Spotting is awful

[Roland_HUNter]

Hello everybody!

Can somebody help me in spotting?

I use this settings:

Problem is: Hard to spot planes, and spots are disappear after 3-4-5 km.

Which settings are wrong?
 
In advance: Thank you for the help!

Edited December 2, 2018 by -[HRAF]Roland_HUNter

[RedKestrel]

Maybe try turning downthe antialiasing and the distant landscape detail? Some people think turning off HDR makes a big difference, I didn't like the effect much.

 

[Roland_HUNter]

I ll check it, thanks.

[EAF19_Marsh]

VR? Difficult to spot in VR, I find. It is something of a knack.

[Roland_HUNter]

I'm not using VR.

Edited December 2, 2018 by -[HRAF]Roland_HUNter

[Barnacles]

29 minutes ago, -[HRAF]Roland_HUNter said:

Hello everybody!

Can somebody help me in spotting?

I use this settings:

Problem is: Hard to spot planes, and spots are disappear after 3-4-5 km.

Which settings are wrong?
 
In advance: Thank you for the help!

The contrast of your screen is very important for spotting, so experiment with your monitor brightness together with the gamma setting.

[Roland_HUNter]

Reducing AA its making ot worse ?

I calibrated my monitor with this:

I can see full black from the R word.

[ShamrockOneFive]

38 minutes ago, -[HRAF]Roland_HUNter said:

Reducing AA its making ot worse ?

I calibrated my monitor with this:

I can see full black from the R word.

 

From the "R" in BRIGHTNESS? There's one additional gradation after that. You may want to recheck the calibration.

[pegg00]

Grass quality to lowest, gamma as low as you comfortably can, landscape to blurred and shadows to ultra. These helped me, other settings dont matter much. Also calibrate your monitor.

Edited December 3, 2018 by pegg00

[Guest deleted@50488]

Strange ???

 

The only combat sim I spot better than IL2 is WT, with the icons ?

In DCS World, there's a Huge problem ...

 

IL2 is by far the easiest ?

 

I don't use sharpen, distance is 2x ( you're at 4x )…, AA at 2x

Edited December 3, 2018 by Von-Target

[CamusB455]

Spotting is indeed a nightmare.  I took some advice from the tutorial and guides forum and run 1080 resolution on a 1440 screen.  That helped alot.  You'll need to edit the ini file in order to drop the gamma below .8.  .5 gamma works for me, nice black contrasted silhouetted airplanes against the ground.

 

And spotting in WT is easier not because of the icons, but because planes render as dots from across the map in simulator difficulty.  Planes in IL2 don't render until something like 2.5 k.  They literally pop into existence.  Someone will correct me on the exact rendering distance.  But if one flies too high an altitude, planes hugging the tree line are invisible.  It's a serious engine limitation. 

Edited December 3, 2018 by CamusB455

[SharpeXB]

2 hours ago, CamusB455 said:

  I took some advice from the tutorial and guides forum and run 1080 resolution on a 1440 screen. 

What tutorial told you to do that? Lowering your resolution doesn’t help. Always run the native res of your monitor. If I try running 1440p on a 4K display it looks terrible and makes visibility much worse. 

[Gambit21]

3 hours ago, CamusB455 said:

.  Planes in IL2 don't render until something like 2.5 k.  They literally pop into existence.  Someone will correct me on the exact rendering distance.  

 

That is absolutely not true.

 

[CamusB455]

17 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

What tutorial told you to do that? Lowering your resolution doesn’t help. Always run the native res of your monitor. If I try running 1440p on a 4K display it looks terrible and makes visibility much worse. 

I searched 'spotting' and just browsed.  Don't remember which thread.  Any pixelation caused by lowering the resolution was not any worse than disabling AA, which I also do.  It doesn't bother me at all, and aircraft are spottable this way.  In 1440, a 109 can be near invisible at pin dot right on my 6.

16 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

 

That is absolutely not true.

 

There is a rendering range, and it is not that large.

[Gambit21]

It sure as hell isn't 2.5k.

 

Aircraft render for me at MUCH further out than that.

 

 

[LuftManu]

3 minutes ago, CamusB455 said:

 

There is a rendering range, and it is not that large.

Prove is 2.5k as you say.

 

I've never had many problems spotting in Il-2 Great Battles, for me it's one of the easiest sims to spot, if not the easiest but there are certain things to consider:
- Scenary behind the plane

- Not using pixels like old Il-2 installments

- Time of day

Edited December 3, 2018 by LF_Gallahad

[Roland_HUNter]

I think, lowering the gamme to 0.5-6-7 is the best. Other options now worked for me ?

[Heckpupper]

Il-2 BoX is a weird one regarding spotting. I like how the aircraft are rendered when between 1 - 3km away, lighting reflecting on the metal seems realistic and when fighting in shade or overcast it's pretty hard to spot which I find to be annoying, but in a good way. What's really upsetting is the bubble surrounding you, that prevents you from seeing further than I think 10km away. It's really awful and prevents from tracking fleeing targets which will dissapear even if fixated on, and one's situational awareness suffers from that tremendously also.

[ACG_KaiLae]

10km is annoying. In the SW pacific, pilots would report that because the skies were so clear you could pick up targets a long way away, like 20+ miles. Japanese at midway reported spotting an incoming air attack at 50 miles. Distance should depend on conditions..not that I expect this to change any time soon, with the netcode we currently have. 

[SharpeXB]

37 minutes ago, CamusB455 said:

Any pixelation caused by lowering the resolution was not any worse than disabling AA, which I also do.  It doesn't bother me at all, and aircraft are spottable this way.  In 1440, a 109 can be near invisible at pin dot right on my 6.

Suit yourself but lowering resolution and disabling AA are just making the situation worse. When I have tried upscaling 1440p to 2160p the resulting screen image is noticeably soft and loses the sharp definitions that help you see objects on the screen. Without AA you can have whole pieces of aircraft alias and vanish off the screen. Plus the game just looks horrible with everything a mess of jaggies. Lower resolution does not make distant 3D objects larger it just makes them fuzzier.

I know players are always in this quest to see better in flight sims but some of the advice here is the problem. 

Edited December 3, 2018 by SharpeXB

[purK]

1 hour ago, SharpeXB said:

What tutorial told you to do that? Lowering your resolution doesn’t help. Always run the native res of your monitor. If I try running 1440p on a 4K display it looks terrible and makes visibility much worse. 

 

This thread is about spotting, and yes lowering your resolution to 1080 on a 1440p monitor will absolutely help spotting other aircraft. As for clarity and IDing spotted targets, that may take a bit more work. I use both a 1080p and 1440p monitor.

 

My 1440p monitor is 10/10 and I have no issues, maybe yours is just trash.

Edited December 3, 2018 by Krupinskii

[SharpeXB]

1 hour ago, Krupinskii said:

My 1440p monitor is 10/10 and I have no issues, maybe yours is just trash.

My monitor is 4K and upscaling 1440p on it looks awful. 2160p looks MUCH nicer than 1440.

 

Lowering resolution would only help if IL-2 uses a pixel sized sprite or graphic that renders as a set number of pixels, hence appearing larger. As far as I know IL-2 does not use this. And any aircraft within range for you to see in IL-2 is already rendering at a size greater than a single pixel. So resolution to help make out it’s shape and detail is important. 

Edited December 3, 2018 by SharpeXB

[Warpig]

I just recently upgraded my GPU and monitor. Going from 1080p 24" screen to 1440p 27" seems to make spotting easier than it was with the old setup.

[SCG_ErwinP]

I like how i can spot with my 2560x1080P but it could be better =D

[Kandiru]

My biggest problem now with the top of the line Alienware machine and curved monitor is plane recognition. The plane charts really help, looking to get giant wall charts to put behind the monitor. 

 

Pegg00 is speaking the truth IMO, focus on the planes and not the scenery. 

[MasserME262]

spotting? what's that? I just wait for their tracers to appear next to me, then stall my airplane and make them overshot, just like a real PRO?

[Asgar]

i run maximum everything, no issues spotting, get some new glasses, that should fix your issue

[Roland_HUNter]

1 hour ago, colemanuk82 said:

Surely this is a bit like cheating? I find it very hard to spot targets like the op. It makes me wonder if when I play multiplayer if it's a true level playing field or if others have a real advantage over me.

This is not a dig at you but it doesnt really seem fair? 

 

Everybody can change the gamma in the cfg. Its not cheating.

[CamusB455]

@colemanuk82 This debate of ethics is as old as multiplayer flight Sims.  Spotting was notoriously difficult in real life and how a game engine renders objects at a distance does little justice to how visual scanning really works.  Obviously reskinning enemy aircraft pink is cheating, but is adjusting graphical settings compareable? 

Is the choice of the game designer to not render distant planes as black dots detrimental to people with 1080p displays?

Large 4k screens are expensive, not every has them, or a graphics card to use them, but they give clear advantages. 

Working within the limits of the game to maximize effectiveness is the natural order of competition. Maybe gamma should be locked, since it can be abused on night missions, but .8 is definitely too high to be practical for playing the game normally in my opinion  

[JG27*Kornezov]

Just go to MP servers where icons are activated, like EU official. Sometimes it is not worth it to give up picture quality for spotting. By the way all the spotting mini-game is not very realistic.I like it how it was in the old game, the possibility to set up  when a plane is withing a certain distance from you 1 to 1,5 km the icon would show.
I personally do not find very entertaining at all spending time to hunt and surprise guys who could not see me.

[Ribbon]

Not just planes popping up at certain distance is problem but also when searching naval objectives.

Flying on 3-5km alt and searching for ships they pop up when you're almost straight above them.

Ship trails on the water should be visible from greater distance and that could be problem when moving to PTO.

But i'm sure devs will take it in consideration by that time.

 

Maybe making vehicles, ships and planes rendering separate from other objects on the map as a option in game settings so they can be seen outside 9-10k bubble.

[CamusB455]

8 minutes ago, EAF_Ribbon said:

Not just planes popping up at certain distance is problem but also when searching naval objectives.

Flying on 3-5km alt and searching for ships they pop up when you're almost straight above them.

It definitely effects how the game is played.  If you're bomber hunting, you know what altitude to patrol at: 3 to 2.5k.  of course, if you're hunting fighters, you go 1.5 to 2k higher. You can't see anything on the ground, but you'll be above fighters patrolling for bombers.

[Desteban]

I got myself a 4k 43 inch monitor and the difference to my  previous 1080p display is massive, literally.

I haven't played much yet and was never very profecient at spotting but after first successful try with head tracking I went online and tried my luck.

 

I parked my 190 at 4-5k height and could spot a plane that was shot down and exploded on the ground. Next thing I spotted was an A20  at 1k height passing below me.

Almost couldn't believe my eyes but the 4k resolution in combination with that ridiculously huge monitor makes it very realistic to spot planes. Best thing is everything seems

close to a 1:1 size on screen so it is very easy to forget you are not in a virtual reality. I had planned to get a VR headset eventually but I am suprisingly satisfied with what I got.

I am not kidding with 43 inch around 1 meter from my eyes it fills alot of my peripheral vision. 

 

Bottom line is if you can't spot properly get a bigger screen, It helps a lot...

And of course it looks awesome.

 

 

 

[CountZero]

i can see contacts from 8-9km away, game starts to show you airplanes that are 9,5km from you. im not having 4k monitor or use any woodo magic exept adjusting gamma to 0.7 and adjusting my screen properly, and look around like crazy

 

if your not able to spot contact from 2-4 or 5km from you, your in deep trouble, and if you on top of that play online your at big disadvantage compared to otheres, as most veteran player can easy spoot you when you enter that 9,5km bubble from them.

 

My only problem is not airplanes in that 9,5km range as i can see them ok, my problem is that game should render airplanes atleast 15km from us and not just 9,5km, and especialy contrails.

 

example of yesterday encounter with 2 enemy airplanes on wol.

Me and my tm8 patrol at 7km on winter map in lagg3, i notice 2 contrails enter my visibility bubble north from us at ~9km alt, instantly i consider them enemy just by their position and alt and they are 9km from us, for me they are big threth, i imidiatly say to my wingma to go SE and go to 5km, and if they saw us we will go below clouds S, and in clouds we will turn N to lose them. And afcorse they saw us also from 9km away when we entered their visibility bubble, and consider us as enemy like they should, and went in persut of us.

 

We by just few sec manage to run away from them, we went N below clouds and they lost us and spend some time serching for us S from clouds. Only when they come 3-4km from us i was able to confirm that they are inded enemy 109s. ( on thuse alts 109 has 80-100kmh speed advantage and if its higher then you its even faster closing that distance, how fast/far you can see them is differance from you staying alive or you being his food)

 

if we spoot them when they were only 5km from us we would both be in our shoots as they would catch us with no problem, and we would not be able to run away and continue to fight on other place and shoot down other enemys in that sortie that dont see us untill its to late to run or react.

 

last month same thing but we react to late few seconds and we are shoot down, even 9km is to short time to react when you play online, and people learn to gues just by looking at spot far is he enemy or not, and make trap for them in case its enemy. 

 

 

Edited December 5, 2018 by 77.CountZero

[CountZero]

if i play with gamma at 1 as by default, i would see them only from 6-7km. I run tests in QM when i place enemys 10km from me to face me and can turn on/off icons so when i see them i can pause game and turn on icons to se what is distance. And then i adjust my monitor and gamma to what gives me most posible distance and still is not to dark like gamma at 0.5 for example.

 

low range gives advantage to fast airplanes, your victam dosent have time to rect fast enought to run.

 

so unlike some people belive that in bobp i me262 players will suffer most from this 9,5km bubble, i think it will worst for players in slowest airplanes like spit9 and they will feel this short bubble most and be at disadvantage. 

[CountZero]

Just now, colemanuk82 said:

 

I think if they had a video test screens with brightnesa/contrast sliders as a `can you spot the plane?` That would be the best way to do it and lock other settings not accessible through the game. They had a similar problem in "PUBG"  where people would use the lowest possible settings to get an advantage over other players spotting wise and ruin the graphics of the game

yes that would be good and easy for all players

 

but then players could still just use reshade or sweetfx like now

Edited December 5, 2018 by 77.CountZero

[Kandiru]

On 12/4/2018 at 11:39 AM, Desteban said:

....I had planned to get a VR headset eventually but I am suprisingly satisfied with what I got.

I am not kidding with 43 inch around 1 meter from my eyes it fills alot of my peripheral vision. 

 

Bottom line is if you can't spot properly get a bigger screen, It helps a lot...

And of course it looks awesome.

 

 

 

You did the right thing. I struggled with both the Odyssey and Vive Pro and ended up returning both for the top of the line Alienware curvie. My only problem is 50yo eyes and poor knowledge, but I am getting better, no friendly fire for a while on furball servers like Berloga.

[LColony_Kong]

On 12/5/2018 at 9:24 AM, 77.CountZero said:

if i play with gamma at 1 as by default, i would see them only from 6-7km. I run tests in QM when i place enemys 10km from me to face me and can turn on/off icons so when i see them i can pause game and turn on icons to se what is distance. And then i adjust my monitor and gamma to what gives me most posible distance and still is not to dark like gamma at 0.5 for example.

 

low range gives advantage to fast airplanes, your victam dosent have time to rect fast enought to run.

 

so unlike some people belive that in bobp i me262 players will suffer most from this 9,5km bubble, i think it will worst for players in slowest airplanes like spit9 and they will feel this short bubble most and be at disadvantage. 

It's the opposite. The short ranges favor slow agile fighters and unrealistically disadvantage fast or climbing fighters. Short and difficult spotting makes realistic SA impossible and shortens the ooda loop of the game considerably. This means fast and high fighters have harder than reasonable time of spotting low contacts or keeping track of threats above them should they choose to attack. Speed is almost useless if you don't know when to run. 

 

As a result everyone in the game flies at or below 4000m and tend to choose to turn fight. Turning is ideal if you can't see because you stay closer to your target and are always changing direction even if you don't spot someone jumping you. 

 

E fighting requires knowledge of the situation and the ability to not easily lose a target.