Zen3 Ryzen 5000 serie

[Jaws2002]

2 hours ago, Voyager said:

@Jaws2002 It looks like the 5600X and 5800X chips could hit the 5950X numbers, but they're running into the hardwired boost cap instead. 

 

 

Absolutely agree. AMD wats to sell the top tier CPU's, so the lower core count ones are boost locked. It may mean that high tier CPUs are better binned.

 Looks like the 5950x is hitting 5.05Ghz out of the box. Most likely the lower core count could hit the same speed if it wasn't for a hard ceiling forced by AMD. 

 

 I'd be curious how  5900x and 5950x do in "Gaming Mode".  In that overclocking mode, you shut down the weaker CCX and put all power to one single CCX. Top tier power and boost limits and low latency typical for single CCX CPU's.

   That could make quite a difference this time. 

Edited November 9, 2020 by Jaws2002

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Looks like I selected the wrong Motherboard anyway. Crappy VRMs and some other things missing.

 

Correcting that decision by getting a 570 Tomahawk now.

[Gambit21]

5 minutes ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

Looks like I selected the wrong Motherboard anyway. Crappy VRMs and some other things missing.

 

Correcting that decision by getting a 570 Tomahawk now.

 

Which one did you have before?

 

 

On another note, Interesting

 

User Benchmark 5950X vs 5800X

 

 

Edited November 9, 2020 by Gambit21

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Too embarassing to tell really, that was the MSI X570 Gaming Plus. It wouldn't even run 4000MHz DIMMs properly, even though advertised, nor have the best of VRMs. Well, not even the average of VRMs, so... a turd basically. Has a WIP BIOS for Zen3. Information was rare, but the lesson didn't cost me much except for maybe 25€ for sending forth and back and a few days.

 

Currently scouting if I should get different RAM as well. Infinity Fabric at 2000MHz, so the Zen3 loves 4000MHz - read that everywhere. The one I have is 4000MHz 18/22/22/42 RipJaw V. Thinking about getting a 4266MHz CL19 instead and tightening it to 4000MHz 18/18/18/36, and as the Tomahawk is Daisy-Chained it'll be 2x16GB as well.

[Gambit21]

Ahh...

 

I have the MSI X570 Meg Unify.

Sticking with my 3600 memory I think.

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

1 hour ago, Gambit21 said:

Ahh...

 

I have the MSI X570 Meg Unify.

Sticking with my 3600 memory I think.

Yeah, I haven't decided on the memory yet. I'll check these out on the Tomahawk. It seems all X570 boards still have issues with their BIOS to run 4000MHz RAM when not standard, so they don't fare well with XMPs and manual OCs. The MSI Reddit is full of it. So... to wait and see, I guess. I want to use 4K ones so I can keep the Infinity Fabric at 2K. 

Edited November 10, 2020 by SCG_Fenris_Wolf

[Confused_2018]

Hardware Unboxed tries to explain it for technically challenged people like me.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGux0pANft0

[robbiec]

Forget all about Ryzen 5000s, you need these 

 

 

 

???? - I'll still keep to my decision of 5950X but maybe the VR Gurus might be interested. 

Edited November 10, 2020 by robbiec

[Confused_2018]

Looks to me like the cry cooler is the thing to look at.

 

After all it I know that we can just order one of those gold CPU's from newegg....err wait one sec.  Gold CPU availability hmm.

[Jaws2002]

1 hour ago, robbiec said:

Forget all about Ryzen 5000s, you need these 

 

 

 

???? - I'll still keep to my decision of 5950X but maybe the VR Gurus might be interested. 

 

Cryogenic coolers and golden chips...

That's what being desperate looks like. ?

 Intel couldn't be more pathetic. 

 

[LukeFF]

I started working towards my AMD build today by picking up a Gigabyte X570 Aorus Elite Wifi motherboard and 16 GB of DDR4 3600 Crucial Ballistix RAM. Hopefully, it won't be too long until I can get the CPU to go along with it.

[Gambit21]

2 hours ago, LukeFF said:

I started working towards my AMD build today by picking up a Gigabyte X570 Aorus Elite Wifi motherboard and 16 GB of DDR4 3600 Crucial Ballistix RAM. Hopefully, it won't be too long until I can get the CPU to go along with it.

 

I’m checking every day for the CPU.

Did you decide on which one?

 

I’m 95% settled on the 5800x - slight waffle toward the 9500x at moments

Edited November 11, 2020 by Gambit21

[LukeFF]

7 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

 

I’m checking every day for the CPU.

Did you decide on which one?

 

I’m 95% settled on the 8500x - slight waffle toward the 9500x at moments

 

Do you mean the 5800X or 5900X?

 

I'm thinking right now it'll probably be the 5900X.

Edited November 11, 2020 by LukeFF

[Gambit21]

10 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

 

Do you mean the 5800X or 5900X?

 

I'm thinking right now it'll probably be the 5900X.

 

Yep, mistyped.

[Confused_2018]

I hope that these new builds work well for all of you.  I look forward to seeing the #'s 

[Gambit21]

I agree with this guy - and that's considering my 3D workflow as well as IL2.

 

Ryzen 7 5800X

[LuftManu]

Just ordered a 5600X too! alongside an Arous B550 Pro. Let's see what happens 

 

A friend of mine had some CPUs to test and the tests were really good with at least 15/20% fps at 1080p. I can't wait to test it fully in career mode and see how it copes with slowdowns.

 

Right now with my current config and the Slowdown mission benchmark 1 Min is 1 min and 32 seconds ingame.

Edited November 11, 2020 by LF_Gallahad

[TWC_Ace]

AFAK some ATI graphic cards had problems in IL2 in the past.....also we still need to see how the new Ryzens will show in a long term. But yeah, they caught Intel sleeping like baby.

Edited November 11, 2020 by =VARP=Tvrdi

[Jaws2002]

48 minutes ago, =VARP=Tvrdi said:

AFAK some ATI graphic cards had problems in IL2 in the past.....also we still need to see how the new Ryzens will show in a long term. But yeah, they caught Intel sleeping like baby.

 

With AMD taking the gaming crown and both xbox and play station being powered by AMD, i think, in the future game engines will be a lot better optimized for AMD hardware. 

I watched a lot of reviews and some reviewers pointed that some really new games, released this year are showing much better performance on this high core count CPUs vs the six  core counterparts. 

We'll see how that will work out. 

Edited November 11, 2020 by Jaws2002

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Now that more and more benchmarks and voices come out, there are a few things others found, which we can sum up already:

 

- 5600/5800 love 1900MHz Infinity Fabric. If yours goes to 2000MHz, then that's a very good chip, open Champagne.

 

- 5900/5950 usually manage 2000MHz Infinity Fabric. But: Many X570 Boards have problems with such high RAM timings. More BIOS patches are getting worked on and will fix it.

 

- The fire in the Chinese MSI facility was just at a production line, no laboratories were there.

 

- If you don't match Infinity Fabric (IF) = Memory Controller (MC) and then add RAM which fits to that, you will have unstable frametimes. These express themselves in comparatively strong 1% amplitudes in the CPU frametime graph, as well as stronger deviating 1% and 0.1% framerates logged.

 

- To smoothen out frametimes, to eliminate microstutters, you'd want to couple them. For example: 1900MHz (IF) = 1900MHz (MC) = 3800MHz RAM clock. Afterwards, make sure to check RAM timings. Some have reported abnormal timings (all over the place) when using XMP.

 

- Zen3 5800/5900 are sensitive to Motherboards with low quality VRMs. Check the list  for true VRM Phases, range and smart power stages. It'll help you achieve stable and smooth performance. I aim for that for VR and overclocking, but it's not necessary for everyone.

 

- Zen3 in conjunction with high clocking memory are sensitive to the memory topology of Motherboards. Check the list and scroll to the right to see Memory-Memory Topology. Not all X570 boards prefer Daisy-Chain, but most do. To boil things down: Daisy Chain prefers two Dual-Ranked RAM, for example 2x16GB sticks. T-Topology likes four Single-Ranked RAM, for example 4x8GB sticks. Do not confuse with Dual-Channel, that's something else. This is the background of what triggered Gamers Nexus' up to 10% performance increase video on RAM.

 

 

Please write if you want to add/remove/correct anything. I just didn't want to go too much into detail, as that just confuses most people. I know there is a lot to add to this, if you want to dive into details.

 

 

 

As a result of all that (I am also learning), especially the BIOS issues and RAM timing difficulties, I am sending back the old and replacing my bad VRM Motherboard and Single-Rank RAM:

MSI MPG X570 Gaming Plus -> MSI MAG X570 Tomahawk WiFi

2x8GB Ripjaw V 4000MHz CL18-22-22-42 -> 2x16GB TridentZ Neo 3600MHz CL-16-16-16-36 (Samsung B-Die)

 

The latter will receive loosened timings, then clock to 4000MHz, then tighten timings. The B-Die is supposedly a champion in that regard.

 

 

[TWC_Ace]

3 hours ago, Jaws2002 said:

 

With AMD taking the gaming crown and both xbox and play station being powered by AMD, i think, in the future game engines will be a lot better optimized for AMD hardware. 

I watched a lot of reviews and some reviewers pointed that some really new games, released this year are showing much better performance on this high core count CPUs vs the six  core counterparts. 

We'll see how that will work out. 

 

Well, we "old farts" are interested in IL2 only. With that said we dont even need to upgrade our PCs if we can run decently under our resolutions or VR.

Edited November 11, 2020 by =VARP=Tvrdi

[Gambit21]

 

 

8 hours ago, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

 

- If you don't match Infinity Fabric (IF) = Memory Controller (MC) and then add RAM which fits to that, you will have unstable frametimes. These express themselves in comparatively strong 1% amplitudes in the CPU frametime graph, as well as stronger deviating 1% and 0.1% framerates logged.

 

- To smoothen out frametimes, to eliminate microstutters, you'd want to couple them. For example: 1900MHz (IF) = 1900MHz (MC) = 3800MHz RAM clock. Afterwards, make sure to check RAM timings. Some have reported abnormal timings (all over the place) when using XMP.

 

 

I'm sure I'll be messing around in the bios playing with memory timings with my 2 sticks of 16Gigs.

Can you clarify this a little?

 

 

 

[thermoregulator]

On 11/7/2020 at 9:23 PM, WheelwrightPL said:

 

Thanks for the info. Can you run HP Reverb with reprojection turned off at CONSTANT 90Hz in career mode ? (I mean  at 100% of Reverb's native resolution with high preset, 2x MSAA, High clouds, high shadows).

Update on this topic: MSI beta BIOS solved my previous issue. I didn't have time yet to play with memory/infinity fabric settings. I have just tried (first shot) 3800 Mhz, Cl 16-16-16-36, FCLK 1900 (g.skill F4-3200C14D-32GTZN), fast ryzen dram calculator subtimings settings. Reverb g1, 112% SteamVR SS.  Everything else on stock (MSI X 570 Prestige Creation, 5900x, arctic liquid freezer II 360 AIO in push/pull,  EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 ULTRA). Ultra settings, high clouds, 2x MSAA, high shadows. I have just played a cople of career missions. Not a single drop bellow 90 Hz.

 

This was impossible to reach with 3900xt (similar settings). Judging only by the first impression, Zen 3 seem to be at least as capable as high clocked Intel (9700k 5.2 Ghz on my other system).

 

Also time diletation issue, which was significant on previous ryzens, is much better. You can set time acceleration to 4x, and it actually does something. This was previously only possible on my Intel system.

 

 

[WheelwrightPL]

2 hours ago, thermoregulator said:

Update on this topic: MSI beta BIOS solved my previous issue. I didn't have time yet to play with memory/infinity fabric settings. I have just tried (first shot) 3800 Mhz, Cl 16-16-16-36, FCLK 1900 (g.skill F4-3200C14D-32GTZN), fast ryzen dram calculator subtimings settings. Reverb g1, 112% SteamVR SS.  Everything else on stock (MSI X 570 Prestige Creation, 5900x, arctic liquid freezer II 360 AIO in push/pull,  EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 ULTRA). Ultra settings, high clouds, 2x MSAA, high shadows. I have just played a cople of career missions. Not a single drop bellow 90 Hz.

 

This was impossible to reach with 3900xt (similar settings). Judging only by the first impression, Zen 3 seem to be at least as capable as high clocked Intel (9700k 5.2 Ghz on my other system).

 

Also time diletation issue, which was significant on previous ryzens, is much better. You can set time acceleration to 4x, and it actually does something. This was previously only possible on my Intel system.

 

 

 

This gives me some hope, maybe I will go the same route with my Reverb which currently gathers dust.

Can you crank it up to 4x MSAA and extreme shadows ?

Also: do you really need 112% of the resolution ? I don't think this extra 12% makes a noticeable difference, and HP Reverb's standard resolution is already the best among all the mainstream VR headsets.

[chiliwili69]

11 hours ago, thermoregulator said:

Reverb g1, 112% SteamVR SS.  Everything else on stock (MSI X 570 Prestige Creation, 5900x, arctic liquid freezer II 360 AIO in push/pull,  EVGA GeForce RTX 3090 FTW3 ULTRA). Ultra settings, high clouds, 2x MSAA, high shadows. I have just played a cople of career missions. Not a single drop bellow 90 Hz

Thanks!

Seems you reached the Nirvana!  ?

 

[Confused_2018]

Der8auer puts an intel cryo on a 5950x

 

I think I would wait for an AMD specific.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2MtHJctd-0

 

Good luck folks.

[Jaws2002]

16 minutes ago, Confused_2018 said:

Der8auer puts an intel cryo on a 5950x

 

I think I would wait for an AMD specific.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2MtHJctd-0

 

Good luck folks.

5.3GHz across 16 cores is bloody impressive.

 

Thank you!

Edited November 15, 2020 by Jaws2002

[LuftManu]

Just installed everything today! wow! What a blast! (5600)

Just tested the Rheinland benchmark mission and no slodowns, I could even push x2 and have some room).

Also getting a lot more frames in DCS in MP with lots of AI.

 

I am really happy of my purchase at this moment. This is a beast.

[hedger72]

1 hour ago, LF_Gallahad said:

I am really happy of my purchase at this moment. This is a beast.

 

Well that certainly sounds encouraging! I have made the decision to jump onto the AMD ship with the 5600X and upgrade my aging i5 2500K - now if I can only find one of these damn chips in stock!!!

 

[LuftManu]

3 minutes ago, hedger72 said:

 

Well that certainly sounds encouraging! I have made the decision to jump onto the AMD ship with the 5600X and upgrade my aging i5 2500K - now if I can only find one of these damn chips in stock!!!

 

I recommend it if you find the original price! Don't buy overpriced!

 

If you do, you're in for a treat. I am almost sure these are the best CPUs for simming right now as their single core performance is the best and a little % than of intel. (Moreso if the 5600 just cost €300).

 

[hedger72]

16 minutes ago, LF_Gallahad said:

I recommend it if you find the original price! Don't buy overpriced!

 

I hear you! If I've held out this long, sticking with my 2500K, I'm certain I can wait a few more weeks for stocks to replenish! ?

 

Glad to hear that you managed to snag one and it's working well for you!

 

[unlikely_spider]

1 hour ago, LF_Gallahad said:

I recommend it if you find the original price! Don't buy overpriced!

 

If you do, you're in for a treat. I am almost sure these are the best CPUs for simming right now as their single core performance is the best and a little % than of intel. (Moreso if the 5600 just cost €300).

 

Good to know. I also recommend not giving in to scalpers. I just have to wait for my mobo to support it (Asus Prime X-470) then I am possibly in the market.

I do recommend the StockDrops Twitter account, which is how I snagged a 3080 from Best Buy. It looks like they are watching the new AMD CPUs now too.

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Until I can run more sophisticated benchmarks for specialised use-cases (IL-2/DCS), these should help comparison. I tuned the RTX 3080 breaking 2000MHz, Memory 2x16GB DDR4-3600 DR to CL14-15-15-30, set 5900X to PBO, but didn't disable the second Die yet, which would probably help IL-2 even more.

 

The thing is blazing fast. Blazing fast.

 

https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/35564379

 

Edited November 17, 2020 by SCG_Fenris_Wolf

[hedger72]

2 hours ago, unlikely_spider said:

I do recommend the StockDrops Twitter account, which is how I snagged a 3080 from Best Buy. It looks like they are watching the new AMD CPUs now too.

 

Awesome! Thanks for the tip! 

[chiliwili69]

11 hours ago, LF_Gallahad said:

Just installed everything today! wow! What a blast! (5600)

Just tested the Rheinland benchmark mission and no slodowns

 

This is one of the first 5600 seen here. If you have some time, could you please run also this benchmark:

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/66924-syn_vander-benchmark-v6-to-measure-il-2-performance/

 

[LuftManu]

3 hours ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

This is one of the first 5600 seen here. If you have some time, could you please run also this benchmark:

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/66924-syn_vander-benchmark-v6-to-measure-il-2-performance/

 

Of course. I have tons of work with this crazy world right now, will do asap ?

[kendo]

14 hours ago, hedger72 said:

 

Well that certainly sounds encouraging! I have made the decision to jump onto the AMD ship with the 5600X and upgrade my aging i5 2500K - now if I can only find one of these damn chips in stock!!!

 

 

I'm in exactly the same situation - will be 10 years in March since I built my i5-2500k system!  With SSD and various video card upgrades it is still coping reasonably well.

 

But looking forward to getting a 5600X, probably early in the new year.

 

Edited November 18, 2020 by kendo

[Sokol1]

An 5600X benchmark using MS FS 2020:

 

https://youtu.be/4paYpMOHYHk?t=830

 

[LuftManu]

I already posted my benchmark, but holy cow!

I had tons of fun with my Hurricane campaign and lots of denstiy of AI. A game changer.

[HunDread]

On 11/11/2020 at 5:04 PM, SCG_Fenris_Wolf said:

- Zen3 5800/5900 are sensitive to Motherboards with low quality VRMs. Check the list  for true VRM Phases, range and smart power stages. It'll help you achieve stable and smooth performance. I aim for that for VR and overclocking, but it's not necessary for everyone.

 

Could you point out what numbers you are exactly looking at? I think the only one I may have been able to identify is the number under true VRM. Like 8x on the picture. I see smart powar phases too but have no idea what's the important number there. Like is it the 70A on the picture?