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JimTM

Notes on AI Taxi, Takeoff, and Landing

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I agree with Jim, except for an escort.

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1 hour ago, =OKT=Muas said:

Noted, thank you.

Another question: is there a way to get an AI plane to join a formation in the air? I mean, for example to get two AI planes to take off separately and then form together in the air?

AFAIK, it's impossible. You can set command Cover only. 

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1 hour ago, JimTM said:

 

I don't think so. You must target link the wingman to the leader to get the wingman to form on the leader. Because of that link, once the leader gets the takeoff command, the wingman follows. 

Well, that I know. I was wondering if there was a way to target link two AI planes by a command when they were already in the air for instance.

 

Anyway, thank you very much.

54 minutes ago, Habu said:

I agree with Jim, except for an escort.

 

11 minutes ago, BlackSix said:

AFAIK, it's impossible. You can set command Cover only. 

Yes, I understand.

 

Cover will get a plane to attack who is a attacking the covered plane. They might fly close but probably not as a formation but as an escort, of course.

 

Anyway I might try to check the behavior of a fighter covering another fighter if there are no enemies around...

 

Thanks.

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22 minutes ago, =OKT=Muas said:

Well, that I know. I was wondering if there was a way to target link two AI planes by a command when they were already in the air for instance.

 

...

 

No, that's not possible.

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On 7/4/2018 at 3:44 PM, JimTM said:

- Land command, one airfield object with taxi path:

 

        The plane lands at the takeoff point defined in the taxi path and taxis in the direction of the taxi path.

 

 

Hi Jim,

 

I am working on a SP campaign and I want the AI planes that land to follow the taxi path until they reach the last parking point. I believe that this used to work but it seems like the AI is just landing and despawning in the middle of the runway instead of following the taxi path to the park area. I do have an airfield with the right country and as a linked entity. I have also edited the taxi paths.

 

Is there a chance this behavior is broken since one of the latest patches?

 

Also, a separate question: Is there any way to make the AI follow the taxi paths until they reach the parking spot, and then NOT Despawn? I would like this behavior but I've had no luck so far. I think the despawning part might be hardcoded.

 

Thanks!

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I’ll test tomorrow.

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13 hours ago, Jade_Monkey said:

 

 

Hi Jim,

 

I am working on a SP campaign and I want the AI planes that land to follow the taxi path until they reach the last parking point. I believe that this used to work but it seems like the AI is just landing and despawning in the middle of the runway instead of following the taxi path to the park area. I do have an airfield with the right country and as a linked entity. I have also edited the taxi paths.

 

Is there a chance this behavior is broken since one of the latest patches?

 

Also, a separate question: Is there any way to make the AI follow the taxi paths until they reach the parking spot, and then NOT Despawn? I would like this behavior but I've had no luck so far. I think the despawning part might be hardcoded.

 

Thanks!

Which plane.

 

For other readers, it's important you specify which plane has the problem, because, it could be just one kind of plane which have the problem.

 

For exemple, there is one bug that Gambit found, and which were fixed. It was link only to the Ju52 with a wind set on 5. In that configuration, the Ju52 didn't taxi and despawn.

 

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Good call Habu - I completely forgot about the plane-specific aspect of this. We ran into quite a bit of this during Ju-52 testing.

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Posted (edited)
16 hours ago, Jade_Monkey said:

 

 

Hi Jim,

 

I am working on a SP campaign and I want the AI planes that land to follow the taxi path until they reach the last parking point. I believe that this used to work but it seems like the AI is just landing and despawning in the middle of the runway instead of following the taxi path to the park area. I do have an airfield with the right country and as a linked entity. I have also edited the taxi paths.

 

Is there a chance this behavior is broken since one of the latest patches?

 

Also, a separate question: Is there any way to make the AI follow the taxi paths until they reach the parking spot, and then NOT Despawn? I would like this behavior but I've had no luck so far. I think the despawning part might be hardcoded.

 

Thanks!

 

I tested with a Yak-1 and it taxied to the parking spot, shut down, and disappeared. 

 

I don't think you can prevent de-spawning. Maybe try a force complete on the plane before it reaches the parking spot.

 

Edited by JimTM

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Jade_Monkey said:

Fw 190 A5 in my case

 

FW 190 A5 works for me.

JimTMTestLandingAndTaxi.zip

Edited by JimTM
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18 hours ago, Jade_Monkey said:

 

 

Hi Jim,

 

I am working on a SP campaign and I want the AI planes that land to follow the taxi path until they reach the last parking point. I believe that this used to work but it seems like the AI is just landing and despawning in the middle of the runway instead of following the taxi path to the park area. I do have an airfield with the right country and as a linked entity. I have also edited the taxi paths.

 

Is there a chance this behavior is broken since one of the latest patches?

 

Also, a separate question: Is there any way to make the AI follow the taxi paths until they reach the parking spot, and then NOT Despawn? I would like this behavior but I've had no luck so far. I think the despawning part might be hardcoded.

 

Thanks!

I've been testing this myself and it works fine with the Me262.

I mean fine, but not perfect, but this is because the "AI doesn't know yet" how to proper taxi the Me262 and keeps accelerating/deaccelerating like a prop, and the 262 is very slow to respond, and sometimes goes one wheel to the grass... Other than that it follows the taxi waypoints in a totally customized taxi path. It parks ok at the last parking point, but then again, not too accurate with the parking direction, which seems to be another consequence of the slow response of the Jumo jets. So everything works fine.

 

Make sure the two circles that define the landing/take off direction are properly set along the the runway and connected to the other "normal taxi" waypoints.

Try to place the circle at the end of the runway, not so far at the end of it. If the runway is too long, the AI needs to "engage" the first taxi point after landing sooner and it makes for a smoother taxi drive. If that circle is at the end, the AI will tend to roll faster until that point and sometimes overshoots the runway and have to turn back to grab the first taxi waypoint.

Again, all this was tested with the Me262 jet. I believe it will work even better with props.

 

Regarding the DESPAWN issue, I wanted that myself but no luck... when the AI switches off the engines it will despawn for sure.

One "workaround" for this, in case you want to see the planes that landed around the parking area is:

1) Set a new plane (same type and skin) as close as possible to the place the one just landed parked, and point it the same direction

2) Link the landed plane event "OnDestroyed" to a spawn trigger and link this to the new plane (enabled unchecked)

When the plane despawns it immediately re-spawn nearby at the spawn point. Its not the same, but if you are not looking it looks like the plane just parked and stayed there.

You might even use the very same spot for one and the other, but in this case add a short timer after the spawn trigger.

Try it out and see if you like the result.

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On 7/1/2019 at 10:59 PM, Jade_Monkey said:

Fw 190 A5 in my case

On which kind of runway (ground/hard/field), in what season (summer/winter/...), and how many planes. All that element can change the result.

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Thanks everyone for testing. I appreciate you taking the time.

Still reviewing the specifics of my mission, just can't find the issue this time.

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Odd...I hate those hair-pullers.

Have you tried changing aircraft type.

Turning off the wind (yeah I know, odd but it makes a difference sometimes)

Pasting the group to a different airfield.

 

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On 6/29/2019 at 6:01 PM, =OKT=Muas said:

Hi all.

Still related to this topic: is it possible to get an AI plane not to disappear after landing (and shutting off the engine), and stay at his parked point after taxi?

 

Thank you!

The taxi circuit for takeoff and landing is at the moment I would say a very limited solution. A full solution would allow more taxi points so as to match more complex configuration of the circuit as well as for landing real parking places. It would allow to have branches in the circuit, so that planes that start from various parking on different taxi circuit branches  could regroup and go to their takeoff position. Same for the landing where the planes would disperse in various places of the airfield according to a circuit with multiple branches. You would have specific parking start points and for each airplane you would assign specific runway position to which they will have to go as well as the direction angle, this to avoid the extremely long procedure of a group of plane positioning themselves on the runway to take-off. You should also be able to have rotational motions at a given spot, this to allow for positioning an airplane in a certain direction on its parking place. Twin engine aircraft can do on spot rotation. For single engine aircraft this is not possible so the rotation would be less realistic but say it is done by invisible ground crew.  This means that each point in the circuit including the parking spots, should allow a rotation command of a certain angle or the default "follow taxiway route". The final parking spots assigned per plane should also have related command like refuel and rearm. In this way you would have a full Park-Taxi-Takeoff-Land-Taxi-Park solution for all airports.

The whole system could be used in a looped mode. That is that the planes that have landed and are parked, after being fueled and rearmed (you can define which) you can restart the whole process using the same circuit either after a certain fixed time or by a signal depending on a given event.

 

Example a flight of fighters takeoff to defend or intercept, then land back at their assigned airport are rearmed and stay on alert. If a new attack arrives they takeoff again to defend the zone same or other.

 

 

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On 6/29/2019 at 6:01 PM, =OKT=Muas said:

Hi all.

Still related to this topic: is it possible to get an AI plane not to disappear after landing (and shutting off the engine), and stay at his parked point after taxi?

 

Thank you!

Hello all,

 

there's a way of keeping the AI plane alive with running engines at it's parking point. Place a Complex Trigger with an appropriate radius at the parking point and message link it to a timer set to 500 ms. OnObjectEntered ist the trigger event to select from the C/T menue. It'll fire the timer and activate the force complete command before the final point has been reached and the deletion sequence of the plane has been started. The C/T of the depicted example, designed for a Ju-52, has a radius of 10 m.

 

227797471_CTParkPosition.thumb.JPG.dff930570535f9885a787f347ad53f54.JPG

 

Cheers

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It's not a solution, because, if you have another Ai which land and taxi, it will crash into the first AI. That's why they disapear.

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Sorry, I forgot to add that the AI plane shall take off after a short while again. The taxiway pickup point is visible above and to the left of the C/T.

 

Cheers

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7 hours ago, Hamaha15 said:

Hello all,

 

there's a way of keeping the AI plane alive with running engines at it's parking point. Place a Complex Trigger with an appropriate radius at the parking point and message link it to a timer set to 500 ms. OnObjectEntered ist the trigger event to select from the C/T menue. It'll fire the timer and activate the force complete command before the final point has been reached and the deletion sequence of the plane has been started. The C/T of the depicted example, designed for a Ju-52, has a radius of 10 m.

 

227797471_CTParkPosition.thumb.JPG.dff930570535f9885a787f347ad53f54.JPG

 

Cheers

Even if it is not perfect I would not have thought of it. It may help in certain cases.

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Posted (edited)

 

I made a Ju-52 land, taxi, pick up cargo (simulated) then taxi and take off again..one of my Pelican missions.

It was smoke and mirrors really.

 

The Ju-52 comes to a stop, is deleted, and a new Ju-52 is immediately spawned in it's place.

 

That's what I love about this editor, for the most part there's always a way...

 

 

 

Edited by Gambit21
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Posted (edited)
On 7/5/2019 at 7:58 PM, IckyATLAS said:

The taxi circuit for takeoff and landing is at the moment I would say a very limited solution. A full solution would allow more taxi points so as to match more complex configuration of the circuit as well as for landing real parking places. It would allow to have branches in the circuit, so that planes that start from various parking on different taxi circuit branches  could regroup and go to their takeoff position. Same for the landing where the planes would disperse in various places of the airfield according to a circuit with multiple branches. You would have specific parking start points and for each airplane you would assign specific runway position to which they will have to go as well as the direction angle, this to avoid the extremely long procedure of a group of plane positioning themselves on the runway to take-off. You should also be able to have rotational motions at a given spot, this to allow for positioning an airplane in a certain direction on its parking place. Twin engine aircraft can do on spot rotation. For single engine aircraft this is not possible so the rotation would be less realistic but say it is done by invisible ground crew.  This means that each point in the circuit including the parking spots, should allow a rotation command of a certain angle or the default "follow taxiway route". The final parking spots assigned per plane should also have related command like refuel and rearm. In this way you would have a full Park-Taxi-Takeoff-Land-Taxi-Park solution for all airports.

The whole system could be used in a looped mode. That is that the planes that have landed and are parked, after being fueled and rearmed (you can define which) you can restart the whole process using the same circuit either after a certain fixed time or by a signal depending on a given event.

 

Example a flight of fighters takeoff to defend or intercept, then land back at their assigned airport are rearmed and stay on alert. If a new attack arrives they takeoff again to defend the zone same or other.

 

 

 

You can create scenarios like this but it just requires a lot more logic to do. The inability to create dynamic formations from individually spawned planes creates a lot more complexity to do this however. The bigger problem (with doing this) is take off and landing damaged planes has not been looked at in detail by development. (yet) and causes a lot of problems.

 

The sim does not handle well planes crashing or having taxi issues during landing or takeoff due to damage sustained before or in flight in my experience.

They can block a run ways and further planes will not land/takeoff.

 

Things like twin engine planes with 1 engine gone or rudder problems tend to cause planes to do infinite donuts for an example. Or planes don't de-spawn if not  completely damaged and can't move and block runways etc.

Never found a good solution to problem , so avoid landing damaged planes or have to force a de-spawn after a time period on any plane that has sustained any damage. Its a complete pain in the A...

 

 

Edited by =RS=Stix_09

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