Reasons for not buying Quest2 or Quest3... for IL-2

March 13, 2021

- The battery of Quest2 (like original Quest) add a weight in the front that other dedicated PC-VR headsets like Reverb G2 don´t suffer. This is problematic for long playing sessions.

- Because the image has to be compressed (USB cable bandwidth) the quality of the image is less good than a native resolution, here you can compare the same view for G2 and Quest2.

The compression also introduces a color banding issues mentioned in the video which is not present in other headsets which uses a proper DP cable and no compression.

- The compression/decompression process add an extra latency to the moving objects and you will see some ghosting of fast moving objects. you can see that by looking at the moving F1 cars in the right side. With the Index there is no ghosting.

https://youtu.be/ny_OPsxHQmU?t=253

- The default headstrap is simple a joke, be aware that to have a minimum comfort you will need the Elite strap, so add 49$ to the bill

- Also be aware that not all USB cables has the same bandwidth, and that´s why the original has a higher cost (in addition to the brand), so add 79$ to the bill to be sure you are not limited.
https://www.reddit.com/r/OculusQuest/comments/fz2r0p/oculus_link_speed_tests_of_usb_link_cables/

- The IPD adjustment of Quest2 has only 3 positions. So you might be lucky if your IPD lays on those positions, but other PC-VR headsets has an slider to adjust more precisely the IPD. Be aware of this.

- And you will need to add some more cash for some good headphones to be on pair with the G2 or Index. They don´t touch your ears, and this is sooo good.

- You should also know that the price of the Quest2 is subsidized by Facebook, you will wonder why. The answer is easy, Facebook wants your data. It is as simple as that. You are obliged to enter Facebook.
Here I would suggest people to watch a couple of documentaries "The social dilemma" and "the great hack", and think about it, specially if you have kids.

But if all the reasons above are not enough, I will give you three more:

- Facebook destroyed the original soul of Oculus (all founders are not there anymore) which always put the PC-VR in the center. Remember Oculus Connect 3 in Oct-2016, when Abrash predicted 4Kx4K per eye with 140FOV for 2021???

- Facebook literally don´t care about the PC-VR enthusiast people (exactly the same people who back them for the kickstarter DK1) and don´t care about the requirements for PC simulators (Flight, Space, Race) which is high resolution, big FOV and comfort.

- IL-2 Great Battles is a PC sim. Its business is based in the PC (either monitor or VR). This is exactly the business which is neglected by Facebook.

If after all you buy a Quest2, that´s fine. You took an informed decission and you will also have a great time.

Edited:

I just found a video that explain much better some of the advices I was pointing out:

Edited March 16, 2021 by chiliwili69

March 13, 2021

Lol ok - I am not a fan of Oculus anymore either as is evidenced by my no longer using an Oculus device, but going by what I am seeing across the various forums there are a lot of happy Quest 2 owners out there that use their device either through Oculus Link or wireless with Virtual Desktop to play flight sims and other PC-VR games.

This is a good thing for VR overall.

And if FB/Oculus gets VR more into the mainstream with them going after the social aspect, all of VR industry will benefit as well.

Plus the cost of entry is more appealing for Quest 2 which helps more individuals get into VR. Again that is not a bad thing.

Heck I even tried out Oculus Link with my original Quest with flight sims, and it did a darn good job all things considered. I probably spent about 8 hours or so gaming with the Quest via Link for PC-games. And undoubtedly the Link technology has improved since then, when I tried it was right after official release of it into beta.

As is evidenced by the number of posters new into VR with Quest 2 and Link on the various flight and racing forums - this is a good thing for the VR industry. Oculus is not for me any longer but I am grateful they are focusing on growing the industry.

Edited March 13, 2021 by dburne

March 13, 2021

Some children are happy to play with a stick and an old bicycle tire too.

Edited March 13, 2021 by SCG_Fenris_Wolf

March 14, 2021

23 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

- The battery of Quest2 (like original Quest) add a weight in the front that other dedicated PC-VR headsets like Reverb G2 don´t suffer. This is problematic for long playing sessions.

- Because the image has to be compressed (USB cable bandwidth) the quality of the image is less good than a native resolution, here you can compare the same view for G2 and Quest2.

The compression also introduces a color banding issues mentioned in the video which is not present in other headsets which uses a proper DP cable and no compression.

- The compression/decompression process add an extra latency to the moving objects and you will see some ghosting of fast moving objects. you can see that by looking at the moving F1 cars in the right side. With the Index there is no ghosting.

https://youtu.be/ny_OPsxHQmU?t=253

- The default headstrap is simple a joke, be aware that to have a minimum comfort you will need the Elite strap, so add 49$ to the bill

- Also be aware that not all USB cables has the same bandwidth, and that´s why the original has a higher cost (in addition to the brand), so add 79$ to the bill to be sure you are not limited.
https://www.reddit.com/r/OculusQuest/comments/fz2r0p/oculus_link_speed_tests_of_usb_link_cables/

- And you will need to add some more cash for some good headphones to be on pair with the G2 or Index. They don´t touch your ears, and this is sooo good.

- You should also know that the price of the Quest2 is subsidized by Facebook, you will wonder why. The answer is easy, Facebook wants your data. It is as simple as that. You are obliged to enter Facebook.
Here I would suggest people to watch a couple of documentaries "The social dilemma" and "the great hack", and think about it, specially if you have kids.

But if all the reasons above are not enough, I will give you three more:

- Facebook destroyed the original soul of Oculus (all founders are not there anymore) which always put the PC-VR in the center. Remember Oculus Connect 3 in Oct-2016, when Abrash predicted 4Kx4K per eye with 140FOV for 2021???

- Facebook literally don´t care about the PC-VR enthusiast people (exactly the same people who back them for the kickstarter DK1) and don´t care about the requirements for PC simulators (Flight, Space, Race) which is high resolution, big FOV and comfort.

- IL-2 Great Battles is a PC sim. Its business is based in the PC (either monitor or VR). This is exactly the business which is neglected by Facebook.

If after all you buy a Quest2, that´s fine. You took an informed decission and you will also have a great time.

Have you tried a Quest 2? I have both headsets. Tyriel's side by side gauge comparison in DCS may not be accurate anymore with the updates they have made. I find the gauges in IL2 on the Quest 2 with some supersampling to be very, very close to the Reverb G2. It is true that the headset is heavier due to the battery and hardware but I would say that the build quality of the Oculus is superior, the Reverb G2 feels more like a cheap toy. As for the ghosting, I have disabled ASW on the OQ2 and I find the image smoother. This is using open composite and Oculus tray tool to tweak settings, which sounds complicated but it is really simple, maybe more tuning is available than with WMR? I am not sure how you can tune the G2. There are available add on braces for the original strap which are really more than adequate for $15 on the jungle website, same for aftermarket link cables ($15). I have my bandwidth cranked to max in Oculus tray tool and I have noticed no issues at sane settings however I did notice image artifacts and lag at 400% SS, so yes there is a limit to USB and the decompression but I do not think it is limiting very much for this generation of GPUs (I'm on a 3090). I do agree with you on the Facebook issues but I just created a burner account to log in one time and that is all that is required at this time. I also agree with Oculus' direction changing from PC vr is a shame. Lastly my G2 had a bad speaker out of the box and the cable broke after 3 months of moderate to light use. It is now a paperweight as they have no cables in stock and don't know when they will. The Quest 2 does not have these issues. I also find it to 'just work' out of the box, a stark contrast to the G2 although I have usb issues with and AMD b550 chipset. I can thoroughly recommend the Quest2 for IL2.

Edit: I will most likely attempt to go back to the G2 for the image quality when I can get a cable and the AMD USB fix is out.

Edited March 14, 2021 by 6./ZG26_Saker
Added info

March 14, 2021

I have the q2 (1st experience with vr) and I like it. I am currently limited because I can’t get out of my 1080 thanks to the bs gpu situation so settings are conservative to get decent performance. But even with the reduced settings my gauges look nothing like that pic. They look clear and sharp. Things outide the cockpit are not as good. They are not as crisp as inside but considering the reduced resolution and ss I have to use for now it still looks good enough that I don’t play without the q2 anymore.

Overall the q2 is a good set and delivers a nice experience and when one considers the price it’s hard to beat. I’m sure the g2 offers better visuals but how much better from what I’ve seen around the net is debatable. Dismissing it outright largely because of the tech that makes it go doesn’t feel like it offers a complete or accurate assessment.

Edited March 14, 2021 by TheSNAFU

March 14, 2021

March 15, 2021

19 hours ago, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

Have you tried a Quest 2?

No, I don´t have it. I didn´t buy it because the Facebook thing. I had the DK1, DK2, Rift-CV1, RiftS(on office) and Quest. But I stopped buying Oculus when they imposed the Facebook thing. Which I consider it was not necessary. But I tried the Quest2 in a shop and it was having the same front weight problem than the Quest. And it is a problem of future Quests unless they mount the baterry in the back side instead of puttin it at front.

19 hours ago, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

I find the gauges in IL2 on the Quest 2 with some supersampling to be very, very close to the Reverb G2

Through lens pictures eliminates subjectivities, it wold be good if you can show some through the lens pictures of G2 vs Quest2 as I did for G2, Index and others.

19 hours ago, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

the build quality of the Oculus is superior, the Reverb G2 feels more like a cheap toy

I think the build quality of the original Quest was better than this new Quest2. How you can say the build quality of the Quest2 strap is better than the G2 strap, or face pad, or audio. Here you are being a bit subjetive.

March 15, 2021

19 hours ago, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

As for the ghosting, I have disabled ASW on the OQ2 and I find the image smoother

That ghosting has nothing to do with the ASW, it is something inherent to the compression of moving objects.

They are similar to the compression algorithms for static images. For example, the jpeg format uses the FastFourierTransform (FFT for 2D) to convert images to the spatial frequency domain and eliminate there the freqs which are mostly not detected by our eyes and then apply again the InverseFFT2D. So size is reduced dramatically. But it is a tradeoff of quality vs size. With movies it is the same, but here you add and extra dimension which is the time, so you use FFT3 and eliminate spatial frequencies and temporal frequencies, and that is used in all streaming and movies codecs like H264 or many other. But its a question of eliminating details in the static image and also eliminate details in how that image change along the time. So it is also a tradeoff of quality versus size (here bandwidth).

25 year ago I was working for more than a year using FFT4 in C code to simulate turbulent flows applied to computer graphics. Those algorithms are basically the same today with somew tweaking.

But the net result is that you have ghosting because the amount of data going through the USB cable is limited. And the comnpress/decompress process add latency. There is no miracles. So you have this:

20 hours ago, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

I do agree with you on the Facebook issues but I just created a burner account to log in one time and that is all that is required at this time. I also agree with Oculus' direction changing from PC vr is a shame

This is interesting. I thought that Facebook really wanted to avoid fake accounts. And they conduct an identification process to be sure you are you. What is exactly a burner account? (Just in case Oculus produces a 140FOV and 4Kx4K per eye for PC-VR in future...)

March 15, 2021

Oculus ASW when active will most definitely create ghosting of the plane as it flies by. Same as Steam VR and Motion Smoothing.

However I find Steam VR does a better job with it, it is sometimes hardly noticeable.

Edited March 15, 2021 by dburne

March 15, 2021

2 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

No, I don´t have it. I didn´t buy it because the Facebook thing. I had the DK1, DK2, Rift-CV1, RiftS(on office) and Quest. But I stopped buying Oculus when they imposed the Facebook thing. Which I consider it was not necessary. But I tried the Quest2 in a shop and it was having the same front weight problem than the Quest. And it is a problem of future Quests unless they mount the baterry in the back side instead of puttin it at front.

Through lens pictures eliminates subjectivities, it wold be good if you can show some through the lens pictures of G2 vs Quest2 as I did for G2, Index and others.

I think the build quality of the original Quest was better than this new Quest2. How you can say the build quality of the Quest2 strap is better than the G2 strap, or face pad, or audio. Here you are being a bit subjetive.

Unfortunately I am on mobile so it would be too time consuming to construct a good quality post. I did say "I would say" that the build quality is inferior. My left speaker was doa on my G2 and the headstrap plastic creaks like it is on the edge of failure every time I take it off. Sure the quest strap is not great but also probably won't fail (or cause the data cable to fail by acting as a pinch point on it as the G2 strap does). The quest 2's facepad is less comfortable. I think because it needs to be tighter on your face and head to compensate for the weight. I do not have a high quality DSLR in a mannequin head to take through the lens pictures as Tyriel does. I can just say I think the side by side picture may be out of date as there has been updates to the quest pertaining to USB bandwidth and encode/ refresh rate I believe since Tyriel captured those pictures in F1/DCS. I am not sure what causes it but for example zooming in while looking at fast moving planes I have noticed warping effects in the G2 that I am well used to in my CV1/Rift S. These are not present with my settings in oculus tray tool with the quest 2. I am unsure if I can stop this behavior with WMR. I am not up the the technical knowledge you are but I did watch his videos and was on the fence about buying a quest 2 to use until HP sends me parts. I was thinking about returning it and buying a second G2 based on all the negative points you have mentioned against the quest 2 in this thread. I was very pleasantly surprised and happy I use it. I even made a thread about it recommending the Quest2. I very seldom create threads. It works so well in my opinion that I seriously debate even going back to the G2. I will just wait until HP gets me a cable and the new Bios that hopefully fixes the severe USB issues I have with the G2. It is quite funny that the Oculus has no issues with USB. I have tried multiple ports and they all work while my G2 only works 90% of the time only on one port.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I just felt that your original post could use some input from someone who owns both because I was very put off by all the negative points that you have made when I was making my decision.

March 15, 2021

12 minutes ago, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

Unfortunately I am on mobile so it would be too time consuming to construct a good quality post. I did say "I would say" that the build quality is inferior. My left speaker was doa on my G2 and the headstrap plastic creaks like it is on the edge of failure every time I take it off. Sure the quest strap is not great but also probably won't fail (or cause the data cable to fail by acting as a pinch point on it as the G2 strap does). The quest 2's facepad is less comfortable. I think because it needs to be tighter on your face and head to compensate for the weight. I do not have a high quality DSLR in a mannequin head to take through the lens pictures as Tyriel does. I can just say I think the side by side picture may be out of date as there has been updates to the quest pertaining to USB bandwidth and encode/ refresh rate I believe since Tyriel captured those pictures in F1/DCS. I am not sure what causes it but for example zooming in while looking at fast moving planes I have noticed warping effects in the G2 that I am well used to in my CV1/Rift S. These are not present with my settings in oculus tray tool with the quest 2. I am unsure if I can stop this behavior with WMR. I am not up the the technical knowledge you are but I did watch his videos and was on the fence about buying a quest 2 to use until HP sends me parts. I was thinking about returning it and buying a second G2 based on all the negative points you have mentioned against the quest 2 in this thread. I was very pleasantly surprised and happy I use it. I even made a thread about it recommending the Quest2. I very seldom create threads. It works so well in my opinion that I seriously debate even going back to the G2. I will just wait until HP gets me a cable and the new Bios that hopefully fixes the severe USB issues I have with the G2. It is quite funny that the Oculus has no issues with USB. I have tried multiple ports and they all work while my G2 only works 90% of the time only on one port.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I just felt that your original post could use some input from someone who owns both because I was very put off by all the negative points that you have made when I was making my decision.

?

Good to hear from those that actually have experience using Q2 via Link.

Similar feedback to what I see on other forums as well. And I do have experience using original Quest via Link.

Whether some like it or not Q2 is gaining a footprint in flight and racing sim community.

It is not for me , mostly because of FB heavy hand on requiring a FB account.

However and I will say it again - Any VR growth is very good for the VR Industry overall!!!!

March 15, 2021

I concur with all of Sakers comments. I feel like OP may have really negative connotations about FB and their data collection methods which may have influenced his post. The quality and build and image of Quest 2 are great using sakers suggestions. If you don’t want FB to have your data then that’s a deal killer for oculus. If you don’t care I highly recommend quest 2 as a next gen iteration towards making VR mainstream. Disclaimer - I have no experience with G2.

March 15, 2021

5 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

Through lens pictures eliminates subjectivities,

I am familiar with those through the lens images. To have a fair opinion on this you need to understand the rate at which oculus have been pushing updates out to the quest 2.

The biggest change was the massive increase in bandwidth available over the link cable. It was capped at 150mb initially and it was making a visible impact just like in the comparison through the lens images (which was taken during this period).

"Update 23" removed the cap and allowed you to push it to 500mb.

Beyond 400mb I can't see any visual difference. I leave it on 500 anyway.

My PC rig cannot extract the maximum potential from a quest2, I have to compromise on super sampling and some in-game settings. I have the AMD equivalent of a 2070. Even then I am extremely impressed with my in game visuals.

If your rig is extremely high end then you will be pushing into the area of taking advantages of the Reverb G2. Personally I need to upgrade my PC before I consider a new headset.

I only know 2 people who own both headsets. General opinion across my small sample set of two is that tracking is better on the quest2. Visual clarity is nominally better on the G2 (which Saker confirms from his opinion too) they are both running 3090's. In fairness the G2 is their go to device. Both people have spent eyewatering amounts on their PC's, and are general tech enthusiasts.

My advice to anyone looking to get into VR with regards headset choice is as follows.

If you have a mid-range rig or lower go with a quest 2 and spend the money you save upgrading your rig. Rig upgrades will take precedence over headset upgrades until you reach high-end. I believe the success of the quest2 will see real acceleration on headset manufacturing too. Hopefully the next wave of devices start releasin/announcing this summer anyway.

Personally it feels like every day Valve wait on announcing the Index2 they are just bleeding market share. That is the device that I really want to buy next. The G2 feels like an Index 1.5.

Final point on the Facebook piece. I don't think there is anyone who likes it. The moment folks can jump out of that eco-system I expect a lot of people will, myself included.

Everyone wants to hate on the Quest2 and I understand that sentiment and I am not an apologist for Facebook I really don't want to be in their eco-system either. This however does not stop me trying to have a fair view of the hardware they have created.

March 15, 2021

Being new to the VR scene I recently purchased Quest 2 and for the price point I think its incredibly good. I have not noticed "ghosting" when flying in IL2 probably due to recent updates. The only downside is the Facebook nonsense which I set up on an old email that I rarely use and a basic Facebook that I will never use.

For the money it has plenty of bang for the buck.

March 15, 2021

10 minutes ago, 6./ZG26_Custard said:

Being new to the VR scene I recently purchased Quest 2 and for the price point I think its incredibly good. I have not noticed "ghosting" when flying in IL2 probably due to recent updates. The only downside is the Facebook nonsense which I set up on an old email that I rarely use and a basic Facebook that I will never use.

For the money it has plenty of bang for the buck.

?

Welcome to the wonderful world of VR!

March 15, 2021

Just now, dburne said:

Welcome to the wonderful world of VR!

Thank you! It is rather wonderful.

March 15, 2021

22 hours ago, dburne said:

Oculus ASW when active will most definitely create ghosting of the plane as it flies by. Same as Steam VR and Motion Smoothing.

However I find Steam VR does a better job with it, it is sometimes hardly noticeable.

I did get my Reverb cable in the mail today. Overnight air Fedex so good on HP for fixing me up after me following up with them and reminding them I exist lol. It is maybe sharper than I remember, not so bad of a comparison in my opinion as those comparison shots. I did turn off motion smoothing in SteamVR but I still have warping effects. I am staying with the reverb however it is sharper but the Quest in my opinion is worth the money for people on the fence unless you're not down with Zuckerburg.

23 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

This is interesting. I thought that Facebook really wanted to avoid fake accounts. And they conduct an identification process to be sure you are you. What is exactly a burner account? (Just in case Oculus produces a 140FOV and 4Kx4K per eye for PC-VR in future...)

I just used an alternate email and made a Facebook account and logged in only once. I think you may have a point though I may have to add some info to it because they may close it after a time of inactivity.

Edit: I would say if you have the $350 to spend on a quest 2, aftermarket cable and headstrap brace but not $600 for the g2 I would not hesitate to buy the quest 2. Also if you didn't have the GPU power to push a Reverb G2 like Saiyon suggested would be another reason to buy the quest 2. Otherwise if you have the money and gpu power to push it I would go with the Reverb G2. Luckily, atleast in the US these headsets seem to keep their value on the used market so buying a quest 2 could lead you to want to upgrade your headset and sell your old one for a nominal loss (and upgrade your pc when parts become available again). Overall I see the quest 2 as a good way of growing the VR and possibly IL2 community.

Edited March 16, 2021 by 6./ZG26_Saker
See edit

March 15, 2021

1 hour ago, dburne said:

?

Welcome to the wonderful world of VR!

1 hour ago, 6./ZG26_Custard said:

Thank you! It is rather wonderful.

I know, right? Every time I take off and look around, I can’t help but appreciate how far the pc gaming (and the technology that helped it) has evolved. I’ve been sim-racing/flying since 98 (Grand Prix Legends, look the original up folks), and now “sitting” in the cockpit and driving/flying with the whole world around you is something we really did dream of back in the day.

1 hour ago, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

I just used an alternate email and made a Facebook account and logged in only once. I think you may have a point though I may have to add some info to it because they may close it after a time of inactivity.

Sigh, knowing Facebook (and other tech giants for that matter), they will require an “active” account once they figure it out. Unfortunately, others may follow suit, but at least Facebook is the only one with their own HMD, for now.

March 15, 2021

1 minute ago, kissTheSky said:

I know, right? Every time I take off and look around, I can’t help but appreciate how far the pc gaming (and the technology that helped it) has evolved. I’ve been sim-racing/flying since 98 (Grand Prix Legends, look the original up folks), and now “sitting” in the cockpit and driving/flying with the whole world around you is something we really did dream of back in the day.

Oh baby GPL that brings back many fond memories of my racing in the Papyrus days. GPL was a classic for sure.

My name is in the back of the manuals of a couple of Papyrus Nascar Racing titles. ( tester).

March 15, 2021

2 minutes ago, dburne said:

Oh baby GPL that brings back many fond memories of my racing in the Papyrus days. GPL was a classic for sure.

My name is in the back of the manuals of a couple of Papyrus Nascar Racing titles. ( tester).

Oh my! Must have been nice to be involved in that! I had purchased the NR2003, just so that I could run the original GTP mod.

March 15, 2021

1 minute ago, kissTheSky said:

Oh my! Must have been nice to be involved in that! I had purchased the NR2003, just so that I could run the original GTP mod.

Yeah it was, great times then. They would mail us builds on cd-rom lol.

March 16, 2021

On 3/15/2021 at 11:41 AM, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

I can just say I think the side by side picture may be out of date as there has been updates to the quest pertaining to USB bandwidth and encode/ refresh rate I believe since Tyriel captured those pictures in F1/DCS.

Yes, here you are right. We will need Tyrel or someone else to make again the comparison with a camera. Most of you tubers just show monitor capturing, but not through lenses like Tyrel does. Of course it will not be what your eye will see (camera and eye are different things) but it is a close aproximation for resolutions and ghosting.

Well, I just found a guy explaining those points better than me:

5 minutes ago, chiliwili69 said:

r someone else to make again the comparison with a camera

I have seen that Tyrel made a new video on 11-Feb comparing the Quest2, XTAL and G2:

But I think he has reused the footage made last year. So the differences on Quest2 and G2 seems the same than in OP:

On 3/15/2021 at 11:41 AM, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

I am not up the the technical knowledge you are

Hey, thanks for the flattering but my technical knowledge in VR is just from users perspective. I am quite far for being an expert in VR or any technology associated. And if sometimes it sound like that it is pure coincidence.

March 16, 2021

@chiliwili69

Out of curiosity did you ever try Oculus Link with the original Quest?

March 17, 2021

16 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

Yes, here you are right. We will need Tyrel or someone else to make again the comparison with a camera. Most of you tubers just show monitor capturing, but not through lenses like Tyrel does. Of course it will not be what your eye will see (camera and eye are different things) but it is a close aproximation for resolutions and ghosting.

Well, I just found a guy explaining those points better than me:

I have seen that Tyrel made a new video on 11-Feb comparing the Quest2, XTAL and G2:

But I think he has reused the footage made last year. So the differences on Quest2 and G2 seems the same than in OP:

Hey, thanks for the flattering but my technical knowledge in VR is just from users perspective. I am quite far for being an expert in VR or any technology associated. And if sometimes it sound like that it is pure coincidence.

As a final note on these pictures and to clarify after just using both headsets: in my opinion in IL2 the Oculus Quest2 is clear and smooth with gauges easily readable and sharp. Spotting/identification is good. The G2 is sharper in and out of the cockpit, but with my settings is less smooth with warping effects noticed with close, fast moving objects. I have motion smoothing off in SteamVR. The G2 is a clear step up in visual clarity, audio, and out of the box comfort. I am back to using the G2, but if I only had the quest 2 and maybe a lesser gpu with it I would be happy and effective with it.

Edited March 17, 2021 by 6./ZG26_Saker

March 17, 2021

So the OP is listing reasons to not use a Quest 2 but doesn’t own a quest 2?

Outside of “down with evil Facebook!” Thought process, it’s an incredible value and the picture is very crisp both in PCVR and wireless. Plus it has the benefit of great operating software. I’m really enjoying mine and I’ve owned just about every oculus headset going back to CV1.

I’m still planning on getting a G2...but the Quest 2 is an outstanding headset...and this is coming from someone who actually owns one.

March 18, 2021

On 3/13/2021 at 2:15 PM, chiliwili69 said:

- The battery of Quest2 (like original Quest) add a weight in the front that other dedicated PC-VR headsets like Reverb G2 don´t suffer. This is problematic for long playing sessions.

- Because the image has to be compressed (USB cable bandwidth) the quality of the image is less good than a native resolution, here you can compare the same view for G2 and Quest2.

The compression also introduces a color banding issues mentioned in the video which is not present in other headsets which uses a proper DP cable and no compression.

- The compression/decompression process add an extra latency to the moving objects and you will see some ghosting of fast moving objects. you can see that by looking at the moving F1 cars in the right side. With the Index there is no ghosting.

https://youtu.be/ny_OPsxHQmU?t=253

- The default headstrap is simple a joke, be aware that to have a minimum comfort you will need the Elite strap, so add 49$ to the bill

- Also be aware that not all USB cables has the same bandwidth, and that´s why the original has a higher cost (in addition to the brand), so add 79$ to the bill to be sure you are not limited.
https://www.reddit.com/r/OculusQuest/comments/fz2r0p/oculus_link_speed_tests_of_usb_link_cables/

- The IPD adjustment of Quest2 has only 3 positions. So you might be lucky if your IPD lays on those positions, but other PC-VR headsets has an slider to adjust more precisely the IPD. Be aware of this.

- And you will need to add some more cash for some good headphones to be on pair with the G2 or Index. They don´t touch your ears, and this is sooo good.

- You should also know that the price of the Quest2 is subsidized by Facebook, you will wonder why. The answer is easy, Facebook wants your data. It is as simple as that. You are obliged to enter Facebook.
Here I would suggest people to watch a couple of documentaries "The social dilemma" and "the great hack", and think about it, specially if you have kids.

But if all the reasons above are not enough, I will give you three more:

- Facebook destroyed the original soul of Oculus (all founders are not there anymore) which always put the PC-VR in the center. Remember Oculus Connect 3 in Oct-2016, when Abrash predicted 4Kx4K per eye with 140FOV for 2021???

- Facebook literally don´t care about the PC-VR enthusiast people (exactly the same people who back them for the kickstarter DK1) and don´t care about the requirements for PC simulators (Flight, Space, Race) which is high resolution, big FOV and comfort.

- IL-2 Great Battles is a PC sim. Its business is based in the PC (either monitor or VR). This is exactly the business which is neglected by Facebook.

If after all you buy a Quest2, that´s fine. You took an informed decission and you will also have a great time.

Edited:

I just found a video that explain much better some of the advices I was pointing out:

I am very happy with my quest 2 and the image you put there is rubbish.
it has nothing to do with how they really look
the only thing that is true is the weight

March 19, 2021

On 3/13/2021 at 2:15 PM, chiliwili69 said:

- The battery of Quest2 (like original Quest) add a weight in the front that other dedicated PC-VR headsets like Reverb G2 don´t suffer. This is problematic for long playing sessions.

- Because the image has to be compressed (USB cable bandwidth) the quality of the image is less good than a native resolution, here you can compare the same view for G2 and Quest2.

The compression also introduces a color banding issues mentioned in the video which is not present in other headsets which uses a proper DP cable and no compression.

- The compression/decompression process add an extra latency to the moving objects and you will see some ghosting of fast moving objects. you can see that by looking at the moving F1 cars in the right side. With the Index there is no ghosting.

https://youtu.be/ny_OPsxHQmU?t=253

- The default headstrap is simple a joke, be aware that to have a minimum comfort you will need the Elite strap, so add 49$ to the bill

- Also be aware that not all USB cables has the same bandwidth, and that´s why the original has a higher cost (in addition to the brand), so add 79$ to the bill to be sure you are not limited.
https://www.reddit.com/r/OculusQuest/comments/fz2r0p/oculus_link_speed_tests_of_usb_link_cables/

- The IPD adjustment of Quest2 has only 3 positions. So you might be lucky if your IPD lays on those positions, but other PC-VR headsets has an slider to adjust more precisely the IPD. Be aware of this.

- And you will need to add some more cash for some good headphones to be on pair with the G2 or Index. They don´t touch your ears, and this is sooo good.

- You should also know that the price of the Quest2 is subsidized by Facebook, you will wonder why. The answer is easy, Facebook wants your data. It is as simple as that. You are obliged to enter Facebook.
Here I would suggest people to watch a couple of documentaries "The social dilemma" and "the great hack", and think about it, specially if you have kids.

But if all the reasons above are not enough, I will give you three more:

- Facebook destroyed the original soul of Oculus (all founders are not there anymore) which always put the PC-VR in the center. Remember Oculus Connect 3 in Oct-2016, when Abrash predicted 4Kx4K per eye with 140FOV for 2021???

- Facebook literally don´t care about the PC-VR enthusiast people (exactly the same people who back them for the kickstarter DK1) and don´t care about the requirements for PC simulators (Flight, Space, Race) which is high resolution, big FOV and comfort.

- IL-2 Great Battles is a PC sim. Its business is based in the PC (either monitor or VR). This is exactly the business which is neglected by Facebook.

If after all you buy a Quest2, that´s fine. You took an informed decission and you will also have a great time.

Edited:

I just found a video that explain much better some of the advices I was pointing out:

Hi, I'm surprise of this "some kind of insidious" post about a headset that the OP haven't even tried. There is some kind of aversion to the Quest 2 that I can understand (I also hate facebook policies) but there is a lot of wrong data and assumptions.

First of all, yes, the Quest 2 needs another strap to be really comfortable but once you have the elite strap the "weight problem" disappear completely.

Second, since the updates from months ago the loss of image quality due to video compression is nearly negligible in most cases. Also the thru the lens images and videos aren't the total truth because depends on multiple factors like position of the camera, frames per second of the video vs Hz of the headset, etc. I use both headsets and I can say that the image quality is similar between them and there are no ghosting problems providing that you don't have any motion smoothing in play. Also, I use a 20€ USB cable without problems of bandwidth.

I think is better if I translate the comparison between G2 and Quest 2 I wrote in another forum (I owned a Rift S, a Quest 2 and a Reverb G2):

- The good: The headset is light, very comfortable (very much) and the panels have very high resolution. And that's all.

- Incompatibilities: I was afraid because I was aware of the usb problems of the G2, but I was hoping that HP had resolve the problems and I found my motherboard on a list of "problem free" ones. Wrong. The headset didn't work on any of my usb ports (sometimes the config program recognized it at a moment and in the next step didn't, I had the complete list of numerical errors). Neither it worked with and external simple hub neither with a powered one. Finally worked with another powered hub (from my father's pc). The headset had a display port cable, a usb cable and a power supply and I had to add a usb hub and another power supply. Good start.

- First impressions: Finally I put on the headset and second disappointment. The visual quality was almost the same as in the Quest 2. It had a bit more contrast (the same difference the rift s had against the quest 2), a bit more resolution and a bit less screen door effect, but in general the quality of image was about the same because the sweet spot is... SHIT. The Quest 2 have a considerable smaller sweet spot than the Rift S, but in the reverb is a joke. And the problem is not that the sweet spot is ridiculously small, the problem is the rapid degradation in sharpness when you look away of the center. In game is not that obvious but when you have to read text (or gauges) is terrible. And about the blacks, it's the same that in Quest 2, there are no blacks but greys. Maybe the blacks are a little more blacks in the G2, but only a little. I was hoping a big gap in visual quality (G2 hype) and the reality is that the gap is really small between the two headsets and in some situations the visual quality is worst in the G2.

- The IPD joke: I have around 59mm of IPD (60mm says my optician) and the Quest are alright in the position 1 (58mm). The Rift S were alright until I "taste" the Quest 2 and I discovered that the Rift made me squint. The G2 go continuously down to 60mm so are the best of the three headsets in advance but with the sweet spot problem the difference with the IPD magnifies a lot. Again, in game is less obvious but is terrible when you had to read text. Also, the continuous adjustment is garbage. If I moved the adjustment slowly, it only reached 60,3-60,7. I needed to move it quick to reach 60mm. And when I was in a dogfight and made abrupt head movements from side to side the IPD changes on its own. In a 700€ headset. Yes.

- The cozy factor: The headset warms up a lot. Really a lot. I thought the quest 2 were hot (the Rift S were cooler) and that made sense because the Quest 2 decode video. But in any scenario the G2 are a lot warmer than the Quest, up to the point that I always ended up sweating.

- The little details: The cable is thick, rigid and "sticky", the texture made it to not slip. I never feel the rift's cable uncomfortable but the one in the G2 is uncomfortable even sit down (I move a lot in flight sims). The controllers are not bad but they simply are worse than the quest ones in any way.

- Extras: The headphones are comfortable and sound decent. In comparison to the rift or quest ones, the g2 headphones are heavenly good but this is because the oculus ones are like a handheld fm radio. I use dedicated headphones so the G2's were like a toy headphones to me. It looks to me that the bar on the hmd headphones are pretty low if the G2's are suppose to be very good.

- Performance: Another hot potato. Make the Quest 2 running fine was complicated (I started with a GTX1660S and then a RTX3070 and a Radeon 6800XT) but is even worst on the G2. Quest 2 can running at 72, 80 and 90Hz (this allow a big range to adjust performance from 36 to 90 FPS). With windows mixed reality you can run only at 60 and 90Hz but I see flickering at 60Hz so it makes it unusable for me and makes the minimum usable FPS 45. Also, with oculus tray tool we can use even more divisors to the refresh rate and there are more options for interpolate than with steam or wmr. In quick transversal movements all interpolation methods fail, but with steam motion smoothing I have artifacts even in static situations. Finally I can't see a performance difference at the same resolution between Quest 2 and G2.

Maybe the IPD adjuster problem was something related to my unit but aside from that my impression was the G2 feels like a preproduction item more than a finish product.

Having the Quest 2 and the G2 side to side makes me wonder how so many reviewers glorify the G2 and vilify the Quest 2. Maybe if the Quest were launched with the update for the link cable from November the general opinion of the Quest over the G2 would be totally different.

March 20, 2021

On 3/14/2021 at 6:49 PM, dburne said:

I tried what dburne wrote and maybe I just have it wrong. First of all, the 'settings' he speaks of is in the Oculus Link app that in on your PC, not what you see in the Oculus Quest 2 when you have in on and running. So, I went to Settings and click on Beta and I see that the Public Test Channel switch has the blue background with the 'nob' to the right. I even did the Restart Oculus. So I then go Home. I then put on my Quest 2 and start up IL-2 GB and sit in a Spit IXe. I look at the fuel gauge. I cannot read the words on the plate above the gauge itself. I was hoping I could. I then went into DCS and tried the same thing with the Spit there. Same story. I love VR and I have a Rift (not s) and I bought a Q2 because of the exercise app Supernatural and because it would also be an upgrade for my flight sim games. I am hoping I just have not got this beta thing right. Otherwise, in VR,I will stick with Flying Circus.

March 20, 2021

On 3/19/2021 at 8:19 AM, Rabino said:

- Performance: Another hot potato. Make the Quest 2 running fine was complicated (I started with a GTX1660S and then a RTX3070 and a Radeon 6800XT) but is even worst on the G2. Quest 2 can running at 72, 80 and 90Hz (this allow a big range to adjust performance from 36 to 90 FPS). With windows mixed reality you can run only at 60 and 90Hz but I see flickering at 60Hz so it makes it unusable for me and makes the minimum usable FPS 45. Also, with oculus tray tool we can use even more divisors to the refresh rate and there are more options for interpolate than with steam or wmr. In quick transversal movements all interpolation methods fail, but with steam motion smoothing I have artifacts even in static situations. Finally I can't see a performance difference at the same resolution between Quest 2 and G2.

Maybe the IPD adjuster problem was something related to my unit but aside from that my impression was the G2 feels like a preproduction item more than a finish product.

Having the Quest 2 and the G2 side to side makes me wonder how so many reviewers glorify the G2 and vilify the Quest 2. Maybe if the Quest were launched with the update for the link cable from November the general opinion of the Quest over the G2 would be totally different.

I am on my second G2 cable and just now I am seeing the 60 IPD message with this new cable. I think that it is actually where you set it last however and whatever sensor it has is buggy for reporting it at 60.

How was your G2 with the 3070? I was on the fence on recommending the G2 for a 2080ti owner, but they have similar performance to the 3070.

March 20, 2021

1 hour ago, 6./ZG26_Saker said:

How was your G2 with the 3070? I was on the fence on recommending the G2 for a 2080ti owner, but they have similar performance to the 3070.

Ok. I’ve only had my G2 for about three weeks, and I’m still not fully into the heavy maps with crowded campaigns, so take this with a grain of salt.

I have i7 10700KF with 16GB ram and 2080 super in my system. With balanced settings (mirrors medium, clouds low), I’m quite content with the visuals of it, so I think it might be acceptable for your friend as well.

I have motion smoothing off, and have not adjusted the per game steam vr settings (SS at 100%). IDing is a bit difficult, but it may be either due to no MSAA/FXAA, or my inexperience (I may or may not have killed fellow “countrymen” due to friendly fire?).

March 20, 2021

Thx,

Just what i need, works great

Is it possible you add a 3 button for head up view

March 20, 2021

Looking at the fuel gauge in the Spit - the one on the lower right and trying to read the plate just above it turns out to be a bogus way of trying to judge this. I can't do it using a monitor. So I looked at other things. I settled on the gun site reflector. I can make out the 100 yards ok from the monitor and from the Quest 2, I can but more so because I know it says yards. Please share what you see from the other VR headsets and such. To me it boils down to that spotting planes at a distance in Quest 2 is bad compared to a monitor.

March 20, 2021

In my experience with q2 I see far better than on my 49 inch 1080p tv. I find that I see trains and vehicles and the like that I didn’t see as much before. Spotting is at least as good as it was on the tv and maybe a bit better. Until I can get a 3080 I can’t say what q2

will do with much higher settings.

March 21, 2021

1080p does not cut it. I tried both that and 4k. But the larger 4k the more the graphics card has too work. I use a 43" 4k TV. But another thing affects how well you can see the detail is how far away the TV/monitor is. I found moving the TV as much as 4 inches close made a difference in being able to read '100 yards' on the Spit reflector gun sight. That was true in GB and DCS. Another thing that affect seeing the detail is the for me the fact that I am near sighted and wear glasses. Just how I have those setting on my nose makes a difference too. If you have the q2 headset on it is near impossible to make any adjustment.

April 12, 2021

Weight: can and should be counterweighted with an extra battery on the back of your head. I use an anker 10000mah (you dont want the entire headset to get too heavy).

Strap: elite strap is bad and prone to breaking, get a third party one. I have this one. 25 gbp + 10-20 gbp for the powerbank. An aliexpress one works as well and you can just use cheap velcro straps to tie a powerbank rigidly to the back of your head. And it also solves the balance problem. With the powerbank it lasts 5+ hours.

Link: I have never used the link cable. It seems pointless to me, especially if it degrades visual quality. For 20 euros you can buy virtual desktop to wirelessly stream to your headset. Requires 5 ghz to work well, but my standard ISP router supports that. Wifi6 isn't needed. I have 30 ms delay. Playing via virtual desktop does not reduce visual quality unless you have a bad connection.

Wireless: being able to play wireless is simply awesome. Cables and base stations increase the hassle of playing in VR by such a degree that it turned me off it. I also enjoy watching movies on a giant VR-TV while taking a bath. Portability is also fun to show it to other people or if you want to watch a movie or something while traveling. The Quest 2 really opens new use cases. Virtual desktop is on the quest store so in that way Facebook doesn't actively prevent it from being used. It is no hassle at all.

Facebook: this sucks. Facebook sucks and they're selling your data which sucks. Their update policy is also weird.

Headphones: everyone owns these already. They're pretty comfortable just on top of the strap I have but I agree that integration in the strap is better.

Still waiting for finger tracking to support virtual interaction with the cockpit.

All in all the Quest 2 is pretty damn awesome imo. I could not go back to a wired headset. If you're using a cable with your Quest 2 you're doing it wrong.

Edited April 12, 2021 by Goldstein

April 12, 2021

12 minutes ago, Goldstein said:

Weight: can and should be counterweighted with an extra battery on the back of your head. I use an anker 10000mah (you dont want the entire headset to get too heavy).

Strap: elite strap is bad and prone to breaking, get a third party one. I have this one. 25 gbp + 10-20 gbp for the powerbank. An aliexpress one works as well and you can just use cheap velcro straps to tie a powerbank rigidly to the back of your head. And it also solves the balance problem. With the powerbank it lasts 5+ hours.

Link: I have never used the link cable. It seems pointless to me, especially if it degrades visual quality. For 20 euros you can buy virtual desktop to wirelessly stream to your headset. Requires 5 ghz to work well, but my standard ISP router supports that. Wifi6 isn't needed. I have 30 ms delay. Playing via virtual desktop does not reduce visual quality unless you have a bad connection.

Wireless: being able to play wireless is simply awesome. Cables and base stations increase the hassle of playing in VR by such a degree that it turned me off it. I also enjoy watching movies on a giant VR-TV while taking a bath. Portability is also fun to show it to other people or if you want to watch a movie or something while traveling. The Quest 2 really opens new use cases. Virtual desktop is on the quest store so in that way Facebook doesn't actively prevent it from being used. It is no hassle at all.

Facebook: this sucks. Facebook sucks and they're selling your data which sucks. Their update policy is also weird.

Headphones: everyone owns these already. They're pretty comfortable just on top of the strap I have but I agree that integration in the strap is better.

Still waiting for finger tracking to support virtual interaction with the cockpit.

All in all the Quest 2 is pretty damn awesome imo. I could not go back to a wired headset. If you're using a cable with your Quest 2 you're doing it wrong.

How long do you get out of the battery?

April 13, 2021

20 hours ago, dburne said:

How long do you get out of the battery?

About 5 hours with the 10000MAh powerbank + integrated battery. About 2 hours without powerbank. If you need more you can just buy another powerbank and switch it out with the old one when it's empty. This strap

Edited April 13, 2021 by Goldstein

Reasons for not buying Quest2 or Quest3... for IL-2

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