I've searched but found nothing re gunners.

[Panzerlang]

So, obvious question is obvious, lol...is there a mod that nerfs the gunners, regardless of their AI setting (novice to expert or whatever it is that governs them)?

TIA and fingers crossed. ?

[rieper_420]

Hello Hetzer-JG21

 

These are my private hacks I made for myself.

 

AI gunners are just a little more inaccurate with these values, not much.

Feel free to increase to have more 'nerfed' gunners

 

I just quickly put the files into an archive - this is not a full release - not fully tested etc.

 

I recommend using JSGME Mod Manager to install:

 

I changed the following parameters:

 

// // coefficient of conversion of the speed difference between the speeds of the object on which the turret and the target, in the aiming plane, into the error angles
ProjSpeedCoef = 0.08f; // org: 0.05

 

//  conversion factor of overload to aiming units
OverloadCoef = 0.04f; //org: 0.02f

 

//default aiming error rate
AddCoef = 0.075f; // org: 0.05

=> change this to a much bigger value and you will have the gunners shoot anywhere

 

 

will shoot shorter bursts

FireWaitTimeMin = 0.6f;    //org: 1.0
FireWaitTimeMax = 2.5f; //org: 2.0

 

 

// target search time, each period is checked, the more often - the more brakes naturally
// further than the search distance for AI levels, for example, Low AI does not perceive a target further than 400 meters - it does not see it, it is afraid, etc.

MaxSearchTime  = 1.3f; //org: 1.0

 

// 1 means: 1 AI target search per second => if you increase this to 5, the AI will search a new target every 5 seconds - this should save lots of AI CPU calculation time and make turret gunners very slow to react to anything.. I never tried that

 

 

Best regards

Rieper

 

PS: am I really the first guy who tried this? I am sure many fellow virtual pilots have some private hacky mods on their HDDs.

- I have another mod which increases AP power of most cannons to make tank hunting in IL-2 / Hs-129 a little easier and less frustrating for me

 

 

Bonus addon:

 I also have a mod which increases turret gunner ammo count (it is even possible to change the gun in the turrets ? )

 

 

Hack_BlindGunners.zip

Hack_MoreTurretAmmo.zip

Hack_BlindGunners.zip

Edited July 16, 2021 by rieper_420

[Beebop]

Hmmm,

Tried 'Blind Gunners'.  I have several mods enabled (clouds mod/historical markings/gui mute/icon mod) but no reported overwrites with the install.

Yet, while getting 107FPS it was a slow slideshow.  Unloaded the mod and back to smooth as butter flight.

Is there something I am missing?

Is there a parameter I should tweak?

 

I like the idea of having "Non-Force" gunners.

 

Test Setup:

QMB  Mission

Lapino Summer.

Noon.

No weather.

 

Edited July 16, 2021 by Beebop

[Napping-Man]

Same here.  Odd stutters with the Mod.  Actually tried the un-edited file extracted straight from the GTP files and it actually crashed the game.  Maybe we're treading where we shouldn't?

[rieper_420]

Hi all,

 

my fault. Uploaded wrong file. Please re-download

 

reason for stutters were incorrect (old) values here:

 

The correct values should be

SearchDistanceLow   = 0.57f;
SearchDistanceMed   = 0.73f;
SearchDistanceHigh  = 0.90f;
SearchDistanceAce   = 1.07f;

 

In the mod that caused the stutters, the SearchDistances were ~800 which should have caused the stutters.

 

 

I have added the file again to this post to avoid more confusion.

 

Sorry for the caused inconvenience.

 

@Napping-Man: I have not experienced any crashes while trying out the modification - weird

 

Download here also:

https://www.mediafire.com/file/vyz48cqvns8c8mb/Hack_BlindGunners.zip/file

 

 

Best regards

Rieper

 

Hack_BlindGunners.zip

Edited July 17, 2021 by rieper_420

[Napping-Man]

Cool, I'll give this one a try.  I don't know why it crashed.  It was just the unmodified file right from the GTP.  I was doing a head-on pass with a Halb, and right about the time he would have opened fire, SteamVR crashed (along with the game).  Coulda just been a fluke.

[Beebop]

E X C E L L E N T !!!

Runs smooth now.

Went against 4 Veteran He-111's in the Hurricane without the additional .303's.  Made the worst possible approach, directly on their six, and though I was shot down it took a lot longer and the hits were fewer at any given time.  I actually was able to knock one out of the air and cause another to drop their bombs.

I finally feel like I'm fighting more human AI and not Darth Vader's Horde.

Thank you for an excellent mod! 

[Beebop]

This is working wonderfully well with AI aircraft gunners but not so much, so far, with ground AAA and ship gunners.

I know, I know, I want it all.  IS that the way you designed this mod, A/C only?  It's OK if you did, I'm just curious.  If not, again, is there some 'adjustment' I should look at in the file(s)?

 

Also, check you PM's please).

Edited July 17, 2021 by Beebop

[rieper_420]

the mod is currently for aircraft gunners only for now. I will release a more refined & adjustable version during this weekend.

 

will provide mods for:

+ BlindPlaneGunners: adjustable also for specific aircraft (e.g. make the famous Pe-2 rear gunners less accurate)

+ BlindFlak

+ BlindShipFlak

 

+ more powerful 23/30/37mm AP ammo

Edited July 17, 2021 by rieper_420

[Beebop]

THANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOU !!!!!

[rieper_420]

Dear fellow virtual pilots,

 

please check the mods for download here:

 

@Hetzer-JG51: since the original query came from your side, I am looking forward to your feedback if the modification meets your expectations or if further adaptions are necessary. I am available to support the further refinement of the AI's accuracy to maintain the balance between realism & personal frustration tolerance.

 

Best regards

Rieper

[Panzerlang]

Thanks for your work on this Rieper.
I'm currently in the 'Ace of Aces' comp so I can't use the mods at the moment. There's also the following query...

Pat's generator forces all multi-crew planes to be 'Novice' unless their class is 'Fighter'. So in Flying Circus, where Bristols are fighters, we observed that the Bristol gunners must have been on Ace setting and their gunners were Star Wars arcade level snipers. They were also wearing titanium armor (effectively, not literally obviously, before somebody comes along and accuses me of "lying", lol). Also immune to G forces and fire. As a result I've stopped playing Flying Circus, which is a shame as I've backed it by buying both volumes.
 On the WW2 eastern front the only time we've had serious issues with IL2s and Pe2s is saddling up on them at 6 o'clock. Off-angle attacks, especially from above (diving onto them vertically) and they have difficulty landing a single hit. How does your mod encompass the game's skill settings? Is it like an extra layer applied to the novice ~ ace setting of each crew?

TIA advance for more insight on how these work.

Edited July 18, 2021 by Hetzer-JG51

[rieper_420]

Hello Hetzer-JG51

 

A hearty "Horrido" on your success so far in "Ace of Aces" competition and a big thanks to Pat Wilson for his awesome PWCG!

 

regarding your specific mentions I would recommend the following:

 

Topic1: Bristol "Ace setting and their gunners were Star Wars arcade level snipers."

 

explanation:

The accuracy of Ace level is really high in the default turretcontrollerai.txt:

 

// coefficients for the dependence of the final shooting area on the AI ??level
CoefLow        = 20.0f;
CoefMed        = 5.0f; //org: 3.0
CoefHigh    = 2.2f; //org: 1.0
CoefAce        = 1.5f; //org: 0.5

 

=> so the coefficient 0.5 was causing the Bristol gunners to be super accurate.

 

Proposed solution:

You can simply create a new file named turretcontrollerai_Bristol.txt and change the parameters e.g. to:

 

CoefLow       = 20.0f;
CoefMed        = 20.0f;
CoefHigh    = 20f;
CoefAce        = 20f;

 

=> That way, the turret AI will have inaccuracy coefficient of 20 (novice level) regardless of the AI skill level.

 

=> then, go to the files botgunner_bff2b*.txt and change the line to

Controller="LuaScripts/WorldObjects/Bots/turretcontrollerai_Bristol.txt"

 

=> that way, you have a custom turretcontrollerai_Bristol just for the Bristol planes

 

Topic2: titanium armor

 

Proposed solution:

again, go to the files botgunner_bff2b*.txt and change the following lines

I suggest to reduce the LifeRate and HeadLifeRate even further for testing to see if this affects the gunners.

I would simpley reduce LifeRate to 100 and LifeRateFrag to 300 and see what happens... (same for HeadLifeRate)

 

// Damage model
Armor=0 // толщина брони
LifeRate=350 // Масштаб пулевых и фугасных повреждений
LifeRateFrag=1000 // Масштаб осколочных повреждений
HeadConvexPrefix="Head" // Префикс имени конвекса колижена головы
HeadArmor=0 // толщина брони головы
HeadLifeRate=170 // Масштаб пулевых и фугасных повреждений головы
HeadLifeRateFrag=440 // Масштаб осколочных повреждений головы
Firing=1 // Минимальное значение поджигания у средства поражения для зажигания объекта
DestroyDelay=15 // задержка на удаление объекта после смерти
MinEjectAlt=10 // ограничение на минимальную высоту выпрыгивания

 

I hope I was able to explain the steps in an understandable way without knowing your technical background

 

Best regards

Rieper

 

[Retnek]

On 7/17/2021 at 11:03 AM, rieper_420 said:

the mod is currently for aircraft gunners only for now. I will release a more refined & adjustable version during this weekend.

...

Rieper, this is one of the most important mods for the IL2-series, finally! Afaik no-one discussed the effects of those values. From the very beginning that Star-Wars-gunnery of the light AAA was THE immersion-killer for mud-movers. At least for people who read some books about WW2-strafing. Neither 777-studios nor most of the mission-designers cared for the AAA-pain. Now there's a way. Thank you!

[Panzerlang]

Thankyou Rieper, superb clarification and I'll see how it works on those little UFO mofos. ?

33 minutes ago, Retnek said:

Rieper, this is one of the most important mods for the IL2-series, finally! Afaik no-one discussed the effects of those values. From the very beginning that Star-Wars-gunnery of the light AAA was THE immersion-killer for mud-movers. At least for people who read some books about WW2-strafing. Neither 777-studios nor most of the mission-designers cared for the AAA-pain. Now there's a way. Thank you!

Indeed, quite amazing to discover how easy it has been all along for the devs to address these glaring deficiencies but yet have done nothing despite, literally, YEARS of complaints. I'm genuinely baffled why they chose to leave something unfixed that has undoubtedly, in my opinion, driven away scores of players and lost them even more sales by word of mouth. Just WHY?! ?

Which leads me to a thought...just as we have single-player options for all kinds of aids and nerfs in the realism panel, why wasn't/isn't there one for 'tuning' gunners? Options are life, as has often been declared by players. Give US the choice in a game we have bought with OUR hard-earned wonga. No?

Edited July 18, 2021 by Hetzer-JG51

[Angry_Kitten]

The AI gunners really are a pain however if you fly enough single player time.. 

 

The AI     has the appearance of getting increased during the session. 

 

IE   start out with novice, and by the 12 plane in that session, they are shooting about at the "average" setting. 

 

  tonight i couldnt even GET the b25 gunners to shoot at me until i was shooting on my 4th plane.  8th managed to put a few into my engine compartment with no impact on me, but the 10th or eleventh damaged my lil engine giving me an oil leak, and shot my wing a few times, and oddly took one wheel off. but i finished 11 and 12 with my 131.