Developer Diary, Part XX

[Feuerfalke]

I really don't wan't to be party pooper but, in my opinion, especially incoming sound are not that good at all. I mean it doesen't sound like DB601/605 at all, more like Cessna or some other plane.

When 109 is passed by sounds are better, more like v12 should be. Listen the real thing and compare yourself, i know there is better examples in youtube but here's one anyway: (fly-by's after 3min mark)

 

 

 

Don't hate me, i'm just trying to give some constructive criticism

 

I live near an airstrip where old warplanes are repaired and tested.

 

Mustang, Spitfire, P38 and a few Yaks, just to name a few. We also had a 109 passing above once or twice.

 

In RL the sound is much different than in these videos. The microphones are usually optimized for speech, not for recording engine-sounds.

Especially in the videos you posted the sound seems pretty muffled.

 

 

However, the "rumbling" or "chortling" of the engine is a little bit overdone in the demo-video. It runs smoother on most airplanes.

 

This one is pretty good, IMHO:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnpC_BcK7xY

 

 

[DB605]

This is exactly what i meant but my english is not that good

 

What could be better is the general sound of the engine. At the moment it sounds like a real airplane...but not like a Bf109 but rather some other airplane with a different engine. It is missing some characteristics that make the Bf109 stand out. And you are right...it is particularly noticable when the aircraft is approaching and close to the observer.

 

Alexander

[Foobar]

Don't tell too much into it. All is still alpha.

[FlatSpinMan]

Oh, our posts crossed in the mail. Your comment about the supercharger sound I totally agree with. I think the engine sounds a bit more throaty than a Cessna myself, but I lack the knowledge and technical vocabulary to support that assertion.

 

Can I just post this clip of some snarling, snapping P-40's, while I'm here?They sound like animals. Has there ever been a sexier plane than this?

Some nice dry, summertime NZ landscape in the background, too.

 

PS - What is it that makes this bird such a beauty? Sorry, that's OT I know, but there's something about this one.

[I/JG27_Rollo]

Finding a good clear 109 clip to compare against is difficult  - often there's airshow commentary or wind distorting the sound - but those clips posted by DB605 are better than any I could find.

You may also check out http://www.neunundzwanzigsechs.de/main.php for a bunch of undisturbed 109 fly-by sounds.

 

The video sounds are somewhat different from the real thing but I think they're well on their way.

 

EDIT: also check out the entry page of the same website http://www.neunundzwanzigsechs.de to hear a DB getting fired up...

Edited June 14, 2013 by I/JG27_Rollo

[No105_Swoose]

Another outstanding update!  And thanks for including the sound demo!

 

I really like the idea of PvE and think it has a lot of potential to enhance gameplay.  I'd be curious to know, in next week's update, if the PvE missions will have the ability be scalable to some extent ala the old IL-2: adjust settings for ability of friendly and enemy AI, amount of flak encountered at random areas off flight route, adjust numbers of random AI flight groups encountered to improve immersion, etc.

[4S_Nero]

I love you.

[DB605]

 

In RL the sound is much different than in these videos. The microphones are usually optimized for speech, not for recording engine-sounds.

Especially in the videos you posted the sound seems pretty muffled.

 

 

 

Sure thing, i've also seen and heard multiple times spitfires, Mustangs, T-6's, B-25's (and of course Cessnas )etc. IRL airshows, also spend most of my childhood in airports.

Edited June 14, 2013 by DB605

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

omg is this awesome sounds I have my head set on which is 5.1 turtle beach, and listening on the rear turns left then right was awesome! thanks cant wait for Alpha-beta, can we participate for Beta?

[FlatSpinMan]

Feuerfalke - lovely clip.

While watching it, without reading the description or anything, I realised how much of a WWII anorak I am. As the plane flew by I spotted the fixed tail wheel and thought - "Must be a G. Maybe the G10?"

Ah, it's nice to be among like-minded folk.

I hope.

[DB605]

You may also check out http://www.neunundzwanzigsechs.de/main.php for a bunch of undisturbed 109 fly-by sounds. (I hope it's ok to post the link...)

 

The video sounds are somewhat different from the real thing but I think they're well on their way.

 

Got instant goose pimples when i opened your link :D Thanks!

[FlatSpinMan]

Well this update seems to have struck a rich vein of sentiment. 

Andy - cheers for the 109 sound link. For those who haven't clicked it yet, the site plays audio of a 109 zooming by as a background. In theory it'S an English/German site but I found clicking the English link didn't work for me.

 

@4SNero - I hear you, man.

[theOden]

Very very impressive.

LOFT, hand your team a friday-beer each.

You guys have impressed in all shown parts so far, from gfx to sound, this just GOTTA be a block buster.

[FlatSpinMan]

Sorry to spam this thread so much, but what range was that 109 in the Alpha footage filmed at? Having watched a few real life 109 film clips this evening I am struck by how realistic the whole thing looked. As others have commented, it didn't look like a bunch of pixels suddenly becoming a plane.

The camera work, which seemed to pan, track, and wobble a bit was great. Is that the normal in-engine static camera?

[DD_bongodriver]

I found it difficult to hear anything here over the sound of gushing but in fairness the video was only to illustrate the complexity of the sound engine rather than the accuracy, clearly the devs have plenty of time to tweak it up and now have plenty of reference to the real thing, even I am confident they will make it sound fairly accurate on the basis of the video.

[DD_bongodriver]

Yes, you'll be able to combat against 'bots' and ground targets offline, for example in the Quick Mission Editor. We'll tell all details in the next diaries.

Connection will be needed for the career (Single Player Online), some other mods and multiplayer.

 

Thanks for the edit, that clears it up a bit more, so single player 'career' mode (is this campaign?) is strictly online, presumably offline will limit to stuff like single missions, free flight etc.

 

Curious to hear mention of 'other mods', will look forward to further explanation.

[ISIDA]

Very very impressive.

LOFT, hand your team a friday-beer each.

 

Thanks for the beer! But ladies prefer friday-martinis

[Uufflakke]

Besides the fact that sounds of the Bf-109 in the YouTube clips are recorded during an airshow with just a simple built in mono microphone -which makes it in a way difficult to compare with BoS flyby sounds-  listening to the update through the tiny crappy speakers of your monitor doesn't help either.

It already sounds much better with a headset on.

The only time I don't like the sound that much is when the Messerschmitt is closest to the viewer. Difficult to describe with words but it sounds a bit grainy, distorted.

 

I am more interested how engine sounds during start up and when we as virtual pilots are ???

[FlatSpinMan]

I found it difficult to hear anything here over the sound of gushing

True    - but it it's just so nice to see things developing well and transparently in such a short space of time. There'll be problems and shortcomings no doubt - after all, we're all expecting them to recreate a battle of millions of men over a huge swathe of territory - but I just like their approach so much.

 

I must say, it's also nice having 2 new officials on the scene in Zak and ISIDA 'cos they actually know stuff! Me and BC are just bouncers at the door knocking skulls together if there's trouble!    

[Avimimusold]

So the basic news is: It will have an online single-player campaign like Rise of Flight (despite previous claims that the intent was for RoF to eventually offer offline campaigns).

 

My obvious reaction is to ask: Will an offline mode be offered at all? Rise of Flight currently offers an offline mode and the ability to run single missions and 3rd party campaigns while offline. This is a really important feature for people living in more remote areas (e.g. Canada has 1/200 th the population density of England and there are many gaps in our internet coverage - especially if speed or stability is an issue). I could easily end up in some of these areas - so it is personally important to me.

 

I don't want to start a habit and then have to give up my Mig-3...

[Uufflakke]

Thanks for the beer! But ladies prefer friday-martinis

 

Found this recipe on the net for a Friday Martini.

(Okay it is the 14th and not the 13rd but what the heck!)  

 

[kestrel79]

The 109 sound is good for an alpha build, well done. I really liked the sound from far away that sounded pretty spot on.

 

When the plane flew by the camera I do agree with DB a bit and I think it needs some more grunt, some more balls. But it is alpha so I'm not worried well done!

[ISIDA]

Found this recipe on the net for a Friday Martini.

(Okay it is the 14th and not the 13rd but what the heck!)  

 

 

Wow!    vielen dank!

[p00d73]

Thanks for the video, it souded great!
I hope the game allows for PvE missions to have certain PvP elements in it, in IL-2 1946 for example, coop missions could be flown either with AI or with real players jumping in the enemy planes.

[Zak]

Thanks for the edit, that clears it up a bit more, so single player 'career' mode (is this campaign?) is strictly online, presumably offline will limit to stuff like single missions, free flight etc.

Thanks for asking, bongodriver. As it was said before, we do care about players who might encounter temporary network limitations. However specific info about what will remain unchanged in the game when you unplug the ethernet cable will be available later in the diaries. Maybe even earlier, I'll just talk to LOFT.

Speaking of the campaign issue - it's not completely correct to call new IL-2 missions a campaign, cause every mission is generated specifically for the user, it's not the same pack of traditional scripts like in other capaign-based singleplayer games. And this is why offline mode is not recommended but still acceptable.

[Bearcat]

Listen carefully BoS video from 0:15 to 0:25, then right after it listen this:

In my opinion it sounds like Cessna indeed Supercharger sound is good thought.

 

The Cessna is higher in pitch .. not as throaty as the 109 clip sounds.. at least not to me.

 

Just for discussion's sake, here are a bunch of Cessna's flying by. I didn't choose these scientifically, just a quick Youtube spree.

 

I think they sound pretty different, what about you guys?

Finding a good clear 109 clip to compare against is difficult  - often there's airshow commentary or wind distorting the sound - but those clips posted by DB605 are better than any I could find.

 

This is so much fun!

I agree... I haven't heard too may real 109s so I can't say.. about hopw accurate is is as a 109 but it sounds nothing like a Cessna to me.. That clip sounds better than any 109 I have heard in a sim... The dopeler effect is very well done.. and like so many have said .. it's only an Alpha so... :)T

he clip at the bottom that Feuerfalke posted sounded much deeper... but I can't help but wonder how much of the sounds from airshows are influenced by the mic..

[Bearcat]

True    - but it it's just so nice to see things developing well and transparently in such a short space of time. There'll be problems and shortcomings no doubt - after all, we're all expecting them to recreate a battle of millions of men over a huge swathe of territory - but I just like their approach so much.

 

I must say, it's also nice having 2 new officials on the scene in Zak and ISIDA 'cos they actually know stuff! Me and BC are just bouncers at the door knocking skulls together if there's trouble!    

[VBF-12_Stick-95]

I wish you would provide more information on PvP.  Will there be only single missions available or will a dynamic campaign of some sort exist?

 

You mention Player versus Environment where single players receive unique missions.   What about Players versus Environment (multiple players such as a squad) in a missions against AI?

[150GCT_Veltro]

About multiplayer, we perfectly know (or better...understand this because of budget ecc. ecc.) we are a few people (da.n you all offliners!), but take care of what some guys did for IL2 (Shades for SEOW first of all).

 

We need a code that could be reworked.

 

Don't forget: IL2 is still a great game thank to HL and third party codes (your first of all)........but we need a code that could be reworked by the community programmers.

 

We have the feeling that this Stalingrad will be a work of art, don't waste this opportunity only in an offline game.....

 

We need campaign, dynamic campaign....we need strategy !

 

@Offliners, human pilots are better than AI, and you could also find new friends.

Edited June 14, 2013 by Veltro

[DD_bongodriver]

Thanks for asking, bongodriver. As it was said before, we do care about players who might encounter temporary network limitations. However specific info about what will remain unchanged in the game when you unplug the ethernet cable will be available later in the diaries. Maybe even earlier, I'll just talk to LOFT.

Speaking of the campaign issue - it's not completely correct to call new IL-2 missions a campaign, cause every mission is generated specifically for the user, it's not the same pack of traditional scripts like in other capaign-based singleplayer games. And this is why offline mode is not recommended but still acceptable.

 

Ok thanks, it makes sense, sounds interesting.

[Rjel]

In the first fly-by there was an appreciable "jump" in LOD detail, though, when the plane approached.

 

I've watched the video several times but I really can't see it. Perhaps just as the plane passes it became more detailed but not so much it looked unrealistic to me. At what time frame do you see the "jump"?

 

@Offliners, human pilots are better than AI, and you could also find new friends.

 

All said is true but it isn't an option for everyone. Certainly not all the time. A balanced game, online and off (even if that waits for future updates), will benefit the majority of users and would expand sales I would think.

[senseispcc]

Sorry to sound negative but !

 

If I understand the full implication of the "single-online"  game is that the only way to play it is to go online?!

Go online to indintify yourself like with Steam or ROF was OK for me but playing even singleplayer missions (the only missions I play) online is a NO !

I do not  in your countries but there are countries where how longer you stay conected, how more you pay for it !

Also do not forget player have not the same machines to play a little slow machine cant compete with a great new machine with a fast connection, it is a live fact.

And there is for me no fun in killing real people even in a game.

If this is the case count me out.

[FlatSpinMan]

@Veltro and VRSTICK

- they've said they'll expand on gameplay in future updates. Given their own experience they'll surely be aware of the benefits of multiplayer.

Focussing on single player is great for a lot of us though - guys whose game time limited and irregular, guys who live in inconvenient time zones, guys without regular high speed net access. These points must cover a lot of players.

 

For those worried about the online aspect - RoF has something like a 99% up record.

Also, I seem to recall Zjason saying somewhere that the amount of data required for single player playing in the current RoF is pretty insubstantial.

 

Sorry - Jason!

[DD_bongodriver]

The 109 sound is good for an alpha build, well done. I really liked the sound from far away that sounded pretty spot on.

 

When the plane flew by the camera I do agree with DB a bit and I think it needs some more grunt, some more balls. But it is alpha so I'm not worried well done!

 

The distant sounds are good I think too, but I think the close in sound actually need 'less' grunt, the sound of the combustion is almost too harsh, needs toning down, the engine sounds like it's thrashing, also a bit of balance between the sound of combustion and the whistle of the supercharger is needed.....should be almost harmonic........I think.

[Pudfark]

I like what I have heard and read here.  Great job B6 and team.  Thanks.

[royraiden]

I cant judge the sound accuracy but it definitely sounds good.It was nice to see a video on this update, even if it was focused on the sonund, we were able to see the 109 flying Hopefully we are getting close to the point where we will see more and more detailed videos in the future updates. Fingers crossed. By the way thanks again for the updates. Fridays are definitely my favourite days of the week.

Edited June 14, 2013 by royraiden

[150GCT_Veltro]

@Veltro and VRSTICK

- they've said they'll expand on gameplay in future updates. Given their own experience they'll surely be aware of the benefits of multiplayer.

Focussing on single player is great for a lot of us though - guys whose game time limited and irregular, guys who live in inconvenient time zones, guys without regular high speed net access. These points must cover a lot of players.

 

For those worried about the online aspect - RoF has something like a 99% up record.

Also, I seem to recall Zjason saying somewhere that the amount of data required for single player playing in the current RoF is pretty insubstantial.

 

Sorry - Jason!

 

Don't worry that they perfectly know what we are taliking about considering they have been themself IL2 third party coders for multiplayer games.

 

In RoF we have an offline career good only for single palyer. This is fine for RoF considering it has been their first sim....but is not good at all for Stalingrad, the first one of the new IL2 serie.

 

No problem at all for single player, but this time please use your time and resources for somentihing we could use also in multiplayer.....a dynamic  multiplayer's code. We perfectly understand all the problems, but we can't delete 10 years of IL2, where have been the multiplayer games to make it very famous in all the world.

Edited June 14, 2013 by Veltro

[JG4_Sputnik]

Thanks for asking, bongodriver. As it was said before, we do care about players who might encounter temporary network limitations. However specific info about what will remain unchanged in the game when you unplug the ethernet cable will be available later in the diaries. Maybe even earlier, I'll just talk to LOFT.

Speaking of the campaign issue - it's not completely correct to call new IL-2 missions a campaign, cause every mission is generated specifically for the user, it's not the same pack of traditional scripts like in other capaign-based singleplayer games. And this is why offline mode is not recommended but still acceptable.

 

What I don't get ist: why do we need an internet connection to genrate missions specifically for users? This can be done offline as well. (Or did I miss something?)

 

I feel almost like with Microsoft, which tells us that we need to stay always connected with the Xbox One because they do "amazing cloud gaming features" which of course only is DRM in disguise. Maybe I'm just spoiled by this horrible company, but the more vague these features are, the more most companies usualy lie to us.

 

So I think as long as you can't tell us exactely why we need to go online to play offline campaigns players will stay suspicious, because nobody seems to get it as for now.

Edited June 14, 2013 by Sputnik

[DB605]

I have to write one more post here about sounds, to make some things  clearer.

 

1. I was NOT talking about sound quality. There's nothing wrong about quality in my opinion. And i am using 5.1 headphones, not some "tiny crappy speakers".

  It's just that engine itself doesen't sound like real one to me, yet. And i did not meant it sounds _just like Cessna_, it was just example to show what is wrong in sounds in my opinion.

 

2. I definitely know the differences in sounds between videos and real life. As i said, i have heard many warbirds IRL, and i am working with planes everyday (my workplace is in airport).

 

3. I know the sounds right now are only alpha or beta stage, and they are definitely going to "right way". I'm just hoping they get sounds as close to reality as possible, i want to love BoS as it's our only hope now when CloD is dead.

[JtD]

Interesting update, thank you. I appreciate the information that it will be possible to play without internet connection.

 

For sounds, I can only recommend to visit a decent air show. I found that the sound alone is worth the visit, and that's true even if you don't have to optimize game sounds thereafter.

 

I also think that everyone around here should be aware that his own computers setting may differ from someone else's. What sounds good/bad/realistic/wrong on your rig doesn't necessarily have to sound the same on another one. Don't go to deep into arguments.