your head, so if you don't like the idea of helping create a better, less buggy product just because the devs will get money in the end and you won't... then don't bother. No big deal.

 

My only criticism (in the other thread) was limiting it to owners of the DLC, as I don't think it will produce the most dedicated VR testing team given that most of them will already be happy playing in 2D mode. But Buzzsaw's explanation of why this is the case (it would require multiple betas) does make sense, so that's fine by me. I'm happy to wait and see how it goes before making a purchase decision. ?