Developer Diary, Part 57

[Emgy]

Didn't one of the guys on this forum test 2700 and 2500rpm? I remember reading his engine didn't blow exactly at the minute mark, I think it was +20 and +40 secs, dunno where to find that post. Will be easy to test tomorrow.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Calvamos

[Venturi]

Detonation. https://www.hastingsmfg.com/ServiceTips/detonation_and_preignition.htm

 

 

 

You can see the scoring on the side of the piston, above in the first picture. This indicates that the entire engine, including the bearings and cylinder walls, was receiving immense hammering during the detonation process.

 

Preignition/detonation can occur from hotspot areas, which causes a hammering effect into the piston. This is only ONE aspect of reaching the mechanical limitations of an engine - detonation can be achieved in several ways by the operator. Note the above article. It should not be taken as a complete engine failure, rather as a loss of one cylinder's power, unbalancing the entire rotating assembly, also indicating that other cylinders are near to complete destruction as well.

 

First sign should be, vibration and loss of power. Not complete engine destruction, if this is the first issue to arise. Vibration will... lead to further damage.

 

For me, this is definitive as relates to this situation:

 

http://kurfurst.org/Engine/Boostclearances/DB605_142ban_June1942.html

"If, in spite of these regulations, a piston does burn through, this is indicated by a strong regular vibration of the engine.
It is still possible to reach the nearest friendly base if the stress is immidiately reduced to about 1600 revs. and the lowest possible boost pressure. The vibration of the engine as a result of piston damage
remains unchanged when both magneto 1 and magneto 2 are switched on, so
that it is possible to confuse it with the a damaged sparking plug. On
the bench, bursts of blue vapour are emitted from the housing ventillator
when a piston is damaged."

Edited March 20, 2014 by Venturi

[Brano]

A few footages of the Yak-1

Making Yak-1 at Saratov Aviation Plant № 292.

Only in Russian, sorry(

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmKo47oG7DI

That is Yak 3 production,late war.

[71st_AH_Hooves]

That is Yak 3 production,late war.

Ah man Its in Russian.....  Was excited to hear what it had to say.   Bummer.  And no CC 

[Thrasher]

Please let me play!!

 

Only complaint..

 

I try to log in and it says a new version is available and I have no idea where to download it.

 

Have mercy.. I just gave you 95 dollars I just want to play it more than 2 days a week lol....

 

I am not a rich man.. I just love your games!

 

If you make it where I can log in and fly no matter what the heck is going on.. I could toss you another 100 bucks.. just saying.

 

But if I do that.. I want founders status!

 

A hundred bucks is more than a weeks worth of tasty groceries!!

Edited March 21, 2014 by TRSThrasher

[II./JG27_Rich]

Detonation. https://www.hastingsmfg.com/ServiceTips/detonation_and_preignition.htm

 

 

 

You can see the scoring on the side of the piston, above in the first picture. This indicates that the entire engine, including the bearings and cylinder walls, was receiving immense hammering during the detonation process.

 

Preignition/detonation can occur from hotspot areas, which causes a hammering effect into the piston. This is only ONE aspect of reaching the mechanical limitations of an engine - detonation can be achieved in several ways by the operator. Note the above article. It should not be taken as a complete engine failure, rather as a loss of one cylinder's power, unbalancing the entire rotating assembly, also indicating that other cylinders are near to complete destruction as well.

 

First sign should be, vibration and loss of power. Not complete engine destruction, if this is the first issue to arise. Vibration will... lead to further damage.

 

For me, this is definitive as relates to this situation:

 

http://kurfurst.org/Engine/Boostclearances/DB605_142ban_June1942.html

"If, in spite of these regulations, a piston does burn through, this is indicated by a strong regular vibration of the engine.

It is still possible to reach the nearest friendly base if the stress is immidiately reduced to about 1600 revs. and the lowest possible boost pressure. The vibration of the engine as a result of piston damage

remains unchanged when both magneto 1 and magneto 2 are switched on, so

that it is possible to confuse it with the a damaged sparking plug. On

the bench, bursts of blue vapour are emitted from the housing ventillator

when a piston is damaged."

Almost looks like a 2 stroke motorcycle piston but it has an oil ring like a 4 stroke engine

[Rama]

I try to log in and it says a new version is available and I have no idea where to download it.

Wait for next early access period (should be sometime tonight). Your game launcher will download the new version automatically.

[Brano]

Ah man Its in Russian.....  Was excited to hear what it had to say.   Bummer.  And no CC 

If you want I can translate main points of that video but in general it describes process of assembly.There are few interesting items :

1. Improvement of production flow itself.At the begining of war it was common to have team of workers running from plane to plane around the factory shopfloor.Here you can see automated production line transporter which moves planes from begining to end,teams stays at their spot.It is same principle of assy line like used also nowdays in mass production.

2. gluing process,which is totally out of control and depends only on skill of worker.No tools to spray the glue or to dose it in same quantity on same spot etc.From that you can understand why they had so many problems with ungluing of leading edges of wing or other parts.

3. There are several moments where I could see different kinds of windshield of canopy on fuselages which were in same line.Ones with no bars which is that of Yak3 and that with bars,which is of Yak1.

 

 I work in automotive industry and that is kind of proffesional deformation of me to focus on such things in production process.I admire those workers and engineers in USSR that even with such primitive and uncontrolable processes they were able to assemble fighter plane and it could fly and fight.

[Emgy]

Cool thanks for the translation.

[senseispcc]

I do not like the fact that some comment disappear from the forum and other not? Is there a objective way to judge and how are the judges?

 

[StG2_Manfred]

If it was realistic, even remotely so, you could run Notleistung for more than 5 minutes no problem. After all, this was a standard engine test after an overhaul. And it doesn't mean the engine will blow up a couple of seconds later. I wonder how many tests Viks has that show how the DB601E will inevitably blow up after a couple of minutes on Notleistung, no matter the circumstances be it high g, high temperatures, bad fuel mix, previous engine abuse and damage or a stationary run under ideal conditions on a test bench.

But than only the time limits are wrong. With other limits you would be happy, correct? I was talking about the way it is simulated. A given time + a random time is enough imo to simulate engine failures. Whatever time limits are going to be used...

[Rama]

I do not like the fact that some comment disappear from the forum and other not? Is there a objective way to judge and how are the judges?

If you didn't read the forum rules, and especially rules #5 and #6, I suggest you'll do

If you did, this is the last remembering.

[StG2_Manfred]

Just a quick note here: this is not a thread for engine modeling discussion and you might feel more comfortable in a specific topic. This one is about dev blog.

And about the DB - as long as the discussion proceeds without any substantiation presented (except the one shown by VikS), it remains only a discussion, not a suggestion thread or something that may result into any in-game changes.

 

Ok, I tried do some research. Best I could found is from http://www.deutscheluftwaffe.de/archiv/Dokumente/ABC/m/Motoren/Daimler%20Benz/Handbuch%20DB%20603%20A.pdf, page 51 (although it's from a DB 603):

 

Bei vollem Fluggewicht oder kleinen Plätzen kann wie folgt gestartet werden:

 

Leistungshebelstellung "Start- und Notleistung"

Drehzahl 2700 U/min.

Ladedruck 1,40 ata

 

...and underneath:

 

Bei Start- und Notleistung wird der Motor stark beansprucht, deshalb ist von dieser Leistungsentnahme auch nur im Notfall Gebrauch zu machen.

 

 

It says that you can use Start- und Notleistung for take off or in emergency cases and that it is big stress for the engine therefore you should not use it for long. But it also don't say, use it only for 1 minute! I mean, if the engine would break down that fast, I guess it would be clearer stated in the manual. 1-3 minutes for the failure might be a bit too short....

Edited March 21, 2014 by StG2_Manfred

[buz13buz13]

Tried to update a number of times and could not....got message that latest update failed.  Never had that problem before.

[SR-F_Winger]

 

everything works thru engine thermodynamic model

as about serial production differences - we use official German data for German airplanes, and official Russian tests of serial production airplanes (mostly NII VVS) for Russian airplanes.

 

 

its already so for 109F-4 now (2500/1.3 for 30 minutes), and yes - G2 will be modelled with 1.42 restricted (even captured around Stalingrad area G2 in Russian tests - used only 2500/1.3).

Hi, in know it is modeled but it still seems the engine almost everytime breaks whenever i try and fly 1.3 ata for more than 10 to 15 minutes.

Any chance this gets explicitely doublechecked by you devys?

And if its correct as is, why do i still break the engine? I mean as it is right now i cant do anything else but set my ata to 1.3. can i? Or wait, maybe is it because ata drops when i climb above a certain height and rpm remain higher? I think i have to doublecheck that for myself. Hopefully i get home early enough to log in before the servers get down:)

Edited March 24, 2014 by VSG1_Winger

[=FB=VikS]

And if its correct as is, why do i still break the engine? I mean as it is right now i cant do anything else but set my ata to 1.3. can i? Or wait, maybe is it because ata drops when i climb above a certain height and rpm remain higher? I think i have to doublecheck that for myself. Hopefully i get home early enough to log in before the servers get down:)

If its so - make a track record, and drop it to us.

 

PS: make sure that your engine temp`s where within its limits.

[SR-F_Winger]

Thanks! Might be a silly question. But where is the temperature gauges in the F4 located? I failed to see them up to now. Also what exactly are the templimits? Ill do some testing and will post my findings.

Found the temperatures in your posted documents. Now kust the tempgauge. Is it the one below the fuel meter? on the lower right side?

Edited March 24, 2014 by VSG1_Winger

[Matt]

It's on the right hand side. And it currently only shows the water temperature, so checking wether or not the oil/engine overheats, is impossible for now.

 

The water temperature always stays way below critical levels (unless the engine is smoking already).