Developer Diary, Part 57

[Goanna1]

Thanks for the new plane as for the multiplayer I, like many others here. would rather it was released in superb condition rather than' buggy'.

Jason your level of constant communication, both bad news and good news, is excellent and a credit to you, especially in the area of the care for your customers desire for a constant information stream and your added desire to bring a remarkable simulation to completion as soon as you can. A situation not present in many game studios  presently. Cudos.

[AX2]

I have to disagree.

The tendency to raise the nose in level flight at certain airspeeds is called "tail heavyness" and has absolutely nothing to do with the aircrafts weight and wing area and everything to do with how the aerodynamics are balanced on that plane.

 

Also keep in mind, that even though the Yak is a lighter aircraft than the Bf 109 and has a slightly larger wing area, that doesn't automatically mean, that the Yak should climb better than the 109, a lot of other factors are in play such as engine power, aerodynamic efficiency and wing profile. In fact the Bf 109 was a better climber than any VVS aircraft in 1942.

Finkeren I can understand your point,   

You have my +1

 

I think we will not get to anywhere, we are not engineers, 

It is like " you must take things as they are "  in BoS, by the wing profile .. END !!

That does not mean that things are well or wrong, but something did not convince me here at the end.

BuT .... 

who knows exactly "tail heavyness" of BF 109 ?....

Edited March 15, 2014 by Mustang

[Nankeen]

You can see what I have enjoyed flying this week

 

Thank you very much

[Finkeren]

Finkeren I can understand your point,

You have my +1

 

I think we will not get to anywhere, we are not engineers,

It is like " you must take things as they are " in BoS, by the wing profile .. END !!

That does not mean that things are well or wrong, but something did not convince me here at the end.

BuT ....

who knows exactly "tail heavyness" of BF 109 ?....

I don't know about any pronounced tail heaviness on real Bf 109s, but I do know, that they were usually pre-trimmed to fly straight and level at 400km/h, meaning that at any other airspeed they didn't fly straight and level.

 

Trims on the 109 weren't adjustable in flight except for the adjustable horizontal stabilizer, which by the way is the only form of trim that currently works in BoS, so you can actually do something about the nose climb on the 109.

Edited March 15, 2014 by Finkeren

[LukeFF]

You can see what I have enjoyed flying this week

 

It's a fun plane, isn't it?

[JtD]

There's pretty good data around for Bf 109 trim and balance. It is fairly hard to test exactly in game, but last time I checked, it wasn't right. Can't say how big the error was exactly.

[303_Kwiatek]

 

Finkeren I can understand your point, 

You have my +1

 

I think we will not get to anywhere, we are not engineers, 

It is like " you must take things as they are "  in BoS, by the wing profile .. END !!

That does not mean that things are well or wrong, but something did not convince me here at the end.

BuT .... 

who knows exactly "tail heavyness" of BF 109 ?....

 

 

109 was known as tailheavy plane - thats why it has nose up tendency with neutral trimm. Tail heavy mean that COG is behind of  center of lift ( mass balance and construction of plane)

 

If you take off with YAk-1 you will find during take off run that it is nose heavy plane   (it required little stick back during take off run).  Spitfires was also known as noseheavy planes.

[DD_Arthur]

It's a fun plane, isn't it?

 

Soviet Spitfire?

[GooseheadGoosehead]

looking forward to it.....

[Conveen]

The rudder on the Yak is very good simulated but the rudder from the 109 still since week too jumpy, dont understand why this will not fixed

[9./JG52Ziegler]

109 was known as tailheavy plane - thats why it has nose up tendency with neutral trimm. Tail heavy mean that COG is behind of  center of lift ( mass balance and construction of plane)

 

If you take off with YAk-1 you will find during take off run that it is nose heavy plane   (it required little stick back during take off run).  Spitfires was also known as noseheavy planes.

Yes quite right.  The F4 you can set down ans stand on the brakes without fear of a nose over.  The Yak 1.......not so much. ;-)

Thanks for that, just took a look and my tracks folder at least is empty, not sure I see a records folder...

It's called updates I believe but don't quote me on that. ;-)

Edited March 15, 2014 by 9./JG52Ziegler

[9./JG52Ziegler]

you need to reinstall game. I had the same issue

me too. lots of crash to desktop

Thanks Voidhunger,  I was hoping not to have to do that because of having to remap all the controls and switches again but there was no alternative.  Saving the inputs folder doesn't seem to save my control settings. Never the less, after an uninstall and reinstall, and remapping and deleteing the contradictions, it's all good again. 

The rudder on the Yak is very good simulated but the rudder from the 109 still since week too jumpy, dont understand why this will not fixed

Take some sensitivity out of it with the curve at the right end of the control map line. 

[Freycinet]

boomerang, fabulous screenies!

[dburne]

Ahh I gave it another try this morning, and finally I was able to complete the whole Yak 1 Escort Mission in Stalingrad without the CTD.

It was fantastic.

 

Sadly, we lost one of the IL-2's, and my wingman. But the other 3 IL-2's and myself made it back safely, and I even got a 109 kill under my belt, I circled as I watched each of the three land, then finally I landed smooth as silk and shut her down. Gotta be real careful with the brakes on the Yak, it will nose over just by breathing on the thing much less applying the brakes.

[Siggels]

There's nothing to be gained by haste.  But on the other hand:

[Nankeen]

Yes the Yak-1 is indeed a fun plane to fly

Geepers does it pick up speed, and very good fire rate ....... With a short burst and steady hand   it can be lethal.

Just had to capture this bird ,(but kind of looks like a shark, don;t you think?), taking off, giving it to a 109 and just admiring it.

 

 

Best Regards,

Boomerang

 

 

[dburne]

Up until now the Lagg was my favorite ride, I can certainly see the Yak 1 overcoming that status.

[303_Kwiatek]

Yak-1 got actually the best/most realistic flight model from all BOS fighters.  

 

The worst for me is still 109  ( rudder overdone, gyroscopic overdone - both casue flick rolls, woblling nose and unrealistic working slats).

 

Stil all fighters have ovedone rudder working which casue flick rolls with kick rudder but Yak-1 got it less noticable. I think all planes still need rudder work rework ( even Yak-1).

 

Beside still not correct rudder response Yak-1 has really good flight model  - one of the best i found in flight sims. High immersion from flying, realistic take off and lands and realistic aerobatic flying  ( would be more realistic with correct rudder response).

Edited March 15, 2014 by Kwiatek

[dburne]

 

 

Stil all fighters have ovedone rudder working which casue flick rolls with kick rudder but Yak-1 got it less noticable. I think all planes still need rudder work rework ( even Yak-1).

 

Beside still not correct rudder response Yak-1 has really good flight model  - one of the best i found in flight sims.

 

I would say the same for the pitch axis as well .

[303_Kwiatek]

Still pitch much better then in 109. Check qiuck strong negative pitch push in Yak-1 and 109.

[Rjel]

Very pretty plane. Can't wait until some good skinners are allowed to tear into this sim.

 

[BeastyBaiter]

Except all us 109 drivers

 

Hehe, indeed. Which is why I said "flying the LaGG-3 against 109F."

[URUAker]

Yak 1 feels very nice.

loved it. 109 Ai´s had no chance.

roll rate seemed a little slow.

In a turning fight i was slow and pulled the stick too hard, entered a spin and went to a flat spin at about 1500m, could not get it out of flat spin. I think this was quite different from il21946 yak1, felt like a p39 with its central engine.

[Georgio]

I haven't found any vices in the Yak yet apart from the inevitable nose over on the end of the landing roll, I swear my pilot leaned forwards and over she went.

Feels very nimble and responsive almost like a Russian spit as some one said. I especially like the way you can just flick roll above an incoming 109 and they can't follow you.

To be honest the Yak almost feels too good; I hope it doesn't get dumbed down by the whiners but if this is how the Yak performs god only knows how the La5 is going to dominate... It's 2003 all over again...^^

[Wolfstriked]

Thanks for the new plane as for the multiplayer I, like many others here. would rather it was released in superb condition rather than' buggy'.

Jason your level of constant communication, both bad news and good news, is excellent and a credit to you, especially in the area of the care for your customers desire for a constant information stream and your added desire to bring a remarkable simulation to completion as soon as you can. A situation not present in many game studios  presently. Cudos.

Hmm interesting that you feel this way as I feel exact opposite.Yes its early access but I did spend $95 dollars on a product here.I posted quite a few times about the ball in my cockpit going erratic and how I cant seem to hit a dam thing and never a response though my posts always get moved to other sections.I post about issues I have on the DCS or Steel Beasts forums and next time I check it always gets answered.Felt the same way in ROF forums so I am not surprised here.And no I am not a troll and trust me when I say that "I DO WANNA BELIEVE" that this is or will be the next big thing.As I also posted,at times the planes settle down and then its truly outstanding!

Edited March 15, 2014 by wolfstriked

[Finkeren]

To be honest the Yak almost feels too good; I hope it doesn't get dumbed down by the whiners but if this is how the Yak performs god only knows how the La5 is going to dominate... It's 2003 all over again...^^

Remember that the Yak-1 we have is a late production model (series 69 I think it says in in game) with the Klimov 105 PF. It is supposed to have performance in the same ballpark as the Yak-9 or -1B. I don't think it's "too good" by any metric, but it forces an opposing Bf 109 to play to its strengths and use the 109s better climb rate, top speed and high altitude performance, rather than just win by default. The 109 is still overall the better plane, just not in every single category.

 

The La-5 on the other hand is gonna be something like a series 6 and won't have spectacular performance. At best it's gonna be a moderate improvement over the LaGG-3. Neither will it handle nearly as well as the Yak (the Lavochkin design never did) It's gonna be a tough, hard hitting fighter, but not a superlative dogfighter like the Yak.

[Conveen]

 

Take some sensitivity out of it with the curve at the right end of the control map line. 

 

Well this helps I know but it is not fixed with that. Yak rudder works so why not from other planes like 109?

Yak-1 got actually the best/most realistic flight model from all BOS fighters.  

 

The worst for me is still 109  ( rudder overdone, gyroscopic overdone - both casue flick rolls, woblling nose and unrealistic working slats).

 

 

+1

[AX2]

109 was known as tailheavy plane - thats why it has nose up tendency with neutral trimm. Tail heavy mean that COG is behind of  center of lift ( mass balance and construction of plane)

 

 

Kiwiatek thanks for the explanation.

Then I then I must assume for Yak 1, The COG is after of the center of lift.

I will think about it.

 

Still pitch much better then in 109. Check qiuck strong negative pitch push in Yak-1 and 109.

+1 

[FuriousMeow]

Here's the thing with Kwiatek, he has spent years believing he's an expert on how aircraft fly that he himself has never flown and he has never provided a factual statement regarding the aircraft themselves. Only unrelated information because he flew one plane that makes the modelling of this one here, that far outperforms anything he's ever flown, incorrect based on nothing other than actually nothing. He did it in Aces High, RoF and now here with BoS. He's like Jason Priestley, he thinks because he can drive a car he's an expert on it and knows how all cars perform. Google Jason Priestley, and find out how well he fared racing cars.

 

He also utilized a video of two players in a RoF two seater to point out how the AI gunner is too good and performs beyond the capabilities it should, except the gunner was player controlled. He's a bastion of something, but facts or relevant experience there is a significant lack of.

Edited March 15, 2014 by FuriousMeow

[Wolfstriked]

And no help as usual from the devs. I reinstalled,I undid all controls so its not a ghost control adding in the erratic behavior etc.Here is a video of what I mean.Granted this is pretty much at its worst when I caught the clip.At other times the plane can be sublime for a few minutes then with sudden almost imperceptible changes that causes an unknown feeling toexist.This has me beginning to not trust the BOS software and when full release comes I will never know if I just suck(very real posibility) or its the game changing the FM.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wT9n9KxeN_g&feature=youtu.be

[DD_Arthur]

Says your video is private Wolfstriked.  Are you doing something you should be ashamed of?

[Wolfstriked]

LOL,I am ashamed of my own video. Try it again as I made it public.

[FuriousMeow]

And no help as usual from the devs. I reinstalled,I undid all controls so its not a ghost control adding in the erratic behavior etc.Here is a video of what I mean.Granted this is pretty much at its worst when I caught the clip.At other times the plane can be sublime for a few minutes then with sudden almost imperceptible changes that causes an unknown feeling toexist.This has me beginning to not trust the BOS software and when full release comes I will never know if I just suck(very real posibility) or its the game changing the FM.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wT9n9KxeN_g&feature=youtu.be

 

Did you overstress the airframe? Chances are you're missing a control surface, that's what happens when you exceed the airframe's limits - things break and the instability occurs.

[NumeroX]

I love the way this game is coming along...   I'm looking forward to spending some more money for additional planes, theaters, contents, etc...

[Wolfstriked]

Am I that hard on the airframe then?Gonna run it again with very little G manuevers just to weed that out.

[FuriousMeow]

Not just Gs cause airframe damage, you can exceed structural limits in Gs or level speed.

Edited March 15, 2014 by FuriousMeow

[arjisme]

Wolfstriked, I flew the Yak-1 dogfight mission (Lapino) today and allowed a 109 to get some hits on me.  Once that occurred, I had erratic flight similar to what you shared in your video.  Interestingly, I went to external view after I landed to see what had been damaged and I saw nothing obvious.  So, for that plane, it might be true that the visual damage model is not 100% complete yet.  The same might also be true of the other aircraft.

 

But point is, my plane was damaged before it flew erratically.  Prior to that, it was smooth and no issues.

Edited March 15, 2014 by arjisme

[Lusekofte]

I do not know, for me it is all the feeling a plane give me, The physics in this game are in my opinion the best ever made . DCS CLOD is not even close. But I hate flying the 109, it just feels like you drive a train. 

The LAGG is so far the best brute in this game. It is so wonderful in all its bad features. It is a real messy plane at low speeds you feel the loose of controls and gravity grabbing it. Wonderful plane.

The YAK made it easy to kill no vise AI in a 109, but that is all. The IL 2 should feel more like the LAGG a bit heavier but I like it. JU 87 is kind of neutral but fun to fly.

By the preview of the authors I think maybe PE-2 will be more what I want. 

I am very grateful for this game

[Trickyricky]

Am I the only one having gamecrashes after a few minutes (maybe 10-15) of playing this weekend?

Never had this problem before

[kendo]

Very pretty plane. Can't wait until some good skinners are allowed to tear into this sim.

 

I agree completely. I expect the aircraft will be revealed in their full glory when the pro skinners finally get busy - there will be really substantial improvements.

 

Not wanting to be overcritical here but the above skin reminds me of something out of original il-2.

 

Panel lines and detailing is really coarse and crude.

Edited March 15, 2014 by kendo