Tempest

[blockheadgreen_]

Everyone goes on about the Thunderbolt and Dora, but is anyone else really pining for the Tempest? 6 tonnes, 4 Hispanos and 2500HP of square-jawed Napier goodness. Nothing could outdive it.

 

[Talon_]

If you are interested in the Tempest, we went into a long discussion and drew some good conclusions over in the Tempest Research Thread  

[ShamrockOneFive]

Ummm yes. Quietly right now because the other aircraft are also exciting but I am MOST excited about the Tempest Mark V. I was the aircraft I wanted them most for IL-2: 1946 (and created a 28 mission campaign for: http://www.mission4today.com/index.php?name=Downloads&file=details&id=3687) and the one that I made into "my" mount when it came to online battles.

 

I intend to do that again here for sure. I'm extremely excited about it.

[BlitzPig_EL]

Very much looking forward to it.

 

As an aside, the cockpit texturing was done by BlitzPig_Hammered.  

 

The Pigs were everywhere...  Be sure.

 

You know, now that I think about it, Hammered did the default skins for the Tempest, not the cockpit.

Edited October 7, 2018 by BlitzPig_EL
Historical correction.

[40plus]

Honestly, I'd give up the lot for the P-38, no hesitation what so ever.

[ebbers]

Hi great Plane the tempest, I always got it confused with the Typhoon type, Tony

[DSR_A-24]

This plane is going to be a monster. I feel dirty just thinking about flying it.

[Rjel]

1 hour ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Very much looking forward to it.

 

As an aside, the cockpit texturing was done by BlitzPig_Hammered.  

 

The Pigs were everywhere...  Be sure.

Hammered was a great skinner too in IL-2 as I remember. Is he still around? So many from that era have gone quiet, at least by their monikers from that time.

[BlitzPig_EL]

Have not seen him, or BBury, or TOAD in a long time.   I know a few of the old crowd still run coops in Hyperlobby, Mongoose, and some of the FA guys I do believe.

 

Hammered's skins were excellent.  He did the defaults for the early P40s.

 

He modified the AVG one for me...

Edited October 7, 2018 by BlitzPig_EL

[Rjel]

22 minutes ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Have not seen him, or BBury, or TOAD in a long time.   I know a few of the old crowd still run coops in Hyperlobby, Mongoose, and some of the FA guys I do believe.

 

Hammered's skins were excellent.  He did the defaults for the early P40s.

 

He modified the AVG one for me...

That's my favorite P-40 model. It just looks perfectly proportioned.

 

Other great skinners who have gone missing are Fury, Bo_Nidle and Canon. All three are/were excellent. So many others that have slipped my mind.

[Gambit21]

I did all the 352nd Mustang skins back in the day, using Sooty's base aluminum Mustang.

 

While doing this, one of the 352nd crew chief's contacted me because I did the aircraft he used to work on, Wally Starck's "Starck Mad"

He happened to see it on IL2 Skins.com.

 

It just so happened I was in contact with Starck having recently interviewed him, and put the two in touch with each other. Pilot, and his old crew chief.

That moment made all the effort worth it and more.

 

Also, he clued me into the artwork that was on the other side that nobody else knew about, so I was able to properly represent the crew chief side of the aircraft as well.

[ShamrockOneFive]

9 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

I did all the 352nd Mustang skins back in the day, using Sooty's base aluminum Mustang.

 

While doing this, one of the 352nd crew chief's contacted me because I did the aircraft he used to work on, Wally Starck's "Starck Mad"

He happened to see it on IL2 Skins.com.

 

It just so happened I was in contact with Starck having recently interviewed him, and put the two in touch with each other. Pilot, and his old crew chief.

That moment made all the effort worth it and more.

 

Also, he clued me into the artwork that was on the other side that nobody else knew about, so I was able to properly represent the crew chief side of the aircraft as well.

 

That's pretty amazing! What a great opportunity to link two people back together again after so long.

 

 

Getting back on to the Tempest. I have very little desire to see any of the quirkier additions to the Tempest V in-game but I wanted to mention that they really tried some interesting things with the Tempest in its career. It was a target tug, it was a testbed for a variety of different radiator and engine configurations, and they attempted to fit 47mm anti-tank cannons on a Tempest in trials as well.

 

[CountZero]

they tryed to make 2.0 Hurricane IID

[CrazyDuck]

Speed and firepower are the two most important properties of a fighter in my book. This puts Tempest among the elite.

[[DBS]TH0R]

Oh yeah. If current Spitfire firepower is anything to go by, this thing will be a bloody beast.

 

Can't wait!

[ShamrockOneFive]

Indeed, the Tempest to me is a kind of hybrid in concept between something as graceful as the Spitfire and something as powerful as the Thunderbolt with a little Mustang thrown into the mix too.

 

With one of the most powerful engines in-game powering the Tempest, plus laminar flow wings, good wing loading, four rapid fire Hispano V cannons, a bubble canopy and overall good handling and flying characteristics. It's a top tier fighter. If there's a weakness it would be in its altitude performance which is a little more average than outstanding.

[Ehret]

2 hours ago, ShamrockOneFive said:

With one of the most powerful engines in-game powering the Tempest, plus laminar flow wings, good wing loading, four rapid fire Hispano V cannons, a bubble canopy and overall good handling and flying characteristics. It's a top tier fighter. If there's a weakness it would be in its altitude performance which is a little more average than outstanding.

 

Altitude can be lost quickly, especially in the Tempest, and most of the enemy's fighters will follow to their demise...

High altitude performance would be useful for intercepting higher flying bombers, thought. Unfortunately, it's something what will not happen in the BOBP much if at all.

[ZachariasX]

3 hours ago, ShamrockOneFive said:

Indeed, the Tempest to me is a kind of hybrid in concept between something as graceful as the Spitfire and something as powerful as the Thunderbolt with a little Mustang thrown into the mix too.

Sidney Camm said that it must have elliptical wings, as the air ministery would only buy planes as long as they have elliptical wings.

 

[LukeFF]

3 hours ago, Ehret said:

Altitude can be lost quickly, especially in the Tempest, and most of the enemy's fighters will follow to their demise...

High altitude performance would be useful for intercepting higher flying bombers, thought. Unfortunately, it's something what will not happen in the BOBP much if at all.

 

Not exactly many German bombers flying daylight missions on the Western Front by late-1944, outside of Ar 234s.

[EAF19_Marsh]

I get weak at the knees, honestly. Anyone who has read Clostermann's - err - 'account' should also read Jim Sheddan's far less depressing Tempest Pilot: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00AJ2QFHG/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1

 

I loves it, my Precious. I would buy it in a second for DCS prices.

[ethelward]

37 minutes ago, EAF19_Marsh said:

Anyone who has read Clostermann's - err - 'account'

 

What is the problem with Clostermann? I remember being fond of his book as a child, but I guess I might have missed many mistakes at the time.

[EAF19_Marsh]

2 minutes ago, ethelward said:

 

What is the problem with Clostermann? I remember being fond of his book as a child, but I guess I might have missed many mistakes at the time. 

 

It is a fantastic story and I mean that in all sense of the word. However, the factual basis is thin, to put it mildly - even in the revised copy.

 

In short, read and enjoy (even if he was clearly suffering from PTSD by the end) but take every factual element with a large measure of salt.

[Bremspropeller]

2 minutes ago, ethelward said:

What is the problem with Clostermann? I remember being fond of his book as a child, but I guess I might have missed many mistakes at the time.

 

Noting is wrong with this book - if you read it more as a novel than as a book selling COLD HARD FACTS (TM).

He does wander off into fairytale land here and then which (at least to a knowledgeable reader) makes you wonder if there's more less-than-true stuff buried in his lines.

[MiloMorai]

4 minutes ago, ethelward said:

 

What is the problem with Clostermann? I remember being fond of his book as a child, but I guess I might have missed many mistakes at the time.

 

Have you read any Caiden books?

[EAF19_Marsh]

OK, Bremspropeller is a bit meaner than I ?

1 minute ago, MiloMorai said:

 

Have you read any Caiden books? 

 

Derek Robinson?

[ZachariasX]

1 hour ago, ethelward said:

What is the problem with Clostermann?

It's a great book, but he is not good with details. He wrote his diary when he had time and you clearly get a sense on how much he was under phisical and mental strain (as well as on prescribed amphetamines). Much of it is written as it left his wrist at the time of writing and since then there was never an editor worthy of that title involved in cleaning out "all those little things". It is an account he wrote for his parents to have some memory of him, as he did not really expect to survive. (His chances being 2% in retrospect.)

 

Knowing his audience, his patrents, this produces different things he wold brag about than if he was writing something along the line "We were brave and we were following orders". But all those technical things that are of least interest to a morning parent, he filled them in an extremely casual and colorful way. This means, reading the book, especially the complete version, you get to know him, but you don't get to know differentiated technicalities of running a squadron and the aircraft themselves.

 

Also it becomes very apparent that (even back then he had a name for that) he is a great storyteller. As @Bremspropeller he produced what is (I think) probably the best novel about WW2 air combat, but that is also wholly unsuitable as a technical reference.

 

[EAF19_Marsh]

It is still a fanastic book though, I have several copies of it and wish it were on Kindle.

 

But please read Sheddan - who actually WAS an O/C of a 122 squadron - for a different perspective.

Edited October 8, 2018 by EAF19_Marsh

[ZachariasX]

7 minutes ago, EAF19_Marsh said:

It is still a fanastic book though, I have several copies of it and wish it were on Kindle.

 

But please read Sheddan - who actually WAS an O/C of a 122 squadron - for a different perspective.

Just got that as Kindle.

[HBPencil]

The Tempest is definitely the BoBP bird I'm most looking forward to, loved it in '46.

 

53 minutes ago, EAF19_Marsh said:

It is still a fanastic book though, I have several copies of it and wish it were on Kindle.

 

But please read Sheddan - who actually WAS an O/C of a 122 squadron - for a different perspective.

Sheddan was the CO of 486sqn.

Edit: Another Tempest sqn CO who wrote a book was Robert 'Spud' Spurdle of 80sqn (a Kiwi with an RAF commission), his autobio is called 'The Blue Arena'. It's a very entertaining book which is no surprise considering the broad range of his experiences. I thoroughly recommend his book but fair warning, he can be quite opinionated and pulls no punches when it comes to the two things he disliked the most about the Allies, namely the RNZAF top brass and the USAAF as a whole.

Edited October 8, 2018 by HBPencil

[MiloMorai]

4 minutes ago, HBPencil said:

The Tempest is definitely the BoBP bird I'm most looking forward to, loved it in '46.

 

Sheddan was the CO of 486sqn.

 

from May '45 to Sept '45.

S/L WE Schrader Apr '45 to May '45.

[blitze]

I'll put my hand up, Tempest is as Tempest was, an awesome airplane.

[EAF19_Marsh]

 

Yes, yes I know - I've read the book.

 

Thanks HB, of that I was not aware. One thing that is common to Sheddan and Clostermann is the report of high loss rate, most of it to flak.

 

 

[Bremspropeller]

23 hours ago, EAF19_Marsh said:

One thing that is common to Sheddan and Clostermann is the report of high loss rate, most of it to flak.

 

Should be around 30% (or greater) for all 2nd TAF/ 9th AF fighter-bomber units.

 

On 10/8/2018 at 1:09 PM, HBPencil said:

Edit: Another Tempest sqn CO who wrote a book was Robert 'Spud' Spurdle of 80sqn (a Kiwi with an RAF commission), his autobio is called 'The Blue Arena'. It's a very entertaining book which is no surprise considering the broad range of his experiences. I thoroughly recommend his book but fair warning, he can be quite opinionated and pulls no punches when it comes to the two things he disliked the most about the Allies, namely the RNZAF top brass and the USAAF as a whole.

 

I was stumbleing across this just a few days ago on that large south-american river website.

Seems like I need to invest a couple of bucks into those Tempest books.

 

 

Did I mention we need a Typhoon?

[ShamrockOneFive]

8 hours ago, Bremspropeller said:

 

Should be around 30% (or greater) for all 2nd TAF/ 9th AF fighter-bomber units.

 

 

I was stumbleing across this just a few days ago on that large south-american river website.

Seems like I need to invest a couple of bucks into those Tempest books.

 

 

Did I mention we need a Typhoon?

 

Oh I know... the Typhoon is high on my list. I haven't flown a Typhoon since Aces Over Europe. There hasn't been one in a sim that I've owned since then (I think there was one in CFS3 if I'm not mistaken).

[busdriver]

On 10/8/2018 at 6:09 AM, HBPencil said:

Edit: Another Tempest sqn CO who wrote a book was Robert 'Spud' Spurdle of 80sqn (a Kiwi with an RAF commission), his autobio is called 'The Blue Arena'. It's a very entertaining book which is no surprise considering the broad range of his experiences. I thoroughly recommend his book but fair warning, he can be quite opinionated and pulls no punches when it comes to the two things he disliked the most about the Allies, namely the RNZAF top brass and the USAAF as a whole.

 

I just ordered this title based upon your recommendation...and Sheddan's book. I recommend Charles Demoulin's enjoyable Firebirds:Flying the Typhoon in Action. Try not to get wrapped up in his statistics (e.g. claiming Typhoons put 1000 tanks out of action during Normandy).

[ZachariasX]

6 hours ago, busdriver said:

 

I just ordered this title based upon your recommendation...and Sheddan's book. I recommend Charles Demoulin's enjoyable Firebirds:Flying the Typhoon in Action. Try not to get wrapped up in his statistics (e.g. claiming Typhoons put 1000 tanks out of action during Normandy).

I‘ll get that then as well. Thanks! 

[EAF19_Marsh]

For Typhoon, see also Desmond Scott and John Golly autobiographies as well.

[Bremspropeller]

8 hours ago, busdriver said:

I just ordered this title based upon your recommendation...and Sheddan's book. I recommend Charles Demoulin's enjoyable Firebirds:Flying the Typhoon in Action. Try not to get wrapped up in his statistics (e.g. claiming Typhoons put 1000 tanks out of action during Normandy).

 

I just gunned 100 bucks away for Typhoon/Tempest books - including Firebirds, Blue Arena, Tempest Pilot and the new book by P. Birtles.

Gonna be an interesting fall season...

 

But first I'll have to finish the other books on my nightstand. I'm kinda paranoid tham I'm inadvertantly bumping that poor thing during the night and I get buried under a ton of semi-read books.

 

I'm currently a third into "Fate is the Hunter", which is about airline flying in the "Golden Age". Very gripping and highly recommended!

[Diggun]

Amazon is doing VERY well on Tempest related literature this week....

 

My Mk V Pilots Notes just arrived. Itching to put them to use...

[Tyberan]

On 10/8/2018 at 5:19 PM, EAF19_Marsh said:

OK, Bremspropeller is a bit meaner than I ?

 

Derek Robinson?

Oh man Derek Robinson writes funny stuff if your into the dark humour. Piece of Cake, War Story etc