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Jason_Williams

Stutters in Multiplayer Research

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Guys,

 

The stuttering topic is very complex because we have seemingly independent issues in SP as well as MP.  We need to be more scientific in this work.

We need help from Server Operators and evidence from users to pinpoint the cause.

 

- Multiplayer Stutters appear to be random on MP servers that seem to be related to either mission design, server load, data packets, object loading, players entering or exiting or some other factor. 

Add Example of MP Stutters

NOTE: If you are on a server with stuttering, please do the following.
- Record a track of the stuttering.
- Please tell us if the track stutters when you play it back.
- Note how many users were on the server when stuttering occurred. 
- Save the mission files (they are downloaded to your install) so we can examine.

Important: You should not help searching for MP stutters unless you have achieved smooth results in SP first! We need to eliminate any stutters you are seeing from SP stutters on your machine before testing MP stutters.

 

More soon...

Jason

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I elimnated my stutters which were apparent when I was looking around in cockpit with track IR . Before  recent patch game was smooth in SP and MP environment. Capping fps to 80 and reduced renders a bit plus set Nvidia low latency to aggressive . Reloaded the game and tested  the same high congested multiplayer mission  at Wings of Liberty - game become smooth again. 

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GN.

Recorded track on Combat Box with severe stuttering while fliying, without other planes on sight. Server was full 64/64.

Played the track later and no stutter was visible.

How do I send you the mission files?

 

Regards,

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I play 100% multi-player. But I set up an 8 vs 8 quick combat. I noticed a few mild stutters, nothing big.

Stutters are most prevalent in multi-player.

I wish I was as good in multi-player as I was in single player. 

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14 hours ago, ECV56_Lubermatz said:

GN.

 

Played the track later and no stutter was visible.

 

I think that has to to with how tracks are saved in IL2. IIRC they are data files that the game replays, not actual videos. Later on I will try with a direct capture from the game using OBS. Another alternative would be Nvidia Shadowplay for those that have it installed.

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 I also made a track during live play. Reviewing the track the stuttering seemed less severe than the live experience.

 

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If you can, record video at the same time as recording the track. Then you can compare how the screen looks when you fly to the track.

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I flew in Combat Box today after flying in SP quite a bit. Inside the double layer clouds it was hitting frame rate but stuttering was more severe than the 10-15 FPS drop I was seeing.  It seemed like it was dropping multiples of frames for brief moments.Once out of and away from clouds it smoothed out. I never ever saw my FPS drop below the pinned rate of 60 before. Was hitting 45 at moments with all the settings maxed out while scanning the sky with TrackIR,

:salute:

Skud

Post Scriptum

In single player there is zero frame hit from clouds. Another thing I noticed is that my CPU was pinning at times. That never happened before.

 

Edited by ATAG_SKUD
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On 10/25/2019 at 11:44 PM, Jason_Williams said:

We need to be more scientific in this work.

 

Very low settings:

settings.thumb.png.c0d1ac5518b63f2c8db191036c88a44d.png

 

 

Offline

 

Offline is very smooth:

 

Frametimes:

offline.thumb.png.781da8c193f6edf28295f8e8fcddb4d3.png

 

offline.zip

 

 

Berloga 44 players

 

There are no ground units on this server and no buildings. However there are stutters even at lowest settings on a powerful setup

 

In-game frametimes.

berloga_realtime.thumb.png.a73e22f43ddf756d1f2d7968ccde30f1.png

 

Record:

 

Frametimes for record playback:

berloga_record.thumb.png.c08c8d06c3db70a07a6f3154ab2bd659.png

 

Mission + record attached

 

berloga_44players.zip

 

 

Liberty 84 players

 

Same for liberty. Even more stutters here.

 

 

Frametimes in-game:

liberty_realtime.thumb.png.6f848682223bc85931d7bcedaae6e3be.png

 

Record is smoother (But there are glithes in head position which is strange a bit):

 

Frametimes when playing the record from WoL:

 

liberty_record.thumb.png.a72c108c127ab4ee8f975e5ecb5e021a.png

 

Record + mission (more than 5 MB):

https://yadi.sk/d/dPS2mFRJxiJOnQ

 

 

There are stutters even at very low settings on a powerful setup and only in MP.

Edited by TUS_Samuel
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My experience of the stuttering is not limited to MP but definitely much worse than SP. It appeard to happen after the last update. 

 

Bergola is one of the best performing MP servers I have found from a FPS perspective and possibly related to clear skys and virtually no trees. Despite seeing 89FPS on there in VR, I am experiencing stuttering. I predominantly fly Spitfire MkIX. 

 

I tried the similar Bergola MP location, weather etc in SP mode and with 4 x AI opponents I saw similar stutters as MP, but definitely less pronounced. 

 

For me, the stuttering does not show on flight records made within the game and does not seem to affect FPS in itself. 

 

I hope this helps. 

 

 

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My GTX970 did NOT like Use 4K Textures option the most. In fact most severe stuttering was caused by having it ON and ingame Vsync.

Just my conclusions after days of trying out different options.

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I would ask kindly if we could keep this thread open until after the update to clouds in Diary 233 as posted Oct 11th is implemented. It may offer a different opportunity to assess this once implemented, as the topic is complex. Thank you,

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On 10/28/2019 at 6:40 PM, [Pb]Slegawsky said:

My GTX970 did NOT like Use 4K Textures option the most. In fact most severe stuttering was caused by having it ON and ingame Vsync.

Just my conclusions after days of trying out different options.

Same here. Once I unticked 4k textures I very rarely experience any stutters. I have in game vsync ON and full screen unticked. Last time we had stutters it was other way around. It was needed to turn ON 4k textures. This game engine is super odd. Why they just didnt go with the (now polished) CLOD engine? Probably because it needs more time to build stuff. Its superb. Cockpits, FM,...etc.

Edited by =VARP=Tvrdi
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Windows 7 64 Bit

i5 3570k - 3.40 + 3.40

RAM 8 GB

GTX 1060

Reshader Programm in the game

Track IR5

Asus GPU Tweak II

 

Today I bought finally Bodenplatte for all the nice late war stuff.

Well, lets say it like this.

I can fly on Moscow, Stalingrad, Kuban (!) on high settings without any problems. I can record via ingame function and NVIDIA shadowplay.

On the new map Rheinland, I have plenty of problems.

 

Problems are:

Microstutters, Screen Freezes between 1 and 10 seconds (even on park positions by headmovement).

Today I was in the air on Rheinland, than freezes, stutters and suddenly a black screen. My plane was going forward and backwards plenty times,

the server did not got all data from me as I saw in some message before blackscreen.

Even my NVIDIA shadowplay stoped recording without any command.

Also the ingame record function stopped without any command.

In the end, there was a blackscreen, even before everything is slow on the mission briefing map.

Even the communication on Diskord were interrupted than.

 

Off course:

That was not the first encounter on Rheinland map.

I tried to tune down my graphic settings in various setup's. 0 result.

I turned off all cockpit photos, ... a little result on all other maps.

I turned down my visibility, shadow's, clouds, textures.... 0 result.

I started to overclock the GPU via Asus GPU Tweak II programm. ....runs better now on all other maps, like pre-Update wise.

In the task manager, I gave the IL-2.exe the highest priority. 0 result on Rheinland.

I also increased the exfiltrated GPU resources on 1.5 times higher (as Microsoft recommends for manually doing so). 0 result on Rheinland.

 

I've read in the forum, that people with better systems than mine, have same problems, and other people with older systems than mine, dont experience such things at all.

Slowly, its really annoying.

As I said, I tried different setups, but nothing was really helpful and as everything is running pretty smoothly over Krasnodar with plenty of planes around and explosions, I think

it must have something to do with Rheinland.

Yes, also the "far distant buildings" options did not helped out.

I tried everything.

 

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13 hours ago, KG_S_Kalle_Kalutz82 said:

Windows 7 64 Bit

i5 3570k - 3.40 + 3.40

RAM 8 GB

GTX 1060

Reshader Programm in the game

Track IR5

Asus GPU Tweak II

 

Today I bought finally Bodenplatte for all the nice late war stuff.

Well, lets say it like this.

I can fly on Moscow, Stalingrad, Kuban (!) on high settings without any problems. I can record via ingame function and NVIDIA shadowplay.

On the new map Rheinland, I have plenty of problems.

 

Problems are:

Microstutters, Screen Freezes between 1 and 10 seconds (even on park positions by headmovement).

Today I was in the air on Rheinland, than freezes, stutters and suddenly a black screen. My plane was going forward and backwards plenty times,

the server did not got all data from me as I saw in some message before blackscreen.

Even my NVIDIA shadowplay stoped recording without any command.

Also the ingame record function stopped without any command.

In the end, there was a blackscreen, even before everything is slow on the mission briefing map.

Even the communication on Diskord were interrupted than.

 

Off course:

That was not the first encounter on Rheinland map.

I tried to tune down my graphic settings in various setup's. 0 result.

I turned off all cockpit photos, ... a little result on all other maps.

I turned down my visibility, shadow's, clouds, textures.... 0 result.

I started to overclock the GPU via Asus GPU Tweak II programm. ....runs better now on all other maps, like pre-Update wise.

In the task manager, I gave the IL-2.exe the highest priority. 0 result on Rheinland.

I also increased the exfiltrated GPU resources on 1.5 times higher (as Microsoft recommends for manually doing so). 0 result on Rheinland.

 

I've read in the forum, that people with better systems than mine, have same problems, and other people with older systems than mine, dont experience such things at all.

Slowly, its really annoying.

As I said, I tried different setups, but nothing was really helpful and as everything is running pretty smoothly over Krasnodar with plenty of planes around and explosions, I think

it must have something to do with Rheinland.

Yes, also the "far distant buildings" options did not helped out.

I tried everything.

 

Do you get the problems with the Rheinland map when offline as well, or just when you are online?

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Since the last update I notice stong microstuttering in MP but single player is OK. In game setting set all to the highest. G-sync LCD.

SP: my FPS fluctuate from 80 to 120 (I have 120 FPS limit set in game) and use TrackIR. Regardless of actual FPS everything is always smooth.

MP: very annoing microstuttering while using TrackIR. Even if my FPS reach 120 it is noticeable. I fly mainly at KOTA, WOL and Combat Box. The suttering is so intense that my eyes pains very soon so I now have to completely withdraw from MP until the solution is found.

Before update I had no problem to fly MP. No change in settigs.

 

P.S. I fly mainly new Bodenplatte map but tried other older maps as well and it seems to have the same problem at MP.

P.P.S. I have Hi-end PC - see my signature.

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On 11/1/2019 at 3:13 PM, RedKestrel said:

Do you get the problems with the Rheinland map when offline as well, or just when you are online?

 

Its a little bit better offline, but in multiplayer its just worse as hell.

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Spiel ist unspielbar,ein unvollständiges Produkt (was macht der Entwickler dagegen???)

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8 hours ago, 9./JG54_GERMANWOLF said:

Stutters in Mp Berloga

Yep, that's what it looks like: The world's heart skips a beat or two every now and then.

 

:drinks:

Mike

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15 hours ago, 9./JG54_GERMANWOLF said:

Stutters in Mp Berloga

 

 This is exacly what I notce in my Computer even with 100+fps

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19 minutes ago, =LG=Lens said:

This is exacly what I notce in my Computer

Same. I've eliminated the stutters in SP, but these (and longer) stutters in MP are what I'm experiencing now.

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I am a passionate fan of Il-2 Great Battles. First, I would like to express sincere respect to the team of enthusiasts who are bringing air simulation to a really new level. Constantly improving and developing Il-2 simulator they give us the opportunity to enjoy the wonderful hobby of virtual flights. Thanks for the job.

Being a frequent online player, I can say that IL-2 Great Battles gameplay is the best among all for the network air battles. However, I think some improvements could be made in network performance.

In the enclosed file (Dserver Test report) you can find the Dserver performance test report which has been made by our friend Rizer after a significant amount of test work. He has created his own software for network data collection and used applications for network simulation. This was done in 2016 but as far as we can see, there were no big changes in DSerever network performance since that time. We suppose that the stutters that we experience in multiplayer game may sometimes be caused by DServer delays.

Could you please see if something can be done about these issues?

Link to the original text of the report: https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/5132-dserver-сетевые-и-технические-проблемы/

 

In addition, here is a short description of online game airplane positioning test (file Positioning Test). This test has been done by our friends with the help of Tackview software.

Dserver Test report.zip Positioning Test.zip

Edited by Kirill
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After last patch, I have found that most of my remaining stutters in MP have disappeared in normal flight and on the ground, as before. However, I still get stutters when there are lots of players around or around ground targets, particularly ground targets with active AA. I got a big stutter/freeze during a dive in on a ground target last night. Not a 'micro-stutter' but a 'macro-stutter' - cockpit froze, propeller froze, saw smoke from my mixture briefly in the cockpit view - then game resumed and it was fine for a while but a little jumpy around the ground target. This was on Combat Box last night with a nearly full server.

Zooming in on big cities caused little hitches now and then, I think that is graphics related. But around ground targets and enemy planes, in relatively open areas free of large numbers of buildings, was where I am seeing most of the stutters.

I completely forgot to record a track/video last night when I was able to get on and fly, I will try and do that next time I am flying. 

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According to my observations, delays occur in places of congestion of players and ground targets(AI). There are still questions for mapmaker's when a full server and all pilots fly in one square. it is necessary to stretch the targets on the map or reduce the number of players to be acceptable SPS and TD at the server.

Edited by -DED-Rapidus

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22 hours ago, 9./JG54_GERMANWOLF said:

micro freezes continue, only better if I leave the graphics at low☹️

I asked about computer and monitor because I had sever stutters for over year.  I ended up with amd 2700x processor with 144hz monitor and 2080card at some point, and it seems to have gone away.  I had 2080 in intel computer before i brought it over to the amd and the stutters were still there at that point. Most importantly, it seems to be gone in vr reverb also , i still get below 60 fps in reverb from time to time but they gone.  It seems to not like 4 core intel processors, never checked reverb with intel 4 core cpu though.  Amd cpu are cheaper at least. I had both monitors before cpu switch and the stutters were present with both.

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On 11/1/2019 at 1:35 AM, KG_S_Kalle_Kalutz82 said:

Windows 7 64 Bit

i5 3570k - 3.40 + 3.40

RAM 8 GB

GTX 1060

Reshader Programm in the game

Track IR5

Asus GPU Tweak II

 

Today I bought finally Bodenplatte for all the nice late war stuff.

Well, lets say it like this.

I can fly on Moscow, Stalingrad, Kuban (!) on high settings without any problems. I can record via ingame function and NVIDIA shadowplay.

On the new map Rheinland, I have plenty of problems.

 

Problems are:

Microstutters, Screen Freezes between 1 and 10 seconds (even on park positions by headmovement).

Today I was in the air on Rheinland, than freezes, stutters and suddenly a black screen. My plane was going forward and backwards plenty times,

the server did not got all data from me as I saw in some message before blackscreen.

Even my NVIDIA shadowplay stoped recording without any command.

Also the ingame record function stopped without any command.

In the end, there was a blackscreen, even before everything is slow on the mission briefing map.

Even the communication on Diskord were interrupted than.

 

Off course:

That was not the first encounter on Rheinland map.

I tried to tune down my graphic settings in various setup's. 0 result.

I turned off all cockpit photos, ... a little result on all other maps.

I turned down my visibility, shadow's, clouds, textures.... 0 result.

I started to overclock the GPU via Asus GPU Tweak II programm. ....runs better now on all other maps, like pre-Update wise.

In the task manager, I gave the IL-2.exe the highest priority. 0 result on Rheinland.

I also increased the exfiltrated GPU resources on 1.5 times higher (as Microsoft recommends for manually doing so). 0 result on Rheinland.

 

I've read in the forum, that people with better systems than mine, have same problems, and other people with older systems than mine, dont experience such things at all.

Slowly, its really annoying.

As I said, I tried different setups, but nothing was really helpful and as everything is running pretty smoothly over Krasnodar with plenty of planes around and explosions, I think

it must have something to do with Rheinland.

Yes, also the "far distant buildings" options did not helped out.

I tried everything.

 

 

Addition from 09.11.2019

Unfortunally not the first and single "Micro"-Stutter-Freeze

 

 

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What types and speeds of hard drive to people have?  I know it's considered an 'outdated' type of issue with SDDs being more common but, can it still exist?  Perhaps loading optimization for lower performance drives could help? 

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The problem still occurs on fast SSD's, so I don't think it's relevant (especially to multi-player environment). 

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9 hours ago, Mobile_BBQ said:

What types and speeds of hard drive to people have?  I know it's considered an 'outdated' type of issue with SDDs being more common but, can it still exist?  Perhaps loading optimization for lower performance drives could help? 

 

I'm running the game of SSD, but OS on HDD.

 

Stutters are much worse on Rheinland map more than others and much worse when theres clouds and other players.

 

In VR, stutters are really nauseating and have also experienced audio glitches with them at times too.

 

Just to add, other graphics issues since BP update are towns being drawn whilst looking and plane skins/ loadout/ pilots appearing/ dissapearing whilst looking around in the AF. (Not sure if theres a different thread for those?).

 

It's a reall shame as some awesome work gone into these new planes, so hope they fix soon. 🤔

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2 hours ago, Nake350 said:

 

I'm running the game of SSD, but OS on HDD.

 

Stutters are much worse on Rheinland map more than others and much worse when theres clouds and other players.

 

In VR, stutters are really nauseating and have also experienced audio glitches with them at times too.

 

Just to add, other graphics issues since BP update are towns being drawn whilst looking and plane skins/ loadout/ pilots appearing/ dissapearing whilst looking around in the AF. (Not sure if theres a different thread for those?).

 

It's a reall shame as some awesome work gone into these new planes, so hope they fix soon. 🤔

You really should put the OS on that SSD as well.

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36 minutes ago, icecream said:

You really should put the OS on that SSD as well.

Very true!... I'm on it 👍

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I've tried a lot of things, nothing worked perfectly. What kinda works was setting Vsnc ON, closing FPS (matching my monitor Hz) and setting triple buffering in Nvida settings. It was better than before, but stutters still occurred. What fixed stutters for me was turning on SSAO 🤨

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I think the stutter issue is very complex and I think this can't be fix permanently by users - as we all can see in this and older topics about stuttering,

everybody has some findings in their fiddling, but there is actually no real persistent solution which cures this stuttering for all of us.

 

Of course everybody has his own hardware, there are lots of setups what makes it even more difficult to find a permanent solution. For some of us

fullscreen is the way to mitigate stuttering, for others it's the opposite, Vsync ON/OFF in game etc.

 

And still, I suspect the engine of this game might be the source of this issue, especially since version 3.001 I observed this. And that said, the last

3 maps are affected the most (BOBP, ARAS, Prokhorovka) - maybe these need some more optimization? I don't know.

 

Just one thing I can say is, that having the HUD (technochat, instruments) toggled off, helps immensely to mitigate stutters! It's a game changer,

at least for me.

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the change to DX-11 was perfect at that time ...... I had more FPS and it was really smooth.........for my CPU and Nvidia card.!!!!

but there were problems with AMD cards any particle effects are not in order,Shortly thereafter, there was a hotfix for it and since then I could not play fullscreen anymore and the stuttering started........Since then, nothing has improved, but it has gotten worse.......For me the problem lies in the Engien or the Net-code......

but I do not give up the hope that the problem will be solved soon,and then the new battlefield can be announced !!!!

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