Rolling_Thunder Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 1 hour ago, DD_Crash said: Luthiers failed WW2 game which DCS took over Not exactly true. "Luthiers WW2" game was a joint venture with ED it didn't fail, it's still in production just waaaaaaaay over due and unrecognizable, except for the original aircraft, from the original Kickstarter. ED fired Luthier. There's a lot of misinformation still being circulated. I know some folk will accept any and all BS, but stop spreading it around.
Jaws2002 Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 4 minutes ago, Rolling_Thunder said: Not exactly true. "Luthiers WW2" game was a joint venture with ED it didn't fail, it's still in production just waaaaaaaay over due and unrecognizable, except for the original aircraft, from the original Kickstarter. ED fired Luthier. There's a lot of misinformation still being circulated. I know some folk will accept any and all BS, but stop spreading it around. 1
dburne Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 2 hours ago, DD_Crash said: Mine is coming thanks to Luthiers failed WW2 game which DCS took over Hmm I suppose mine is too then.
sevenless Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 5 hours ago, Legioneod said: Can't wait for the P-47, gonna be interesting to see how well it handles. 34:05 and 41:43 are particularly interesting to watch. Looks very promissing.
CanadaOne Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 8 hours ago, AndyJWest said: Carry on dreaming about it if you like though... Truth be told, we're all here together because we have a penchant for playing make believe. Let us dream together. 3
AndyJWest Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 38 minutes ago, CanadaOne said: Truth be told, we're all here together because we have a penchant for playing make believe. Let us dream together. Fair enough. ? 2
CanadaOne Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 4 hours ago, Archie said: Oh man, now I've got to buy the P-47 and channel map! Wonder if there'll be a bundle deal. I hope so because I'm grabbing them both. And DCS is certainly pimping them as a matched set. Without a package deal it could hit$120Cdn. That's pricey, but I'm getting that map no matter what.
DD_fruitbat Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 10 hours ago, AndyJWest said: Neither will happen. Or not in the timescale described. Not unless you define 'DCS being in the Pacific' as a Corsair flying around with no historical opponents. And Microsoft has invested heavily in technology to use satellite data to produce a map for a civilian flight sim. There is no WW2 satellite data. If the current flight sim fails (which seems unlikely) they aren't going to want to dump core tech in order to chase a smaller market. Carry on dreaming about it if you like though... Agree completely on the Microsoft position, but there is a very good chance that you'll be able to take off in a corsair, on a Lexington class carrier and fight a zero in the Marianas before you can in great battles. It's at least being worked on and we've seen some vid. Of course, we also know DCS timescales for development, and third party sometimes questionable delivery ability! The update I'm most looking forward to in DCS however, is the damage model update, which in the words of Nick Grey is pants at the moment. At the moment, along with normal co-ops, the dangerdogz are flying a co-op campaign in p-38's in GBS thanks to Pat Wilson, and some member are also flying in a 433 squadron campaign in DCS which is getting amazing feedback for realism and immersion..... Either way for me, its a win win situation the way both sims are pushing forward
CanadaOne Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, DD_fruitbat said: Agree completely on the Microsoft position, but there is a very good chance that you'll be able to take off in a corsair, on a Lexington class carrier and fight a zero in the Marianas before you can in great battles. It's at least being worked on and we've seen some vid. Of course, we also know DCS timescales for development, and third party sometimes questionable delivery ability! The update I'm most looking forward to in DCS however, is the damage model update, which in the words of Nick Grey is pants at the moment. At the moment, along with normal co-ops, the dangerdogz are flying a co-op campaign in p-38's in GBS thanks to Pat Wilson, and some member are also flying in a 433 squadron campaign in DCS which is getting amazing feedback for realism and immersion..... Either way for me, its a win win situation the way both sims are pushing forward What surprises me is that there are some people who scoff at the idea of a carrier full of Zeros and another full of Corsairs. They'll say it's not complete or real enough or there aren't enough associated whatevers to go along with it to make it "historic". I'll tell you this, if DCS makes an interactive WWII carrier full of Corsairs, I'll buy it on day one and a schmidtload of other people will too. And I see a WWII DCS carrier happening within a year. And I agree that the sim competition is good, gets ideas moving.
DD_Crash Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 I might be wrong but I dont remember any mention of Eagle Dynamics in the kickstarter pitch for Luthiers game. I remember him showing some Korean War models and as I wasnt happy with CloD (mainly the way the map looked) and Battle of Stalingrad was heading in a strange direction I thought even with his record of delivering stuff it was worth a punt. I was very suprised the ED stepped in.
Lusekofte Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 8 minutes ago, DD_Crash said: punt. I was very suprised the ED stepped I heard rumors the other way around. That Luthier went to ED and tricked them into WW 2 era It was so much talk and rumors. I still had echoes from banana forum. Too me it is all a bundle of blur militant conspiracy quarrel
Bremspropeller Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 I have always wondered why the Hornet is so awkward to land on the boat. I think it's the slightly messed up engine-spool time in combination with the high drag in the flaps DN position. IIRC the F404 has a 4s idle-MIL (or was it blower?) time. In DCS it seems to be longer. Check this video by Mover as reference (touch and go at ~24:30 and Landing at ~27:00) T'n'G: 24:30 ENG idle or close to idle (ENG NOZ POS indicator stays "closed") 24:34 ENG MIL 24:36 ENG-sound at MIL-level 24:37 weight off wheels Landing: 27:01 ENG idle (almost at touchdown) 27:02 ENG NOZ POS indicator going open (probably engines going into ground-idle with weight on wheels and/ or wheel spin-up) Now this is just a rough estimate, but it's one of the more pressing core FM-issues of the Hornet to me.
Rolling_Thunder Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 4 hours ago, DD_Crash said: I might be wrong but I dont remember any mention of Eagle Dynamics in the kickstarter pitch for Luthiers game. I remember him showing some Korean War models and as I wasnt happy with CloD (mainly the way the map looked) and Battle of Stalingrad was heading in a strange direction I thought even with his record of delivering stuff it was worth a punt. I was very suprised the ED stepped in. From The Kickstarter page " under The project is a joint venture between RRG Studios and Eagle Dynamics. Its all there on the page. Also from here "The exception will be the circumstances which led to this change in product management and development." People will believe what they want to believe. They would rather believe that ED jumped in and saved the project from failure rather than believe they were shafted. 1
Rolling_Thunder Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, DD_Crash said: I was wrong Its all good. The usual story has done its rounds and has become the "truth" that most folk believe and repeat.
DD_Fenrir Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 No Thunder you're truth is off. ED had the Hornet, update to version 2.5 graphics engine, the planned Modern Air Combat, planned Vulkan integration and maintainance of it's existing modules on it's hands - they didn't deem the time or resources available to expand the WW2 era with their own staff. The idea was to hand off development of WW2 content to a party experienced in the genre; EDs role as a partner would be providing the engine and acting as QC and giving their approval on what RRG developed. That is the partnership. Back at the very inception no-one, even Luthier was sure what iteration that DCS:WW2 was going to take, that much was clear. Whether it was going to be a stand alone game using the DCS core, or whether it was going with a GBS style, independent but integratable modules or a full integration into DCS World was still to be decided. As development panned out it then looked as if the latter was going to make most sense. But development updates were slow, little progress seemed to be coming and ultimately RRG didn't hit their targets. ED ultimately were obliged to terminate their contract. They had every right to leave the WW2 stuff out as half baked vaporware but rather than leave all their kickstarters dead in the water having paid a lot of money ED took over the development of the WW2 content - except the Normandy map which they contracted out to Ugra media, the very same Ugra media responsible for the Po-2/U-2 available in GBS.
Rolling_Thunder Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, DD_Fenrir said: No Thunder you're truth is off. ED had the Hornet, update to version 2.5 graphics engine, the planned Modern Air Combat, planned Vulkan integration and maintainance of it's existing modules on it's hands - they didn't deem the time or resources available to expand the WW2 era with their own staff. The idea was to hand off development of WW2 content to a party experienced in the genre; EDs role as a partner would be providing the engine and acting as QC and giving their approval on what RRG developed. That is the partnership. Back at the very inception no-one, even Luthier was sure what iteration that DCS:WW2 was going to take, that much was clear. Whether it was going to be a stand alone game using the DCS core, or whether it was going with a GBS style, independent but integratable modules or a full integration into DCS World was still to be decided. As development panned out it then looked as if the latter was going to make most sense. But development updates were slow, little progress seemed to be coming and ultimately RRG didn't hit their targets. ED ultimately were obliged to terminate their contract. They had every right to leave the WW2 stuff out as half baked vaporware but rather than leave all their kickstarters dead in the water having paid a lot of money ED took over the development of the WW2 content - except the Normandy map which they contracted out to Ugra media, the very same Ugra media responsible for the Po-2/U-2 available in GBS. Where did you get that from? Show me the source of your information otherwise its just conjecture on your part. "The vast majority of funds needed to finance this project have and will continue to come from Eagle Dynamics (not Kickstarter). To give you a feel… just the Eagle Dynamics developed and funded flight model for the Bf-109K has already cost us about 120k USD" THAT is from Wags. More than just "providing the engine and acting as QC"
SCG_OpticFlow Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 On 5/31/2020 at 11:41 PM, Rolling_Thunder said: Considering the lack of official help and complexities, there are some quite outstanding mods for DCS. The fact that one can, in theory, make your own aircraft, ships, ground assets is one of the great things about DCS. There are a lot of failed mods and with each update a lot of mods become broken but the modding community over there is pretty impressive. It is a philosophy of openness in many aspects. Like for the example the free map and the two free planes (which have been kept more or less up-to-date). Or how easy it is to make your own mission with the editor inside the game. Or allowing all these mods (including the SRS Radio mod). Or allowing 3rd parties to make their own models and sell them inside the DCS World through the ED payment/authentication mechanics. You see small studios with handful of employees like Leatherneck or even Razbam still being able to survive in this business because ED provides the eco-system for them. Yugra made the Normandy map for DCS and while there were many complaints about the early versions, they improved it a lot in the recent months and now it is joy to fly on it. At the same time Yugra did the Flying Circus map for IL2 as a subcontractor and it looks IMO mediocre (especially the No Mans Land). Why the difference in quality? Is it a difference in the incentives?
AndyJWest Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 Is there really any point in rehashing the DCS WW2 Kickstarter saga yet again? Regardless of what happened, we are were we are now - with at least some DCS WW2 stuff under development, albeit at a slow pace. Griping about it, and arguing over facts when we clearly aren't in full possession of them isn't going to change anything.
Rolling_Thunder Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) 54 minutes ago, OpticFlow said: Is it a difference in the incentives? I think its a limitation of the engine. Something I believe they're working on 7 minutes ago, AndyJWest said: Is there really any point in rehashing the DCS WW2 Kickstarter saga yet again? Regardless of what happened, we are were we are now - with at least some DCS WW2 stuff under development, albeit at a slow pace. Griping about it, and arguing over facts when we clearly aren't in full possession of them isn't going to change anything. I will rehash it over and over when folk continue to paint ED as the knights on white horses over the debacle. and nobody was griping, merely pointing out what's in black and white. Edited June 2, 2020 by Rolling_Thunder 1
LLv34_Flanker Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 S! @Bremspropeller Nozzle position on the F/A-18 goes like: engine off - closed, idle - open, mil power - closed, mil max/afterburner - open. There is a detent for flight idle and ground idle as well as for afterburner and shut down. Not so complicated as it sounds 1
Bremspropeller Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 11 minutes ago, LLv34_Flanker said: S! @Bremspropeller Nozzle position on the F/A-18 goes like: engine off - closed, idle - open, mil power - closed, mil max/afterburner - open. There is a detent for flight idle and ground idle as well as for afterburner and shut down. Not so complicated as it sounds Do you have a document that has a diagram on the nozzle-schedule? The F110 closes the nozzle fairly early (not just at reaching MIL) - and that one is fairly similar to the F404 (albeit larger).
JG7_X-Man Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 (edited) On 4/12/2018 at 1:38 PM, Gambit21 said: They should have stuck with jets and committed to Korea years and years ago. I mean it still wouldn't be finished - let's not get silly. It would have been a worthwhile and wise endeavor though. Instead just more aircraft with no plausible theater. That makes me the most sad where the MiG 15 comes in because they could have pulled me back in with that. New title - DCS Air Show This is the prime example of very smart group of guys with no direction! For the life of me, I don't understand why they introduce the F-86 and MiG-15/19/21 without a map to support a plausible theater. If the idea of just releasing random aircraft haphazardly is the business strategy - they they are on point. If the idea is to cultivate an identity, I'd call that a miss. -------------------------------------------- To add to the DCS lack of direction - they just released a 1944 pre D-Day Channel map without the correct aircraft for the period yet. Edited June 6, 2020 by JG7_X-Man
9./JG27DefaultFace Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 Weren't those both made by Belsimtek, which was a 3rd Party at the time..... 1
Trooper117 Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 It all comes under the DCS banner.... it's not as if 'they' just decided to stick them in there without permission, lol! 1
kestrel79 Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 I think I get my P-47 free from the Kickstarter as well. I think I got the 3 plane package and went with the 109, 190, and P-47. The Channel Map looks great wow.
CanadaOne Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 Schmucks! They have the P-47 and the Channel map listed on Steam for release tomorrow but no prices.
Dijital_Majik Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 1 hour ago, 9./JG27DefaultFace said: Weren't those both made by Belsimtek, which was a 3rd Party at the time..... IIRC Belsimtek were always an ED team, but sent out as an example of what a third-party could operate like, until they were "re-absorbed" into ED.
CanadaOne Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 Damn, no mention of a bundle deal either. Too bad. They've been pimping the P-47 along with the Channel map, it really looked like there might be a deal.
CanadaOne Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 I've seen nothing at the DCS site about either the P-47 or the map coming out, but Steam has them listed for tomorrow. Weird. This game is not yet available on Steam Planned Release Date: 3 June This game plans to unlock in approximately 19 hours
DD_Arthur Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, CanadaOne said: Weird. Wellllll.....they handed out copies to every YouTube Tom, Dick and Harry over the weekend and 3rd. June is this Friday. Perhaps in these strange times the DCS left hand does not know what the DCS right hand is up to and you might just get lucky......
Bremspropeller Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 27 minutes ago, DD_Arthur said: and 3rd. June is this Friday. Make sure you're running on an updated calendar-driver. 2020 is the current build-version. 2 1
DD_Arthur Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 Thanks Brems. I’m loosing my freakin’ marbles. Weeks upon weeks of wall to wall sunshine in the midst of a great plague. It’s just not British you know? 1 1
CanadaOne Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 1 hour ago, DD_Arthur said: ...and 3rd. June is this Friday. Not on Earth. 1
9./JG27DefaultFace Posted June 2, 2020 Posted June 2, 2020 Its planned for tomorrow, they mentioned it in some of the livestreams/discord.
CanadaOne Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 Still no prices on Steam. My guess is $45 to $55 for the Channel map and $65 for the P-47. Knock of $15 with a bundle and I'll be happy.
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