More different collector planes

[76IAP-Black]

What i would like to discuss is, would it make sense to create more collector planes? 

I would agree for the companies point of view and the players perspective.

 

New technologies could be implemented with the development of the new collector planes.

 

My two cents

 

 

Edited May 19, 2021 by 76IAP-Black

[Lord_Strange]

I agree. Proper mechanics for photo/radio reconnaissance would allow for more unique planes like the Fw 189 (as well as giving us another use for the U2-VS).

 

However for now I think the team has its hands full with BoN and their partners with FC volume 2 and the German flak vehicle. But in the future it would be nice to see another collector plane that isn't a fighter.

[DBFlyguy]

More collector AIRCAFT are always welcome!

 

 

Edited May 19, 2021 by DBFlyguy

[Bremspropeller]

Like a proper pea for tea.

[76IAP-Black]

From the sales perspective, it makes sense to enlarge the variety of collector planes. 
- Training planes
- Sea planes
- two seaters
- cargo planes
I even believe they could sell Cargo Trucks for 10$ each, or jeeps. Just to drive around the landscape 
 

[DBFlyguy]

2 hours ago, 76IAP-Black said:

From the sales perspective, it makes sense to enlarge the variety of collector planes. 
- Training planes
- Sea planes
- two seaters
- cargo planes
I even believe they could sell Cargo Trucks for 10$ each, or jeeps. Just to drive around the landscape 
 

 

I was with you until ...Cargo Trucks ? The sooner this misadventure of ground vehicles in a combat FLIGHT sim is over, the better, especially at the cost (time, money and staff resources) that should be used for the 100s of WWI & WWII aircraft we could have instead.  I'd buy literally ANY WWII collector AIRCRAFT that is announced.  Leave the ground combat stuff to where it makes sense and is done well from the ground up like ARMA, Squad, Hell Let Loose etc.... yeah, I get some folks are fans of it... just not my cup of tea when there are better options mentioned already thriving.  WWI and WWII air combat is the strength of Great Battles.

Edited May 19, 2021 by DBFlyguy

[76IAP-Black]

It is about financing the company and provide fun to the player base. It is a nice idea and i wouldn't call it misadventure, maybe an interesting feature.

Sadly you can't finance it the way Star Citizen is, but you can provide fun stuff to the crowd! With different Cargo options, resupply airfields, field camps etc 

[Bremspropeller]

On 5/19/2021 at 7:27 PM, DBFlyguy said:

I was with you until ...Cargo Trucks ? The sooner this misadventure of ground vehicles in a combat FLIGHT sim is over, the better, especially at the cost (time, money and staff resources) that should be used for the 100s of WWI & WWII aircraft we could have instead.  I'd buy literally ANY WWII collector AIRCRAFT that is announced. 

 

THIS!

 

Ran out of likes for the day - and this needs more than one.

[Rodwonder]

On 5/19/2021 at 1:27 PM, DBFlyguy said:

 

I was with you until ...Cargo Trucks ? The sooner this misadventure of ground vehicles in a combat FLIGHT sim is over, the better, especially at the cost (time, money and staff resources) that should be used for the 100s of WWI & WWII aircraft we could have instead.  I'd buy literally ANY WWII collector AIRCRAFT that is announced.  Leave the ground combat stuff to where it makes sense and is done well from the ground up like ARMA, Squad, Hell Let Loose etc.... yeah, I get some folks are fans of it... just not my cup of tea when there are better options mentioned already thriving.  WWI and WWII air combat is the strength of Great Battles.

 

1 minute ago, Rodwonder said:

 

I second this!!! 

 

I second this!!

27 minutes ago, Bremspropeller said:

 

THIS!

 

Ran out of likes for the day - and this needs more than one.

Me too!!

[itsbillyfrazier]

I think the additional ground vehicles have been a welcome addition to the sim. Afterall, didn't we get the DVD/ tactical codes tech as a direct result of the devs branching out into this area? 

 

I dont think il-2 will ever become a full scale combined arms sim, not sure I would want that either.

 

But the new additions to the sim will drive additional revenue streams and bring new players. This can only be a good thing in my eyes. 

 

Pretty certain the devs understand that the flight sim side of things remains their bread and butter, but realise there's an opportunityto expand a little into new areas and are doing so tentativly. We should all benefit from this IMO.

Edited May 23, 2021 by itsbillyfrazier

[Bremspropeller]

On 5/19/2021 at 7:57 PM, 76IAP-Black said:

It is about financing the company and provide fun to the player base

 

Yeah, but you could do that with good choices of collector's planes, too.

 

Start with low hanging fruits, like un-porking the P-40E by giving it proper, western allied gas and engine-limitations. And add a couple of western loadouts.

[DBFlyguy]

35 minutes ago, itsbillyfrazier said:

I think the additional ground vehicles have been a welcome addition to the sim. Afterall, didn't we get the DVD/ tactical codes tech as a direct result of the devs branching out into this area? 

 

I dont think il-2 will ever become a full scale combined arms sim, not sure I would want that either.

 

But the new additions to the sim will drive additional revenue streams and bring new players. This can only be a good thing in my eyes. 

 

Pretty certain the devs understand that the flight sim side of things remains their bread and butter, but realise there's an opportunityto expand a little into new areas and are doing so tentativly. We should all benefit from this IMO.

I hear you but I just don't believe DVD and tactical codes couldn't have been developed by that same "separate team" as a project for the aircraft alone.  If the desire is additional revenue, then use that team to create the collector aircraft folks have been asking for, even if there isn't a direct applicable map for the aircraft...ie Corsair & Zero. I think doing both of those aircraft as separate collector aircraft would go a LONG way into earning back some goodwill for folks that have been here a lot longer than I have waiting for literally any PTO themed content. There are also tons of other aircraft that make more sense and have more demand than collector trucks and (dear god I hope its not this latest "tease"...) boats.

[itsbillyfrazier]

I'm all for new collector planes too, but think we should keep an open mind re: adding some additional ground vehicles.

 

Clearly the majority of us want more aircraft, but there is a case for adding a select few additional ground vehicles too IMO.

 

 @76IAP-Black idea of adding a cargo truck or Jeep isn't a bad  idea at all and I'm assuming would be easier/quicker to develop than say the GAZ or new tanks.

 

I could see these two additions greatly enhancing the gameplay experience for MP at least (Although maybe not so much  for SP....)

 

13 minutes ago, DBFlyguy said:

(dear god I hope its not this latest "tease"...) boats.

I agree, I would assume adding boats would require a great deal of resources to implement properly with probably little ROI for the Devs or users tbh.

[6./ZG26_5tuka]

1 hour ago, DBFlyguy said:

If the desire is additional revenue, then use that team to create the collector aircraft folks have been asking for, even if there isn't a direct applicable map for the aircraft...ie Corsair & Zero.

More harm than good. Look at the other big sim studio providing aircraft without any applicable theatre. People rightfully complain about their missing inclusiveness into the whole sim.

 

The current marketing model is allright. Big addons for safe sales, collector planes for extra revenue and other collector vehicles now and than for experimentation and market studies. Sure more flexibility and progressiveness would be great to have but how many people would enjoy flying a A6M Zero over Russia or France against allied opponents it never met?

 

Ground vehicles are very difficult to make fit into a flight sim. Not only because their complexability has to match the high standards of the aircraft modeling but also because of the great scales of the map and comparetively little use of non combat oriented vehicles in general.

 

My personal wishlist includes:

 

Float planes / flying boats, torpedo bombers, more special variants of existing aircraft (like Mig-3 with AM-38 engine, P-40F, Ju-87 D5), fully incooperated reconissence aircraft with spotting and artillery guidance mechanics and maybe some oddballs like the Su-2 and He-112 which don't fit into existing addons yet took part in the battles.

Edited May 23, 2021 by 6./ZG26_5tuka

[DBFlyguy]

1 hour ago, 6./ZG26_5tuka said:

More harm than good. Look at the other big sim studio providing aircraft without any applicable theatre. People rightfully complain about their missing inclusiveness into the whole sim.

 

The current marketing model is allright. Big addons for safe sales, collector planes for extra revenue and other collector vehicles now and than for experimentation and market studies. Sure more flexibility and progressiveness would be great to have but how many people would enjoy flying a A6M Zero over Russia or France against allied opponents it never met?

 

Ground vehicles are very difficult to make fit into a flight sim. Not only because their complexability has to match the high standards of the aircraft modeling but also because of the great scales of the map and comparetively little use of non combat oriented vehicles in general.

 

My personal wishlist includes:

 

Float planes / flying boats, torpedo bombers, more special variants of existing aircraft (like Mig-3 with AM-38 engine, P-40F, Ju-87 D5), fully incooperated reconissence aircraft with spotting and artillery guidance mechanics and maybe some oddballs like the Su-2 and He-112 which don't fit into existing addons yet took part in the battles.

Admittedly the Zero would be a harder sale but DCS sales of modules like the MiG 15 & F-86 seem to be doing just fine without a Korea map, there's even user and payware campaigns for both available.  Folks forget at the end of the day, we are playing pretend with these games anyway, if campaign makers can come up with ways to use modules, I don't see the harm in making them available if they sale.

 

Ground vehicles are definitely a difficult fit into a flight sim.  Ground combat needs to be something that is designed from the ground up, not as an add-on to a flight sim.  I know the devs of Tank Crew work very hard on the product but the fidelity for things like the terrain as an example just isn't there when compared to other products on the market like an Arma...Squad...Hell Let Loose...etc where ground combat is the main feature.  It makes more sense to make a flight sim out of a ground sim then vice versa.

 

I definitely agree with a lot of your wishlist, making additional variants of previously released aircraft seems like a no-brainer...

Edited May 23, 2021 by DBFlyguy

[LukeFF]

15 minutes ago, DBFlyguy said:

Admittedly the Zero would be a harder sale but DCS sales of modules like the MiG 15 & F-86 seem to be doing just fine without a Korea map, there's even user and payware campaigns for both available.  Folks forget at the end of the day, we are playing pretend with these games anyway, if campaign makers can come up with ways to use modules, I don't see the harm in making them available if they sale.

 

ROFL - DCS is hardly a good example to use about what aircraft and maps to buy - and the relative dearth of single-player content for them proves it. Only a tiny minority of players would be happy flying a Zero and/or Wildcat here over Western Europe, and I absolutely guarantee on day one those planes were released, the forums would be flooded with players asking "where are the campaigns & missions for these two planes?"

 

Just because one sim has anachronistic map and aircraft setups doesn't mean it's a good example for other sims to emulate.

Edited May 23, 2021 by LukeFF

[Bremspropeller]

16 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

Only a tiny minority of players would be happy flying a Zero and/or Wildcat here over Western Europe, and I absolutely guarantee on day one those planes were released, the forums would be flooded with players asking "where are the campaigns & missions for these two planes?"

 

They're kinda fixing that with the Mariannas map and the upcoming Corsair.

Not a great fix, but a fix nonetheless. What's still un-fixed is the lack of a Zero, though

 

 

DCS and BoX and CloD are all not perfect - each for different reasons. But then again, which game ever is?

[DBFlyguy]

2 hours ago, Bremspropeller said:

 

They're kinda fixing that with the Mariannas map and the upcoming Corsair.

Not a great fix, but a fix nonetheless. What's still un-fixed is the lack of a Zero, though

 

 

DCS and BoX and CloD are all not perfect - each for different reasons. But then again, which game ever is?

 

An AI Zero is coming with the Corsair along with the Essex carrier I believe.  Nineline has also hinted that the Hellcat will probably be next after the Mosquito and Wags recently confirmed in an podcast interview that they will be doing Japanese WWII era assets for the WWII version of the Marianas map eventually as well. 

2 hours ago, LukeFF said:

 

ROFL - DCS is hardly a good example to use about what aircraft and maps to buy - and the relative dearth of single-player content for them proves it. Only a tiny minority of players would be happy flying a Zero and/or Wildcat here over Western Europe, and I absolutely guarantee on day one those planes were released, the forums would be flooded with players asking "where are the campaigns & missions for these two planes?"

 

Just because one sim has anachronistic map and aircraft setups doesn't mean it's a good example for other sims to emulate.

As far as a Corsair (never mentioned the Wildcat) and Zero, there is no evidence saying those would sale any less than collector ground vehicles.  The Corsair had a small role in the ETO and the Zero is just an iconic aircraft, plus it would be something for those that have been asking for any kind of PTO content for years.  DCS is by no means perfect, I hate their early access model, I still prefer Great Battle as a game over it, but to say there is nothing that can be learned or taken from DCS is a bit myopic.

 

Personally, I'd like to see more ETO or MTO centric collectors aircraft like scout and bomber aircraft as well as more variants of released aircraft. Oh and a FLYABLE C-47 and/or B-25

[PatrickAWlson]

14 hours ago, itsbillyfrazier said:

I'm all for new collector planes too, but think we should keep an open mind re: adding some additional ground vehicles.

 

Clearly the majority of us want more aircraft, but there is a case for adding a select few additional ground vehicles too IMO.

 

 

The kind of ground vehicle that I want most has two legs and holds a rifle.

12 hours ago, LukeFF said:

 

ROFL - DCS is hardly a good example to use about what aircraft and maps to buy - and the relative dearth of single-player content for them proves it. Only a tiny minority of players would be happy flying a Zero and/or Wildcat here over Western Europe, and I absolutely guarantee on day one those planes were released, the forums would be flooded with players asking "where are the campaigns & missions for these two planes?"

 

Just because one sim has anachronistic map and aircraft setups doesn't mean it's a good example for other sims to emulate.

 

I used the Stalingrad and Rhine maps as stand ins for Eastern Front 1944 and 1945 to allow an end of war Russian career.  I think maybe two people have used it  . Not too many people want a stand in.

 

I think there is still plenty of ground to cover using the existing model.  I was pushing France 1940 awhile back.  North Africa, Italy, Battle of Britain, Bagration, Berlin - all could be done with the map and 10 planes model, especially if 1C was willing to ease up on the five planes per side concept.  Do Bagration or Berlin and fill it with Russian planes.  

 

Anyhow, it takes multiple people on a team to make the planes, and my guess is that the whole crew is involved in the pipeline for Normandy at the moment.  

[Eisenfaustus]

4 hours ago, PatrickAWlson said:

Do Bagration or Berlin and fill it with Russian planes.  

NOOOOOO!!!!!!!11111 We NEEEEEED the Bf 109 G10 more than ANYTHING else!!!!!!!!!1111

 

Just kidding of course - but there are indeed some German planes left for a late war eastern front I'd really love to get in this sim: Ju 188, Do 217, Ju 87 D-5, Fw 190 A-9 and in total spite of it's historic insignificance: Ta 152 H-1.

ANd yes I actually would also like to have a G10 at some point

 

5 hours ago, PatrickAWlson said:

I was pushing France 1940 awhile back.

I'd preorder this day one ^^

[[CPT]Crunch]

Well, if the ground vehicle development leads to the point where there's a smart ground war going on with infantry, it makes it all worth it, something that's sorely missing in this ground attack focused flight sim.