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II./JG77_motoadve

Wake turbulence, adding realism.

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Some people say its modeled in single player, if its modeled its very subtle, have not felt it.

Wish it was modeled properly in single player and MP,  dont know if it could be done or not, but if done , the realism would be amazing,it could be a game changer, no more sneak on your 6 at 100 yards and shoot you down easily.

 

Wake turbulence its nasty IRL, moves you around a bit , but the worse part is your controls loose authority, they become slow and unresponsive.

Definitely will throw your aim off.

Here is a couple of pics I took yesterday while dogfighting in the CJ6s, couple of times crossed the wake turbulence, was nasty, staying at dead six can be very challenging, you want to avoid the wake turbulence, its not very wide, you get an exact idea where it is most of the time.

 

While dogfighting , I was amazed as how similar it looked to Il2 in VR, we were not  pulling high G, was mostly low dogfight, and yes same combat maneuvers as in the sim work real good.😁

 

What was really different was presence of wake turbulence, if implemented will add lots of realism.fjfj.jpg.afc60fce77b4c250c68645ae21c34a6c.jpgwake tur image.thumb.png.f8edb22faa298dda84c760094124ed0b.pngbulence.

 

 

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It is absolutely 100% in single player. Dcs tried enabling it online and the server crashes or comes to a crawl. It's not happening online. 

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If it is in single player, its very subtle, I fly lots of SP and its not an issue.

Does not need to be a bomber wake turbulence, a fighter wake turbulence is strong enough to put your plane upside down, if too close, and fast,  it happened at Reno air races with a P51.

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But, Motoadve, in your real life simulated dogfights did wake turbulence really play a role ?

 

I do identify it all of the time in my towing times ( I only fly gliders ) but, I never thought about it's relevance for instance during a dogfight between my Me109 E and whoever I'm after 🙂 unless it's a bomber...

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Posted (edited)

Read many times (pilot bibliographys) that staying at 6 will throw your aim do to propwash , same with jetwash . Accurate aim would be very hard. In modern times there are regulation about time in between one and next plane landings do to this also.

Edited by 307_Tomcat

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I have also read that it can cause sudden stalls (in an article about mock dogfighting in 3/4 size WW1 replicas): because the air is swirling about, your AoA can suddenly change, perhaps only on one wing, with drastic results.

 

There is some modelling in SP - perhaps it is simply a propwash "tube" that extends behind the plane. The effect is similar to setting turbulence on in the weather options - it is just a bit bumpy.

 

 

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6 hours ago, jcomm-il2 said:

But, Motoadve, in your real life simulated dogfights did wake turbulence really play a role ?

 

I do identify it all of the time in my towing times ( I only fly gliders ) but, I never thought about it's relevance for instance during a dogfight between my Me109 E and whoever I'm after 🙂 unless it's a bomber...

 

Definitely wake turbulence pays a role in the real life simulated dogfights, I try to avoid it,  usually you kind of know where it is going to be ,  when you hit it, you loose quite a bit of control authority , there is a jolt, turbulence, it throws you around some.

 

In the simulator,  a fighter shooting at another plane from dead six, it will throw your aim off for sure.

Maybe  it is too complicated to implement it for MP, hopefully implemented in a proper way , closer to reality in single player, I have never seen this in any other simulator.

 

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In my experience anyway, Multiplayer dogfights rarely result in a straight shot from dead six regardless. If its a bounce they tend to come up from underneath at low six or at high angle. in a dogfight everyone's rolling and turning so much that its extremely rare to get a shot that's less than 20 degrees AOT.

So something that would be cool to see but wouldn't change the multiplayer dynamic all that much I think. 

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26 minutes ago, RedKestrel said:

In my experience anyway, Multiplayer dogfights rarely result in a straight shot from dead six regardless. If its a bounce they tend to come up from underneath at low six or at high angle. in a dogfight everyone's rolling and turning so much that its extremely rare to get a shot that's less than 20 degrees AOT.

So something that would be cool to see but wouldn't change the multiplayer dynamic all that much I think. 

Many many kills are dead six shots in servers like TAW, the best pilots kill that way and dont get involved in dogfights, this is how they survive.

Usually the victim is cruising along unaware, happens often.

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2 hours ago, II./JG77_motoadve said:

 

Definitely wake turbulence pays a role in the real life simulated dogfights, I try to avoid it,  usually you kind of know where it is going to be ,  when you hit it, you loose quite a bit of control authority , there is a jolt, turbulence, it throws you around some.

 

In the simulator,  a fighter shooting at another plane from dead six, it will throw your aim off for sure.

Maybe  it is too complicated to implement it for MP, hopefully implemented in a proper way , closer to reality in single player, I have never seen this in any other simulator.

 

 

At what kind of ranges did you feel the wake turbulence ? I think for large Aircraft it can be felt at 3 miles ? Just wondered in fighter sized AC at what range it becomes a problem, typically I like to set my convergence for 250 meters

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Just now, ACG_Herne said:

 

At what kind of ranges did you feel the wake turbulence ? I think for large Aircraft it can be felt at 3 miles ? Just wondered in fighter sized AC at what range it becomes a problem, typically I like to set my convergence for 250 meters

Fighter size planes 1,000 meters or so you can feel it for sure, of course the closer you are, the faster both planes are, and  the bigger the planes, changes the level of wake turbulence.

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20 hours ago, ACG_Herne said:

At what kind of ranges did you feel the wake turbulence ? I think for large Aircraft it can be felt at 3 miles ? Just wondered in fighter sized AC at what range it becomes a problem, typically I like to set my convergence for 250 meters

 

Don't think in distances, think in time. The usual spacing for a smaller aircraft trailing a larger aircraft is 2-3 minutes. It depends on your relative wake-category.

The wakes need TIME to die down.

 

The faster the air speed of the vortex-generating airplane, the longer the active trail of wakes. At airliner cruise-speeds, "wakes of 25NM length" aren't unheard of:

https://avherald.com/h?article=4a5e80f3

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I would love this feature for a diffrent reason; it would add intresting aspects to formation keeping.

IIRC, ROF had wake turbulance in MP.

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